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The All-Purpose Goaltending Thread #9

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Old
03-31-2013, 11:36 AM
  #701
1865
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Originally Posted by hckyplayer8 View Post
Snider's an idiot.
He's right. Bryz hasn't had any help this season whatsoever. Even a moderate defence would increase his stats exponentially.

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Old
03-31-2013, 11:46 AM
  #702
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Originally Posted by 1865 View Post
He's right. Bryz hasn't had any help this season whatsoever. Even a moderate defence would increase his stats exponentially.
Umm timonen, schenn, coburn, grossmann, meszaros, gervias/gus?

Seriously we have a team with 5 top 4 defenders. Now if u said the system needs some work ya i agree but personal wise we have a pretty good defense. Just an even combination of breakdowns among the defense and bryz himself is the reason.

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03-31-2013, 12:11 PM
  #703
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As sa cyred said above, it's a large combination of defensive breakdowns and Bryzgalov being unable to bail team out on defensive breakdowns. He's saved one breakaway all season, I mean come on. I know those are high percentage chances, but I would like to see him save a few more of them.

I don't know why but he seems to sit back constantly and just get sniped. I want to see him come out and challenge skaters more.

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03-31-2013, 12:32 PM
  #704
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Originally Posted by JDinklage Morgoone View Post
As sa cyred said above, it's a large combination of defensive breakdowns and Bryzgalov being unable to bail team out on defensive breakdowns. He's saved one breakaway all season, I mean come on. I know those are high percentage chances, but I would like to see him save a few more of them.

I don't know why but he seems to sit back constantly and just get sniped. I want to see him come out and challenge skaters more.
Defensive breakdowns and breakaways are 100% not the goalie's fault. They aren't supposed to make those kinds of saves since they are impossible to stop.

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Old
03-31-2013, 12:47 PM
  #705
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Originally Posted by FlyingPhilly View Post
Defensive breakdowns and breakaways are 100% not the goalie's fault. They aren't supposed to make those kinds of saves since they are impossible to stop.
This isn't me trying to spark debate. I still have faith that Bryzgalov can be a good goaltender on this team. He might not meet a lot of expectations for people based on his pay, but I know he's not as bad as his stats indicate.

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03-31-2013, 01:01 PM
  #706
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Originally Posted by JDinklage Morgoone View Post
This isn't me trying to spark debate. I still have faith that Bryzgalov can be a good goaltender on this team. He might not meet a lot of expectations for people based on his pay, but I know he's not as bad as his stats indicate.
Fair enough. I don't think Bryz can be a good goalie here though, especially for what he is getting paid. I don't believe Bryz can be a good goalie anywhere unless he plays in a Phoenix or Hitchcock style of system, defensive minded and goalie friendly.

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Old
03-31-2013, 01:10 PM
  #707
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"Goaltenders who could be on the move: Los Angeles’ Jonathan Bernier, Ottawa’s Ben Bishop, Edmonton’s Nikolai Khabibulin, Calgary’s Miikka Kiprusoff, Anaheim’s Jonas Hiller and the Blue Jackets’ Steve Mason.
Yes, Mason. Philadelphia was kicking the Blue Jackets’ tires for Mason even before it traded Jeff Carter to Columbus two summers ago. Bernier and Bishop are young players who would come with a significant price tag."

http://bluejacketsxtra.dispatch.com/...-deadline.html

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03-31-2013, 01:41 PM
  #708
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Originally Posted by sa cyred View Post
Umm timonen, schenn, coburn, grossmann, meszaros, gervias/gus?

Seriously we have a team with 5 top 4 defenders. Now if u said the system needs some work ya i agree but personal wise we have a pretty good defense. Just an even combination of breakdowns among the defense and bryz himself is the reason.
The defense is the result of the collection of defensemen and the system. Good defenders do not a good defence make.

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03-31-2013, 03:18 PM
  #709
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Given that it's all the turnovers and the subsequent breakaways and odd-man rushes that have led to all of these "unstoppable" goals against Bryz, it's interesting how all the goalies on teams who have more giveaways than us have better save percentages than Bryz. Must just be another statistical anomaly (like the fact that are among the ten best teams at limiting shots, which suggests our defense is actually pretty good).

Turnover ranking (1=Most)
1. Buffalo = Miller (.911)
2. Pittsburgh = Fleury (.918)
3. Boston = Rask (.922)
4. Ottawa = Anderson (.952) Bishop (.922)
5. Carolina = Ward (.908)
6. Nashville Rinne (.910)
7. Toronto Reimer (.920)
8. Phoenix Smith (.901) LaBarbera (.918)
9. Florida Markstrom (.919)
10. New Jersey Brodeur (.907)
11. Flyers = Bryz (.902)

So I guess at the end of the day you could say that Bryz is fairly comparable to Mike Smith. Who'd have thunk it?

In closing, another really nasty stat: Among goalies w/ 20+ starts, only Lindback and Quick have a worse even-strength save percentage.

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03-31-2013, 04:24 PM
  #710
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillDineen View Post
"Goaltenders who could be on the move: Los Angeles’ Jonathan Bernier, Ottawa’s Ben Bishop, Edmonton’s Nikolai Khabibulin, Calgary’s Miikka Kiprusoff, Anaheim’s Jonas Hiller and the Blue Jackets’ Steve Mason.
Yes, Mason. Philadelphia was kicking the Blue Jackets’ tires for Mason even before it traded Jeff Carter to Columbus two summers ago. Bernier and Bishop are young players who would come with a significant price tag."

http://bluejacketsxtra.dispatch.com/...-deadline.html
I think a trade for Bernier won't happen until the draft unless someone offers something monumental. Quick isn't where he was last year and Bernier's been really good.

OMG, please tell me Homer isn't looking at Mason!

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Old
03-31-2013, 04:32 PM
  #711
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Bryz for Mason - hahaa, reunite Bob and Bryz....

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Old
03-31-2013, 04:38 PM
  #712
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Bryz for Mason - hahaa, reunite Bob and Bryz....
And it's Bob's job to lose!

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Old
03-31-2013, 05:26 PM
  #713
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And it's Bob's job to lose!


If only patience were a virtue the org had....

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Old
03-31-2013, 08:23 PM
  #714
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Originally Posted by FlyingPhilly View Post
Defensive breakdowns and breakaways are 100% not the goalie's fault. They aren't supposed to make those kinds of saves since they are impossible to stop.
Yes they are. Elite goaltenders are paid to make the occasional stop in these situations. If not, why else do you pay one goalie more than the other? Otherwise you're just paying them to make the routine stop. Bryz is paid to steal a few of these saves to bail out the defense. He doesn't. He doesn't justify his salary nor does he provide good value for the cost.

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03-31-2013, 09:34 PM
  #715
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Originally Posted by BroadStreetPhila View Post
Yes they are. Elite goaltenders are paid to make the occasional stop in these situations. If not, why else do you pay one goalie more than the other? Otherwise you're just paying them to make the routine stop. Bryz is paid to steal a few of these saves to bail out the defense. He doesn't. He doesn't justify his salary nor does he provide good value for the cost.
exactly

a. he doesnt make "all the saves he needs to make" - he lets in a lot of really bad goals

b. even if he was one of those goalies who made all the stops he was supposed too, we are paying him to be a goalie that wins us games. he doesnt do that. never seems to make the save when we really need it.

for what he's being paid, he needs to make all the stops he should, and then some. he doesnt. id buy him out after the season, regardless of how he plays from here on in. hes not a top tier goalie, and he counts against the cap as one.

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Old
03-31-2013, 09:44 PM
  #716
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Originally Posted by BroadStreetPhila View Post
Yes they are. Elite goaltenders are paid to make the occasional stop in these situations. If not, why else do you pay one goalie more than the other? Otherwise you're just paying them to make the routine stop. Bryz is paid to steal a few of these saves to bail out the defense. He doesn't. He doesn't justify his salary nor does he provide good value for the cost.


Someone's sarcasm meter is off, even with the emoticon there.

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03-31-2013, 09:56 PM
  #717
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Originally Posted by sg12lw View Post
exactly

a. he doesnt make "all the saves he needs to make" - he lets in a lot of really bad goals

b. even if he was one of those goalies who made all the stops he was supposed too, we are paying him to be a goalie that wins us games. he doesnt do that. never seems to make the save when we really need it.
He's made enough saves to win 15 games this year, but his cap hit and more importantly the fact that his contract goes until 2020 make me want the Flyers to buy him out in the 2014 offseason unless he wins the Vezina next season.

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Old
03-31-2013, 10:34 PM
  #718
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Originally Posted by FlyingPhilly View Post


Someone's sarcasm meter is off, even with the emoticon there.
My bad. I'm not emoticon savvy.

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Old
04-01-2013, 01:30 AM
  #719
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You know, it's been way too long since I've posted anything positive in this thread. So here goes: nobody wants Bryz to be successful in Philly more than Bryz. And that's good.

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Old
04-01-2013, 01:38 AM
  #720
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voracek is a better goalie than bryz

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Old
04-01-2013, 08:39 AM
  #721
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Originally Posted by 1865 View Post
He's right. Bryz hasn't had any help this season whatsoever. Even a moderate defence would increase his stats exponentially.
Not sure if serious.

Top 10 in the league for shots against.
Top 10 in the league on the PK.
Top 10 in the league for blocked shots.

What exactly constitutes "help" in your eyes?

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04-01-2013, 08:46 AM
  #722
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The Flyers are in the top 10 in PK percentage partly because of Bryzgalov's play. But they have being shorthanded the second most times in the league, so taking less penalties would help.

Other help would include blowing less coverages, especially around the net where opponents have had a field day tipping in shots from the point, and not giving up as many odd man rushes and breakaways. Oh, and reducing the amount of failed clearing attempts would be a huge help.

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Old
04-01-2013, 08:53 AM
  #723
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillDineen View Post
"Goaltenders who could be on the move: Los Angeles’ Jonathan Bernier, Ottawa’s Ben Bishop, Edmonton’s Nikolai Khabibulin, Calgary’s Miikka Kiprusoff, Anaheim’s Jonas Hiller and the Blue Jackets’ Steve Mason.
Yes, Mason. Philadelphia was kicking the Blue Jackets’ tires for Mason even before it traded Jeff Carter to Columbus two summers ago. Bernier and Bishop are young players who would come with a significant price tag."

http://bluejacketsxtra.dispatch.com/...-deadline.html
I don't want to take the thread on a bunny trail, but this little tidbit further down in this article caught my eye.

Quote:
The Flyers say they won’t move any of their “kids,” but they might consider moving center Sean Couturier, who, despite a very good rookie season, is not seen as a future top-six forward.
Hmm, would that be the same Couturier taken with the Blue Jackets' 1st round pick? A bit of sour grapes, I'd say.

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Old
04-01-2013, 11:02 AM
  #724
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Originally Posted by Curufinwe View Post
The Flyers are in the top 10 in PK percentage partly because of Bryzgalov's play. But they have being shorthanded the second most times in the league, so taking less penalties would help.

Other help would include blowing less coverages, especially around the net where opponents have had a field day tipping in shots from the point, and not giving up as many odd man rushes and breakaways. Oh, and reducing the amount of failed clearing attempts would be a huge help.
They play well disciplined defence on PK, something that desintegrates in 5v5 situations.

Three forward behind offencive goal line and 1 defender pinching in creates a horrible defencive liability.


Bryz MUST play much better consistently, but playing more disciplined defencively is also a must. Let me clarify this statemnt, I am not advocating for defence only team, I would like to see a game plan where the whole teams knows what to do and where each of them needs to be when other team has puck posession.

They need to learn small details and discipline, not necesserily change the whole strategy. So it comes downt to tactics and execution (i.e. 2010). I feel that with that approach the goalkeeping situation will drasticly imrove.

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Old
04-01-2013, 11:52 AM
  #725
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Not sure if serious.

Top 10 in the league for shots against.
Top 10 in the league on the PK.
Top 10 in the league for blocked shots.

What exactly constitutes "help" in your eyes?
I agree that Bryz has not played we'll at all, but these stats don't tell the story. The flyers defense, an forwards for that matter, give up WAYYY too many prime scoring chances, odd man rushes, breakaways. Way to many blown coverages, standing around in the d zone. The biggest issue is how TERRIBLE they are at clearing the puck. I have never seen so many failed clearing attenpts by a team over the course of a season. People need to watch games and not just look up stats. The defense has played pretty bad, and i don't know how people can say they have played good

Bryz has been bad and inconsistent on his end too, but I think it's wrong when people act like the defense and the whole team is playing great, and Bryz is the sole one letting the team down and holding them back, that is simply untrue

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