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All Encompassing Tortorella Thread Pt. II

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Old
04-01-2013, 11:03 AM
  #726
GWOW
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The next month should determine Torts' fate. No reason to fire him now with the team still controlling its own destiny.

If they dont make the playoffs???? Different story.

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Old
04-01-2013, 11:14 AM
  #727
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Originally Posted by Dorado View Post
Lets not be Pollyanna's here . Richards chose NY partially for Torts but also because
East coast travel schedule
Chartered jets and first class accomadqtions always
First class training facilities
Manhattan lifestyle with access to the best golf in the area in off season out East
Easy travel back home to PEI .
NYR overpaid to get him and basically bid against themselves .
So. , yes Torts is part of the equation but only a small part . Players come to NY to retire high on the hog
ESPO
DIONNE
HODGE
VADNAIS
LAFLEUR
LINDROS
FLEURY
DRURY THE LAIY GOES ON
This is all true, but my point was that Richards chose to come to a team coached by Torts regardless of the other reasons and, while some players have gripes against the coach that are partially legitimate, Richards isn't one of them. He's been treated like the golden boy despite his lackluster play.

I don't think Torts is perfect and I don't doubt that its possible that some of the players are fed up with him, I just don't see the Avery - Richards connection as being something that's really there and really a possibility regarding Avery's quote. Richards has had it real good here - way better than he deserves to have it, in fact.

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Old
04-01-2013, 11:48 AM
  #728
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Originally Posted by haveandare View Post
This is all true, but my point was that Richards chose to come to a team coached by Torts regardless of the other reasons and, while some players have gripes against the coach that are partially legitimate, Richards isn't one of them. He's been treated like the golden boy despite his lackluster play.

I don't think Torts is perfect and I don't doubt that its possible that some of the players are fed up with him, I just don't see the Avery - Richards connection as being something that's really there and really a possibility regarding Avery's quote. Richards has had it real good here - way better than he deserves to have it, in fact.
I tend. To agree with you here. Our Vezina winner otoh definitely has an opinion close to that of Sean Avery. That I heard from a very reliable source last week. And the Mods here removed it when I mentioned it a Couple of days prior to Sean's tweet.

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04-01-2013, 12:26 PM
  #729
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Originally Posted by haveandare View Post
Richards could have gone anywhere just a year ago and he chose to go to a team coached by Torts. I really, really doubt that in the past year he went from wanting to play for Torts' team specifically to having such huge problems with the guy that he's venting to Avery about him. Further, of all people, Richards has the least to complain about. The guy has looked like garbage all season and Torts has been feeding him top 6 minutes anyway.

Also, Avery caused problems in Dallas as well. He's not a symptom of this atmosphere, he's just a guy with a particularly odd attitude IMO.
Choosing to go to a team with a coach whom you have fond memories of and seeing the reality of that coach today are two different things.

I didn't realize that a person needs "such huge problems" with a boss to vent to a friend about it. In my experience, all it takes is a minimal problem. By the way, another thought could be that Richards (or someone else hanging out the Avery) vented about how he thinks the team has given up on Tortorella, even if he hasn't himself. My main point was that Richards and Avery were friends before NY and I'm sure have remained so. Avery has at least one potential source for his comment.

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Old
04-01-2013, 12:30 PM
  #730
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He's not on the chopping block.

It's as simple as, he WILL get the benefit of the doubt after being a Jack Adams finalist, no training camp, shortened season& large roster turnover (no to mention the Stanley Cup ring).

We have until Xmas to debate it... But it won happen until close to then, if at all.
I know we don't have our Captain, as far as we know, actively undermining our coach with our GM, but I seem to remember a point in Rangers history where a guy got fired halfway through a season following a President's Trophy win.

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Old
04-01-2013, 12:44 PM
  #731
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Originally Posted by Tawnos View Post
Choosing to go to a team with a coach whom you have fond memories of and seeing the reality of that coach today are two different things.

I didn't realize that a person needs "such huge problems" with a boss to vent to a friend about it. In my experience, all it takes is a minimal problem. By the way, another thought could be that Richards (or someone else hanging out the Avery) vented about how he thinks the team has given up on Tortorella, even if he hasn't himself. My main point was that Richards and Avery were friends before NY and I'm sure have remained so. Avery has at least one potential source for his comment.
For your first point, I think/hope that Richards did some serious research about how things are with NYR currently instead of just relying on his fond memories and singing a huge, long contract like that.

But your second point is extremely valid. I just don't see what Richards of all people would be complaining about. He's in a position to make or break the team and he's breaking it every. single. night. while still getting superstar treatment. If I were him I'd want to stretch Torts' tenure out as long as possible - a new coach might actually demand results from him.

Bottom line, it's not impossible that some players, maybe even Richards, did vent to Avery. I just personally don't see, from my admittedly far-off perspective, what Richards of all people has to complain about.

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04-01-2013, 12:51 PM
  #732
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Richards has nothing to complain about. I doubt he would.

He has been babied since putting on the NYR sweater. Guy is emotionally soft as charmin, can't play hockey anymore and still gets top 6 minutes and is never benched.

He is pathetic and a waste of space but he is Torts' golden boy still, so he has NOTHING to complain about.

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04-01-2013, 01:36 PM
  #733
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Originally Posted by Riverdale View Post
Richards has nothing to complain about. I doubt he would.

He has been babied since putting on the NYR sweater. Guy is emotionally soft as charmin, can't play hockey anymore and still gets top 6 minutes and is never benched.

He is pathetic and a waste of space but he is Torts' golden boy still, so he has NOTHING to complain about.
There ya go

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04-01-2013, 02:10 PM
  #734
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I tend. To agree with you here. Our Vezina winner otoh definitely has an opinion close to that of Sean Avery. That I heard from a very reliable source last week. And the Mods here removed it when I mentioned it a Couple of days prior to Sean's tweet.
Seriously. Why are people even speculating about Richards? If Avery did hear it from someone on the team (and I'm not saying that's a certainty), then the obvious source would be Lundqvist. He's been getting more and more frustrated, he's business partners with Avery, and they were good friends. I'd be curious to hear Henke's response to Avery's tweet.

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04-01-2013, 02:24 PM
  #735
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Originally Posted by smoneil View Post
Seriously. Why are people even speculating about Richards? If Avery did hear it from someone on the team (and I'm not saying that's a certainty), then the obvious source would be Lundqvist. He's been getting more and more frustrated, he's business partners with Avery, and they were good friends. I'd be curious to hear Henke's response to Avery's tweet.
It would be the same response Callahan gave. They are professionals. Even if they agreed with Avery 100% and/or fed him that sentiment directly, they would never publicly state as much.

If you want Lundqvist's reaction, just read Callahan's.

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04-01-2013, 04:23 PM
  #736
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Originally Posted by Ailurophile View Post
It would be the same response Callahan gave. They are professionals. Even if they agreed with Avery 100% and/or fed him that sentiment directly, they would never publicly state as much.

If you want Lundqvist's reaction, just read Callahan's.
This is true.

These are hockey players here, not NFL or NBA guys. Look at all the chaos that broke out just because Ryan Miller called Patrick Kaleta a baby in an interview. No one on this team would ever say anything negative publicly about their coach.

Also, I can't remember if it was Zipay, Gross or Leonard but one of the Rangers beat guys tweeted afterwards that Avery doesn't have much contact with the team anymore. I think the conspiracy theories here are getting a little bit overdone.

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Old
04-01-2013, 04:33 PM
  #737
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StaalWars View Post


Also, I can't remember if it was Zipay, Gross or Leonard but one of the Rangers beat guys tweeted afterwards that Avery doesn't have much contact with the team anymore. I think the conspiracy theories here are getting a little bit overdone.
Not for nothing, but how poor of a job the beat writers do covering the team I really don't think they would have any idea if Avery has any contact with the players or not.

Why would any player offer to a beat writer if they talk to Avery or not???

Don't know for sure, but my opinion is that I'm sure a at least a couple of players definitely still have contact with Avery. I'm not saying his tweet has any merit, I'm only saying that I'm sure he has still has some contact with players on the team.

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Old
04-01-2013, 04:35 PM
  #738
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Originally Posted by Riverdale View Post
Richards has nothing to complain about. I doubt he would.

He has been babied since putting on the NYR sweater. Guy is emotionally soft as charmin, can't play hockey anymore and still gets top 6 minutes and is never benched.

He is pathetic and a waste of space but he is Torts' golden boy still, so he has NOTHING to complain about.
Guy has won a cup, won a Conn Smythe, and was our best forward in the playoffs last season. Thats tough to do when you're "emotionally soft"

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Old
04-01-2013, 04:35 PM
  #739
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Originally Posted by Jim Ramsay View Post
Not for nothing, but how poor of a job the beat writers do covering the team I really don't think they would have any idea if Avery has any contact with the players or not.

Why would any player offer to a beat writer if they talk to Avery or not???

Don't know for sure, but my opinion is that I'm sure a at least a couple of players definitely still have contact with Avery. I'm not saying his tweet has any merit, I'm only saying that I'm sure he has still has some contact with players on the team.
Considering he and Lundqvist co-own a restaurant in Tribeca together, I think it's safe to say they're still in contact.

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Old
04-01-2013, 04:37 PM
  #740
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Originally Posted by silverfish View Post
Considering he and Lundqvist co-own a restaurant in Tribeca together, I think it's safe to say they're still in contact.
yeah I thought so.... well in that case it proves what I'm saying that a beat writer saying that avery doesn't have contact with players is silly

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Old
04-01-2013, 04:39 PM
  #741
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Originally Posted by smoneil View Post
Seriously. Why are people even speculating about Richards? If Avery did hear it from someone on the team (and I'm not saying that's a certainty), then the obvious source would be Lundqvist. He's been getting more and more frustrated, he's business partners with Avery, and they were good friends. I'd be curious to hear Henke's response to Avery's tweet.
Why are we speculating at all when the overwhelming odds are that its just Sean Avery, notorious *******, being an *******.

He probably wishes he couldve tweeted this last season.

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Old
04-01-2013, 04:49 PM
  #742
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Avery bad mouthed the NYR during his press conference when he signed with the Stars, this is his M.O. Not surprised that he's bitter at the way he was treated by Tortorella. Despite his off ice stupidities, I thought he was a good player for us. We're not in that room though, and I wouldn't be surprised if he pissed people off.

Avery isn't saying or seeing anything that we're not. If they miss the playoffs with this roster, with the way they've played this season, they need to start anew going into next season.

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Old
04-01-2013, 04:50 PM
  #743
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Originally Posted by GWOW View Post
The next month should determine Torts' fate. No reason to fire him now with the team still controlling its own destiny.

If they dont make the playoffs???? Different story.
I actually think if we lose tonight and lose both games to the Pens he's done and Schoenfield is in as the interim. Slats isn't gonna let this season waste away with no 1st.

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Old
04-01-2013, 04:55 PM
  #744
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Moving this here from Trade thread; sorry for helping to further derail that thread:


Quote:
Originally Posted by Trxjw View Post
Can't blame the coach! He has the wrong players! Gee, haven't heard that one around here before.

The lack of accountability up and down this organization is disturbing.
I can play this game too!

Another post ignoring the fact that the organization, the beat writers (who have inside access to the team, organization, coach, and players -- and thus have a better perspective than virtually any of us), AND the players all say Torts isn't the problem! Gee, haven't heard that one around here before.

The lack of emotional depth around here is disturbing.

---

No one is saying the guy is perfect. And if the team continues to play this poorly 20-30 games into next season, fine, I could be convinced to explore other options. But right now, to want to throw him away like trash, as so many people have suggested on these boards, is beyond short-sighted and hyperbolic. This is a guy who has slowly turned this team around during his time here, who has helped develop a ton of young guys into great players, who has helped develop one of the strongest cores this team has had in years, and who helped get them to the ECF last year. But now, after a rough 30 games, people want to **** all over him. Grow up.

We've played just over 30 games this season. The top 4 teams in the east last year besides the Rangers all also had terrible stretches of ~30 games:

Pittsburgh (Oct 29 - Jan 11): 13-15-2
Boston (Dec 31 - Mar 4): 14-14-2
Philly (Oct 15 - Dec 19): 13-13-4
New Jersey (Oct 8 - Dec 10): 14-13-1

Were any of those teams' coaches realistically on the chopping block? No. **** happens. Get used to it.

I get that everyone is disappointed because the Rangers were considered favorites to go all the way (the players included - perhaps why they look so down, ever thought of that?), but this crap is getting out of hand and ridiculous. Get some perspective.

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Old
04-01-2013, 05:05 PM
  #745
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Guy has won a cup, won a Conn Smythe, and was our best forward in the playoffs last season. Thats tough to do when you're "emotionally soft"
Average in the 1st round, great in the 2nd round, and pretty piss-poor in the 3rd round. Hardly our best forward in the playoffs. In fact, with how inconsistent our offense was, I would have a difficult time putting any of them in a best forward category.

I believe that, just like with Gabby, we gotta let him work through this funk and hope we get into the playoffs. I don't care what anyone says about playing Pitt or Boston in the 1st round...if things start to click offensively and Henrik is truly on top of his game, we can win a 7-game series against either team.

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04-01-2013, 05:05 PM
  #746
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I actually think if we lose tonight and lose both games to the Pens he's done and Schoenfield is in as the interim. Slats isn't gonna let this season waste away with no 1st.
Ah, because bringing in a new coach with only a few weeks left wouldn't be letting the season "waste away" or anything, right?

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Old
04-01-2013, 05:08 PM
  #747
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Originally Posted by Block More Shots View Post
Average in the 1st round, great in the 2nd round, and pretty piss-poor in the 3rd round. Hardly our best forward in the playoffs. In fact, with how inconsistent our offense was, I would have a difficult time putting any of them in a best forward category.

I believe that, just like with Gabby, we gotta let him work through this funk and hope we get into the playoffs. I don't care what anyone says about playing Pitt or Boston in the 1st round...if things start to click offensively and Henrik is truly on top of his game, we can win a 7-game series against either team.
Someones gotta be the best one, and he was it. I wasnt trying to convey that he was the catalyst on some magical offensive run. But he was very good.

I agree with the 2nd paragraph.

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Old
04-01-2013, 05:10 PM
  #748
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Originally Posted by BBKers View Post
If the Rangers drop the next three games (hope not but...) then we will be hearing an entirely different melody. Guaranteed. Watch...the enraged villagers will come out en masse with pitchforks and Torches...and then Torts will be walking his dogs elsewhere
You can't miss the POs with this roster.

Especially not while playing the most defensive booring style in the league.

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Old
04-01-2013, 05:13 PM
  #749
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You can't miss the POs with this roster.

Especially not while playing the most defensive booring style in the league.
In a lockout shortened crapshoot of a season with no training camp, that statement doesnt hold as much weight.

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Old
04-01-2013, 05:16 PM
  #750
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Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Guy has won a cup, won a Conn Smythe, and was our best forward in the playoffs last season. Thats tough to do when you're "emotionally soft"
There's been a lot of names on that cup and conn Smythe since 2004 . To quote Vince Lomabrdi '" fatigue makes cowards of most men " and Beaver is looking awfully tired

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