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A bevy of new draft picks, what is the plan???

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Old
04-02-2013, 09:46 PM
  #76
sjshark91
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Originally Posted by The Last Outlaw View Post
I'm for Chimera. We could use his skill set.
You mean his speed right, he has no skill set.

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04-02-2013, 09:50 PM
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I don't know that I trust this staff with all these draft picks.

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04-02-2013, 09:52 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
Outside of Hertl and Nieto, the Sharks have no forward that projects beyond the 3rd line level. They have plenty of defensemen to fill out the depth levels. They're committing to Burns as their #1 and Vlasic is a serviceable partner for him for as long as they want to do that. They don't need much focus on that level with a young roster of d-men and solid group of d-men prospects. And honestly, the need for much attention or resources on goalies is dwindling overall. You can go years and not draft any and it wouldn't matter because it's cheap to go out and find someone to fill the role and do well as long as it fits.

If they can pluck two quality winger prospects out of the draft that can/will project to be a top six player, they will succeed in a short term refresh or whatever they want to call it. If they land three, it would be ideal in terms of preparing for the future as Marleau and Havlat will be on their way out when this class is about ready to step in. Three would actually fill a void if we assume Nieto is filling the fourth winger spot in the top six. However, it's not all that likely to get that kind of pull in this draft with their picks as they are.

To get two, they likely will need a solid pick in the first round and hope that one of their pretty much four second round picks goes to historic formula of a 25% clip of success.

Of course, all this doesn't mean anything if they find a long term solution by trading Boyle or someone else for a young winger that has many years of top six play in front of him.
I think drafting 2 potential top 6 in the next drafts and trading Boyle + one of Demers/Braun/Irwin/Tennyson this offseason for a young top 6 forward would be the best path to turn the top 6 fwds over.

In a few seasons, with the above 3 top fwds, plus Juicy and Pavs, that's not a bad top 6. Add Hamilton as a 3rd liner + our young defense. I kind of like that team down the road.

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04-02-2013, 09:52 PM
  #79
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Originally Posted by Eighth Fret View Post
I don't know that I trust this staff with all these draft picks.
If they make picks I'm cool with it. Trading them away for garbage is the problem.

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04-02-2013, 09:54 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by Eighth Fret View Post
I don't know that I trust this staff with all these draft picks.
They're good at certain levels. I will give them credit where it's due. I'm weary on their 1st round pick and still weary on Hertl partially because of it. They're above average in the 2nd round slightly so if they focus their efforts on wingers at that level, they should be fine. Beyond that, it's a crap shoot. They've gotten their fair share of luck but they've bombed more often than not like everyone else. That's why if they hang on to their first, their three 2nds, and the Florida 3rd, I'm confident that they can pluck two quality prospects for their future. It's whether they concentrate their efforts or not. They don't need d-men or goalies in their pool at this moment.

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04-02-2013, 09:55 PM
  #81
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Originally Posted by Blades of Glory View Post
You really would be trolling Rutherford if you faxed him a signed offer sheet for a player on the Blues. I don't believe he could match even if he wanted to.


Probably because he is the GM of the Carolina Hurricanes
Oh ****. I said Rutherford because he's their beat writer. My bad.

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04-02-2013, 09:57 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by magic school bus View Post
Yeah, they had the 4th overall pick. I'm still not sure who came out looking worse - Garth Snow for offering it, or Scott Howson for rejecting it.
IIRC the deal was rejected because the Blue Jackets could not possibly have enough contract slots to handle a 13 player draft. They probably could have made it work, but that was the reason Howson gave.

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04-02-2013, 10:09 PM
  #83
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Originally Posted by Gilligans Island View Post
I think drafting 2 potential top 6 in the next drafts and trading Boyle + one of Demers/Braun/Irwin/Tennyson this offseason for a young top 6 forward would be the best path to turn the top 6 fwds over.

In a few seasons, with the above 3 top fwds, plus Juicy and Pavs, that's not a bad top 6. Add Hamilton as a 3rd liner + our young defense. I kind of like that team down the road.
Does it make any sense for DW to talk to Tampa Bay about a Boyle trade? Could it be a draft day deal?

Seems like they're the only non-contender that Boyle might approve a trade to, and they're in line for a top 10 draft pick.

Big downside is their gawd-awful cap situation next season, but I don't know enough about their potential buy-out options.

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04-02-2013, 10:11 PM
  #84
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Originally Posted by Linkster View Post
Does it make any sense for DW to talk to Tampa Bay about a Boyle trade?

Seems like they're the only non-contender that Boyle might approve a trade to, and they're in line for a top 10 draft pick.

Big downside is their gawd-awful cap situation next season, but I don't know enough about their potential buy-out options.
Trade Boyle for Tampa's 1st and use that pick to draft Monahan. One can dream.

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04-02-2013, 10:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Linkster View Post
Does it make any sense for DW to talk to Tampa Bay about a Boyle trade? Could it be a draft day deal?

Seems like they're the only non-contender that Boyle might approve a trade to, and they're in line for a top 10 draft pick.

Big downside is their gawd-awful cap situation next season, but I don't know enough about their potential buy-out options.
I'm guessing they'll amnesty buy-out one or two of Ohlund, Brewer, Salo, or Malone. But yeah, might be a good fit. They always need more two-way D, and they might want another run for Lecavalier. Plus, it's Yzerman. It's possible.

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04-02-2013, 10:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Linkster View Post
Does it make any sense for DW to talk to Tampa Bay about a Boyle trade? Could it be a draft day deal?

Seems like they're the only non-contender that Boyle might approve a trade to, and they're in line for a top 10 draft pick.

Big downside is their gawd-awful cap situation next season, but I don't know enough about their potential buy-out options.
I think Boyle's partial NTC opens up during the offseason. He can only name 8 teams he WON'T accept a trade to. DW can trade him to any of the other 21 teams. I'm not sure when this window opens up - ideally before this year's draft.

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04-02-2013, 10:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Gilligans Island View Post
I think Boyle's partial NTC opens up during the offseason. He can only name 8 teams he WON'T accept a trade to. DW can trade him to any of the other 21 teams. I'm not sure when this window opens up - ideally before this year's draft.
It opened up last June.

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04-02-2013, 10:20 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by rangerssharks414 View Post
It opened up last June.
For some reason I thought it closed back up before the season started. Great if it's still open.

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04-02-2013, 10:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Gilligans Island View Post
I think Boyle's partial NTC opens up during the offseason. He can only name 8 teams he WON'T accept a trade to. DW can trade him to any of the other 21 teams. I'm not sure when this window opens up - ideally before this year's draft.
Details are buried deep deep inside the new CBA, no doubt. They might need to send in Kurz to investigate!

All kidding aside, this will be a great draft day for semi-pro Sharks fans (like me) to actually tune in to.

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04-02-2013, 10:23 PM
  #90
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They've been drafting great lately when they DO draft, especially in the first round, but DW usually trades the picks.

The fact that under DW we have about a 50% success rate of useful NHL players (3 for 6, Nieto is the 7th, jury is out) in the second round is pretty good. Also very good in the late rounds under DW, and the last two first round picks weren't bad. Coyle looks like a guaranteed top-6 forward and the people who watch him more than me say that Hertl is all but a lock to be a top 6 player.

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04-02-2013, 10:29 PM
  #91
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Originally Posted by Pinkfloyd View Post
Outside of Hertl and Nieto, the Sharks have no forward that projects beyond the 3rd line level. They have plenty of defensemen to fill out the depth levels. They're committing to Burns as their #1 and Vlasic is a serviceable partner for him for as long as they want to do that. They don't need much focus on that level with a young roster of d-men and solid group of d-men prospects. And honestly, the need for much attention or resources on goalies is dwindling overall. You can go years and not draft any and it wouldn't matter because it's cheap to go out and find someone to fill the role and do well as long as it fits.

If they can pluck two quality winger prospects out of the draft that can/will project to be a top six player, they will succeed in a short term refresh or whatever they want to call it. If they land three, it would be ideal in terms of preparing for the future as Marleau and Havlat will be on their way out when this class is about ready to step in. Three would actually fill a void if we assume Nieto is filling the fourth winger spot in the top six. However, it's not all that likely to get that kind of pull in this draft with their picks as they are.

To get two, they likely will need a solid pick in the first round and hope that one of their pretty much four second round picks goes to historic formula of a 25% clip of success.

Of course, all this doesn't mean anything if they find a long term solution by trading Boyle or someone else for a young winger that has many years of top six play in front of him.
Could Neito play on JT's wing? Sounds like he has the tools. If Hertl comes over next year,he could start the 3rd line with Shepp & Pavs.

With Acolatse,Abeltshauser,Doherty,Petrecki in the pipe line why not trade/package them for winger prospects??

WHAT IF Burns dominates in the playoffs at F??? THIS IS THE BIGGEST ISSUE imo..I think this team is better with him at forward and Boyle the #1D..In this case, Boyle doesn't get traded and Burns is our starting RW for the 13-14 season..This is why I feel we move/trade/buyout Havlat(5mil)& trade Nemo(3.8) THIS SUMMER.
Between the picks we have,Havlat,Nemo being moved,the Sharks could put together a nice package for some quality wingers.

Roll with this to start the 13'-14 season:
Neito(692k)-Jt(7m)-Burns(5.76m)=13.45
Patty(6.9m)-juicy(2.875)-Wingels(775k)=10.5
Shepp(1.2m?)-pavs(4m)-Hertl(2m?)=7.2
Gali(900k)-gomez(850k)-desi(700k)=2.45
33.6
Irwin(800k)-Boyle(6.66m)=7.46
Vlasic(4.25m)-Braun(1.25m)=5.50
Stuart(3.6m)-Demers(1.8m)=5.4
Tennyson(1.175m)
19.535
Stalock(900k)
Sateri(900k)
1.8
CapHit of 54,935,000....I ballparked on a few(shepp/hertl/both goalies)but should be close.THATS 10MIL IN CAP SPACE..

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04-02-2013, 10:35 PM
  #92
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Originally Posted by TheJuxtaposer View Post
I'm guessing they'll amnesty buy-out one or two of Ohlund, Brewer, Salo, or Malone. But yeah, might be a good fit. They always need more two-way D, and they might want another run for Lecavalier. Plus, it's Yzerman. It's possible.
Seems like Yzerman would prefer youth. But he still has to sell tickets next season, and Boyle might get that done.

Daring to dream for Tampa's 1st.

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04-02-2013, 10:39 PM
  #93
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FeedingFrenzy View Post
Could Neito play on JT's wing? Sounds like he has the tools. If Hertl comes over next year,he could start the 3rd line with Shepp & Pavs.

With Acolatse,Abeltshauser,Doherty,Petrecki in the pipe line why not trade/package them for winger prospects??

WHAT IF Burns dominates in the playoffs at F??? THIS IS THE BIGGEST ISSUE imo..I think this team is better with him at forward and Boyle the #1D..In this case, Boyle doesn't get traded and Burns is our starting RW for the 13-14 season..This is why I feel we move/trade/buyout Havlat(5mil)& trade Nemo(3.8) THIS SUMMER.
Between the picks we have,Havlat,Nemo being moved,the Sharks could put together a nice package for some quality wingers.

Roll with this to start the 13'-14 season:
Neito(692k)-Jt(7m)-Burns(5.76m)=13.45
Patty(6.9m)-juicy(2.875)-Wingels(775k)=10.5
Shepp(1.2m?)-pavs(4m)-Hertl(2m?)=7.2
Gali(900k)-gomez(850k)-desi(700k)=2.45
33.6
Irwin(800k)-Boyle(6.66m)=7.46
Vlasic(4.25m)-Braun(1.25m)=5.50
Stuart(3.6m)-Demers(1.8m)=5.4
Tennyson(1.175m)
19.535
Stalock(900k)
Sateri(900k)
1.8
CapHit of 54,935,000....I ballparked on a few(shepp/hertl/both goalies)but should be close.THATS 10MIL IN CAP SPACE..
Throwing Nieto into a high-expectation role right out the gate of his professional career is not smart. He still has a lot of learning to do. He's not like Couture and even if he was, he needs to start a season in Worcester and let him focus on improving his game before making him worry about his productivity. I don't think Hertl's coming over next year. I'm pretty sure it's going to be another year then he'll come over.

As for your question, prospect swaps very rarely work out. They need to prove themselves at the NHL level somewhat then be moved to garner value. Otherwise, they're adds for a trade involving a legitimate NHL'er.

It really doesn't matter if Burns dominates in the playoffs as a forward. While I agree this team is better with him up front, this team isn't going to last forever. Boyle is not going to work back there past next season at most. The reality is that finding a forward is easier than finding a #1 d-man and Burns is a #1 d-man.

Buying out Havlat doesn't provide the team any assets. Trading Niemi, even at his peak value, is not going to yield quality assets in the form you're seeking. Goalies are cheap to acquire because there is a surplus. This team also is not going to go out and sign anyone via free agency at that level so where do the wingers come from except for the draft or trading what we have on the blue line? Even with all the selections the team has, they need to use them to replenish the pool first and foremost. So by and large those assets are off the table as well.

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04-02-2013, 10:40 PM
  #94
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Originally Posted by FeedingFrenzy View Post
Could Neito play on JT's wing? Sounds like he has the tools. If Hertl comes over next year,he could start the 3rd line with Shepp & Pavs.

With Acolatse,Abeltshauser,Doherty,Petrecki in the pipe line why not trade/package them for winger prospects??

WHAT IF Burns dominates in the playoffs at F??? THIS IS THE BIGGEST ISSUE imo..I think this team is better with him at forward and Boyle the #1D..In this case, Boyle doesn't get traded and Burns is our starting RW for the 13-14 season..This is why I feel we move/trade/buyout Havlat(5mil)& trade Nemo(3.8) THIS SUMMER.
Between the picks we have,Havlat,Nemo being moved,the Sharks could put together a nice package for some quality wingers.

Roll with this to start the 13'-14 season:
Neito(692k)-Jt(7m)-Burns(5.76m)=13.45
Patty(6.9m)-juicy(2.875)-Wingels(775k)=10.5
Shepp(1.2m?)-pavs(4m)-Hertl(2m?)=7.2
Gali(900k)-gomez(850k)-desi(700k)=2.45
33.6
Irwin(800k)-Boyle(6.66m)=7.46
Vlasic(4.25m)-Braun(1.25m)=5.50
Stuart(3.6m)-Demers(1.8m)=5.4
Tennyson(1.175m)
19.535
Stalock(900k)
Sateri(900k)
1.8
CapHit of 54,935,000....I ballparked on a few(shepp/hertl/both goalies)but should be close.THATS 10MIL IN CAP SPACE..
Snowball's chance that Gomez bites on 850k. He is about the money. More likely around $2mil. Hertl will get a rookie contract and I doubt big bonuses will be associated as sizable bonuses rarely get outside of the top 10 picks.

The Sharks, after Clowe, have about $1mil/slot for 9 slots. All lower slots. Any veteran acquisition is going to require moving a big contract, not one of the $1mil/year guys.

The easiest moves, based on performance, would be Stuart and Havlat. Both have clauses. I don't think DW will push either until the deadline next season.

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04-02-2013, 10:41 PM
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Worst case scenario, if the team felt they had to get rid of Havlat, we could almost definitely get some sort of asset from New Jersey, who has the space, need, and Elias/Zidlicky.

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04-02-2013, 10:42 PM
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Originally Posted by TheJuxtaposer View Post
Worst case scenario, if the team felt they had to get rid of Havlat, we could almost definitely get some sort of asset from New Jersey, who has the space, need, and Elias/Zidlicky.
Elias Gomez. Back again

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04-02-2013, 10:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Linkster View Post
Seems like Yzerman would prefer youth. But he still has to sell tickets next season, and Boyle might get that done.

Daring to dream for Tampa's 1st.
Is Boyle for Tampa's 1st (which may be in the top 5) a fair trade? Or would the Sharks have to add? I'm betting the latter, but I really have no idea.

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04-02-2013, 10:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FeedingFrenzy View Post
Could Neito play on JT's wing? Sounds like he has the tools. If Hertl comes over next year,he could start the 3rd line with Shepp & Pavs.

With Acolatse,Abeltshauser,Doherty,Petrecki in the pipe line why not trade/package them for winger prospects??

WHAT IF Burns dominates in the playoffs at F??? THIS IS THE BIGGEST ISSUE imo..I think this team is better with him at forward and Boyle the #1D..In this case, Boyle doesn't get traded and Burns is our starting RW for the 13-14 season..This is why I feel we move/trade/buyout Havlat(5mil)& trade Nemo(3.8) THIS SUMMER.
Between the picks we have,Havlat,Nemo being moved,the Sharks could put together a nice package for some quality wingers.

Roll with this to start the 13'-14 season:
Neito(692k)-Jt(7m)-Burns(5.76m)=13.45
Patty(6.9m)-juicy(2.875)-Wingels(775k)=10.5
Shepp(1.2m?)-pavs(4m)-Hertl(2m?)=7.2
Gali(900k)-gomez(850k)-desi(700k)=2.45
33.6
Irwin(800k)-Boyle(6.66m)=7.46
Vlasic(4.25m)-Braun(1.25m)=5.50
Stuart(3.6m)-Demers(1.8m)=5.4
Tennyson(1.175m)
19.535
Stalock(900k)
Sateri(900k)
1.8
CapHit of 54,935,000....I ballparked on a few(shepp/hertl/both goalies)but should be close.THATS 10MIL IN CAP SPACE..
Why would you want Nemo moved? I thought we've already established that elite goalies like him don't come around very often.

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04-02-2013, 10:43 PM
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Originally Posted by SJeasy View Post
Snowball's chance that Gomez bites on 850k. He is about the money. More likely around $2mil. Hertl will get a rookie contract and I doubt big bonuses will be associated as sizable bonuses rarely get outside of the top 10 picks.

The Sharks, after Clowe, have about $1mil/slot for 9 slots. All lower slots. Any veteran acquisition is going to require moving a big contract, not one of the $1mil/year guys.

The easiest moves, based on performance, would be Stuart and Havlat. Both have clauses. I don't think DW will push either until the deadline next season.
Best / easiest move should be moving Boyle (or Havlat) to free up space. Need a vet like Stuey in the back more than Boyle, IMO.

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04-02-2013, 10:43 PM
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Originally Posted by SJeasy View Post
Snowball's chance that Gomez bites on 850k. He is about the money. More likely around $2mil. Hertl will get a rookie contract and I doubt big bonuses will be associated as sizable bonuses rarely get outside of the top 10 picks.

The Sharks, after Clowe, have about $1mil/slot for 9 slots. All lower slots. Any veteran acquisition is going to require moving a big contract, not one of the $1mil/year guys.

The easiest moves, based on performance, would be Stuart and Havlat. Both have clauses. I don't think DW will push either until the deadline next season.
Now when you say the easiest moves based on performance, are you saying those two deserve to be first on the chopping block as a big contract to go? Because I would disagree with Stuart when Boyle hasn't performed at his normal level. I do agree with Havlat but I don't see how moving him with his clause and value would get us any better.

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