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[DAL/BOS] Jaromir Jagr to Boston for Lane MacDermid, Cody Payne, conditional 2nd

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04-03-2013, 11:15 AM
  #676
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Originally Posted by Hedberg1 View Post
Yeah people bringing up career stats and whatnot need to stop. This isn't the 2000, hart and Pearson winning Jagr. He'll provide a little offense and powerplay help but he isn't the dominant force he once was.
This. People are also conveniently forgetting that he was a 3rd/4th liner on the pens cup teams. His stats are great for the playoffs, mostly due to when he was in his prime with some very competitive pens teams (without 66). No one has ever accused him of being a leader or bringing other intangibles into play. Both he and Iginla are "depth" guys for the teams that acquired them. The difference being that Iginla has the intangibles while Jagr doesn't. No one (outside of recent events) has ever uttered a negative word about Iginla's attitude/commitment. The same cannot be said for Jagr.

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04-03-2013, 11:32 AM
  #677
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Originally Posted by The Dangley One View Post
Iginla never has and never will be able to do what Jagr does on the offensive end of the ice.
That is right... Jagr was one of the most gifted and exciting offensive performer, but Jagr still cannot provide what Iginla can provide. A nasty gritty in your face experience. Iginla is built for the playoffs.

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04-03-2013, 11:36 AM
  #678
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Originally Posted by TSC View Post
Jarg has been over a PPG player in the playoffs his entire career. He's a great depth pickup for the Bruins, and will definitely help them in the playoff run.
unless it is a short playoff run.... like 4 games ....... Jagr will not be a point a game player in the 2013 playoff year.

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04-03-2013, 11:46 AM
  #679
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Originally Posted by NWTBoonies View Post
That is right... Jagr was one of the most gifted and exciting offensive performer, but Jagr still cannot provide what Iginla can provide. A nasty gritty in your face experience. Iginla is built for the playoffs.
Give us a brake will you, those days are long gone and hard to find, didnt he get his ass kick by that redheaded kid that plays for dallas ?

Nasty ?

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04-03-2013, 11:59 AM
  #680
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Originally Posted by 4ORRBRUIN View Post
Give us a brake will you, those days are long gone and hard to find, didnt he get his ass kick by that redheaded kid that plays for dallas ?

Nasty ?
He won the crap out of that fight, and he didn't even break a sweat. Eakin flopped around the entire time like a rag doll. Iginla's not the same force he was in his prime, but that's a terrible example to bring up. He could've wiped the floor with Eakin if he'd felt like it.

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04-03-2013, 12:03 PM
  #681
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This I can agree with. I'm a huge Iginla fan, but at this point in his career he has appeared to be only a little more effective than Jagr currently is, overall. Still better, but when you're talking about a playoff team that's trying to add some top 6 scoring, I don't think Iginla's potential contribution to Boston over Jagr was going to be worth the value difference between Koko+1st compared to a conditional 1st and whoever these two kids are.

I'd love to see Iggy turn it on and blast out a Conn Smythe or something, and it's not entirely out of the question, but as of this moment I'd say he and Jagr are very similar players in terms of their offensive effectiveness. If you want to bring things like lockerroom presence, intangibles, etc. into the discussion, that's another story, but I don't think we're really talking about that here.


Last edited by EastonBlues22: 04-03-2013 at 12:05 PM. Reason: qdp
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04-03-2013, 12:09 PM
  #682
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Originally Posted by SmellOfVictory View Post
This I can agree with. I'm a huge Iginla fan, but at this point in his career he has appeared to be only a little more effective than Jagr currently is, overall. Still better, but when you're talking about a playoff team that's trying to add some top 6 scoring, I don't think Iginla's potential contribution to Boston over Jagr was going to be worth the value difference between Koko+1st compared to a conditional 1st and whoever these two kids are.

I'd love to see Iggy turn it on and blast out a Conn Smythe or something, and it's not entirely out of the question, but as of this moment I'd say he and Jagr are very similar players in terms of their offensive effectiveness. If you want to bring things like lockerroom presence, intangibles, etc. into the discussion, that's another story, but I don't think we're really talking about that here.
Exactly.

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04-03-2013, 12:25 PM
  #683
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Jagr is a terrific fit for Boston.

Him on the PP feeding Chara, finding the open guys on either side for the one timer, shooting it on net for the bigger guys to bury it. Boston addressed their only major weakness.

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04-03-2013, 12:54 PM
  #684
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Originally Posted by SupremefartMachine View Post
Just wait until he's sporting those glorious yellow socks.
As I said in another thread, I had a weird dream where Jagr has a spaced-out/confused moment and goes top shelf on Rask.

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04-03-2013, 01:01 PM
  #685
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Originally Posted by The Furnace View Post
Why is it being reported as a conditional 2nd? Aren't conditional picks usually reported with the better, lower (closer to 1) option first. As in this is a conditional first?
You report the sure thing.

So they got a 2nd-rounder which could become a 1st-rounder.

But that 1st-rounder would almost be a high 2nd-rounder as it would be the 27th/28th/29th/30th pick.

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04-03-2013, 01:12 PM
  #686
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Lemieux never won a Cup after 1992 either. Winning takes a whole team to do it. What is being a winner? Playing in net, playing on all 3 defensive pairings and all 4 forward combinations all at once?

Jagr always did his fair share and then some during his prime when it came to the playoffs. Not that long ago (2007-08) at age 36 and way past his prime Jagr put up a huge 15 Pts in 10 games. Had that team gotten more from Drury, Gomez and Shanahan (players who all get a free pass for the Rangers' struggles) that team possibly at least beats the Penguins and advances to the Eastern Conference Finals. His play against the Penguins in 5 games was as dominant a performance you will get from an individual player.

I hope for argument's sake Jagr takes his game to another level from this point on and carries the momentum into the playoffs and then just beats the Penguins.

He would easily be a PPG player right now had the Stars been a team capable of potting in all those great setups and passes Jagr gave them. In the last 5 games he played with the Stars alone, he could have easily had 10 assists and most who watched him play this year will agree, heck even ask Dallas fans.

Jagr never came back to the NHL to just collect his cheques and playout his twilight years. He came back to play a significant part on a winning team and help them win the Cup.

I think on the powerplay alone Jagr's presence will play dividends for the Bruins. Imagine having Jagr and Chara on the same powerplay? It will happen.

If Jagr can develop quick chemistry with his linemates then I can see him finishing strong enough to end up with a PPG average by season's end. He's got 13 games to do it. I say it's possible.


Last edited by EastonBlues22: 04-03-2013 at 01:27 PM. Reason: qdp
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04-03-2013, 01:14 PM
  #687
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Originally Posted by The Dangley One View Post
So is jagr, buy I could easily counter that by bringing up the point that jagr is on the 3rd line and iginla is on the 1st line
Jagr is on the 3rd line? He was playing on Dallas' first line all season long and was leading that team in goals and points.

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04-03-2013, 01:24 PM
  #688
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Originally Posted by Coach Parker View Post
See, I think it all depends on who each team is playing and not on the age.

For example, if Pittsburgh has to play against the Rangers in the first round while the Bruins face the Senators I can see how Iginla would come out much more fatigued than Jagr (Senators play a much more up-tempo speed game while the Rangers and Penguins would go to war).

Just an example. Now what if the Bruins then play the Jets while the Penguins get the Canadiens? Once again, the series will take it's toll on Pittsburgh. It is all relative to the teams they are playing.

I'll still take both players going deep and playing at the top of their game this season. I don't see either of these players showing signs of fatigue in the playoffs.
A younger Jagr had 3 goals in his last 23 regular season games last + 1 goal in 11 playoff games, which included 6 games of pond hockey against the Pens.

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04-03-2013, 01:27 PM
  #689
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Originally Posted by livewell68 View Post
Lemieux never won a Cup after 1992 either. Winning takes a whole team to do it. What is being a winner? Playing in net, playing on all 3 defensive pairings and all 4 forward combinations all at once?

Jagr always did his fair share and then some during his prime when it came to the playoffs. Not that long ago (2007-08) at age 36 and way past his prime Jagr put up a huge 15 Pts in 10 games. Had that team gotten more from Drury, Gomez and Shanahan (players who all get a free pass for the Rangers' struggles) that team possibly at least beats the Penguins and advances to the Eastern Conference Finals. His play against the Penguins in 5 games was as dominant a performance you will get from an individual player.

I hope for argument's sake Jagr takes his game to another level from this point on and carries the momentum into the playoffs and then just beats the Penguins.

He would easily be a PPG player right now had the Stars been a team capable of potting in all those great setups and passes Jagr gave them. In the last 5 games he played with the Stars alone, he could have easily had 10 assists and most who watched him play this year will agree, heck even ask Dallas fans.

Jagr never came back to the NHL to just collect his cheques and playout his twilight years. He came back to play a significant part on a winning team and help them win the Cup.

I think on the powerplay alone Jagr's presence will play dividends for the Bruins. Imagine having Jagr and Chara on the same powerplay? It will happen.

If Jagr can develop quick chemistry with his linemates then I can see him finishing strong enough to end up with a PPG average by season's end. He's got 13 games to do it. I say it's possible.
Difference between Jagr and Lemieux in terms of leading teams is pretty evident. Lemieux was able to win as the guy, Jagr was not.

And to the bolded, new to the NHL are we?

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04-03-2013, 01:28 PM
  #690
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Originally Posted by beauchamp View Post
A younger Jagr had 3 goals in his last 23 regular season games last + 1 goal in 11 playoff games, which included 6 games of pond hockey against the Pens.
A younger Jagr who was coming off of 3 years being away from the NHL and who was bothered by a groin injury pretty much the entire second half of the season. Last year is last year.

This year Jagr has looked better and is much healthier. Also playing in Boston's system will benefit him. It's been a very long time since Jagr has played on such a great team as Boston. Opponents will not be able to rough him as he now has teammates that can step in and protect him.

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04-03-2013, 01:34 PM
  #691
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Originally Posted by Pens1566 View Post
Difference between Jagr and Lemieux in terms of leading teams is pretty evident. Lemieux was able to win as the guy, Jagr was not.

And to the bolded, new to the NHL are we?
New to the NHL? I have watched hockey since the late 80's.

The difference is actually that Lemieux was in his prime and before Jagr even came into the picture, he had missed the playoffs in all but 1 of his seasons to start his career. On the other hand Jagr never missed the playoffs as a Penguin, Lemieux or not.

Also by the time Jagr was in his prime, he had some pretty weak teams that he carried and helped them to overachieve. Jagr at his very best is 1998-99 and 1999-00. Those teams no matter how well Jagr played, were not going to beat teams like the Flyers. He also played hurt in those years.

Lemieux was flat out dominant in his Cup runs but if not for Jagr (at age 20) carrying those Penguins when Lemieux went down with an injury, that 1992 team doesn't even get to the Finals. Also do you forget that goal that Jagr scored against Chicago? That goal changed the entire momentum and outcome of that series. The Penguins looked outmatched up until then, the Blackhawks were coming off a record 11 straight wins in the playoffs and looked to continue that march. Everything changed after that goal.

Jagr is not asked to be the man right now, just part of the team. He does have a lot more left in the tank though than most would like to admit.


Last edited by livewell68: 04-03-2013 at 01:42 PM.
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04-03-2013, 01:37 PM
  #692
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Don't make us lock this thread... stay on topic. Crosby winning a cup has nothing to do with anything.

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04-03-2013, 01:43 PM
  #693
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Interesting. Penguins get Iginla to try and win him his first cup. Bruins get Jagr who has won before and will give them the boost they need right now in the scoring dept. Imagine if the Penguins got knocked off in the playoffs by Boston after Iginla decided to choose to go to Pittsburgh lol.

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04-03-2013, 01:45 PM
  #694
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I still take Jagr 100/100 over Iginla when you account for pure skill, experience, and what the Bruins had to give up in the trade. Excellent trade by Chiarelli and a win-win for both teams.

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04-03-2013, 01:49 PM
  #695
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Originally Posted by livewell68 View Post
New to the NHL? I have watched hockey since the late 80's.

The difference is actually that Lemieux was in his prime and before Jagr even came into the picture, he had missed the playoffs in all but 1 of his seasons to start his career. On the other hand Jagr never missed the playoffs as a Penguin, Lemieux or not.

Also by the time Jagr was in his prime, he had some pretty weak teams that he carried and helped them to overachieve. Jagr at his very best is 1998-99 and 1999-00. Those teams no matter how well Jagr played, were not going to beat teams like the Flyers. He also played hurt in those years.

Lemieux was flat out dominant in his Cup runs but if not for Jagr (at age 20) carrying those Penguins when Lemieux went down with an injury, that 1992 team doesn't even get to the Finals. Also do you forget that goal that Jagr scored against Chicago? That goal changed the entire momentum and outcome of that series. The Penguins looked outmatched up until then, the Blackhawks were coming off a record 11 straight wins in the playoffs and looked to continue that march. Everything changed after that goal.

Jagr is not asked to be the man right now, just part of the team. He does have a lot more left in the tank though than most would like to admit.
Aside from the goal in game 1 against the Hawks, revisionist history. Like I said earlier (possibly even in this thread) Stevens and Murphy (and Francis and Tocchet and ... you get the point) had more to do with those teams winning the cup than a 3rd/4th line Jagr ever did.

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04-03-2013, 01:54 PM
  #696
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Aside from the goal in game 1 against the Hawks, revisionist history. Like I said earlier (possibly even in this thread) Stevens and Murphy (and Francis and Tocchet and ... you get the point) had more to do with those teams winning the cup than a 3rd/4th line Jagr ever did.
Jagr didn't have much to do with the 1991 Cup win but as for the 1992 win, he was a huge factor. It wasn't Stevens, Murphy, Francis or Tocchet who carrried those Penguins when Lemieux went down against the Rangers, it was Jagr.

Jagr was never the type of player who leeched off of other players or who padded his stats. BTW, Jagr played on the second line in the 1991-92 playoffs, not the 3rd or 4th lines.

I'm not going to argue about this though. Let the outcome prove that Jagr going to Boston was a better deal than Iginla going to Pittsburgh.

I just find it a bit amusing that a thread about Jagr being traded to Boston is mostly being populated by Pittsburgh fans.


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04-03-2013, 02:26 PM
  #697
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Pens fan love Jagr, admit or not

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04-03-2013, 02:57 PM
  #698
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Pens fan love Jagr, admit or not
I never boo'd him, thought it was kind of silly (aside from the fact that it seemed to work, it usually took him off his game).

And I would have welcomed him back to Pittsburgh, as a backup plan. He certainly is a good addition, if you keep perspective on what the 41 year old Jagr brings to the table, and ignore the HOF past and do not let that cloud your judgment. Jagr was a good pickup, but he is not what so many in this thread are expecting him to be. I expect a lot of you will be disappointed when the dust has settled. The cost reflected accurately what he brings. And the fact that people are building him into more than he is right now is a shame, because he does bring some valuable things to the table.

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04-03-2013, 04:27 PM
  #699
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This. People are also conveniently forgetting that he was a 3rd/4th liner on the pens cup teams. His stats are great for the playoffs, mostly due to when he was in his prime with some very competitive pens teams (without 66). No one has ever accused him of being a leader or bringing other intangibles into play. Both he and Iginla are "depth" guys for the teams that acquired them. The difference being that Iginla has the intangibles while Jagr doesn't. No one (outside of recent events) has ever uttered a negative word about Iginla's attitude/commitment. The same cannot be said for Jagr.
Intangibles for Iginla? I don't know about that..

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04-03-2013, 04:44 PM
  #700
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Lemieux was flat out dominant in his Cup runs but if not for Jagr (at age 20) carrying those Penguins when Lemieux went down with an injury, that 1992 team doesn't even get to the Finals.
Ron Francis says hi.

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