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WOW: Dubey with a .922 save ptg is tied for 7th

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Old
04-10-2013, 01:27 AM
  #201
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Originally Posted by Insta View Post
Fine. Pick any goalie you think is a realistic answer to the oilers goaltending woes then go to nhl.com and watch the highlights of his last 7 or 8 games and get back to me with the ones that save every shot that isnt an impossible save. Preferably they face 30+ shots per night as well.
I couldn't care less about any other team or their goalie. I care about the Oilers and our goalie. And right now he is not providing the consistent stability this team needs.

That said, I think you think I'm blaming him for last night's loss, for example. I'm not. But there have been a few too many games this season where he's failed to make a routine save early in the game or where he's done so when we still had a chance to take the game. Has the team lost him some games? Of course, it's not a good team yet. But has he cost the team some games? Imo, yes, that has happened, too.

As for me going to NHL.com to do your homework for you, I don't think so. Do it yourself.

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04-10-2013, 01:32 AM
  #202
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Originally Posted by 17Kurri View Post
I couldn't care less about any other team or their goalie. I care about the Oilers and our goalie. And right now he is not providing the consistent stability this team needs.

That said, I think you think I'm blaming him for last night's loss, for example. I'm not. But there have been a few too many games this season where he's failed to make a routine save early in the game or where he's done so when we still had a chance to take the game. Has the team lost him some games? Of course, it's not a good team yet. But has he cost the team some games? Imo, yes, that has happened, too.

As for me going to NHL.com to do your homework for you, I don't think so. Do it yourself.
I'm totally in agreement. The team needs stability. Dubnyk has cost this team points.

Somehow the people who are here defending Dubnyk think trying to goad people to put out names of potential replacements just so they can tear them down is a valid defence of Scoobie Doobie Doo's various inadequacies. Hopefully Tambo disagrees.

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04-10-2013, 01:52 AM
  #203
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Originally Posted by 17Kurri View Post
I couldn't care less about any other team or their goalie. I care about the Oilers and our goalie. And right now he is not providing the consistent stability this team needs.

That said, I think you think I'm blaming him for last night's loss, for example. I'm not. But there have been a few too many games this season where he's failed to make a routine save early in the game or where he's done so when we still had a chance to take the game. Has the team lost him some games? Of course, it's not a good team yet. But has he cost the team some games? Imo, yes, that has happened, too.

As for me going to NHL.com to do your homework for you, I don't think so. Do it yourself.
He is providing consistent goaltending and you must compare him to other teams goalies or your argument holds no water. All goalies are human and let goals in, simple fact. Dubnyk has let in less goals as a percentage of shots than most starters in the league. What you are asking for is a fantastical goalie. He does not exist. The whole bad timing thing is another product of bias. The fact you have no replacement goalie in mind also shows you have no leg to stand on. If dubnyk was that bad you would be able to easily give me a handful of available goalies who could come in and improve the team, and you would have stats to show it.

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04-10-2013, 01:57 AM
  #204
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Originally Posted by Insta View Post
He is providing consistent goaltending and you must compare him to other teams goalies or your argument holds no water. All goalies are human and let goals in, simple fact. Dubnyk has let in less goals as a percentage of shots than most starters in the league. What you are asking for is a fantastical goalie. He does not exist. The whole bad timing thing is another product of bias. The fact you have no replacement goalie in mind also shows you have no leg to stand on. If dubnyk was that bad you would be able to easily give me a handful of available goalies who could come in and improve the team, and you would have stats to show it.
You're a clever little one, aren't you, trying to get me to do your homework for you? No thanks.

The nuts and bolts of it is that I'd have confidence in him if he didn't let in critical goals, even when it is the team's fault for putting him in a position to have to do so. Until he can do that, he doesn't have my vote of confidence. End of story.

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04-10-2013, 01:57 AM
  #205
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Originally Posted by shoop View Post
This is OT, and probably a good topic for another thread.

I just don't get why teams would agree to compliance buyouts in the CBA at all if they weren't going to use them. That doesn't necessarily mean that they will, but I will be a little surprised if they don't.

Luongo hasn't been moved because of his contract. He really can't be moved because of his contract. The Canucks definitely don't want another season of the Luongo circus in town. With no trade that leaves buyout or bury him as their options. Sure they could eat a ton of his contract in a trade, but that would probably not provide much savings and would hurt on the cap.



So Horcoff and Schultz can't be bought out because it will have an impact on the dressing room, by Smytty can be? Right...

Nick Schultz is a very useful player?

Horcoff is overpaid by a small amount? At what point isn't he over paid then? $5.3 M a year? $5.1 M a year?

Compliance buyouts are to make your team better.
you cannot bury contracts anymore, at least not ones as rich as Luongo's.

both Horcoff and Schultz are overpaid by about $1.5M per season. maybe $2M for Horcoff. Good luck finding a 16 minute a night center who is top unit PK, wins draws and is the team leader, and a 20 minute a night Dman to replace them while still saving any money. If only everything was as easy as you make it out to be.

Buy out Smyth and Belanger and save more money. Get rid of useless players. Make your team better.

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04-10-2013, 02:00 AM
  #206
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Originally Posted by shoop View Post
I'm totally in agreement. The team needs stability. Dubnyk has cost this team points.

Somehow the people who are here defending Dubnyk think trying to goad people to put out names of potential replacements just so they can tear them down is a valid defence of Scoobie Doobie Doo's various inadequacies. Hopefully Tambo disagrees.
what games has he cost this team points in? Try to find more than one game where the Oilers lost when they outplayed their opponent.

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04-10-2013, 02:00 AM
  #207
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Originally Posted by Insta View Post
He is providing consistent goaltending and you must compare him to other teams goalies or your argument holds no water. All goalies are human and let goals in, simple fact. Dubnyk has let in less goals as a percentage of shots than most starters in the league. What you are asking for is a fantastical goalie. He does not exist. The whole bad timing thing is another product of bias. The fact you have no replacement goalie in mind also shows you have no leg to stand on. If dubnyk was that bad you would be able to easily give me a handful of available goalies who could come in and improve the team, and you would have stats to show it.
Your entire argument is fantastical ... or maybe even a word that really exists.

What bad timing thing are you talking about? Dubnyk's weak goals deflating the team is a fact. No bias there.

There are plenty of ways to replace Dubnyk. Create cap space for a FA signing or trade.

Which stats would you need?
Save percentage - Dubnyk has a good save percentage.
GAA - not so good. (But that's a team stat his supporters will shout.)
Record in the shootout - really bad.
Soft goals per game. - Leads the league no question asked. OK, I fantasticalled that one.

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04-10-2013, 02:05 AM
  #208
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what games has he cost this team points in? Try to find more than one game where the Oilers lost when they outplayed their opponent.
Kurri gave the perfect response to your insistent demands.

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Originally Posted by 17Kurri View Post
You're a clever little one, aren't you, trying to get me to do your homework for you? No thanks.

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04-10-2013, 02:05 AM
  #209
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Name any player on the roster who is providing any kind of constant stability?

Dubnyk has been the most constant and stable player on the roster this year. Gagner probably was for the first 10-15 games, but Dubnyk was also lights out for that period. Since then Gagners game has fallen off and his defensive play has been awful. Dubnyk has been our most consistant pllayer this year. Hall is the MVP, of that there is no doubt, but he has not been as consistant as Dubnyk.

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04-10-2013, 02:07 AM
  #210
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Originally Posted by shoop View Post
Kurri gave the perfect response to your insistent demands.
no I'm telling you that you are making baseless claims that the statistics and video evidence does not support. You made the claim, you back it up.

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04-10-2013, 02:08 AM
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Originally Posted by shoop View Post
Your entire argument is fantastical ... or maybe even a word that really exists.

What bad timing thing are you talking about? Dubnyk's weak goals deflating the team is a fact. No bias there.

There are plenty of ways to replace Dubnyk. Create cap space for a FA signing or trade.

Which stats would you need?
Save percentage - Dubnyk has a good save percentage.
GAA - not so good. (But that's a team stat his supporters will shout.)
Record in the shootout - really bad.
Soft goals per game. - Leads the league no question asked. OK, I fantasticalled that one.
when argument is clearly lost, might as well resort to outlandish claims and sarcastic quips.

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04-10-2013, 02:11 AM
  #212
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Originally Posted by nabob View Post
Name any player on the roster who is providing any kind of constant stability?
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Originally Posted by 17Kurri View Post
You're a clever little one, aren't you, trying to get me to do your homework for you? No thanks.
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Originally Posted by nabob View Post
Dubnyk has been the most constant and stable player on the roster this year. Gagner probably was for the first 10-15 games, but Dubnyk was also lights out for that period. Since then Gagners game has fallen off and his defensive play has been awful. Dubnyk has been our most consistant pllayer this year. Hall is the MVP, of that there is no doubt, but he has not been as consistant as Dubnyk.
Agreed. He has consistently let in soft goals all season that have crushed the spirits of the team.

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04-10-2013, 02:12 AM
  #213
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when argument is clearly lost, might as well resort to outlandish claims and sarcastic quips.
No outlandish claims. Even Dubnyk's defenders admit he lets in soft goals.

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no I'm telling you that you are making baseless claims that the statistics and video evidence does not support. You made the claim, you back it up.
What about the GAA and the terrible record in the shootout? They are statistics. They are not the statistics of a good goalie.

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04-10-2013, 02:13 AM
  #214
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Originally Posted by 17Kurri View Post
You're a clever little one, aren't you, trying to get me to do your homework for you? No thanks.

The nuts and bolts of it is that I'd have confidence in him if he didn't let in critical goals, even when it is the team's fault for putting him in a position to have to do so. Until he can do that, he doesn't have my vote of confidence. End of story.
Ive done the homework. My asking of you is to try and get an honest debate. You provide nothing to discuss other than some undefined critical goals thing that apparently dubnyk is bad at, yet you don't watch any other goalies so you have no actual idea whether he is better or worse than anyone else.

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04-10-2013, 02:21 AM
  #215
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No outlandish claims. Even Dubnyk's defenders admit he lets in soft goals.



What about the GAA and the terrible record in the shootout? They are statistics. They are not the statistics of a good goalie.
Sure he lets in soft goals. So does Lundquist, so does Rinne, so does Rask...

Dubnyk would have to have the best sv% in the league by a long shot to have a better than average GAA. It is a team stat, Just like goals scored per game is.

cant win shootouts when RNH and Hemsky dont even get shots on net in their attempts.

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04-10-2013, 02:23 AM
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Agreed. He has consistently let in soft goals all season that have crushed the spirits of the team.
when? would you care to back up one point that you have made in this entire thread. Or are you just going to respond by throwing out more baseless, biased opinions.

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04-10-2013, 02:25 AM
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Ive done the homework. My asking of you is to try and get an honest debate.
No you aren't. If you truly want to get a debate going why don't you through out some names they Oilers could add in net. Could be by trade or FA signing. Maybe there is not good deal out there. Throw out the closest thing to a good deal that you can come up with. That's what you would do if you wanted to get an honest debate going.

What you have done so far is shoot down any potential name that could be considered. Not a real debate. I would actually like you to prove me wrong and start an honest debate on this.

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04-10-2013, 02:41 AM
  #218
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when? would you care to back up one point that you have made in this entire thread. Or are you just going to respond by throwing out more baseless, biased opinions.
I'll throw out this one statistical analysis to disprove yet another point of yours before I sign out for the night. While I'm clearly winning this debate the obstinance is tiring.

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Dubnyk would have to have the best sv% in the league by a long shot to have a better than average GAA. It is a team stat, Just like goals scored per game is.
No. Six fewer goals against would move him to 15th in the league for GAA at 2.31. That would put him within .001 of Rask and Schneider for save percentage. (Definitely not better than them by a long shot under any definition.) Nevermind Anderson's ridiculous save percentage ... yeah yeah he has been hurt yada yada.

Just imagine the statistical year Dubnyk would be having if only he had let in six fewer soft goals this season.

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04-10-2013, 02:42 AM
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No you aren't. If you truly want to get a debate going why don't you through out some names they Oilers could add in net. Could be by trade or FA signing. Maybe there is not good deal out there. Throw out the closest thing to a good deal that you can come up with. That's what you would do if you wanted to get an honest debate going.

What you have done so far is shoot down any potential name that could be considered. Not a real debate. I would actually like you to prove me wrong and start an honest debate on this.
Im the one saying dubnyk is fine so why would i bring up the replacements? I think the oilers should just bring in a decent backup and spend the capital elsewhere where they would actually be improving the team.

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04-10-2013, 02:47 AM
  #220
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No you aren't. If you truly want to get a debate going why don't you through out some names they Oilers could add in net. Could be by trade or FA signing. Maybe there is not good deal out there. Throw out the closest thing to a good deal that you can come up with. That's what you would do if you wanted to get an honest debate going.

What you have done so far is shoot down any potential name that could be considered. Not a real debate. I would actually like you to prove me wrong and start an honest debate on this.
The point is that the Oilers dont need to replace Dubnyk. He is playing very well. You are the one who says he needs to be pushed/replaced.

My solutions, as for who may realistically be available in the offseason.
-Enroth, was a solid backup last season. Had good seasons in the AHL and great seasons in the SEL before that. Buffalo has Miller and just got Hacket.
-Miller, Buffalo may go full crazy and burn it down, I doubt he would accept a trade here though.
-Emery, very inconsistant, poor locker room presence.
-Neuvirth, might become available if Holtby plays well for the rest of the season
-Greiss, has never been very good at the AHL or NHL level, certainly no better than Dubnyk either of the past two years
-Elliot, 1 great year and 4 bad ones in the NHL. Lets in lots of bad goals.

not much out there.

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04-10-2013, 02:48 AM
  #221
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Ive done the homework. My asking of you is to try and get an honest debate. You provide nothing to discuss other than some undefined critical goals thing that apparently dubnyk is bad at, yet you don't watch any other goalies so you have no actual idea whether he is better or worse than anyone else.
You're assuming I haven't done my homework because I disagree with your viewpoint. My point is that you can find the bad goals if you look for yourself, they're not that hard to find. That said, since you're so anxious for me to provide examples for "an honest debate", let me start you off.

How about the 2-0 Legwand goal against Nashville on March 8? That one, of course, is just the most obvious. There are many other not so obvious ones, like the 3-3 Wingels goal on March 8. There are more, but I'm guessing you're capable of finding the rest.

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04-10-2013, 02:51 AM
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Name any player on the roster who is providing any kind of constant stability?

Dubnyk has been the most constant and stable player on the roster this year. Gagner probably was for the first 10-15 games, but Dubnyk was also lights out for that period. Since then Gagners game has fallen off and his defensive play has been awful. Dubnyk has been our most consistant pllayer this year. Hall is the MVP, of that there is no doubt, but he has not been as consistant as Dubnyk.
Hall is the MVP, but has not been as consistent? How do you figure? He's brought is every night, even if he didn't get on the board every night. Can't say that about Dubnyk.

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04-10-2013, 02:52 AM
  #223
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You're assuming I haven't done my homework because I disagree with your viewpoint. My point is that you can find the bad goals if you look for yourself, they're not that hard to find. That said, since you're so anxious for me to provide examples for "an honest debate", let me start you off.

How about the 2-0 Legwand goal against Nashville on March 8? That one, of course, is just the most obvious. There are many other not so obvious ones, like the 3-3 Wingels goal on March 8. There are more, but I'm guessing you're capable of finding the rest.
Yeah exactly. You go back a month to find a blooper reel type goal and then another one that was stoppable but not soft. So youve gone back to march and have barely come up with anything at all.

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04-10-2013, 02:53 AM
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Im the one saying dubnyk is fine so why would i bring up the replacements? I think the oilers should just bring in a decent backup and spend the capital elsewhere where they would actually be improving the team.
I thought you wanted an honest debate?

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04-10-2013, 02:54 AM
  #225
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I'll throw out this one statistical analysis to disprove yet another point of yours before I sign out for the night. While I'm clearly winning this debate the obstinance is tiring.



No. Six fewer goals against would move him to 15th in the league for GAA at 2.31. That would put him within .001 of Rask and Schneider for save percentage. (Definitely not better than them by a long shot under any definition.) Nevermind Anderson's ridiculous save percentage ... yeah yeah he has been hurt yada yada.

Just imagine the statistical year Dubnyk would be having if only he had let in six fewer soft goals this season.

If the Oilers let up 4 less shots per game that would equal 10 less goals over the course of the season. Imagine of the Oilers only gave up the average amount of shots per game. That would move Dubnyk into the top 10 in GAA.

You still havent provided one realistic option as a goalie to push/replace Dubnyk next season

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