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Oilers and Gagner working on extension: [UPD: Elected Arbitration]

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04-10-2013, 01:35 PM
  #126
Everest
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
Maybe all it means is they are making the safe smart move. Just because we sign Gagner to a 4 or 5 year deal doesn't mean he is on this team for the next 4 or 5 years.
Thats a very good point. No matter how obvious it is.

Maybe the perfect sequence starts with signing him to a contract WITHOUT any clause(s) regarding trades & give it another go for a year or two.

I'm not over the moon with the current roster. I still detest certain weaknesses in Gagner's game...but...the people pointing out its NOT so simple as just a matter of running him out of town & replacing him with a better solution right away...make a realisitc point on Gagners' behalf.

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04-10-2013, 01:48 PM
  #127
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I would love him for 4M, but with a half invisible guy like Hemsky making 5 he won't take that. Sign Gags long term try shipping Hemmer out ASAP

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04-10-2013, 01:59 PM
  #128
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Originally Posted by BlueChip01 View Post
I would love him for 4M, but with a half invisible guy like Hemsky making 5 he won't take that. Sign Gags long term try shipping Hemmer out ASAP
If were keeping Gagner...we need to obtain a classic power forward to play along side him.

Big time.

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04-10-2013, 02:02 PM
  #129
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Yup. I keep saying. I would rather get a guy who makes the same or a tad less than Hemsky who can create room and play. Puts up less points, but is effective a lot more. Need a lot more consistency.

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04-10-2013, 02:36 PM
  #130
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Originally Posted by Everest View Post
Thats a very good point. No matter how obvious it is.

Maybe the perfect sequence starts with signing him to a contract WITHOUT any clause(s) regarding trades & give it another go for a year or two.

I'm not over the moon with the current roster. I still detest certain weaknesses in Gagner's game...but...the people pointing out its NOT so simple as just a matter of running him out of town & replacing him with a better solution right away...make a realisitc point on Gagners' behalf.
I too don't think this is the best roster, but I don't think the answer is to create a hole without and soft of backup plan.

Sign the kid and move him if and when the right time comes up.

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04-10-2013, 02:40 PM
  #131
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5 years 25 mill. I would like to get him for less, but I think that is realistically how much it will cost.

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04-10-2013, 02:41 PM
  #132
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Originally Posted by Everest View Post
If were keeping Gagner...we need to obtain a classic power forward to play along side him.

Big time.
Iggy? He can even take faceoffs for Sammy.

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04-10-2013, 04:02 PM
  #133
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Just looking at the Oilers roster and seeing Hemsky at 5 and Eberle at 6 must make Gagner's agent salivate.


The oilers are going to have to argue that Sam is streaky and and has put together similar stretches before. Going to be a tough sell. Anything less than 5 is unrealistic at this point imo.

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04-10-2013, 04:05 PM
  #134
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Originally Posted by okgooil View Post
5 years 25 mill. I would like to get him for less, but I think that is realistically how much it will cost.
Realistically?


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04-10-2013, 04:06 PM
  #135
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Originally Posted by Sheikyerbouti View Post
Just looking at the Oilers roster and seeing Hemsky at 5 and Eberle at 6 must make Gagner's agent salivate.


The oilers are going to have to argue that Sam is streaky and and has put together similar stretches before. Going to be a tough sell. Anything less than 5 is unrealistic at this point imo.
In what way are Hemsky or Eberle comparables for Gagner?

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04-10-2013, 04:07 PM
  #136
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Originally Posted by Everest View Post
Its really hard to envision a short term improvement if we decide to move on without Gagner...but...

I think it might be worth the half-step backwards, if we opt out on a long term commitment to him and look elsewhere to find a more suitable 2nd line centre. We might not find a perfect fit right away. I realize this.

Bottom line is...I think we've seen what we look like WITH Gagner.

Do we like it?
I agree and

Short answer: no

Long answer: **** no

Okay I'll digress slightly...

What you see is what you get with Gags. And I'm still not sold on him given its the back half of a shortened season (where he typically has excelled)... he is no Doug Gilmour, he is no Marc Savard, he is no Krejci, no Doug Weight, definitely no MSL. The foot speed and playmaking isn't there. He's just an all around average, heart and soul moderately skilled smurf of a centre.

While he does have heart and is a guy you want I cheer for, do we really want to see over 20 million (including after RNH's next contract which will be no less than 5 per, bet your boots) invested in what is ultimately a disappointing, albeit developing non playoff core of players? Eberle's is not a value deal. Hall will end up being fairly paid if he stays healthy... Yak is a wildcard... they simply have too many of the same player and I absolutely think the team needs to make hard decisions in either drafting or trading for a bigger, or at least more physical second line C for the future.

Either that or flank Gags with Clowe and Lucic, and that ain't likely...


Last edited by Philly85: 04-10-2013 at 04:21 PM.
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04-10-2013, 04:09 PM
  #137
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I see a lot of posts indicating what people want to give him, what they think is fair, what they think he should take, what they think fits our cap budget going forward...but the thing is they are ideal situations.


I think people need to simplify the thought process. I tend to agree with the OP

Gagner will be wanting 5x5+, and if he doesn't get it will go to arbitration and be ufa in a year.

I think there is 0 chance he takes another bridge contract, or takes a long term deal under 5M.


So this should be made into a poll question:

Would you rather...

A) Sign him to 5x5 Now

B) 1 year deal

keep in mind B) leads him into UFA where he could end up earning something more along the lines of Zajacs contract 6x8.
A)Sign him to 5x5

B)Trade as a part of the package for upgrade in some other area

I would not sign him 1 year deal and loose him for nothing next year. I prefer A solution.

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04-10-2013, 04:10 PM
  #138
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Originally Posted by Everest View Post
If were keeping Gagner...we need to obtain a classic power forward to play along side him.

Big time.
Let's get him. Who is your suggestion and what it takes to get him to oil silks

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04-10-2013, 04:12 PM
  #139
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Originally Posted by Broilers View Post
A)Sign him to 5x5

B)Trade as a part of the package for upgrade in some other area

I would not sign him 1 year deal and loose him for nothing next year. I prefer A solution.
youre right, i should of added option C):


Trade him, and have no capable 2C anywhere near the roster or system.

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04-10-2013, 04:33 PM
  #140
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If they sign him i hope that they dont do the horc mistake again! Worst scenario is if we sign him longterm let say 5x5 and he runs out of steam in a full regular season as before in his career and are back on his 40p seasons, hes still bleeding goals.

At least we had use in horc at fo and in a checking line but Gagner would be a healthy scratch eating popcorn if we are forced to upgrade his position, and as horc a contract who make him untradeable.

I can live with 2x4 million, to me its wasted money for a team who needs to get stronger and grittier to compete against the best teams, but if we dont find any option to him off season, i do that deal.

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04-10-2013, 04:55 PM
  #141
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Originally Posted by Broilers View Post
Let's get him. Who is your suggestion and what it takes to get him to oil silks
Im fully aware there are no garuntees or easy answers at this point.

But the way were currently put together is not going to do the trick.

Sooner we pop the hood and set to getting it fixed the better.

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04-10-2013, 04:58 PM
  #142
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If they sign him i hope that they dont do the horc mistake again! Worst scenario is if we sign him longterm let say 5x5 and he runs out of steam in a full regular season as before in his career and are back on his 40p seasons, hes still bleeding goals.

At least we had use in horc at fo and in a checking line but Gagner would be a healthy scratch eating popcorn if we are forced to upgrade his position, and as horc a contract who make him untradeable.

I can live with 2x4 million, to me its wasted money for a team who needs to get stronger and grittier to compete against the best teams, but if we dont find any option to him off season, i do that deal.
Gagner being 23 kinda takes that worry out. Horc was 2 months shy of his 30th birthday when he signed his extension. I just can't see him running out of steam. Maybe never reaching the PPG pace he played for most this year, but have doubts he's going to look tired out there.

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04-10-2013, 05:01 PM
  #143
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
Gagner being 23 kinda takes that worry out. Horc was 2 months shy of his 30th birthday when he signed his extension. I just can't see him running out of steam. Maybe never reaching the PPG pace he played for most this year, but have doubts he's going to look tired out there.
He is tired right meow.

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04-10-2013, 05:09 PM
  #144
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$4mil per or less over a term of 4 years or less would be what I'd hope for from an Oilers standpoint. Anything more in terms of dollars or term would probably be overkill.

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04-10-2013, 05:18 PM
  #145
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$4mil per or less over a term of 4 years or less would be what I'd hope for from an Oilers standpoint. Anything more in terms of dollars or term would probably be overkill.
Agreed that would be a fair contract.

Sadly, don't think that will get it done.

$4.5M per for 4 years might, but it would probably be perceived as a hometown discount.

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04-10-2013, 05:31 PM
  #146
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I skeptical of signing Gagner to a long term deal based on this season only. He's still bad defensively and on faceoffs.

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04-10-2013, 06:20 PM
  #147
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
Gagner being 23 kinda takes that worry out. Horc was 2 months shy of his 30th birthday when he signed his extension. I just can't see him running out of steam. Maybe never reaching the PPG pace he played for most this year, but have doubts he's going to look tired out there.
Gagner is 24 in august in his 6th nhl season! He hasnt showed any consistence in his career before. He had his streaks of making points and then draw blank for long stretches of games.

I dont think his physics is enough for a full season + playoffs, he has already shown signs to run out of steam the last 10 games in this shortened season.

If people here want to invest 5x5 on him based on 39 gp and a production mainly in pp and with defensive issues, its up to them.

I hope that the org. doesnt gamble with our future that way!

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04-10-2013, 06:49 PM
  #148
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
In what way are Hemsky or Eberle comparables for Gagner?
Do you seriously think the teams pay structure isn't a factor in contract discussions? Then why was Hall and Eberle's 6 million deals supposed to set a bar for the rest of the team moving forward? It goes both ways.


If Gagner had put this PPG over an 82 game season he could ask for six.


5X5=25 is very realistic. I'd trade him before signing that contract, but his agent has ammunition. He's outproducing wingers that are making more and the contract will be buying UFA years. I hope he really wants to stay an oiler or we trade him.

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04-10-2013, 06:52 PM
  #149
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Originally Posted by McClelland View Post
Gagner is 24 in august in his 6th nhl season! He hasnt showed any consistence in his career before. He had his streaks of making points and then draw blank for long stretches of games.
Agreed, and he usually streaks in the second half of the season which is what this was.

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04-10-2013, 06:53 PM
  #150
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Originally Posted by Sheikyerbouti View Post
Just looking at the Oilers roster and seeing Hemsky at 5 and Eberle at 6 must make Gagner's agent salivate.


The oilers are going to have to argue that Sam is streaky and and has put together similar stretches before. Going to be a tough sell. Anything less than 5 is unrealistic at this point imo.
Hemsky's contract has no movement/trade clauses and was a 2 year deal when we had cap room to spare. They can't simply use the 1-year cap hit as a bench mark.

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