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[NYR/CBJ] Gaborik, Delisle, Parlett to Columbus for Brassard, Dorsett, J. Moore, 6th

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Old
04-04-2013, 11:46 AM
  #776
Ola
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Originally Posted by BPD View Post
Good god, am I the only poster here who thinks this was a good hockey trade? Seriously?

The Jackets had expendable depth and needed a scorer. The Rangers had an expendable scorer and needed depth. Both got what they wanted. End.

The ONLY way this trade goes lopsided is if Brassard or Moore realize their draft potential or Gaborik suddenly becomes Sidney Crosby.
The level at this board is pretty ridiculous.

A couple of things.

-Has anyone, who trash the trade, even mentioned one thing about what CBJ should have done -- instead -- of this trade?

Its just reality, but its not easy for a team like CBJ to attract UFA's. They have to develop/trade for any player they are going to get basically. And kids tends to develop a helluva lot better on good teams instead of below avg temas.

For CBJ this process of getting over that 8th spot bump has more or less been ongoing for ever now. I've not heard that they turned down a deal for a better player than Gabby.

-I like the deal from NYR's point of view -- if -- Brassard basically exceeds everyone's expectations. I think there were enough teams in the NHL -- in the CBJ-mold, who have to "overpay" to just get established experienced players who can take on certain goto roles on their teams and take pressure of the kids, or teams like say Vancouver who possibly might look for 2nd line precense -- for Slats to get one priced assed in return. Somewhere along the lines of a Brayden Schenn maybe. Or a high pick.

If Brassard "just" becomes like Matt Cullen II, I am not a big fan of the trade.

No matter what I definitely like the concept of the trade. I just don't believe in Gabby on a strong team.

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04-04-2013, 11:54 AM
  #777
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I hate to admit this... but this trade will make the Rangers a tougher team to play against.

They lost their identidy when they moved a bunch of players for Nash and didn't resign Prust. Now, with Clowe and the 3 players they landed from Columbus, they got most of that identity back and will make them a much harder team to play against.

You don't win cups with a bunch of All-Stars on your 1st line and average players threwout your entire lineup. If there's one thing the Rangers organisation should know by now, is that building a team of "big names", doesn't get you anywhere. They've been gathering "big names" for years and the result has been the same year after year.

Good move for the Rangers... unfortunatly for this Devils fan.

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04-04-2013, 12:45 PM
  #778
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The bigger move for the Rangers was picking up Clowe. If Dorsett were healthy and could play I think he would really help in the lockerroom, however, he's not due back until the playoffs which could potentially be too late. Clowe is a good addition and will pay the bigger dividends this year than any of the players from Columbus (last night not withstanding).

It's a good trade overall for both teams as they both addressed needs. question marks on both sides so we'll have to wait to see what happens.

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04-04-2013, 01:00 PM
  #779
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What opposing fans fail to realize is that this move from a Rangers perspective was highly cap influenced. Gaborik has another year at $7.5 and the cap goes down 6 million next season. The Rangers will have to re-sign Stepan, McDonagh and Hagelin who are all coming off their ELC's. They can now do that with ease and still give Clowe a long term contract upwards of $5 million.

Perhaps the current state of the team expedited the decision, but Gaborik was gone either way before next season. This is no knee-jerk reaction. It was inevitable.

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04-04-2013, 01:05 PM
  #780
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Way too early to say who won but this move made sense for both teams. Columbus Rangers needed a scorer and happens to have chemistry with Prospal, Dubi, and Anisimov. New York Blue Jackets addressed needing depth, and guys with more JAM. Also Gaborik was going sooner or later with the cap going down next year. Obviously Torts would rather have his boy Richards then Gabby.

And no one should expect these guys to keep racking up as much points as they did last night. I would say alot of it has to do more with adrenaline then anything else.

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04-04-2013, 01:06 PM
  #781
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A lot of this has to do with Tortorella and Richards. If the coaches can use the players they got effectively and not stifle them, then it should be an exciting trade for both teams.

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04-04-2013, 01:55 PM
  #782
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having not read all 32 pages, I am not sure if anyone saw the one player that has already moved between these two teams in this deal. Delisle was part of the Nash trade, now goes back to CBJ. he seems to be an escort for high priced scorers as a throw in player in deals between these 2 teams

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04-04-2013, 01:57 PM
  #783
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This move gives the Rangers their identity back. Obviously Clowe plays a big part in that too. For that, these moves were smart. For CBJ, they get a big time goal scorer, which they definitely needed badly. Like it a lot for both sides.

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04-04-2013, 02:01 PM
  #784
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Gabby needed a change of scenery and I hope he does well in Columbus.....As a Ranger fan, I like the trade(added much needed depth) and hope it pays off for both teams.

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04-04-2013, 02:08 PM
  #785
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Originally Posted by Oh Thats Nashty View Post
What opposing fans fail to realize is that this move from a Rangers perspective was highly cap influenced. Gaborik has another year at $7.5 and the cap goes down 6 million next season. The Rangers will have to re-sign Stepan, McDonagh and Hagelin who are all coming off their ELC's. They can now do that with ease and still give Clowe a long term contract upwards of $5 million.

Perhaps the current state of the team expedited the decision, but Gaborik was gone either way before next season. This is no knee-jerk reaction. It was inevitable.
However, this move only saved $1.7MM in cap space from this deal. Maybe that's enough? That's probably a 3rd line addition to the Rangers value wise (or Clowe at $5MM with no additions). The bigger advantage likely comes from Redden and Drury dropping off the cap figure. If they want to sign Clowe, Stepan, McDonagh, Hagelin and Zuccarello next year (don't know if they qualify Sauer) they still probably need some creativity. The year after that is another big year with Callahan, Lundquist, Brassard, Moore (probably not an issue), MDZ and Girardi needing to be signed.

I think this was the year for them to move Gaborik not necessarily for cap reasons but maybe they felt they wouldn't get the return next year if teams thought their cap problems would severe. Maybe Gaborik was similar to the Luongo situation in Vancouver (don't see Vancouver getting fair return for Lou). The cap is definitely an impact but I don't think it opened up a lot of space with this move.

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04-04-2013, 03:17 PM
  #786
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Originally Posted by Xoggz22 View Post
However, this move only saved $1.7MM in cap space from this deal. Maybe that's enough? That's probably a 3rd line addition to the Rangers value wise (or Clowe at $5MM with no additions). The bigger advantage likely comes from Redden and Drury dropping off the cap figure. If they want to sign Clowe, Stepan, McDonagh, Hagelin and Zuccarello next year (don't know if they qualify Sauer) they still probably need some creativity. The year after that is another big year with Callahan, Lundquist, Brassard, Moore (probably not an issue), MDZ and Girardi needing to be signed.

I think this was the year for them to move Gaborik not necessarily for cap reasons but maybe they felt they wouldn't get the return next year if teams thought their cap problems would severe. Maybe Gaborik was similar to the Luongo situation in Vancouver (don't see Vancouver getting fair return for Lou). The cap is definitely an impact but I don't think it opened up a lot of space with this move.
It's a bit more fluid because these guys, along with probable contributions from guys like Lindberg and Fast allow us to free up some spots in the summer. Guys like Boyle, Pyatt, Powe, etc, could all be dealt for assets that do not effect the cap. So, in the short term, it didn't do too much to the cap, but it gives us options that we were lacking with so much money tied up in only a handful of players.

I don't think Clowe will get $5M, and the team is notoriously stingy when it comes to bridge deals, so we should be able to work it all out. How well Zucc plays over the next couple weeks will really determine his future with the team. Plus, hopefully Kreider and Miller will be able to challenge for a spot again next fall. Barring injuries, I think they'll be in CT for the remainder of the Whale's season.

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04-04-2013, 05:04 PM
  #787
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Originally Posted by First Man In View Post
There are some well-known Ranger haters who use the derogatory name "rags" to get a rise out of people. I wouldn't feel so cocky after tanking in the mid 200s to get 2 generational players and a very shaky goalie who just so happened to win a cup with 3 overall picks. The Rangers NEVER tank, that's why it's damn near impossible for us (or anyone outside of Detroit for that matter) to draft our own franchise forwards or defensemen because we never finish low enough in the standings. We drafted our franchise goalie and our franchise defenseman (Staal in 06) and add to the team through free agency or trades. That's what you do when you want to win. Haters like that gonna keep hating, and quite frankly, it's all good because when we put a beat down like last nights on the Pens it feels that much better knowing we didn't have to tank for 3 years to score some goals.
Do we really have to hear this tanking nonsense all the time? The Pens were 12-5-3-0 in their final 20 games of the 2003-04 season which got them Malkin. I'd hardly call that tanking to get Malkin. There was no season in 2004-05 that got them Crosby. How do you tank in a season that never happened?

It also goes without saying that the Rangers never had to tank during the mid 2000's or earlier since they were in a huge market in a pre salary cap league. They were a team that could try to fix a lot of their problems in UFA instead of the draft. What's hilarious is spending lots of money in UFA didn't seem to work in the 2000's for them. It wasn't until they started building from within that they turned things around again.

Anyway, I like the trade for the Rangers. I've always loved Dorsett. He's one of my favorites grinders in the league. Brassard has lots of skill and you saw flashes last night of what he's capable of. He just hasn't put it all together yet. Maybe he will in NY.

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04-04-2013, 05:25 PM
  #788
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This Ranger fan wishes Gaborik nothing but the best, miss the guy already but it is what it is.

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04-04-2013, 08:07 PM
  #789
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Originally Posted by Iron Balls McGinty View Post
As a CBJ fan, Derek Dorsett is not a top 6 player. He is exactly what he is. A 3rd liner with a ton of heart and grit and will be good for maybe 10 goals a year. He had 12 last season.

Brassard has the potential to be a good top 6 player but it never really materialized consistently but I thought he played pretty well this year. He can be a solid #2 Center but he isn't physical enough to be a 3rd liner C.

The highest upside is probably actually John Moore. I'm still pretty high on him to have a long career in the NHL but the CBJ's D depth really made him expendable.

I do agree both teams got what they want. CBJ desperately need someone to score some goals and the Rangers get some much needed depth back that was lost when they sent Anisimov and Dubinsky to Columbus last summer.
I think if Dorsett develops his offense a bit, or something just clicks with him, he could have decent 2nd line capability, he's already steadily hitting 20 points and if he does develop that offensive talent i could see 30-40 point seasons in the future.

brassard is easily a 2nd liner right now, and if he develops like he should he'll be first line someday, guarantee it.

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04-04-2013, 09:49 PM
  #790
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Gabby 1G 1A 2 Pts. against a tough, tough Nashville team. He looked a little shaky but hey the trade looks real good for both teams 1 game in.

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04-04-2013, 09:56 PM
  #791
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With so many fan favorite players involved, I feel like this trade is like that scene in Step Brothers.

"Did we (Jackets and Rangers fans) just become best friends?!"

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04-04-2013, 09:58 PM
  #792
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I think if Dorsett develops his offense a bit, or something just clicks with him, he could have decent 2nd line capability, he's already steadily hitting 20 points and if he does develop that offensive talent i could see 30-40 point seasons in the future.

brassard is easily a 2nd liner right now, and if he develops like he should he'll be first line someday, guarantee it.
Dorsett has one 20 point season and he's 26 years old. He is a heart and soul guy but he simply doesn't have the talent to do much more.

Brassard, if he ever puts it all together, could be a first line center. But Jackets fans have been saying that for years and it has yet to happen. He's 25 years old and really has yet to show why he was a 6th overall pick. The talent is there, but he has yet to really break through.

Your estimates are very optimistic.

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04-04-2013, 10:28 PM
  #793
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Get Gaborik away from Torts and he starts going to the net again. Who's not surprised? I'm not surprised.

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04-04-2013, 10:39 PM
  #794
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Do we really have to hear this tanking nonsense all the time? The Pens were 12-5-3-0 in their final 20 games of the 2003-04 season which got them Malkin. I'd hardly call that tanking to get Malkin. There was no season in 2004-05 that got them Crosby. How do you tank in a season that never happened?

It also goes without saying that the Rangers never had to tank during the mid 2000's or earlier since they were in a huge market in a pre salary cap league. They were a team that could try to fix a lot of their problems in UFA instead of the draft. What's hilarious is spending lots of money in UFA didn't seem to work in the 2000's for them. It wasn't until they started building from within that they turned things around again.
Thank you for answering that in a civilized manner. You did it better than I could.


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04-05-2013, 06:22 AM
  #795
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Get Gaborik away from Torts and he starts going to the net again. Who's not surprised? I'm not surprised.
All this says is what everyone knows: Gaborik plays hard when he wants to. Gook luck with him.

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04-05-2013, 06:46 AM
  #796
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Gaborik still doesn't look like the old Gaborik. He could beat goalies with his wrist shot and use his speed to blow past defenders. Whether its a confidence issue or its father time. There was a 2 on 1 in the first period last night,Gaborik was stopped by Rinne. He was automatic in those situations. His first season with the Rangers,he was fantastic before getting hurt. He got cut by Lundqvist's skate in practice before the Olympics. He played in the Olympics and hurt his groin. The Rangers missed the playoffs that season. The 2nd year he was terrible. Streaky. Had a concussion. He played with Stepan and Anisimov in the first half of 11-12. Then Anisimov disappeared. Gaborik was quiet for a while. Then Gaborik got hot again with Richards and Hagelin. This season was a tough year. He scored 9 of his goals in 5 games. You couldn't find him in the other games.

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04-05-2013, 06:54 AM
  #797
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Gaborik still doesn't look like the old Gaborik. He could beat goalies with his wrist shot and use his speed to blow past defenders. Whether its a confidence issue or its father time. There was a 2 on 1 in the first period last night,Gaborik was stopped by Rinne. He was automatic in those situations.
It was 1 shot. I find it hard to believe that as a 20 year old 3rd year player or even his first year as a Ranger he was a perfect 100% at wrist shots. Rinne is a good goalie and even Wayne Gretzky missed a shot now and then.

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04-05-2013, 06:58 AM
  #798
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It was 1 shot. I find it hard to believe that as a 20 year old 3rd year player or even his first year as a Ranger he was a perfect 100% at wrist shots. Rinne is a good goalie and even Wayne Gretzky missed a shot now and then.
Obviously it's just one shot, but his point is valid. Gaborik has been missing those shots (generally speaking) this season when last season they were going in (generally speaking). To some degree bad luck is involved, but he also just doesn't appear to be the same player. I really like Gaborik and I have nothing against the Blue Jackets, so if he does well then awesome. Maybe he just needs the change in scenery because it was clear that he had zero confidence. But I'm skeptical of it.

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04-05-2013, 08:05 AM
  #799
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Gaborik used to be one of my favourite players to watch, he had a hop in his step and could fly like the wind. Only problem was/is his proneness to get injured.

He's slowed down, no longer a super exciting player to watch, but still exciting. I don't think he'll get a 40 goal season again (at least not with who he plays with), but he'll still get high 20s low 30s, pretty much the same player Nash was.

Still looked good last night in a CBJ uniform, a goal and an assist is nothing to sneer at. Who knows? It maybe the change he needed...

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04-05-2013, 08:16 AM
  #800
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All this says is what everyone knows: Gaborik plays hard when he wants to. Gook luck with him.
to add it all up, columbus gets anisimov, dubinsky, a 2013 first, erixon, and spare parts for brassard, dorsett, john moore, and spare parts. that's a pretty lopsided deal for the beejays.

but then to also replace rick nash with gaborik... i mean not only is gaborik arguably the more talented player, and certainly the more well-rounded and creative offensively, rick nash plays hard never.

after years and years of watching columbus get reamed always every single time, it's kind of nice to see those guys making out like bandits here.

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