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All Encompassing Tortorella..ella..ella..eh..eh...and Glen Cigar Thread Part III

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Old
04-14-2013, 10:17 AM
  #251
Leetch66
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I also like Dallas Eakins and or Dave Cameron an assistant with Ottawa and former coach of our World Jr Canadian team . There is a guy in the AUAA Hockey League....Canadian University...for U of New Brunswick...he has a great record as did 2 other Canuck University coaches named Keenan and Perron...who both won Stanley Cups . Might be a fresh new look and I think we have a squad that could work with him...I don't think we have a team of guys with egos and I think that is a good thing . Gardiner MacDougall.

http://varsityreds.ca/coaches.aspx?rc=121

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04-14-2013, 10:24 AM
  #252
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Originally Posted by Pizza View Post
Interesting. Gabby bears no responsibility for being invisible for the majority of games he played in this season? None? Amazing, along with the rest of this post which is a departure from reality.

Gaborik was not THE problem, but he was a huge problem. Nice guy. Good Team mate. ZERO presence on the ice. I'm sure that went over well in the locker room.

Tort's hates Euros. Again with this nuttiness. Just like he hated Feds, Vinny P., and now hates Hags.

I agree completely as to Richards. An even bigger disgrace.

Let's put it to the floor regarding Gabby: What would any of you, were you the coach of an NHL team, do with a highly paid athlete, that continued to be a non factor in game after game.
Chain him up in a public stockade and throw rotten food at hm...I dunno...just a suggestion LOL !

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04-14-2013, 10:25 AM
  #253
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Here are some quotes from guys who have played for Eakins.

Nazem Kadri:

He’s the glue that keeps the puzzle together. He’s the quarterback, so to speak, that gives us all the faith and confidence that we need to be successful… words can’t describe what he’s meant to me… When you have a coach like him, you just want to win so badly for him.

Joe Colborne:

I wouldn’t be surprised if some team steals him for next season. There’s no doubt in my mind that he’ll be a very successful NHL coach… What it comes down to is that he actually cares about his players. You want to go through a brick wall for him, and win for him. There’s huge respect for him in this dressing room. From the first line to the fourth line, he commands respect. Nobody wants to let him down. He’s such a great teacher…From day one when I came here, he’s been a breath of fresh air for me.Since coming here, my defensive play has skyrocketed. I’m much more confident in my own zone. I feel now, more than ever in my career, that I can step in as a third-line player and contribute. If that’s the role I need to play to crack the big team, I know I can do it.

Korbinian Holzer:

He’s a great players’coach. He involves his players. He treats us with respect. He’s also a great motivator. His speeches before games and in between periods get the most out of us. He always finds the right words to fire us up. As players, you see how hard that he works every day. He lives the way he wants us to live and he sets a great example.

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04-14-2013, 10:28 AM
  #254
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I heard Ron Low is available.

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04-14-2013, 10:35 AM
  #255
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Originally Posted by Pizza View Post
I think he will do very well in Cbus. Fresh start. Greatly reduced pressure. They looked great against the Blues last night. I will be surprised if they don't make the play offs at this point and I'm really pulling for them.

So yes, Gabby will do well. This only underscores the point. It's about how he, Gabby feels. Which means that first and foremost it's about Gabby and NOT the team. To me, that is mainly why he is no longer a Ranger. I can't believe that some of his Ranger team mates were not tempted to give him a sound thrashing. Same with that other malcontent Richards.

You can't get away from this in modern sports unfortunately. The culture coddles and gives special privilege to professional athletes. Especially the more highly skilled and compensated. Gabby has become the cliche' out of central casting for the modern athlete. A highly paid, temperamental, head case. He'll play well for you if you don't use harsh language, don't ride his a$$ for being one dimensional, and most especially, if he feels like it. It has zero to do with if he's a Euro or not.

Dealing with this is a very fine line for any Coach or franchise to walk and Tort's is by no means the most adroit at dealing with it and is not exempt from blame to some extent. But I do think it's telling that the Rangers decided to pull the trigger on this deal and Gabby signed off on it as well.

Bottom line for me is that when an athlete decides to stop playing his best, he is quitting on his team, his mates and the fans that pay his salary. I don't see how any one who paid a nickle to watch this guy play has any sympathy for him.

####ENDRANT#####
Lot of truths there Pizza [and Torts has to go] ...it also makes me wonder about our team leadership and I don't specifically mean Cally [and Torts has to go] ...I think we are still lacking[and Torts has to go] ....this team has not bonded [and Torts has to go] or maybe because the parts have been moved around so much... time to gell just never occurred [and Torts has to go] . Whatever it is [and Torts has to go] ...it certainly is by no means a recipe for success in the playoffs and again...all our hopes are placed on Hank . That really is a sad state of affairs . [and Torts has to go]

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04-14-2013, 10:59 AM
  #256
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Originally Posted by setkreiderfree View Post
Our best faceoff guy by far Brian Boyle is no longer taking faceoffs while the team is getting slaughtered every night in the circle. I think that sums up our head coach quite nicely.
Sums up this board too, which wanted him benched/traded because he's useless...

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04-14-2013, 11:23 AM
  #257
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pizza View Post
Interesting. Gabby bears no responsibility for being invisible for the majority of games he played in this season? None? Amazing, along with the rest of this post which is a departure from reality.

Gaborik was not THE problem, but he was a huge problem. Nice guy. Good Team mate. ZERO presence on the ice. I'm sure that went over well in the locker room.

Tort's hates Euros. Again with this nuttiness. Just like he hated Feds, Vinny P., and now hates Hags.

I agree completely as to Richards. An even bigger disgrace.

Let's put it to the floor regarding Gabby: What would any of you, were you the coach of an NHL team, do with a highly paid athlete, that continued to be a non factor in game after game.



Let him play his game and do what he's good at instead of forcing him to play a style that he is neither physically or mentally able to play? Seems to be working for him in Columbus.

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04-14-2013, 11:40 AM
  #258
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Players should be put in positions to accentuate their positives not constantly dwell on their negatives. Coaches should maximize their players talents. How many times on this board have we heard a certain player could never play for Torts because he is not Torts kind of player because he doesn't grind on the side boards, jam, or block shots? Well that is ridiculous. Was Wayne Gretzky that type of player? Was Mike Bossy? Was Guy Lafluer? Torts like Avery had his time here and at some point it may have became enough. If this team does not go far in the playoffs he should be replaced just like Renney was replaced. No hard feelings. There is a saying that coaches are hired to be fired. Barry Melrose coached his team to a Stanley cup final. It did not mean he should stay coach forever.

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04-14-2013, 11:43 AM
  #259
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Originally Posted by NickyFotiu View Post
I could name 50 guys at different levels I would prefer over Torts. I believe guys are flat out worn down by his petulant ways. Other teams commentators say the joke around the NHL is the Rangers play blocky not hockey. This team wins inspite of Tort not because of him. When I see a guy like Cally giving a half effort and looking for shortcuts I shake my head. Tort has grinded the fun out of the game.
Please, name them. So many people have asked you guys to do this, and it keeps getting ignored. And then instead of actually responding, people like yourself just come along and say complete BS like this. Go ahead, NAME them. 50 coaches that are realistic options for replacements. In previous versions of this thread I could only name ~8-10 that I would want over Torts, and every single one of them was not a realistic option. But please, fire away. Get me those 50 names... unless you're full of ****.

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04-14-2013, 11:52 AM
  #260
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NickyFotiu View Post
I could name 50 guys at different levels I would prefer over Torts. I believe guys are flat out worn down by his petulant ways. Other teams commentators say the joke around the NHL is the Rangers play blocky not hockey. This team wins inspite of Tort not because of him. When I see a guy like Cally giving a half effort and looking for shortcuts I shake my head. Tort has grinded the fun out of the game.
Oh, please. The guy interviewing an Isles player after the second period said that and he sounded like an idiot. The player didn't even laugh if I recall correctly, he said that the Isles' plan was to block a lot of shots too. Welcome to the NHL in 2013.

I'm sick of hearing "the team wins in spite of Torts, not because of him." That's not an argument, it's a statement and it's a shallow statement at that. Argue in favor of it - based on what?

Call me crazy, but when I see two players that can't make a pass to one another from 4 feet away, the coaching doesn't leap out to me as being the main problem.

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04-14-2013, 12:00 PM
  #261
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Originally Posted by NickyFotiu View Post
Players should be put in positions to accentuate their positives not constantly dwell on their negatives. Coaches should maximize their players talents. How many times on this board have we heard a certain player could never play for Torts because he is not Torts kind of player because he doesn't grind on the side boards, jam, or block shots? Well that is ridiculous. Was Wayne Gretzky that type of player? Was Mike Bossy? Was Guy Lafluer? Torts like Avery had his time here and at some point it may have became enough. If this team does not go far in the playoffs he should be replaced just like Renney was replaced. No hard feelings. There is a saying that coaches are hired to be fired. Barry Melrose coached his team to a Stanley cup final. It did not mean he should stay coach forever.
We haven't "heard" that ever. "We," meaning some people on HF, say that. Huge difference. I have never once heard of a player not coming to NYR or not being acquired by NYR because he's not a a Torts player. Zucc doesn't stand out to me as a "Torts guy," neither does Brassard, neither does Nash for that matter, or Hagelin. Are these guys not put in positive positions? Is Stepan a board-warrior, shot-blocking, jam jam jam kind of player? How's he doing this year?

Maybe Torts should be replaced if the team doesn't have a good playoff run, but it's not because of these silly points, it's because, like you said, coaches don't last forever. Maybe the team has already peaked with him. It's too early to say right now, but we'll see. That's a logical reason for a new coach, not these silly "blocky" and "Torts type of guy" memes.

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04-14-2013, 12:19 PM
  #262
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Originally Posted by haveandare View Post
We haven't "heard" that ever. "We," meaning some people on HF, say that. Huge difference. I have never once heard of a player not coming to NYR or not being acquired by NYR because he's not a a Torts player. Zucc doesn't stand out to me as a "Torts guy," neither does Brassard, neither does Nash for that matter, or Hagelin. Are these guys not put in positive positions? Is Stepan a board-warrior, shot-blocking, jam jam jam kind of player? How's he doing this year?

Maybe Torts should be replaced if the team doesn't have a good playoff run, but it's not because of these silly points, it's because, like you said, coaches don't last forever. Maybe the team has already peaked with him. It's too early to say right now, but we'll see. That's a logical reason for a new coach, not these silly "blocky" and "Torts type of guy" memes.
Exactly, except I don't think he should be replaced for next year regardless. "Torts kind of guy" and the like is an HF board thing, it's not coming from the franchise. Last year, the line was "the right way". That was the mantra. What that meant was just to not cut corners or play lazy. It meant not cheating, either on O or on D. It asked guys to play each game like it ****ing mattered. Play "playoff hockey" all the time. And it worked. Gabby had an incredible individual season with it. It's disgusting seeing posters say we shouldn't ask this from our players, that our coach should encourage them to be soft and lazy.

And the passing complaints are just comical. The team can't pass well, ****ing torts not doing enough passing drills in practice. A coach Bombay would have brought out the eggs and had this team passing great by now!

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04-14-2013, 12:26 PM
  #263
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Originally Posted by Richter Scale View Post
Please, name them. So many people have asked you guys to do this, and it keeps getting ignored. And then instead of actually responding, people like yourself just come along and say complete BS like this. Go ahead, NAME them. 50 coaches that are realistic options for replacements. In previous versions of this thread I could only name ~8-10 that I would want over Torts, and every single one of them was not a realistic option. But please, fire away. Get me those 50 names... unless you're full of ****.
I said I could name 50 coaches I would prefer over Torts. I never said all were available. You changed the specifications of what I said.

I apologize in advance for some misspellings.

1. Babcock
2. Bowman
3. Robinson
4. Schoenfeld
5. Bylsma
6. Burns
7. Crawford
8. Demers
9. Hanlon
10. Therrien
11. Lewis
12. Hartley
13. Samualson
14. Laviolette
15. Lemaires
16. Lamoriollo
17. Peters
18. Daryle Sutter
19. Julien
20. Carlyle
21. Ruff
22. Muarry (Terry)
23. Mactavish
24. Maurice
25. Maclean
26. Wilson
27. Quinn
28. Leetch
29. Hartsburg
30. Davidson
31. Hitchcock
32. Johnston
33. Lowe
34. Nolan
35. Muarry (Bryan)
36. Quenneville
37. Herb Brooks ghost
38. Barry Trotz
39. Vigneault
40. Ron Wilson
41. Sam Rosen's hair
42. The guy selling roast beef sandwiches
43. Tiger Williams
44. Gordon Bombey
45. Murray Chadwick
46. Al Arbour
47. Herb Brooks Widow
48. Reggie Dunlop
49. Tom Renney
50. Brian Sutter

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04-14-2013, 12:54 PM
  #264
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Originally Posted by NickyFotiu View Post
I said I could name 50 coaches I would prefer over Torts. I never said all were available. You changed the specifications of what I said.

I apologize in advance for some misspellings.

1. Babcock
2. Bowman
3. Robinson
4. Schoenfeld
5. Bylsma
6. Burns
7. Crawford
8. Demers
9. Hanlon
10. Therrien
11. Lewis
12. Hartley
13. Samualson
14. Laviolette
15. Lemaires
16. Lamoriollo
17. Peters
18. Daryle Sutter
19. Julien
20. Carlyle
21. Ruff
22. Muarry (Terry)
23. Mactavish
24. Maurice
25. Maclean
26. Wilson
27. Quinn
28. Leetch
29. Hartsburg
30. Davidson
31. Hitchcock
32. Johnston
33. Lowe
34. Nolan
35. Muarry (Bryan)
36. Quenneville
37. Herb Brooks ghost
38. Barry Trotz
39. Vigneault
40. Ron Wilson
41. Sam Rosen's hair
42. The guy selling roast beef sandwiches
43. Tiger Williams
44. Gordon Bombey
45. Murray Chadwick
46. Al Arbour
47. Herb Brooks Widow
48. Reggie Dunlop
49. Tom Renney
50. Brian Sutter
So basically you were full of **** when you said 50?

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04-14-2013, 01:04 PM
  #265
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.....no greasy Islanders guy on that list?

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04-14-2013, 01:15 PM
  #266
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Originally Posted by NYR1967 View Post
[/B]

Let him play his game and do what he's good at instead of forcing him to play a style that he is neither physically or mentally able to play? Seems to be working for him in Columbus.
What is "his game"? It certainly isn't coasting and not engaging himself in anyway.

Gaborik wasn't putting in the full effort required to be successful, here - maybe it's because he wants to be the #1 focus on the team, maybe it's because he's sick of Tortorella - but, whatever the case may be, it doesn't matter. The whole "Tortorella ran him out of town, poor Gabby" mantra is such BS and so made up I can't believe people buy into it. Gaborik gave up when he decided he didn't want to be here anymore, and frankly, he can get the **** out if he's not going to put in the effort he needs to to be successful.

Whatever success he has in Columbus, he wasn't finding it here, because he didn't want to find it here.

This is coming from an active Torts criticizer.

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04-14-2013, 01:25 PM
  #267
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Originally Posted by Zenith View Post
What is "his game"? It certainly isn't coasting and not engaging himself in anyway.

Gaborik wasn't putting in the full effort required to be successful, here - maybe it's because he wants to be the #1 focus on the team, maybe it's because he's sick of Tortorella - but, whatever the case may be, it doesn't matter. The whole "Tortorella ran him out of town, poor Gabby" mantra is such BS and so made up I can't believe people buy into it. Gaborik gave up when he decided he didn't want to be here anymore, and frankly, he can get the **** out if he's not going to put in the effort he needs to to be successful.

Whatever success he has in Columbus, he wasn't finding it here, because he didn't want to find it here.

This is coming from an active Torts criticizer.
Agree that Gabby had quit here and needed to go, the change in his game since the trade is night/day.

Does anyone think that Torts post elimination comments last season killed what was already not a great relationship between them?

Remember the guy played 2 rounds with a torn labrum...

“Gabby ... still has to learn, I believe, along with a number of our guys ... that when you get to the conference finals — and Gabby wasn’t bad in the first two rounds — as it ratchets up and there are four teams left, you have to get it to another level, and I don’t think he was able to,”

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04-14-2013, 01:36 PM
  #268
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Originally Posted by Zenith View Post
What is "his game"? It certainly isn't coasting and not engaging himself in anyway.

Gaborik wasn't putting in the full effort required to be successful, here - maybe it's because he wants to be the #1 focus on the team, maybe it's because he's sick of Tortorella - but, whatever the case may be, it doesn't matter. The whole "Tortorella ran him out of town, poor Gabby" mantra is such BS and so made up I can't believe people buy into it. Gaborik gave up when he decided he didn't want to be here anymore, and frankly, he can get the **** out if he's not going to put in the effort he needs to to be successful.

Whatever success he has in Columbus, he wasn't finding it here, because he didn't want to find it here.

This is coming from an active Torts criticizer.
Well said.

I can't feel sympathetic for any player that quits on his team. I'm sure there have been times when Lundqvist gets fed up with the way the team is performing in front of him. He looked absolutely devastated a few weeks ago. But he doesn't complain about it or put in less than an effort because he's unhappy.

Gabby was playing like he wanted out. He was fully capable of playing and skating like he currently is in Columbus but he chose not to. I don't know if it's because he was trying to spite Torts or if he was disappointed that he had to share the spotlight with Nash. I think Gabby was a good teammate prior to this season but his attitude this year is not something I want in the locker room.

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04-14-2013, 01:50 PM
  #269
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Originally Posted by Zenith View Post
What is "his game"? It certainly isn't coasting and not engaging himself in anyway.

Gaborik wasn't putting in the full effort required to be successful, here - maybe it's because he wants to be the #1 focus on the team, maybe it's because he's sick of Tortorella - but, whatever the case may be, it doesn't matter. The whole "Tortorella ran him out of town, poor Gabby" mantra is such BS and so made up I can't believe people buy into it. Gaborik gave up when he decided he didn't want to be here anymore, and frankly, he can get the **** out if he's not going to put in the effort he needs to to be successful.

Whatever success he has in Columbus, he wasn't finding it here, because he didn't want to find it here.

This is coming from an active Torts criticizer.
I don't disagree with you that Gabby had given up, but let me propose a hypothetical situation for you.

Let's say that you are a whiz bang marketer/PR guy, but you really suck at math. You have a 5 year contract with a firm (doesn't matter what type) and you were hired to be in marketing. Your efforts at marketing and PR are for the most part successful, but for the past 3 years your boss tells you that if you don't have the skills or the will to become a CPA, you're a useless POS. Now, maybe you could tolerate that, and if you can, kudos to you, because you are mentally tougher than me. If I were in that situation, my response after 3 years of that would be "**** this guy, I'm done."

Torts is IMHO not a creative problem solver - his asset management is suspect at best. If he can't bang a square peg into a round hole, he throws the peg in the garbage - regardless of whether the peg is made of balsa wood or oak, and honestly, I don't really blame Gaborik for throwing in the towel.

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04-14-2013, 01:58 PM
  #270
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Agree that Gabby had quit here and needed to go, the change in his game since the trade is night/day.

Does anyone think that Torts post elimination comments last season killed what was already not a great relationship between them?

Remember the guy played 2 rounds with a torn labrum...

“Gabby ... still has to learn, I believe, along with a number of our guys ... that when you get to the conference finals — and Gabby wasn’t bad in the first two rounds — as it ratchets up and there are four teams left, you have to get it to another level, and I don’t think he was able to,”
I think so.

While it is obvious Gabby wasn't really giving 100% this season, it really had to hurt playing so hard in the playoffs with an obviously serious injury, and then being blasted for not being good enough by his coach afterwards. We do have to remember, at that time (I think you're referring to a tv interview Torts did during the cup finals when he made those comments) no one in the Rangers organization really knew the extent of the injury.

It's never ok to quit on your team and your teammates. That much is for certain. But I also wonder if there was an attempt on either Gabby's or Torts' side to try and mend fences at some point. From on outsider prospective, it really doesn't feel like Torts ever bothered to extend an olive branch. If it was me, I'd probably want to make sure my top scorer was feeling good about management and the team.

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04-14-2013, 01:59 PM
  #271
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So the player can't quit if he is having big disagreements with the coach? He was sick and tired of Torts coaching just as most of us and I am sure some other players for the Rangers.

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04-14-2013, 02:08 PM
  #272
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So basically you were full of **** when you said 50?
No I could have named a lot more than 50 but I attempted to include some humor in around the last 10. Do you think that Tort apologists have a sense of humor? Or are they just like he is?

Would you like me to name another 10? 15? 20? I barely touched assistant coaches, college coaches, minor league coaches and current coaches in my list so far.

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04-14-2013, 02:12 PM
  #273
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Originally Posted by NickyFotiu View Post
No I could have named a lot more than 50 but I attempted to include some humor in around the last 10. Do you think that Tort apologists have a sense of humor? Or are they just like he is?

Would you like me to name another 10? 15? 20? I barely touched assistant coaches, college coaches, minor league coaches and current coaches in my list so far.
Your list became a joke way before number 40.

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04-14-2013, 02:13 PM
  #274
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Originally Posted by NYR1967 View Post
I don't disagree with you that Gabby had given up, but let me propose a hypothetical situation for you.

Let's say that you are a whiz bang marketer/PR guy, but you really suck at math. You have a 5 year contract with a firm (doesn't matter what type) and you were hired to be in marketing. Your efforts at marketing and PR are for the most part successful, but for the past 3 years your boss tells you that if you don't have the skills or the will to become a CPA, you're a useless POS. Now, maybe you could tolerate that, and if you can, kudos to you, because you are mentally tougher than me. If I were in that situation, my response after 3 years of that would be "**** this guy, I'm done."

Torts is IMHO not a creative problem solver - his asset management is suspect at best. If he can't bang a square peg into a round hole, he throws the peg in the garbage - regardless of whether the peg is made of balsa wood or oak, and honestly, I don't really blame Gaborik for throwing in the towel.
When did Torts ask Gaborik to do something aside from what he was hired to do? The guy had two of the best years of his career here with Torts. He never even came close to playing a "Torts game," yet he got first line minutes year after year until his play completely fell off toward the end of this season.

Torts gave him the business about not stepping up in the playoffs last year, and maybe that was a stupid thing to do because he was hurt, but he didn't get on Gabby for not grinding hard enough, he got on him for not scoring, which is exactly what he was brought in to do.

I don't see the problem with "creative problem solving" either. Zucc isn't a "Torts guy," neither is Brassard, or Nash, or Stepan for that matter. Is he trying to change those guys and getting ready to throw them out? No. They're doing what is expected of them, and they're getting minutes, and occasionally getting outright praise for their play.

Like I said earlier, maybe Torts' time is coming to an end. Maybe the team has peaked with him. That's a reason to find a new coach, not these fabricated theories about why Torts is responsible for every single shortcoming that every single player shows.

Lastly, there is never an excuse to quit on your team like that. Demand a trade if you want one, but keep playing your hardest for the sake of your teammates and your fans.

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04-14-2013, 02:25 PM
  #275
bernmeister
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Harleydude666 View Post
I see everyone here week after week bash Tortorella, " needs to be fired, he sucks, get rid of him right now" etc etc etc

Ok, then tell me who can come in here right now or for next season who can do better??? And don't give me a coach who's already committed to another team right now or resurrect a coach from the dead. I see all this negative crap on how this guy can't coach, but no one offers a realistic replacement. Anyone here smart enough to give this answer because I haven't seen a viable one yet. I like Torts, but I'm all for improvement anytime you can. Anyone??????
I do not have an immediate definitive answer long term.

I do have a sure fire winner short term.
Someone we all like and respect.
Someone qualified on the basis of knowledge and ability.
Someone who knows the team.
Someone who all or nearly all the entire team would not dare defy, and if there were one or two holdouts, which I'm not saying there are, but for arguments sake, the support from the majority of the players would force them into line.
Someone who is aware of what's going on, yet could offer a fresh personal perspective.
Guess who?





Wait for it....


Wait for it....



My vote is for PLAYER-COACH, Ryan Callahan.

See how he likes it for post retirement, and it provides full time to get any other guy we'd want in the meantime.

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