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Old
04-14-2013, 09:32 AM
  #201
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Quote:
Originally Posted by setkreiderfree View Post
If you can't realize that Stralman is not a good defenseman, then I don't see much point debating it with you. It's pretty obvious to anybody who watches this sport. However, feel free to continue to praise him. He won't be on this team next season unless Sather is drunk.
Solid argumentation. If you wanna make a point, at least back it up. This way, I don't see much point debating it with you. You ran out of reasons, it's pretty obvious to anybody who read your comment. However, feel free to continue to hate him.

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Old
04-14-2013, 09:51 AM
  #202
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Quote:
Originally Posted by setkreiderfree View Post
If you can't realize that Stralman is not a good defenseman, then I don't see much point debating it with you. It's pretty obvious to anybody who watches this sport. However, feel free to continue to praise him. He won't be on this team next season unless Sather is drunk.
Stu Bickel is the definition of a bad defensive player. Stralman is the definition of a safe, bottom-6 player who can play a bigger role without looking out of place. The only one who's drunk here is you.

There are a lot of people here who watch hockey, and have been watching hockey. Seems like you're the only one who dislikes Stralman.

The reason why you don't want to continue this debate is because it's a losing cause. You haven't proven anything concrete. You criticize Stralman for reason's that back-fired, and now you're running out of material. Quite while you're behind, I guess.

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Old
04-14-2013, 10:03 AM
  #203
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IMHO, the emergence of Moore makes Del Zotto expendable, unless of course they decide to switch DZ permanently to the right side.

Thing is though, if the Rangers are set on grabbing a #1 pick at the draft this year, they're going to have to pay to get it. Del Zotto can be that payment.

Moore has been great so far in his time here, but it is obvious the coaching staff feels a little differently with the minutes he's been getting. I think he's first guy out of the lineup when Staal comes back, and I'm not sure I agree with that.

Staal - G
McD - DZ
Moore - Stralman

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Old
04-14-2013, 10:08 AM
  #204
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Originally Posted by silverfish View Post
IMHO, the emergence of Moore makes Del Zotto expendable, unless of course they decide to switch DZ permanently to the right side.

Thing is though, if the Rangers are set on grabbing a #1 pick at the draft this year, they're going to have to pay to get it. Del Zotto can be that payment.

Moore has been great so far in his time here, but it is obvious the coaching staff feels a little differently with the minutes he's been getting. I think he's first guy out of the lineup when Staal comes back, and I'm not sure I agree with that.

Staal - G
McD - DZ
Moore - Stralman
lol not even close. Moore hasn't proven any more than Tim Erixon.

MDZ is still far and away the better player at both ends of the rink.

We'll have no offense from the back end.

Moore's played 10 mins or less in 5 straight games, meanwhile MDZ has average 25+ mins per game in that same time span. A bottom pair guy doesn't make a top 4 guy expandable.

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Old
04-14-2013, 10:15 AM
  #205
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Originally Posted by Kershaw View Post
lol not even close. Moore hasn't proven any more than Tim Erixon.

MDZ is still far and away the better player at both ends of the rink.

We'll have no offense from the back end.

Moore's played 10 mins or less in 5 straight games, meanwhile MDZ has average 25+ mins per game in that same time span. A bottom pair guy doesn't make a top 4 guy expandable.
I agree. I'm not saying it like that. I'm saying it as if the Rangers are dead set on acquiring some high draft picks this season, Del Zotto makes the most sense to part with as the Rangers can go into next season with Staal > McD > Moore down the left side.

And, in my opinion, Del Zotto has been horrid recently. But this isn't the Del Zotto thread, so I'll leave it at that. Staal can't get back quick enough.

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Old
04-14-2013, 11:30 AM
  #206
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silverfish View Post
IMHO, the emergence of Moore makes Del Zotto expendable, unless of course they decide to switch DZ permanently to the right side.

Thing is though, if the Rangers are set on grabbing a #1 pick at the draft this year, they're going to have to pay to get it. Del Zotto can be that payment.

Moore has been great so far in his time here, but it is obvious the coaching staff feels a little differently with the minutes he's been getting. I think he's first guy out of the lineup when Staal comes back, and I'm not sure I agree with that.

Staal - G
McD - DZ
Moore - Stralman
Strong disagree.

MDZ this season is what I hope a guy like can Moore can maybe one day look like. Doesn't make sense to get rid of one of the good d-men on what's been a subpar group without Marc Staal.

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Old
04-14-2013, 08:01 PM
  #207
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Quote:
Originally Posted by setkreiderfree View Post
Moore is already so much better than Stralman it's hilarious.
Quote:
Originally Posted by setkreiderfree View Post
Stralman is a turnover machine. Open your eyes. He's awful at covering players in front of the net. He can't move players in front of the net. He consistently turns back into the other teams players when he has the puck behind the net. Watch for this next game. He'll get the puck free, instead of skating to open ice, he turns back into the other teams forwards. He does it all the time. It's the dumbest thing I've ever seen. He also is absolutely horrible at getting his shot through to the net. I can't remember a player that is worse at hitting the other teams players with his shot. It's embarrassing. He doesn't have a clue what a body check is. I would say that is why Moore is better.

Remember what the defense was like before the Moore trade. Despite his limited ice time, he has already improved the defense significantly. There was a reason Moore was drafted in the first round and Stralman was a guy one of the worst defensive teams in hockey didn't want. He's not very good.
Quote:
Originally Posted by setkreiderfree View Post
If you can't realize that Stralman is not a good defenseman, then I don't see much point debating it with you. It's pretty obvious to anybody who watches this sport. However, feel free to continue to praise him. He won't be on this team next season unless Sather is drunk.
What? You must really hate that guy. Did he crash your wedding, do your bride and piss in the champagne or something? He's been one of the most consistent d-men this season and was one of the best players last night.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Boom Boom Geoffrion View Post
18 turnovers in 41 games, and he's a turnover machine? What does that make Del Zotto, McDonagh, and Girardi? They all have more turnovers than Stralman.

You also question his ability to hit the net with his shot which is more garbage. Stralman has less Missed Shots than Del Zotto, McDonagh, and Girardi.

He also does take the body. Stralman, Del Zotto, and McDonagh are all in the same range as far as hits go.

Dan Girardi wasn't draft either.

The only thing that's not very good here, is your analysis.

You whine about his physicality when he's just as physical as Del Zotto and McDonagh.

You whine about his turnovers when he averages less turnovers per game than pretty much all of our dmen.

You whine about his ability to get his shot on goal, despite him missing less shots than most of our dmen.

What we have here, is some biased nonsense by someone who can't even do a little bit of homework. In the future, when you feel the urge to bless this forum with your awesome opinion, research the crap you're spewing. Because right now none of it makes sense and the only thing you're doing is proving you don't know a single thing about Stralman.
Good post. I think you pretty much ended that discussion right there.. To add to that, just noticed Stralman is +8 in his last 7 games, compared to McDonagh (+5), Del Zotto (+1) and Girardi (-3).

On topic: I think Moore has most of the tools to be a good d-man, the question as always being if he can learn how and when to use them. With good coaching I see him being a solid second pairing d-man in a couple of years.

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Old
04-14-2013, 08:36 PM
  #208
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silverfish View Post
IMHO, the emergence of Moore makes Del Zotto expendable, unless of course they decide to switch DZ permanently to the right side.
Emergence? What emergence?

What McDonagh did the last half of 10-11, and through last season is an emergence. I like Moore's tools, but hes just another #6 guy getting limited and sheltered minutes right now.

To assume that he makes Del Zotto expendable in any way, shape, or form is reckless.

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Old
04-14-2013, 08:38 PM
  #209
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Quote:
Originally Posted by silverfish View Post
IMHO, the emergence of Moore makes Del Zotto expendable, unless of course they decide to switch DZ permanently to the right side.

Thing is though, if the Rangers are set on grabbing a #1 pick at the draft this year, they're going to have to pay to get it. Del Zotto can be that payment.

Moore has been great so far in his time here, but it is obvious the coaching staff feels a little differently with the minutes he's been getting. I think he's first guy out of the lineup when Staal comes back, and I'm not sure I agree with that.

Staal - G
McD - DZ
Moore - Stralman
Moore emerging makes Girardi expendable. Not DZ.

Moore hasn't really emerged at all, yet.

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Old
04-14-2013, 09:41 PM
  #210
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleed Ranger Blue View Post
Emergence? What emergence?

What McDonagh did the last half of 10-11, and through last season is an emergence. I like Moore's tools, but hes just another #6 guy getting limited and sheltered minutes right now.

To assume that he makes Del Zotto expendable in any way, shape, or form is reckless.
Just saying Moore coming in opens up options. If the Rangers want to explore adding a 1st rder this year, Moore, at the least, allows discussions to take place regarding Del Zotto.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zenith View Post
Moore emerging makes Girardi expendable. Not DZ.

Moore hasn't really emerged at all, yet.
I don't think this applies at all. Girardi is really the only reliably consistent RD the Rangers have right now. He's going nowhere.

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Old
04-14-2013, 09:44 PM
  #211
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Originally Posted by silverfish View Post
I don't think this applies at all. Girardi is really the only reliably consistent RD the Rangers have right now. He's going nowhere.
DZ can play on the right side.

DZ is a better player than Girardi, who happens to also be a UFA at the end of next season. He is also younger and cost controlled for a longer time. He is ALSO the only above-average offensive defenseman on our D.

Frankly, the notion that he should be moved, using nearly ANY hypothetical situation, is ludicrous.

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Old
04-15-2013, 12:22 AM
  #212
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Is there really someone in this thread going after stralman??? He is a 5/6 defenseman who does not hurt the team. What the hell more do you want? Phaneuf? Staal? Chara? Those are top 2 defensemen. Those guys get paid like top defenseman. And I know some ******* will argue about staal being a top 2 defenseman but it is pretty clear how important staal is to this team. Stralman gets paid a low salary and does a solid job. He played a pretty damn good game in toronto when they lost. He saved a goal. The guy has been consistent all year. Give it a rest.

I like Moore. He has flaws. He is raw and still young. But so far as played well. But to say he is ahead of stralman is silly.

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Old
04-15-2013, 05:07 AM
  #213
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Quote:
Originally Posted by setkreiderfree View Post
If you can't realize that Stralman is not a good defenseman, then I don't see much point debating it with you. It's pretty obvious to anybody who watches this sport. However, feel free to continue to praise him. He won't be on this team next season unless Sather is drunk.

Stralman is signed thru next season and he also plays the right side. Barring a trade or something terrible happening in the offseason Stralman will be with Rangers next season. Hopefully beyond that as well.


Staal - Girardi
McTruck - MDZ
Moore - Stralman

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Old
04-15-2013, 06:13 AM
  #214
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The Rangers had no choice but to play McDonagh big minutes. Del Zotto was terrible. He was assigned to the AHL and then broke his finger. McDonagh was brought up and Del Zotto was sent down. Then in 11-12,Staal missed the first 3 months with the concussion issues. Both McDonagh and Del Zotto benefitted from Staal being out in 11-12. DZ got his game back. Would that have happened if Staal was healthy? On this team,there is McDonagh and Del Zotto on the left side. That's not counting Staal being out with the eye injury. Looking at the depth on D and the amount of players up for new contracts,the Rangers will look to make a move. Moore has another year in entry level. McIlrath has 2 more years in entry level. Finances always come into play.

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Old
04-15-2013, 07:38 AM
  #215
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We have such a limited sample size with regard to Moore.He's had about what,twelve minutes to acclimate himself to the team?

He's an unknown commodity to the coaching staff so obviously he's going to see sheltered time.But with a full training camp under his belt next season he should be handled better.

He was a first rounder for a reason, let's see what some development could yield.

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Old
04-15-2013, 07:50 AM
  #216
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zenith View Post
DZ can play on the right side.

DZ is a better player than Girardi, who happens to also be a UFA at the end of next season. He is also younger and cost controlled for a longer time. He is ALSO the only above-average offensive defenseman on our D.

Frankly, the notion that he should be moved, using nearly ANY hypothetical situation, is ludicrous.
I could not disagree more.

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04-15-2013, 09:05 AM
  #217
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I like Moore and I like his tools, but he's not making anyone expendable for a while.

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04-15-2013, 09:05 AM
  #218
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Quote:
Originally Posted by setkreiderfree View Post
If you can't realize that Stralman is not a good defenseman, then I don't see much point debating it with you. It's pretty obvious to anybody who watches this sport. However, feel free to continue to praise him. He won't be on this team next season unless Sather is drunk.
I LOVE that statement. Because what followed was 10 people or so, who watch this team religiously, disagreeing with you.

Perfect argument, man. Gotta give the guy credit. You just can't argue with that logic.

I think a pair of Moore-Stralman is about as good as 3rd pairs get in the NHL. He's a solid player with great potential. Hopefully both are here for a few more years.

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Old
04-15-2013, 09:19 AM
  #219
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dudes played all of 57 minutes for this team and hes emerged and is now making guys expendable...seriously :faepalm:

dont get me wrong i like his game, his skating ability and his potential but this guy is still a very very raw talent.

for everyone saying DZ's been horrible and needs to be moved think about how he was playing before and now after the staal injury, he clearly isnt cut out to play 25 minutes a game.

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Old
04-15-2013, 09:24 AM
  #220
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This year's Moore is better than last year's Erixon.

No problem with Stralman or even Eminger though Stralman's the better player.

Don't like Del Zotto very much on the right side and right now I don't see him as a top pairing defenseman. I see him as a top 4 with very good (not great) puck moving skills. As a pwp point man he's okay--he handles and distributes the puck well but he doesn't have a great shot. That hurts his effectiveness. The Rangers need another d-man good on the pwp with a better (and accurate) shot.

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04-15-2013, 09:27 AM
  #221
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People do realize that MDZ is 1 year older than Moore right?

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04-15-2013, 09:55 AM
  #222
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DZ is 5 months older than Moore. Mike Sullivan is helping Moore. They watch video everyday. Not really sure what Columbus does with their D because the majority of them were developed in other organizations. The Rangers have a good track record with the young D. The Rangers will work with him and develop him into a NHL D.

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Old
04-15-2013, 10:09 AM
  #223
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Moore makes MDZ expendable? haha how do you figure that one?

Last time I checked we weren't exactly overflowing with offensive D-men. MDZ is still very young, and getting better all the time. MDZ stays.

Moore has some upside, and I'm excited to see him grow as a player, but he in no way, shape or form makes MDZ expendable.

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04-15-2013, 10:09 AM
  #224
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DZ is 5 months older than Moore. Mike Sullivan is helping Moore. They watch video everyday. Not really sure what Columbus does with their D because the majority of them were developed in other organizations. The Rangers have a good track record with the young D. The Rangers will work with him and develop him into a NHL D.
Ahh, ****.

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Old
04-15-2013, 10:12 AM
  #225
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Originally Posted by silverfish View Post
Just saying Moore coming in opens up options. If the Rangers want to explore adding a 1st rder this year, Moore, at the least, allows discussions to take place regarding Del Zotto.
Why? I dont see any feasible scenario where trading one of our top 4 defensemen (MDZ, Girardi, whoever) for a 1st rounder that wont be ready for years benefits this team in any way

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