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Habs on Tradecentre Part 8 (Post-Deadline & Free Agency Talk: All proposals here)

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Old
04-16-2013, 04:35 PM
  #876
HiggsBozon
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
I'm not blinded by homerism, it's that you can't look at players objectively. Doesn't take a genius to see the value Gorges bring to the team.

Once again you're pretty far off the mark. Elias is 6'1" how does that make him "smallish"? He's bigger than Ryder!

He will cost around what Ryder will and he is a better player and more versatile. He has 31 points in 42 games on a crappy New Jersey team who's #3 scorer is Clarkson with 21 points in 42 games! One of the most underrated players in the NHL the last 10 years. He would be a great signing for 2 years at around 5 mil(which is what Ryder will cost anyways).
No, it doesn't take a genius to know the value of Gorges. But you're definitely not one of those who does.

Elias might be 6'1, he's not even 200 pounds. He's as big as Colby Armstrong, and Koivu would level him more often than not against Montreal. He's also a 37 years old player who's bound to regress. We just got rid of a horrible contract with Erik Cole, why would anyone want to replace him with another old player?

As for your premise that he was able to score 31 points for a crappy NJ team while being the only guy to produce... isn't it an indicative that the guy no longer has the kind of impact he once had on his team? No? I guess I'm still the one stretching things...

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04-16-2013, 04:36 PM
  #877
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Stalberg is a free agent? He would look nice next to Eller.

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04-16-2013, 04:40 PM
  #878
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Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
I'd love Stalberg on the 3rd line with Eller.
Would be absolutely dynamite. Stalberg-Eller-Galchenyuk would be awesome to see in sheltered minutes. Very fast, quite reliable defensively, not at all small, strong on the puck. Where Stalberg often goes wrong is trying to play too much of a skill game, on that line I think he'd really excel.

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04-16-2013, 04:51 PM
  #879
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Stalberg is a free agent? He would look nice next to Eller.
I've always loved Stalberg ever since his Leafs days. Big body, and also quick as hell. Quite physical too. He's rather similar to our own Eller, and I think they would indeed look formidable together on an offensive-minded 3rd line. Stalberg also is quite capable in his own end.

I was happy when he got traded away from the Leafs. Another one I wouldn't mind seeing in another jersey than Toronto is Matt Frattin.

But to come back to Stalberg, he's exactly the kind of player who will create a lot of time and space with his size and skating combined. On a relentless forechecking team like ours under Therrien, I would see a really good fit.

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04-16-2013, 04:54 PM
  #880
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Sweet nectar of the gods...!

Max Pacioretty ($4.500m) / Tomas Plekanec ($5.000m) / Brian Gionta ($5.000m)
Rene Bourque ($3.333m) / David Desharnais ($3.500m) / Brendan Gallagher ($0.870m)
Viktor Stalberg ($3.250m) / Lars Eller ($1.325m) / Alex Galchenyuk ($3.225m)
Travis Moen ($1.850m) / Brandon Prust ($2.500m) / Bryan Bickell ($2.750m)

Andrei Markov ($5.750m) / Alexei Emelin ($2.000m)
Josh Gorges ($3.900m) / P.K. Subban ($2.875m)
Raphael Diaz ($1.225m) / Francis Bouillon ($1.500m)
Nathan Beaulieu ($1.275m)

Carey Price ($6.500m)
Peter Budaj ($1.400m)

Buyout: Tomas Kaberle ($0.000m)

CAP SPACE: $3,606,667

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04-16-2013, 04:56 PM
  #881
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Originally Posted by Draft View Post
Sweet nectar of the gods...!

Max Pacioretty ($4.500m) / Tomas Plekanec ($5.000m) / Brian Gionta ($5.000m)
Rene Bourque ($3.333m) / David Desharnais ($3.500m) / Brendan Gallagher ($0.870m)
Viktor Stalberg ($3.250m) / Lars Eller ($1.325m) / Alex Galchenyuk ($3.225m)
Travis Moen ($1.850m) / Brandon Prust ($2.500m) / Bryan Bickell ($2.750m)

Andrei Markov ($5.750m) / Alexei Emelin ($2.000m)
Josh Gorges ($3.900m) / P.K. Subban ($2.875m)
Raphael Diaz ($1.225m) / Francis Bouillon ($1.500m)
Nathan Beaulieu ($1.275m)

Carey Price ($6.500m)
Peter Budaj ($1.400m)

Buyout: Tomas Kaberle ($0.000m)

CAP SPACE: $3,606,667
Easily the best and most expensive 4th line in the league but... maybe I've got something. When every player on your 4th line could be moved up to your first line...... either your first line sucks or your fourth line is really good. Bit of both here.

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04-16-2013, 04:59 PM
  #882
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Originally Posted by Draft View Post
Sweet nectar of the gods...!

Max Pacioretty ($4.500m) / Tomas Plekanec ($5.000m) / Brian Gionta ($5.000m)
Rene Bourque ($3.333m) / David Desharnais ($3.500m) / Brendan Gallagher ($0.870m)
Viktor Stalberg ($3.250m) / Lars Eller ($1.325m) / Alex Galchenyuk ($3.225m)
Travis Moen ($1.850m) / Brandon Prust ($2.500m) / Bryan Bickell ($2.750m)

Andrei Markov ($5.750m) / Alexei Emelin ($2.000m)
Josh Gorges ($3.900m) / P.K. Subban ($2.875m)
Raphael Diaz ($1.225m) / Francis Bouillon ($1.500m)
Nathan Beaulieu ($1.275m)

Carey Price ($6.500m)
Peter Budaj ($1.400m)

Buyout: Tomas Kaberle ($0.000m)

CAP SPACE: $3,606,667
Not sure Bickell would sign to play on a 4th line, and anyway, that line is pretty expensive... our defense is still the same, not sure I like. We still lack toughness (not as in 'goon toughness', but just tough players)

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04-16-2013, 05:05 PM
  #883
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Fixing the defense should be the absolute #1 priority in the off season. Forget Stalberg , we have glaring holes on the back end and it's costing us games right now. I know Diaz and Emelin are injured but the Habs still lack 2 other quality defensemen imho.

Granted that doesn't mean they can't sign a forward on top of fixing the D. Howver i'm not sure Stalberg is the answer to anything. The Habs need an Andrew Ladd type , not a Stalberg type imho

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04-16-2013, 05:06 PM
  #884
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Originally Posted by Vasculio View Post
Not sure Bickell would sign to play on a 4th line, and anyway, that line is pretty expensive... our defense is still the same, not sure I like. We still lack toughness (not as in 'goon toughness', but just tough players)
If we let Ryder go, I would:

Sign Stalberg OR Bickell for our 3rd line
Sign/trade for a tough d-man capable of playing 20 minutes a game
Fill the 4th line with a tough, heart and soul guy ala Nystrom.

Pacioretty - Galchenyuk - Gallagher
Bourque - Plekanec - Gionta
Stalberg - Eller - Desharnais
Moen - Prust - Nystrom

Markov - *Tough d-man*
Gorges - Subban
Emelin - Diaz
Bouillon

Price
Budaj

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Old
04-16-2013, 05:07 PM
  #885
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Originally Posted by HiggsBozon View Post
I've always loved Stalberg ever since his Leafs days. Big body, and also quick as hell. Quite physical too. He's rather similar to our own Eller, and I think they would indeed look formidable together on an offensive-minded 3rd line. Stalberg also is quite capable in his own end.

I was happy when he got traded away from the Leafs. Another one I wouldn't mind seeing in another jersey than Toronto is Matt Frattin.

But to come back to Stalberg, he's exactly the kind of player who will create a lot of time and space with his size and skating combined. On a relentless forechecking team like ours under Therrien, I would see a really good fit.
Yeah, Stalberg would be a good fit. He is a lot like Eller, not quite as skilled but even bigger, plus he seems to have learned to be a little more direct on Chicago.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Flying Knee View Post
Fixing the defense should be the absolute #1 priority in the off season. Forget Stalberg , we have glaring holes on the back end and it's costing us games right now. I know Diaz and Emelin are injured but the Habs still lack 2 other quality defensemen imho.

Granted that doesn't mean they can't sign a forward on top of fixing the D. Howver i'm not sure Stalberg is the answer to anything. The Habs need an Andrew Ladd type , not a Stalberg type imho

I completely agree that defense is the number 1 priority. But I'm not really sure Ladd and Stalberg are all that different anymore. Chicago basically groomed Stalberg to replace Ladd.

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04-16-2013, 05:10 PM
  #886
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Originally Posted by Flying Knee View Post
Fixing the defense should be the absolute #1 priority in the off season. Forget Stalberg , we have glaring holes on the back end and it's costing us games right now. I know Diaz and Emelin are injured but the Habs still lack 2 other quality defensemen imho.

Granted that doesn't mean they can't sign a forward on top of fixing the D. Howver i'm not sure Stalberg is the answer to anything. The Habs need an Andrew Ladd type , not a Stalberg type imho
Stalberg is as close to an Andrew Ladd type as there is in Chicago in terms of contributions to a team on the forecheck and offensively. Plus, he'd come in relatively cheap.

Both can be helped; the offense AND the defense.

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04-16-2013, 05:11 PM
  #887
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Originally Posted by Vasculio View Post
Not sure Bickell would sign to play on a 4th line, and anyway, that line is pretty expensive... our defense is still the same, not sure I like. We still lack toughness (not as in 'goon toughness', but just tough players)
Yeah, bit of a pipe dream. Adding Stalberg and Bickell does improve size, sort of improves toughness. Bickell is a pretty tough fellow himself, Stalberg.... he has turtled pretty hard in the past. If a center (ahem, DD) is traded it makes room for a tougher 4th liner if we're happy with Bickell/Prust on the 3rd line.

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04-16-2013, 05:16 PM
  #888
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Originally Posted by Et le But View Post
Yeah, Stalberg would be a good fit. He is a lot like Eller, not quite as skilled but even bigger, plus he seems to have learned to be a little more direct on Chicago.

I completely agree that defense is the number 1 priority. But I'm not really sure Ladd and Stalberg are all that different anymore. Chicago basically groomed Stalberg to replace Ladd.
If two 2nd/3rd liners are added to the team, it makes DD expendable (Not that he isn't already). Putting DD in a package with any one of our defenceman brings back a pretty great return to improve the defence. It isn't just quantity that's lacking on the Habs, it's quality defenceman. Package DD and Gorges and you can get a pretty darn good player.

***Not suggesting we trade Gorges, would prefer Emelin, Bouillon, Diaz or even Markymark.


Last edited by Draft: 04-16-2013 at 05:27 PM.
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Old
04-16-2013, 05:31 PM
  #889
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sooo....no laganiere for us....kinda disappointing getting my hopes up for the acquisition of a player only to have him choose elsewhere..but o well...**** it

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04-16-2013, 05:36 PM
  #890
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No, it doesn't take a genius to know the value of Gorges. But you're definitely not one of those who does.

Elias might be 6'1, he's not even 200 pounds. He's as big as Colby Armstrong, and Koivu would level him more often than not against Montreal. He's also a 37 years old player who's bound to regress. We just got rid of a horrible contract with Erik Cole, why would anyone want to replace him with another old player?

As for your premise that he was able to score 31 points for a crappy NJ team while being the only guy to produce... isn't it an indicative that the guy no longer has the kind of impact he once had on his team? No? I guess I'm still the one stretching things...
Apparently I am since you spend your day crapping on him for no real reason...

Who do you suggest we replace Ryder with that is better than Elias? If you bothered watching him play you'd know the guy can still play, wether he is old or not is irrelevant. Recchi played on boston's best line the year they won the cup and he was 42, they probably don't win it without him. Lidstrom was a productive NHLer until he was 42.

How does him producing with little help show he no longer has the impact he once did? That's the most ridiculous logic ever. So it's his fault that he is playing with stiffs and Kovalchuk is out? Yes, you definitely have a habit of stretching things. You make mountains out of molehills.

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04-16-2013, 05:37 PM
  #891
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Originally Posted by dreamingofdrouin View Post
sooo....no laganiere for us....kinda disappointing getting my hopes up for the acquisition of a player only to have him choose elsewhere..but o well...**** it
He is going straight to the Mighty Ducks, they probably had to promise him NHl games this year...maybe MB didn't want to do that?

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04-16-2013, 05:38 PM
  #892
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Originally Posted by Draft View Post
If two 2nd/3rd liners are added to the team, it makes DD expendable (Not that he isn't already). Putting DD in a package with any one of our defenceman brings back a pretty great return to improve the defence. It isn't just quantity that's lacking on the Habs, it's quality defenceman. Package DD and Gorges and you can get a pretty darn good player.

***Not suggesting we trade Gorges, would prefer Emelin, Bouillon, Diaz or even Markymark.
In order to have DD expendable you need to sign a #1 or 2 center. Adding more 2nd o 3rd line wingers doesn't make Eller or Galchenyuk top 2 line centers.

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04-16-2013, 06:15 PM
  #893
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In order to have DD expendable you need to sign a #1 or 2 center. Adding more 2nd o 3rd line wingers doesn't make Eller or Galchenyuk top 2 line centers.
I think a summer of training and conditioning can make them both 2nd line centres or at least 2.5s. With two more solid wingers, the team can easily roll three lines, it doesn't have to depend on a two line offensive system. Centers aren't the be all and end all of lines, quality forwards on a line make a quality line. Say you sign Stalberg and Bickell, two second tier guys in FA this year. This is the Top-9:

Pacioretty-Plekanec-Gallagher
Bourque-Eller-Gionta
Stalberg-Galchenyuk-Bickell/Prust

Those are all excellent two-way lines. Shut down capability, can be rearranged for PP, fast, not too small, strong on the puck. Every single line would be miserable to play against. If you were to sign Clowe, Clarkson or Horton they're even better lines. This isn't even taking into account the return for DD+ on defence and how that would affect the team. The only thing missing would be offence so, perhaps you sign one of Ryder/Elias unstead of Bickell/Stalberg. I don't think too much would be missing if DD left that couldn't be made up by 81/27. Leblanc/Bournival/Dumont/Prust can all potentially fill in a 3rd line C spot in case of injury.

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04-16-2013, 07:12 PM
  #894
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Originally Posted by dreamingofdrouin View Post
sooo....no laganiere for us....kinda disappointing getting my hopes up for the acquisition of a player only to have him choose elsewhere..but o well...**** it
The Ducks also signed big center David Steckel from Toronto just lately making sure they are ready for the SC Playoffs.Damn Where oh where can the Habs come up with an extra center with that edge,nowhere that's where,Now what?

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04-16-2013, 08:15 PM
  #895
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
In order to have DD expendable you need to sign a #1 or 2 center. Adding more 2nd o 3rd line wingers doesn't make Eller or Galchenyuk top 2 line centers.
What makes DD a top 2 center other than points in a garbage season?

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04-16-2013, 08:53 PM
  #896
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Here's another local boy who doesn't want to play in MTL. The list keeps getting longer and longer...

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04-16-2013, 10:47 PM
  #897
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Originally Posted by Carey Price View Post
In order to have DD expendable you need to sign a #1 or 2 center. Adding more 2nd o 3rd line wingers doesn't make Eller or Galchenyuk top 2 line centers.
their ES production makes them 2nd line C as much as DD.

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04-16-2013, 11:03 PM
  #898
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get rid of Kaberle(buyout)

Get rid of Gionta(bag of pucks or some decent composite sticks)

Get a big semi skilled D man

Get a kick ass forward to help Prust out.

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04-16-2013, 11:32 PM
  #899
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get rid of Kaberle(buyout)

Get rid of Gionta(bag of pucks or some decent composite sticks)

Get a big semi skilled D man

Get a kick ass forward to help Prust out.
Kaberle: yup, I think that's a given.

Gionta: he has lost half a step, he may lose another next season, but I don't think we're close to "bag of pucks" yet. Cap hit aside, the Habs are a better team with him on the ice.

Big Semi (hey, just quoting!): not too many available. Some Devil fans are suggesting Volchenkov may be bought out... not sure how much he has left, and what kind of contract he'd get on the market. I'd love to get another competent dman, big or otherwise. There's not much out there. I thought Leopold might be a good bargain, but the return for him at the deadline suggests GMs still like him. The returns for Murray and Regehr also suggest a seller's market for blueliners.

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04-16-2013, 11:48 PM
  #900
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In order to have DD expendable you need to sign a #1 or 2 center. Adding more 2nd o 3rd line wingers doesn't make Eller or Galchenyuk top 2 line centers.
What makes DD a 2nd line center over Eller? He had ONE good season in probably our worst season in history. Please don't make it sound that this team cannot succeed without DD as our 2nd line center.

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