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Habs D doesn't hold up 7-3 loss

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04-16-2013, 12:51 AM
  #301
SouthernHab
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Originally Posted by Et le But View Post
Well, as far as "insurance" goes, that's what Drewhiskie was for. You only go for a Murray if you are making a run for it. Murray is a bottom pairing guy at this point who costs more than most. People complained when Gauthier traded for Sopel and Mara, Murray is like a cross between them.

Clowe was allegedly demanding a lot of money if resigned, we don't know if that's true but we do know he hasn't signed yet. And really, Clowe plays the same role as Bourque does. Not that they are identical players but they both are at their best in similar circumstances, doing the dirty work while serving as secondary shooters. You have complained that Bourque being back has hurt the team's chemistry, Clowe would be like that only more so. Sure, he'd probably have been a better choice to try and fight guys like Simmonds than Moen, but who knows at this point. If we make room for Clowe we can still go after him in the off season, but he really hasn't done much after a great first game with the Rangers.
I have to go to bed.

I will say that Bourque is not even close to Clowe in what they do on the ice. The only similarity is that they both wear skates.

And yes, if Therrien did have Clowe on the team and moved Ryder down to the 3rd, I would complain also. Most normal hockey fans would as well. Clowe would be a great addition to the DD or Eller line. Not a subtraction that Bourque has been on the top line.

Anyway, rough night. Things can only get better or worse.

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Old
04-16-2013, 12:51 AM
  #302
Et le But
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Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
That's what I was just pointing at..

Desharnais, Gionta, Moen, Armstrong and Bouillon need to go.

To be acquired:
A skilled forward who is average size 5'11 or so.
A physical forward who can be a net front presence and chip in goals.
A face-off/PK specialist that can be physical.
A top-4 D Man that is physical in his own end.
So, Jagr, Clarkson, Ott and Giordano?

Just get us unlimited cap space and the ability to blackmail other GMs and we are set.

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04-16-2013, 12:52 AM
  #303
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Originally Posted by StellerEller View Post
Am I the only one who likes Blunden? The guy is a big boy who doesn't get pushed around and can actually play some hockey. Not an elite 4th liner but a more than competent one.

Dumont is cool too, but he's another smurf, we can't afford to have him in the lineup IMO.
No you're not. I also think Blunden does exactly what he's supposed to AND can score. He got taken out because he made a good hit in the last game he was in, but they called it late. He hasn't done anything wrong, hasn't cost the team and hits. Also pretty quick for his size.

Honestly I love Dumont. No idea why he isn't in, but the Gallys get the chance. He was awesome in every one of his games. I don't remember a single complaint about him. Reminded me of when Lappy was coming into his own, creating scoring chances and being strong and tenacious on the puck. Dumont doesn't play like a smurf and if you look at Gally, you know that it's how you play that matters.

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04-16-2013, 12:53 AM
  #304
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
We have the goal scorers on this team. We dont need Clowe to be the goal scorer for this team. We need Clowe to allow our goal scorers to do their job, all the while being on the ice and not hurting the team.

Isnt that what was always said on the enforcer thread? We need someone who can play hockey and still step up when needed.

And there was Clowe, and now he is based on zero goals (he's had a couple with the Rangers so far) and useless to this team.
Useless? No. But it doesn't make sense for us to make that kind of trade now. In the offseason we can look for bigger players via FA or make trades at that point. I don't see any reason to deal away picks to get the guy esp when it's a deep draft.

If we're going to deal picks I hope it's to deal UP in the draft.

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04-16-2013, 12:53 AM
  #305
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Et le But View Post
So, Jagr, Clarkson, Ott and Giordano?

Just get us unlimited cap space and the ability to blackmail other GMs and we are set.
The choice is simply:
Gionta + Weber to Colorado for 2nd round pick. Habs eat 2.5 million of Gionta's salary.
DD to Tampa Bay for Kucherov and 2014 3rd round pick
Moen to Oilers to 2014 5th round pick.

Okay, I need to go to bed.,

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Old
04-16-2013, 12:54 AM
  #306
Rosso Scuderia
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Originally Posted by thebinne4pres View Post
F
Voracek, 6'2"
Rosehill, 6'3"
Simmonds, 6'2"
Mcginn, 6'2"
Knuble, 6'3"
Hartnell, 6'2"
Hall, 6'2"
Couturier, 6'3"

D
Foster, 6'5"
Huskins, 6'4"
Lauridsen, 6'6"
Schenn, 6'2"

No player under 5'10"

Look at this defense....you see this defense, right?

I know...let's throw our 5'7" Desharnais 20:44 freaking minutes on the ice
That's a good idea. Let's put 5'7" Gionta and 5'9" Gallagher a bit more than 15 minutes.

We have 4 players with a 6'2" frame in our team....only that!!
Nothing more....let's play Bourque 14M. Eller 14:43......Moen 10M

Do not even try to protect a little Gallagher...the kids getting banged up.
Left him on a line with a player who can't do absolutely nothing to anyone in case of intimidation.
And with Pacioretty who is barely capable of taking care of himself.

Grrrrrrr..................
Was in the CB tonight....that size is so much more obvious at the rink
Not like I disagree that we need to get bigger and grittier but the example of the Flyers defense just don't work. Yes, they are big but there aren't that good if good at all. If they are that good, we will see the Bryzgalov in Phoenix not the one that allows 3 goals+ almost every games.

Pretty sure if we played hard and followed the system, those giants defenseman would look like cone.

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04-16-2013, 12:56 AM
  #307
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Originally Posted by BlackWatch View Post
We lost two *********g games grow up people, this years team will not give an inch to anyone in the playoffs. Have some pride!
You think tonight's loss was just another loss? That it wasn't significant for a multitude of reasons, one of which (unexpected) is that the leafs might pass us?

This wasn't just another game, this was a character game, so I don't see why you think come playoffs, we would respond differently. The team had a mission. They failed MISERABLY. It's justified to be livid about the team's play or worried at the least. I wish the team played with some pride (save 3-4 players). Not sure what you mean by posting that we should have pride. It's THAT we have pride that is causing the discussions about what we need to change, cuz sans Emelin...this D sucks.

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04-16-2013, 12:58 AM
  #308
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Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
That's what I was just pointing at..

Desharnais, Gionta, Moen, Armstrong and Bouillon need to go.

To be acquired:
A skilled forward who is average size 5'11 or so.
A physical forward who can be a net front presence and chip in goals.
A face-off/PK specialist that can be physical.
A top-4 D Man that is physical in his own end.
I feel you totally.

Bourque-Plekanec-Ryder
XXX-Eller-Gallagher
Patches-Galchenyuk-XXX
Prust-XXX-Dumont/Armstrong(I really don't mind him there.)

XXX-Subban
Emelin-Diaz
Markov-Gorges

This is how I see our lineup going forward...
Kristo, Hudon, Bournival, Leblanc, Holland , Beaulieu, Tinordi, Pateryn and Nattinen could all maybe fit in one of those spots right away.

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04-16-2013, 12:59 AM
  #309
Et le But
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
The choice is simply:
Gionta + Weber to Colorado for 2nd round pick. Habs eat 2.5 million of Gionta's salary.
DD to Tampa Bay for Kucherov and 2014 3rd round pick
Moen to Oilers to 2014 5th round pick.

Okay, I need to go to bed.,
And before I sign off myself I will think of my magical lineup that fills your request:

Bourque-Plekanec-Jagr
Pacioretty-Galchenyuk-Ryder
Gallagher-Eller-Clarkson
White?-Ott-Prust

Subban-Diaz
Giordano-Gorges
Markov-Emelin

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04-16-2013, 12:59 AM
  #310
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Originally Posted by Rosso Scuderia View Post
Not like I disagree that we need to get bigger and grittier but the example of the Flyers defense just don't work. Yes, they are big but there aren't that good if good at all. If they are that good, we will see the Bryzgalov in Phoenix not the one that allows 3 goals+ almost every games.

Pretty sure if we played hard and followed the system, those giants defenseman would look like cone.
Big don't mean good.....but even without being good...they can stop small forwards.
It's easy to stop small forward by shaking them a little.

Well...let's look at another team the Habs seems to have all the trouble in the world lately...Toronto:

D
Franson, 6'5"
Fraser, 6'4"
Gardiner, 6'2"
Gunnarson, 6'2"
O'byrne, 6'5"
Phaneuf, 6'3"

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04-16-2013, 01:00 AM
  #311
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Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
Exactly.. we could be the Florida Panthers next year. The goal is to become like the Bruins, Penguins, Blackhawks and Red Wings + Devils (now starting to falter). A team that has a chance to win year in and year out.
Or you can go the Flyers and Rangers route.. which only has one year of magic, then a bunch of puzzling years where you're left wondering what the hell is going on.

If this team isn't meant to do it as is this year, you adjust in the off season, identify the weak spots and make the necessary moves to ensure that this team is an elite team going forward. If we fall flat on our faces in the play-offs and next season.. all that means is we rode a half-season hot streak, which is enough because it was a shortened season.
Exactly. I'm tired of waiting for us to have a flukey season. We finally have a good core and we should add to it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by habtastic View Post
You think tonight's loss was just another loss? That it wasn't significant for a multitude of reasons, one of which (unexpected) is that the leafs might pass us?

This wasn't just another game, this was a character game, so I don't see why you think come playoffs, we would respond differently. The team had a mission. They failed MISERABLY. It's justified to be livid about the team's play or worried at the least. I wish the team played with some pride (save 3-4 players). Not sure what you mean by posting that we should have pride. It's THAT we have pride that is causing the discussions about what we need to change, cuz sans Emelin...this D sucks.
This team has answered the bell all year long. We haven't had a three game losing streak this season yet. It had to happen at some point. Let's not be overly dramatic here.

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04-16-2013, 01:01 AM
  #312
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And about the general game of everyone tonight:


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04-16-2013, 01:02 AM
  #313
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Btw, what happened with Marc Denis tonight? What did he do?

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04-16-2013, 01:02 AM
  #314
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the bandwagon is emptying fast!!!this is the time where true fans are separated from the poseurs.

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04-16-2013, 01:04 AM
  #315
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Fact is that intensity and killer instinct is clearly missing after they clinch playoff-spot.

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04-16-2013, 01:14 AM
  #316
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Fact is that intensity and killer instinct is clearly missing after they clinch playoff-spot.
yup.its the end of the world.

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04-16-2013, 01:15 AM
  #317
Et le But
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thebinne4pres View Post
Big don't mean good.....but even without being good...they can stop small forwards.
It's easy to stop small forward by shaking them a little.

Well...let's look at another team the Habs seems to have all the trouble in the world lately...Toronto:

D
Franson, 6'5"
Fraser, 6'4"
Gardiner, 6'2"
Gunnarson, 6'2"
O'byrne, 6'5"
Phaneuf, 6'3"
Too bad all that size isn't stopping them from being outshot 3 to 1. We were able to do that under Jacques Martin too.

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04-16-2013, 01:16 AM
  #318
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if size were the be all end all the bruins would be a dynasty.

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04-16-2013, 01:18 AM
  #319
habtastic
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Exactly. I'm tired of waiting for us to have a flukey season. We finally have a good core and we should add to it.

This team has answered the bell all year long. We haven't had a three game losing streak this season yet. It had to happen at some point. Let's not be overly dramatic here.
LG, I agree with everything you're saying in this thread, including MB doing a good job at the deadline, but the Toronto game is one thing (which btw happened twice), this was something else. It's at least a sign that certain players aren't capable of filling certain roles. So maybe, yeah, less drama, but time to look at changing things before it's too late. There's nothing special about DD and Patches and MT better explain the system to the team again, cuz I have also forgotten what it looks like.

That and our scorers have lost their touch. Not sure how to fix that although coaching helps.

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04-16-2013, 01:24 AM
  #320
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Btw, what happened with Marc Denis tonight? What did he do?
You know that part when someone asks him a question and he gives his opinion?

Q tonight was "what's up with CP31?"

He answered it standing RIGHT next to Price and in doing so mentioned his name (could easily not have). Carey thus knew that the telecast was now focussed on him and he gave this knowing glance at the camera. Following shots showed him either super pissed, super upset or both (which I would be).

Denis is a moron for that, I hope he had a talk with Carey after to tell him that everyone is still behind him. We don't need another 09 playoff experience, we need him to feel like the fans are counting on him and believe in him. His psychological state is (I know it sounds petty) really important right now. He needs a lift, not a sledgehammer to the face like MD delivered.

It was replayed on AC and made more obvious how that slip up by Denis was affecting Price.

I know people think he doesn't care, but he really does. A lot.

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04-16-2013, 01:26 AM
  #321
Watsatheo
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Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
That's what I was just pointing at..

Desharnais, Gionta, Moen, Armstrong and Bouillon need to go.

To be acquired:
A skilled forward who is average size 5'11 or so.
A physical forward who can be a net front presence and chip in goals.
A face-off/PK specialist that can be physical.
A top-4 D Man that is physical in his own end.

No idea how the D is going to be fixed, but on offense:

Out: Desharnais, Gionta, Armstrong, Bourque

UFA: Clowe, Stalberg
Trade: Stastny

Pacioretty - Stastny - Gallagher
Clowe - Plekanec - Ryder
Galchenyuk - Eller - Stalberg
Moen - Dumont - Prust

With that as top 9, we'd be pretty hard to beat. Maybe Avalanche would be dumb enough to take DD, Bourque, Boullion.

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04-16-2013, 01:28 AM
  #322
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So what's the general opinion on Bouruqe. Will he get back to where he was at the beginning of the season or will he just be missing chances left, right and center/not creating them at all?

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04-16-2013, 01:28 AM
  #323
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if size were the be all end all the bruins would be a dynasty.
Well they won a cup just before the Kings.

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04-16-2013, 01:32 AM
  #324
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I want to see:

Pacioretty - Plekanec - Bourque
Galchenyuk - Eller - Gallagher
Gionta - Desharnais - Ryder
Moen - Halpern - Dumont/Prust

Give Patches a game or two with Pleks and Bourque to see how much his point production improves. Give DD softer minutes with less ice time. Give Eller's line more ice time.

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04-16-2013, 01:36 AM
  #325
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Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
Nope. He was inactive for good reason. This team doesn't have what it takes. I saw it and thankfully he saw it too.

Don't call me another bipolar fan because you can go back to the trade deadline where I repeatedly said we have to see how this team performs in the play-offs before we start making deals like a contender. We've seen this team over-achieve before only to plummet to the earth where they belong.

I'd package Gionta and Weber send them to Colorado for a 2nd round pick with us eating 2.5 million of Gionta's salary.
Moen would be sold to the highest bidder for whatever pick we can get.
I'd move Desharnais for a pick and a solid prospect like Kucherov out of Tampa Bay (they love our ex-players).
Armstrong would not be re-signed.

I'd make a pitch for Clowe, a fighter who can play regular minutes in the bottom four, a rugged penalty kill/face-off specialist, a top 4 defenseman and a skilled player with at least average size.
I don't disagree with that. The fact is, MB probably thought we didn't have the team to go far anyway. But we were first in the East and this does not happen everyday and maybe it won't happen ever again. On this type of situation you can go get a top player without sacrificing youth.

Also he should have helped fixing the physical aspect of our team too and help our D squad. Cause players are gonna get injured and this is a problem he has not been fixed yet.

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