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Old
04-05-2013, 06:53 PM
  #226
Shockmaster
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Originally Posted by TakeYOrpik View Post
I really disagree with this. Setting up your lineup requires putting all of your players in the best possible position to succeed. Putting Morrow with Malkin best utilizes his skillset, as well as Malkin and Neal's. Putting Iginla with Crosby gives the top line a guy we know can finish scoring opportunities and give Crosby some space against top defenses. Dupuis will make an impact on the third because he is such a versatile player.
Kunitz can do what Morrow does and more. Morrow is a better fit on the third line. Dupuis hasn't brought down the team in anyway playing in the top 6. 18 goals doesn't lie.

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04-05-2013, 07:15 PM
  #227
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Originally Posted by Shockmaster View Post
Kunitz can do what Morrow does and more. Morrow is a better fit on the third line. Dupuis hasn't brought down the team in anyway playing in the top 6. 18 goals doesn't lie.
Nobody is saying Dupuis is bringing the team down. But keeping him on the top line over Iginla just doesn't make sense. Dupuis brings speed to the 3rd line that Morrow doesn't add. Morrow can crash the net as good as, if not better than, any other Penguin player.

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04-05-2013, 07:20 PM
  #228
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Dupuis/Crosby/Iginla
Kunitz/Malkin/Neal
Morrow/Sutter/Bennett
Cooke/Jokinen/Kennedy

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Old
04-06-2013, 01:53 PM
  #229
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I don't like the Iginla - Malkin - Neal line (though it's a bit tough to judge given Geno and Neal haven't been at the top of their games recently), Iggy and Neal seem to want to occupy similar spots an it's taking Iginla a while to adjust to play his off-wing. When everyone is back healthy I'd go with

Dupuis - Crosby - Iginla
Kunitz - Malkin - Neal
Morrow - Sutter - Cooke
Jokinen - Adams - Kennedy (Jokinen taking all the draws though)

If you want to keep Kunitz with Sid then it would be worth trying Dupuis with Geno, I know it didn't work last time but Dupuis has looked much better since then.

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Old
04-06-2013, 02:07 PM
  #230
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Pretty much everyone here is for the Kunitz - Malkin - Neal line again. Sadly, if we didn't see it by now, we probably aren't going to.

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Old
04-06-2013, 04:37 PM
  #231
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wej20 View Post
Jokinen - Adams - Kennedy (Jokinen taking all the draws though)
If Jokinen is on the 4th line, I'd keep him at center and try to utilize him as F3. He seems capable of responsible defense, but I don't know how voracious of a forechecker he is capable of being. Plus if either of his wingers win a puck battle down low, and Jokinen floats into the slot...we could finally have our dream of 4th line scoring.

Of course, I wouldn't use Jokinen only on the 4th line. He has too much skill to only be seeing 10 mins a night. So you'd want to double shift him with Crosby/Malkin every so often.

Which is why I'd kinda like to see Jokinen and Bennett on our 4th line -- when they double shift with Crosby/Malkin, we'd have another dangerous scoring line.

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Old
04-06-2013, 04:38 PM
  #232
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Originally Posted by PensPlz View Post
Pretty much everyone here is for the Kunitz - Malkin - Neal line again. Sadly, if we didn't see it by now, we probably aren't going to.
i'm looking at that as a potential silver lining if Neal is hurt. Force the lines to be shaken up a bit. Ideally, bring up Bennett too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DoktorZaius View Post

Which is why I'd kinda like to see Jokinen and Bennett on our 4th line -- when they double shift with Crosby/Malkin, we'd have another dangerous scoring line.
exactly. I'd love the 4th line to be Jokinen with either Morrow or Bennett if everyone is healthy. With the other of Morrow and Bennett on Geno's LW.

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Old
04-06-2013, 05:11 PM
  #233
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Can we have a thread purely about the 4th line? In all seriousness?

Top 9:

Kunitz-Crosby-Dupuis
Neal-Malkin-Iginla
Morrow-Sutter-Cooke

is pretty set. 4th line possibilities includes:

TK
Adams
Glass
Vitale
Jeffrey
Jokinen
Bennett

A lot of possible combinations. The problem is...this line has no purpose, no identify, no goal. For the last 30 games is been "Dear god get on the ice and don't mess up while our top 3 lines rest". They were awesome in the first couple of games. Against Washington early in the season they terrorized Ovechkin's line...now...we'd just about have a heart attack should we find that match up.

Are they an energy line? They can be...but they lack defensive and offensive abilities. Are they a shutdown line? No. They have no skill...they are meh at best at hitting...they are completely unable to match up against a top line...they are a mess right now.

Do we want skill? Do we want energy? Do we want shutdown abilities? Do we want any amount of production? The reason why this line has struggled so much is that its a complete ****show on the ice and on paper. Now with so many candidates, you have to ask countless questions:

1. Glass. Obviously favored by the coach and management despite complete ******* play. 0 points in 30+ games is something you expect from a defensive dman...not a wing.

2. Adams. Has PK ability and can score a goal here and there. Veteran and DB loves him. Whatever the line up may be, we can count on Adams being on it.

3. Vitale vs Jeffrey. Does the line want skill or grit? Faceoffs? Puck movement? DB seems to want Jeffrey who has a bit of skill but zero grit. Whatever skill he has is wasted on Glass and Adams which minimizes his abilities and worth. Vitale has all the and energy you could ever want plus great faceoff abilities...but he's rather limited in the skill department.

4. TK. He needs to be on the line because he's clearly the best (arguably) of any of them. Someone in the top 9 goes down...he's probably the next in line. Sadly. Though with the addition of Jokinen this could be debatable.

5. Bennett. Doesn't belong on the 4th...TBH

6. Hitting. Glass hits I guess...Vitale does some...Adams, meh. TK has energy with limited hitting. Jokinen, no idea yet but I would lean towards no. Bennett, sorta...but not his purpose, nor should it be.

So listing this things out...you can see why this line has an identity problem. Its a pot luck of missing parts and pieces that do not fit together. So the question is...what combination of these minions will be the most beneficial for us in the playoffs?

For me: Adams-Jokinen-TK

Speed, little grit, 2 centers with faceoff abilities, Joks and TK could even potentially hook up for a goal. Injury in top 9 you have 2 candidates to move up. If Sid or Geno double shift, Jokinen-Sid/Geno-TK form a decent line. All three can play an energy roll and 2 of them are PK'ers.

Glass needs to sit as he has proven to be awful. Vitale is the next up IMHO as I believe Jokinen would be the better center. Jeffrey after that but he'd be debatable with Vitale depending on who goes out and which team we are playing. Last is Bennett...again he doesn't belong on that line.

So thats my 4th line soap box speech...

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Old
04-06-2013, 05:12 PM
  #234
Zirakzigil
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Kunitz - Crosby - Iginla
Jokinen - Malkin - Neal
Morrow - Sutter - Dupuis
Cooke - Vitale - Kennedy

Iginla has looked average at best with Malkin. They need to be split apart when Crosby is healthy. Jokinen with Malkin on the second line addresses that lines biggest weakness which is faceoffs. I think he could complement Malkin and Neal nicely as well. Third line is gritty, has some speed and can score. Fourth line is what I would like to see, but it will never happen sadly

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Old
04-06-2013, 05:16 PM
  #235
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wej20 View Post
I don't like the Iginla - Malkin - Neal line (though it's a bit tough to judge given Geno and Neal haven't been at the top of their games recently), Iggy and Neal seem to want to occupy similar spots an it's taking Iginla a while to adjust to play his off-wing.

I know it's still quite early and I'm not jumping off a bridge, but I've been terribly unimpressed with Iginla. He's not the guy I thought we were getting thus far. Assuming he just needs some time to gel and get used to not being the main man.

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Old
04-06-2013, 05:16 PM
  #236
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There's no reason at all 4th line talk can't go here. Both the 3rd and 4th will be a jumble of players IMO so it doesn't make sense otherwise we're going ot end up with a 3rd line thread, etc. Just keep it going here. The thread has a lot of good momentum at this point and there's plenty to talk about with Neal possibly missing some time (or not -- hard to say at this point since they have the weekend off).

If he does miss time (and he comes back the same day as Sid to make the debate simpler), I'd go with this for now:

Kunitz - Geno - Iginla
Bennett - Juice - Dupuis
Morrow - Sutter - Cooke
Glass - Vitale - Kennedy
Adams PK

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Old
04-06-2013, 07:19 PM
  #237
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I think bennett is about to be called, he isnt playing in the baby pens game tonight.

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Old
04-06-2013, 07:25 PM
  #238
Ugene Malkin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zirakzigil View Post
Kunitz - Crosby - Iginla
Jokinen - Malkin - Neal
Morrow - Sutter - Dupuis
Cooke - Vitale - Kennedy

Iginla has looked average at best with Malkin. They need to be split apart when Crosby is healthy. Jokinen with Malkin on the second line addresses that lines biggest weakness which is faceoffs. I think he could complement Malkin and Neal nicely as well. Third line is gritty, has some speed and can score. Fourth line is what I would like to see, but it will never happen sadly
I'm with you on this. very ballanced and has vets throughout the lines that are defensively responsible and can score on all 4 lines.

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04-06-2013, 07:34 PM
  #239
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zirakzigil View Post
Kunitz - Crosby - Iginla
Jokinen - Malkin - Neal
Morrow - Sutter - Dupuis
Cooke - Vitale - Kennedy

Iginla has looked average at best with Malkin. They need to be split apart when Crosby is healthy. Jokinen with Malkin on the second line addresses that lines biggest weakness which is faceoffs. I think he could complement Malkin and Neal nicely as well. Third line is gritty, has some speed and can score. Fourth line is what I would like to see, but it will never happen sadly
If we have a 4th of Cooke-Vitale-Kennedy, I'm almost certain it would be Jeffrey rather than Vitale.

And...would Jokinen-Malkin-Neal offer anything over Iggy-Malkin-Neal? Does Jokinen provide the Kunitz-Morrow grit game thats needed to make that line work?

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Old
04-06-2013, 08:19 PM
  #240
SidTheKid8787
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I'll take a stab at a DB lineup without Crosby and Neal:

Morrow/Bennett-Malkin-Iginla
Kunitz-Jokinen-Dupuis
Cooke-Sutter-Kennedy
Glass-Adams/Vitale-Adams/Bennett
(Jeffrey/Bennett or Vitale)

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Old
04-06-2013, 08:20 PM
  #241
Ogrezilla
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I like Jokinen, but not as Geno and Neal's LW. This team needs Bennett. He's the best option for that spot.

Bennett - Malkin - Iggy
Kunitz - Jokinen - Dupuis
Morrow - Sutter - Cooke
Glass - Adams - TK

I'd obviously take Vitale over Glass, but Disco wouldn't. I'm not sure about Bennett, because I think the other option is Vitale or Jeffrey being in. Not sure which he prefers.


Last edited by Ogrezilla: 04-06-2013 at 08:26 PM.
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Old
04-06-2013, 08:26 PM
  #242
Ugene Malkin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SEALBound View Post
If we have a 4th of Cooke-Vitale-Kennedy, I'm almost certain it would be Jeffrey rather than Vitale.

And...would Jokinen-Malkin-Neal offer anything over Iggy-Malkin-Neal? Does Jokinen provide the Kunitz-Morrow grit game thats needed to make that line work?
That consists of two #1 lines and two #3 lines. I don't see how Jokinen would be a bad third wheel on Malkins line. He's essentially a Pascal Dupuis type player, can do it all and give the other two freedom while he does the F3 role.

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Old
04-06-2013, 08:28 PM
  #243
Ogrezilla
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ugene Malkin View Post
That consists of two #1 lines and two #3 lines. I don't see how Jokinen would be a bad third wheel on Malkins line. He's essentially a Pascal Dupuis type player, can do it all and give the other two freedom while he does the F3 role.
Jokinen is soooooooooo much slower than Dupuis. Jokinen is a skill player. Dupuis is an effort/speed player.

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04-06-2013, 08:29 PM
  #244
Ugene Malkin
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ogrezilla View Post
I like Jokinen, but not as Geno and Neal's LW. This team needs Bennett. He's the best option for that spot.

Bennett - Malkin - Iggy
Kunitz - Jokinen - Dupuis
Morrow - Sutter - Cooke
Glass - Adams - TK

I'd obviously take Vitale over Glass, but Disco wouldn't. I'm not sure about Bennett, because I think the other option is Vitale or Jeffrey being in. Not sure which he prefers.
I agree with you for the regular season, but for this particular year, I want guys who have been there before. All in, meaning, Beau gets limited use, a game here or there. If everyone stays healthy. If not, then he'll see more time.

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Old
04-06-2013, 08:31 PM
  #245
Ogrezilla
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ugene Malkin View Post
I agree with you for the regular season, but for this particular year, I want guys who have been there before. All in, meaning, Beau gets limited use, a game here or there. If everyone stays healthy. If not, then he'll see more time.
I like Bennett and Morrow both in the line-up, because I think they can both play in that spot very well, but I don't know that either can do it full time through a full post-season. I think they'd fill Geno's left wing platoon style. My dream healthy lineup is

Kunitz - Sid - Iggy
Morrow/Bennett - Geno - Neal
Cooke - Sutter - Dupuis
Bennett/Morrow - Jokinen - Adams

with Bennett and Morrow rotating with Geno and Neal.

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Old
04-06-2013, 08:34 PM
  #246
Waffle Fries
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ugene Malkin View Post
I agree with you for the regular season, but for this particular year, I want guys who have been there before. All in, meaning, Beau gets limited use, a game here or there. If everyone stays healthy. If not, then he'll see more time.
I think those lines will work out really well if they come to fruition. And I believe they were meant for the regular season, because the team will hopefully have both Crosby/Neal back for the playoffs. Don't worry, Bennett's playoff time will certainly be limited, whether it deserves to be or not.

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Old
04-06-2013, 08:35 PM
  #247
Ogrezilla
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Originally Posted by Waffle Fries View Post
I think those lines will work out really well if they come to fruition. And I believe they were meant for the regular season, because the team will hopefully have both Crosby/Neal back for the playoffs. Don't worry, Bennett's playoff time will certainly be limited, whether it deserves to be or not.
sadly, I think you're right. I'm not even confident he'll get a call while we are in need of a top 9 winger. TK will just slide back up to the 3rd line.

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Old
04-06-2013, 08:38 PM
  #248
Ugene Malkin
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Originally Posted by Ogrezilla View Post
Jokinen is soooooooooo much slower than Dupuis. Jokinen is a skill player. Dupuis is an effort/speed player.
Definitely give the edge speed wise, but that doesn't change his role or his effectiveness in doing it. Remember Pascals speed is suited for Crosby's line or a great 3rd line. Jokinen's speed, while slower, matches up well for Malkins line.

Lets just hope he can keep up what he showed in his first game and ride that all the way in and through the playoffs wherever he ends up. A chance to win seems to perk players up after having to settle for a lot less the past couple years. We saw it in, Guerin. We don't need him to do a 24 mile marathon but rather a 12 mile one in perspective to what's left in the season and the playoffs.

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Old
04-06-2013, 08:43 PM
  #249
Ogrezilla
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Originally Posted by Ugene Malkin View Post
Definitely give the edge speed wise, but that doesn't change his role or his effectiveness in doing it. Remember Pascals speed is suited for Crosby's line or a great 3rd line. Jokinen's speed, while slower, matches up well for Malkins line.

Lets just hope he can keep up what he showed in his first game and ride that all the way in and through the playoffs wherever he ends up. A chance to win seems to perk players up after having to settle for a lot less the past couple years. We saw it in, Guerin. We don't need him to do a 24 mile marathon but rather a 12 mile one in perspective to what's left in the season and the playoffs.
I just see him more like a more rounded version of Sullivan than as Dupuis. Maybe I'm wrong, I haven't seen a ton of him. Doesn't seem like puck retrieval and board battles are his main strengths.

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04-06-2013, 08:44 PM
  #250
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ogrezilla View Post
I like Bennett and Morrow both in the line-up, because I think they can both play in that spot very well, but I don't know that either can do it full time through a full post-season. I think they'd fill Geno's left wing platoon style. My dream healthy lineup is

Kunitz - Sid - Iggy
Morrow/Bennett - Geno - Neal
Cooke - Sutter - Dupuis
Bennett/Morrow - Jokinen - Adams

with Bennett and Morrow rotating with Geno and Neal.
It will be interesting if DB does have a full lineup, what he does with Jokinen and Kennedy.

Jokinen should effectively push Glass off of this roster but i fear DB loves his "hitting?" i guess?

A full healthy roster we know for sure the bubble players are going to be Vitale, Jeffrey, Bennett but after that, i have no clue what DB will do.

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