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Roster/Trade/Etc Discussion Part VI

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04-21-2013, 01:40 AM
  #576
Jesus Teemu
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Bobby has quit going to the net and is very soft along the boards this year and last year too. Maybe due to an injury? Who knows.

I think his evolution into a perimeter player is why he's just not that effective anymore. This really seemed to accelerate when RC was fired IMO.

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04-21-2013, 02:11 AM
  #577
KEEROLE Vatanen
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I want to believe Bobby is injured to explain why he is playing so poorly, it would not surprise me if he was after that seemingly ugly knee/ankle injury he had several weeks ago was something alot worse than we know. Regardless he looks bad.

With that said, he can completely vindicate himself in the playoffs. I believe the RPG line will turn it up a notch, if Ryan fails to, being traded is going to be a hot topic again.

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04-21-2013, 02:40 AM
  #578
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Here's an attempted illustration of part of our offensive issues lately.
the break out passes are really killing us. to many of our defensemen fail to be able to pass to players in transition accurately. Allen, Sbisa, Lydman, and to a lesser extent Souray and Lovejoy are easy to defend. sometimes Souray tries for the stretch pass but that is not in this drawing.

this is what i believe to be part of the problem, the defensemen always try the same two things, either the reverse behind the net pass/backwards cross ice, or are simply content to skate up the boards and pass it out that way as seen here. This almost always leads to dump ins. or bad attempts to carry it in, the opposing teams basic goal is to just slow us down.


(dots are us, x's are other team, grey is pass)

Vatanen and Fowler are the only players that seem able/willing/capable to carry the puck and able to do quick outlets that get our forwards some space, and at the very least give us a decent chance at entries.

BB has to adjust and stop putting so many d men in the lineup who can't skate and pass. teams don't even have to send in more than 1 forechecker anymore because they know we're going to give the puck back either because the D can't complete passes, or because our forwards are simply forced to dump it in. We're not scoring goals because we are simply unable to generate good chances consistently, I don't think it's effort, just a team that has failed to adjust back to how they're defended

(yes i know it's a crappy drawing, I was bored)

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04-21-2013, 08:49 AM
  #579
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@KEEROLE Vatanen

I think you are on to something here! I think Boudreau is wasting too much time and energy of himself and the players with constant line combination changes instead that the team has several options how to play and that he sticks with his lines.

"I do not care" (of course I do, do not agree with the reaction of the coach) if the original 3rd line has not scored for a long time, in any case I think it is due to the combination of over achievement and that players getting more and more tired. I even would argue that they do not play the same way (driving to the net?).

I could not see anything being better while we are getting lines that seem to be randomly generated. In my opinion, the team has played great despite the constant line combination changes, not because of it; but it seems the staff thinks otherwise.

So I would vote for, choose a style of play, if the opposing team adjusts so good that they stop you from getting results, readjust it and, please, do not change line combinations just because you can or the players are not playing great. For that you can use healthy scratches to "wake" someone up.

BTW, the signings this year have been fantastic, Lovejoy is impressing me more and more, especially his physical play, I have seen more hard hits from him than from Sbisa this year. The only disappointment is Lombardi, but I found it very interesting that someone posted his name in the "playoff surprise" player thread.

Sorry for the overly long post...

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04-21-2013, 09:49 AM
  #580
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Bobby is playing like Bobby always has. He disappears for games at a time. He will always put up points. But seldom will those points matter. Seldom is he a clutch "go to" guy who carries the team. He's always been that way and we've always waited for him to "put it all together" and upgrade his game. He's not going to and I'm all for trading him for some heart and soul guy.

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04-21-2013, 09:56 AM
  #581
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddie Shack View Post
Bobby is playing like Bobby always has. He disappears for games at a time. He will always put up points. But seldom will those points matter. Seldom is he a clutch "go to" guy who carries the team. He's always been that way and we've always waited for him to "put it all together" and upgrade his game. He's not going to and I'm all for trading him for some heart and soul guy.
Hello Eddie... How do you rate Bobbys play when he was playing center this year? I thought this was his best play, because the additional responsibility+trust seem to have got an positive effect.

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04-21-2013, 10:08 AM
  #582
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Originally Posted by Yemeth View Post
Hello Eddie... How do you rate Bobbys play when he was playing center this year? I thought this was his best play, because the additional responsibility+trust seem to have got an positive effect.
He's always plays well in short streaks. It just never lasts and then he disappears again for long stretches. That's the whole mystery with Bobby. A move to C won't change that. I'm tired of his act.

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04-21-2013, 12:44 PM
  #583
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddie Shack View Post
Bobby is playing like Bobby always has. He disappears for games at a time. He will always put up points. But seldom will those points matter. Seldom is he a clutch "go to" guy who carries the team. He's always been that way and we've always waited for him to "put it all together" and upgrade his game. He's not going to and I'm all for trading him for some heart and soul guy.
Very fair assessment of Bobby's game

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04-21-2013, 12:48 PM
  #584
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I'm fine with trading him as well.

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04-21-2013, 01:04 PM
  #585
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RPG have collectively blown my hockey pool as I have all 3. Their collective collapse and Houdini act the last month is shocking and disappointing.

But I guess if they are your hopes for a successful playoff run I would be more concerned. You have bigger fish to fry.

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04-21-2013, 01:29 PM
  #586
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Originally Posted by Eddie Shack View Post
He's always plays well in short streaks. It just never lasts and then he disappears again for long stretches. That's the whole mystery with Bobby. A move to C won't change that. I'm tired of his act.
well he never got an extended shot at C.. its always a game or half a game

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04-21-2013, 10:41 PM
  #587
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Since Vatanen won't be going back to Norfolk, he should be on the playoff roster. I think the puck moving element is crucial for us. I just wouldn't feel comfortable with him against St.Louis though

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04-21-2013, 11:36 PM
  #588
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well he never got an extended shot at C.. its always a game or half a game
I hear ya. And I don't know why they didn't leave him there longer. But I figure BB probably knows more than we do, how best to utilize the guys. I've just given up on Bobby. He's been around long enough now that I think what you see, is what you get.

He supposedly didn't get along with RC. If BB can't get any more out of him I don't think it's there to be had. Changing positions isn't going to wake this guy up. IMHO of course.

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04-22-2013, 12:05 AM
  #589
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I love Bobby, but the more I realize it, it's probably time to trade him. We really need a second line center, and while I'd love to see Holland develop into just that, I also wouldn't mind getting a younger solid one anyway. We have a rather large stockpile of winger prospects and it's also not too hard to pick up a good top-6 winger on the free agent or trade market. If we could move Bobby to get that second line center type, and the move makes sense(ie. not dumping Bobby for a guy like David Bolland), I'm all for it.

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04-22-2013, 12:23 AM
  #590
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I'd think that they'd look for a center on the FA market first; if they aren't going with Bonino or Holland again.

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04-22-2013, 12:26 AM
  #591
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I'd think that they'd look for a center on the FA market first; if they aren't going with Bonino or Holland again.
I do as well, I also think we'll strike out. Although, the center market could be inflated a tad due to compliance buyouts, but we'll see.

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04-22-2013, 12:29 AM
  #592
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With Burke in the organization, I wouldn't be surprised if we were able to pull Bozak off of the FA market, provided he makes it there.

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04-22-2013, 12:31 AM
  #593
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I'd think that they'd look for a center on the FA market first; if they aren't going with Bonino or Holland again.
Yeah, but how much do you think we'll have to spend? Aren't we pretty much out of money with the Twins getting their raises?

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04-22-2013, 12:37 AM
  #594
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With Burke in the organization, I wouldn't be surprised if we were able to pull Bozak off of the FA market, provided he makes it there.
if he does. i hope theres no way murray pays him the rumoured 5m+ he wants

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04-22-2013, 12:42 AM
  #595
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With Burke in the organization, I wouldn't be surprised if we were able to pull Bozak off of the FA market, provided he makes it there.
Although I'm not sure if Burke will still be with us come July 1, that's certainly a possibility, and one that I like. With Ribeiro, Weiss and Roy on the market, likely to be joined by Briere and possibly some others, and maybe even Elias if somehow he doesn't stay in NJ, he could slide under the radar, and he's a guy I like for the role. Can't see him being too expensive, good in the dot, and competent enough everywhere else. I could see Toronto letting him go due to Grabovski's bloated contract, along with The Dream needing a new deal.

On the trade market, Paul Stastny's a name to look out for. Colorado doesn't have cap issues yet, but they also shouldn't be competitive next year, and have much bigger fish to fry, likely meaning they won't be signing him after next year. It'd be tough to squeeze his cap hit in, but if we centered a deal around Stastny+ for Sbisa, possibly had them retain some cap(they certainly can afford to do it), and bring in Sbisa's replacement on the cheap(or just sign some cheaper 7th defenseman and pencil Lovejoy in), it's certainly doable.

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04-22-2013, 12:56 AM
  #596
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With Burke in the organization, I wouldn't be surprised if we were able to pull Bozak off of the FA market, provided he makes it there.
Even if he relaxes his ridiculous demand isn't this guy just another 3C masquerading as a 2C (or is it 1C?) this year? Would he honestly be any better than what the boner has shown offensively at 2C? Or what Holland could turn into with little effort?

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04-22-2013, 01:19 AM
  #597
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Even if he relaxes his ridiculous demand isn't this guy just another 3C masquerading as a 2C (or is it 1C?) this year? Would he honestly be any better than what the boner has shown offensively at 2C? Or what Holland could turn into with little effort?
He's putting up numbers on a 2C's pace. I'm just eyeballing, but it looks like he's on about a 40+ point pace, which is what he hit last year as well. Those are in the range of a guy that gets that sort of ice time.

As for the other bit, I'm not sold that we're trading for or signing a 2C with so many options nearby, like Bonino and Holland or guys like Rakell and Karlsson down the road, but if we did go that route then I think we'd have a shot at landing one of those FAs. If need be some salary could be moved.

If we move Ryan, then I think we'd be eying a different position, maybe D and/or left wing.

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04-22-2013, 01:21 AM
  #598
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Not a fan of Bozak, jmo.

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04-22-2013, 01:24 AM
  #599
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I agree with the complaint about our terrible transition game/break out passes.

Been saying it all season.

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04-22-2013, 01:39 AM
  #600
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He's putting up numbers on a 2C's pace. I'm just eyeballing, but it looks like he's on about a 40+ point pace, which is what he hit last year as well. Those are in the range of a guy that gets that sort of ice time.

As for the other bit, I'm not sold that we're trading for or signing a 2C with so many options nearby, like Bonino and Holland or guys like Rakell and Karlsson down the road, but if we did go that route then I think we'd have a shot at landing one of those FAs. If need be some salary could be moved.

If we move Ryan, then I think we'd be eying a different position, maybe D and/or left wing.
I have to think Teemu is done and not returning. If we decide to move Bobby I would think we might want a winger who may score a bit less but play a more complete game. We are still going to need some production there next year.

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