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Carey Price was NOT a bad pick at all

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Old
08-13-2006, 12:33 PM
  #26
montreal
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Originally Posted by Russian_fanatic View Post
I've watched this guy a lot, and let me say this. He has the tools to be a star. These people who rag on Price are stupid let me tell you this. They haven't even seen him play, and are judging him off stats. He put on NHL style equipment this season which hindered some of his abilities for now, but in the near future this move is going to pay off big time for Price.

Price before this move(equipment change) was a very good goaltender and owned something like a .921(around there) save percent, and was a dominate goaltender. Carey Price hardly gets any help from the defensive end of the rink, and it doesn't help that they don't really have a true star on their team right now, but Price keeps them competitive. When ever the Tri-City Americans decide to play their back ups, they get dogged. Look at their stats if you're a stat monger.

All in all I can see Price becoming a top 5 goaltender when he makes the NHL. This kid has all the tools, and the mental thinking to become a star. Anyone who thinks this is a bad pick should really watch Price some more.

You can't look at who you COULD HAVE picked, but have to look at who you picked. Price was the right pick.

I haven't seen him as much as you then, but I did watch him at times last year mostly early in the season. At the time it didn't sink in about him changing to the smaller pads, so I never took that into consideration. That said he was not very good in the games I saw although he and the team clearly got a lot better by november. The team I saw at the first couple weeks of the season was one of the worst CHL teams I've watched, they were brutal, really couldn't do much of anything and the games were so boring I struggled to stay awake (I'm on the east coast so it's on late)

For me the real concern came later on during games I'd listen on the radio, when he was too often getting pulled, this was during january, in alll I think he was pulled 7 or 8 times all season, just that 4 or so came close together. On the other hand it sounded like he was really solid in the playoffs, although I didn't see any games just radio. Also of concern was that he played in almost 700 minutes less then the year before.

I don't agree about the backup Pickard getting "dogged" since he put up almost the exact same stats as Price and a better win/loss ratio, both had 3 SO's but he played in 1800 less minutes.

Personally I don't think it's a bad pick at all, I do understand why people are so upset at picking a goalie 5th overall, just as it makes a lot of sense for the Habs to grab who they felt was the best at that position. I've seen Price at the U-18's, remax game for Team WHL and a handful of Tri City games (I should of asked for my money back! ) plus several on the radio which of course is almost impossible to get an idea of how a goalie is doing. That said I've seen him play really well and not so well. The thing is that he never made me think, wow we have something really special. I understand the Habs are very high on him and they know better then me, so I'm glad we have Price in the system and can't wait to see him in Hamilton either at the end of this season or next year. For me that's when I'll get a better feel for him, I try not to get caught up in good or bad CHL play. I like to see what our prospects can do at the AHL level before saying one way or another what their NHL future holds.

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08-13-2006, 01:39 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by montreal View Post
... The thing is that he never made me think, wow we have something really special. ...
And that statement sums up what I've seen from Price too. Yes, he looks like a fine goaltending prospect. He has good potential. I'm glad to have him in the organisation. But I just think that with a #5 pick I would have liked to be able to watch him and say, wow we have something really special.

(See, I could watch Brule in the Mem Cup and say, wow Columbus has something really special. I can watch Rask and Pavelec and think, hey, those are fine goaltending prospects, just like I can with Price. I just can't see what separates Price from Rask and Pavelec, I guess.)

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08-13-2006, 01:46 PM
  #28
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Price's attitude is not a factor. His parents made huge sacrifices throughout his minor hockey to help him get to where he is. He's not going to to screw it up by having a bad attitude. He'll do what it takes to win. If he'd have known missing an optional practice would get him booted off the team, he would have shown up. He'll show his mettle this season at the WJC. A couple of other guys like Lats and Setoguchi are in a similar position with the Juniors.

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08-13-2006, 04:44 PM
  #29
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Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
And that statement sums up what I've seen from Price too. Yes, he looks like a fine goaltending prospect. He has good potential. I'm glad to have him in the organisation. But I just think that with a #5 pick I would have liked to be able to watch him and say, wow we have something really special.

(See, I could watch Brule in the Mem Cup and say, wow Columbus has something really special. I can watch Rask and Pavelec and think, hey, those are fine goaltending prospects, just like I can with Price. I just can't see what separates Price from Rask and Pavelec, I guess.)
And that's one of the things that makes him special, he makes saves look easy. Another similar goaltender would be Brodeur.. he can dominate a game and it'll look quite easy to him.

You have to look at the potential down the road as well, and the personality, things you can't see on videos.

Sure Brule is spectacular, but it doesn't make him a better pick for the habs (altho i sure would love to have him or Kopitar now..)

Price was a great pick because no1 goaltenders are worth a ton and you can't win without one. In 3-4 yrs when Huet is getting old Price will be ready to step in. It's a long-term investment.

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08-13-2006, 05:20 PM
  #30
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I really don't see what's so hot about Brule. Sure he dominated Junior, but we've seen it all before. A guy his size won't last long in the NHL playing the way he does. He'll either spend all his time on injured reserve or he'll have to drop the chip on his shoulder.

Price has everything needed to become an NHL goaltender. He has the size, the pois, the talent, and he even uses NHL-style pads. I wouldn't take Brule over him ever. We have enough small, talented centers as is.

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08-13-2006, 07:39 PM
  #31
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Originally Posted by TheHoser View Post
I really don't see what's so hot about Brule. Sure he dominated Junior, but we've seen it all before. A guy his size won't last long in the NHL playing the way he does. He'll either spend all his time on injured reserve or he'll have to drop the chip on his shoulder.

Price has everything needed to become an NHL goaltender. He has the size, the pois, the talent, and he even uses NHL-style pads. I wouldn't take Brule over him ever. We have enough small, talented centers as is.
Imagine Darcy Tucker with great speed and a wicked shot.

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08-13-2006, 08:50 PM
  #32
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Originally Posted by toshiro View Post
Imagine Darcy Tucker with great speed and a wicked shot.
Why would anyone aspire to being like Darcy Tucker?

Look, Brule only played in the NHL for 7 games - and he already broke a leg and broke his themor (I think that was it.) Imagine over an 82-game schedual? The kid's to small to play that way. So he can dominate with kids his own age and people around his size, he'll never pull it off in the NHL.

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08-13-2006, 08:59 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by TheHoser View Post
Look, Brule only played in the NHL for 7 games - and he already broke a leg and broke his themor (I think that was it.) Imagine over an 82-game schedual? The kid's to small to play that way. So he can dominate with kids his own age and people around his size, he'll never pull it off in the NHL.

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Old
08-13-2006, 09:00 PM
  #34
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Price > Brule Like I said everytime .

I see Price at developement camp , his stickhandling skill is AMAZING . He's very atletic and can save games by himself .

Brule is a very fragile guys . Sure he have very good skill , but still an injury prone .

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08-13-2006, 09:08 PM
  #35
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Brule is a very fragile guys . Sure he have very good skill , but still an injury prone .

2 injuries is not enough to call him injury prone. It's not a good excuse anyway as both injuries came after he got drafted.

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Old
08-13-2006, 09:09 PM
  #36
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2 injuries is not enough to call him injury prone. It's not a good excuse anyway as both injuries came after he got drafted.
we have psychic scouts?

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08-13-2006, 09:13 PM
  #37
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2 injuries is not enough to call him injury prone. It's not a good excuse anyway as both injuries came after he got drafted.
It doesn't take Nostradamus to figure out that a 5'10, 175 pound forward playing a 6'4, 230 pound-style of game is going to spend most of his time on the shelf.

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08-13-2006, 09:13 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by Soldat Samsonov View Post
IMO, Carey Price have the potential to dominate the nhl. Great size, nice technique, unique poise. I do not think it is a bust or a bad pick, but i was very high on Anze Kopitar, a huge centre, with awesome skills, now the canadiens need a big centre like kopitar ... and no goalie like price
Kopitar would be a 5 years project with the habs, not the with the Kings.

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08-14-2006, 10:39 AM
  #39
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It doesn't take Nostradamus to figure out that a 5'10, 175 pound forward playing a 6'4, 230 pound-style of game is going to spend most of his time on the shelf.
ie. Koivu

and it wrecked his career IMO. Let me explain... without those injuries Koivu would be one of the best Centers in the league in his career. in my opinion of course. his knee injury really slowed him down.

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08-14-2006, 03:20 PM
  #40
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[QUOTE=TheHoser;6277858]Why would anyone aspire to being like Darcy Tucker?

I personally see Brule as more of a Theo Fleury type, before all of his personal problems got the worst of him. And Fleury is essentially Tucker with more skill, more heart,.. well he's basically a better all-around NHLer.

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08-14-2006, 03:36 PM
  #41
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Good goalies are easy to obtain. Even franchise goalies are easy to obtain.

Franchise defensemen or franchise forwards are not.

Answer this question: If Bobby Clarke said he would be willing to trade Simon Gagne to Montreal (or Chris Pronger, or Patrick Marleau, Vincent Lecavalier or Sydney Crosby or whoever your wet dream player is), but he wants one of Komisarek or Price, who would you give up?

It's a no-brainer in my opinion. We give up Price LONG before we give up Komisarek. That says it all.

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08-14-2006, 03:52 PM
  #42
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Answer this question: If Bobby Clarke said he would be willing to trade Simon Gagne to Montreal (or Chris Pronger, or Patrick Marleau, Vincent Lecavalier or Sydney Crosby or whoever your wet dream player is), but he wants one of Komisarek or Price, who would you give up?

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08-14-2006, 04:09 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by JohnnyReb View Post
Good goalies are easy to obtain. Even franchise goalies are easy to obtain.

Franchise defensemen or franchise forwards are not.

Answer this question: If Bobby Clarke said he would be willing to trade Simon Gagne to Montreal (or Chris Pronger, or Patrick Marleau, Vincent Lecavalier or Sydney Crosby or whoever your wet dream player is), but he wants one of Komisarek or Price, who would you give up?

It's a no-brainer in my opinion. We give up Price LONG before we give up Komisarek. That says it all.
Agreed. With who I'd give up, anyway. Not sure if that quite says it all but it does say something. I don't know how we can look at Price as a surefire NHLer. Brian Finley, Jamie Storr, Patrick Desrochers, Ari Ahonen, Max Ouellet, Mathieu Chouinard, Eric Fichaud... there have been plenty of hyped 1st round goalie picks who never made it. And they all looked great at times too, on a scale comparable to what Price has achieved (and beyond in some cases).

Of course, that doesn't mean Price won't be more like the ones who did pan out, the Pascal Leclaires, Marc Denis, Rick DiPietro, etc types.

But if it's 50/50 that he plays, and then MUCH higher odds still against him being a true franchise-level star goaltender... well... Komisarek is already here, already looking like a top-4 D. And non-franchise-level star goaltenders are growing on trees these days.

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08-14-2006, 07:31 PM
  #44
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Originally Posted by Blind Gardien View Post
Agreed. With who I'd give up, anyway. Not sure if that quite says it all but it does say something. I don't know how we can look at Price as a surefire NHLer. Brian Finley, Jamie Storr, Patrick Desrochers, Ari Ahonen, Max Ouellet, Mathieu Chouinard, Eric Fichaud... there have been plenty of hyped 1st round goalie picks who never made it. And they all looked great at times too, on a scale comparable to what Price has achieved (and beyond in some cases).

Of course, that doesn't mean Price won't be more like the ones who did pan out, the Pascal Leclaires, Marc Denis, Rick DiPietro, etc types.

But if it's 50/50 that he plays, and then MUCH higher odds still against him being a true franchise-level star goaltender... well... Komisarek is already here, already looking like a top-4 D. And non-franchise-level star goaltenders are growing on trees these days.
Would you trade Komisarek for Denis, Leclair or even Dipietro?

As you say, star goalies are everywhere these days. Those that don't have them, think that they have one in their system. Depending on who you talk to, Montreal has FIVE #1, or potential #1's in their system (Huet, Abby, Danis, Price and Halak) to say nothing of a potential wildcard in Lacasse. The market for goalies is a poor one, because everyone has one.

On the other hand, everybody is trying to get a defenseman, especially the good, young ones. How much would Marc Staal or Luc Bourdon fetch right about now? Same thing for big, offensive centers, something Montreal hasn't had since Bobby Smith retired.

Price is an attempt to catch lightning in a bottle. They're HOPING that he turns into a top 5 goalie. Anything less, and they probably could have gotten it for a 2nd round pick.

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08-14-2006, 07:44 PM
  #45
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It doesn't take Nostradamus to figure out that a 5'10, 175 pound forward playing a 6'4, 230 pound-style of game is going to spend most of his time on the shelf.
Nonsense. Most of the grittiest energy players in the league are not injury prone and are no bigger than Brule will be by the time he hits the NHL.

Tell me: do you think Begin is much bigger than Brule? Begin plays with far more of a chip on his shoulder and reckless abandon than Brule does. He's not injury prone.

Sean Avery, arguably most irritating player in the NHL, is smaller than Brule yet maintains his health.

Brule's sandpaper game is overstated, anyhow. I don't think he'll play nearly as tough as these guys in the NHL. He just doesn't back down and plays it hard every shift.

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08-14-2006, 07:46 PM
  #46
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Would you trade Komisarek for Denis, Leclair or even Dipietro?

As you say, star goalies are everywhere these days. Those that don't have them, think that they have one in their system. Depending on who you talk to, Montreal has FIVE #1, or potential #1's in their system (Huet, Abby, Danis, Price and Halak) to say nothing of a potential wildcard in Lacasse. The market for goalies is a poor one, because everyone has one.

On the other hand, everybody is trying to get a defenseman, especially the good, young ones. How much would Marc Staal or Luc Bourdon fetch right about now? Same thing for big, offensive centers, something Montreal hasn't had since Bobby Smith retired.

Price is an attempt to catch lightning in a bottle. They're HOPING that he turns into a top 5 goalie. Anything less, and they probably could have gotten it for a 2nd round pick.
I agree entirely. Marc Staal or Brule would look terrific in the CH. Ah well.

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08-15-2006, 10:13 AM
  #47
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Would you trade Komisarek for Denis, Leclair or even Dipietro?
Since we don't need any of those guys now, obviously no. But even if we hadn't picked Price, I still would say no. It's not a popular opinion I'm sure, but I just don't think that even good goalies are worth all that much. And I'm not just a raving Komisarek fan either. I like him okay, but he's not the second coming or anything. Good young defensemen are just rarer and harder to come by than good goalies right now. Supply and demand.
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As you say, star goalies are everywhere these days. Those that don't have them, think that they have one in their system. Depending on who you talk to, Montreal has FIVE #1, or potential #1's in their system (Huet, Abby, Danis, Price and Halak) to say nothing of a potential wildcard in Lacasse. The market for goalies is a poor one, because everyone has one.
Exactly. Which, incidentally, also factors in to why I go around saying that teams don't have to worry about losing their Danis or Bacashihua types if they were exposed to waivers. Everybody has those guys of their own.

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08-16-2006, 10:15 AM
  #48
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Since we don't need any of those guys now, obviously no. But even if we hadn't picked Price, I still would say no. It's not a popular opinion I'm sure, but I just don't think that even good goalies are worth all that much. And I'm not just a raving Komisarek fan either. I like him okay, but he's not the second coming or anything. Good young defensemen are just rarer and harder to come by than good goalies right now. Supply and demand.
I agree with you 100%. Which is why I don't think it was a great pick. Drafts are about acquiring and maximizing assets, and UNLESS Price becomes a top 5 goalie in the NHL, it was not a maximization of assets. No team in the league needs a goalie right now, and the second one does, there will be a good 5 teams banging on their door trying to give them one, including the Habs. On the other hand, just about every team in the league needs a good young defenseman, again, including the Habs.

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08-16-2006, 10:26 AM
  #49
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I agree with you 100%. Which is why I don't think it was a great pick. Drafts are about acquiring and maximizing assets, and UNLESS Price becomes a top 5 goalie in the NHL, it was not a maximization of assets. No team in the league needs a goalie right now, and the second one does, there will be a good 5 teams banging on their door trying to give them one, including the Habs. On the other hand, just about every team in the league needs a good young defenseman, again, including the Habs.

You make good points but the point I high lighted in bold does not make sense to me.
You have to draft any player at hopes he becomes what you drafted him to become. Price was drafted because the Habs and probably 10 other teams think he is going to be a franchise goalie. Montreal got lucky with the draft lottery and they had to take that chance.
And in my opinion it was a very good decision they made.

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08-16-2006, 11:35 AM
  #50
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You make good points but the point I high lighted in bold does not make sense to me.
You have to draft any player at hopes he becomes what you drafted him to become. Price was drafted because the Habs and probably 10 other teams think he is going to be a franchise goalie.
I think there's a big big difference between "...think he is going to be a franchise goalie" and "...think he could be a franchise goalie."

There are a handful of goalies drafted every year who teams think could be franchise goalies. Hardly any of them ever turn out to be, though. I don't know what scout or GM can fool himself well enough to truly believe that they know what goalies are going to be franchise goalies. If anybody truly believed Price would be the next Martin Brodeur, he probably challenges Crosby, no?

Heck, Martin Brodeur himself was a late first rounder. Who are the other "franchise goalies" lately? Patrick Roy? Kiprusoff? Hasek? Belfour? Let's not get into where they were drafted. Maybe Luongo is the only example who might yet hit that target from the high end 1st rounders? And Lehtonen, ok. It's not encouraging odds still, IMO. Not when you can just pick up guys with equivalent odds later on.

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