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House Cleaning Must Go On This Season Too

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Old
04-21-2013, 11:03 AM
  #151
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Originally Posted by jgoud View Post
The first thing we need to do is trade Gagner and get some size down the middle. Secondly, we need a D who can make an outlet pass by trading N Schultz+
Do we have an other option. We wil keep Gagner but get rid of Horcoff, Belanger. Smithson and replace them with elite third line center who has size two way game and offensive edge 40-45 pt guy. And the forth line center should be elite center with capacity to carry puck to the offensive zone and make some plays and kill penalties.

I think Gagner is pretty decent 2nd liner. I want to keep him around next 5 years

I dream that we can land Barkov3. He is big offensive minded center and can replace Gagner in 2-3 years. Gagner can serve his final 2-3 years as an 3rd liner. those are the years we are really competing.

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04-21-2013, 11:09 AM
  #152
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Do we have an other option. We wil keep Gagner but get rid of Horcoff, Belanger. Smithson and replace them with elite third line center who has size two way game and offensive edge 40-45 pt guy. And the forth line center should be elite center with capacity to carry puck to the offensive zone and make some plays and kill penalties.

I think Gagner is pretty decent 2nd liner. I want to keep him around next 5 years

I dream that we can land Barkov3. He is big offensive minded center and can replace Gagner in 2-3 years. Gagner can serve his final 2-3 years as an 3rd liner. those are the years we are really competing.
go look up league wide scoring, 40 points is the cutoff for a second liner, 3rd liners don't score that much unless you want to make the argument that J Staal was a "3rd liner."


you basically want bozak+size...which every team does, and bozak will be getting at least 4M this summer, probably more.

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04-21-2013, 11:34 AM
  #153
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Would love to go after Matthias in FLA, he's RFA and they will be able to sign him.

Another guy that would be nice but likely will require an overpay is Zack Smith in Ottawa.

Edit: Haha thought this was the trade rumor thread...

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04-21-2013, 01:09 PM
  #154
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I would happily move Gags and PRV who both add elements of soft play. Replace those guys with 2nd liners who have a physical dimension and this team is significantly improved.

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04-21-2013, 03:50 PM
  #155
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Do we have an other option. We wil keep Gagner but get rid of Horcoff, Belanger. Smithson and replace them with elite third line center who has size two way game and offensive edge 40-45 pt guy. And the forth line center should be elite center with capacity to carry puck to the offensive zone and make some plays and kill penalties.

I think Gagner is pretty decent 2nd liner. I want to keep him around next 5 years

I dream that we can land Barkov3. He is big offensive minded center and can replace Gagner in 2-3 years. Gagner can serve his final 2-3 years as an 3rd liner. those are the years we are really competing.
An elite centre will cost upwards of 5M and will refuse to play 4th line duties. Would you mind letting me know of an elite centre that plays 4th line duties?


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04-22-2013, 02:52 AM
  #156
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An elite centre will cost upwards of 5M and will refuse to play 4th line duties. Would you mind letting me know of an elite centre that plays 4th line duties?
I misused vocabulary I meant elite third line center not elite first line center. But I want to have actualy someone who is paid less than 4M a year eg. Vermette, Umberger, Dubinsky

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04-22-2013, 03:13 AM
  #157
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I misused vocabulary I meant elite third line center not elite first line center. But I want to have actualy someone who is paid less than 4M a year eg. Vermette, Umberger, Dubinsky
That's 1 of my wish for this summer. Buyout Horcoff and get a reliable 3C. I would love Bolland out of Chicago. Pry the Hayes brothers at the same time.

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04-22-2013, 08:55 AM
  #158
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I read article above

http://blogs.edmontonjournal.com/201...ional-players/

General statement is that we are one of the worst teams in NHL for a reason. Reason si that our players are not good enough. According to article following players are reason for that and IMO they should be moved.

Defencemen Ryan Whitney, Mark Fistric and Theo Peckham, wingers Mike Brown, Ryan Jones, Lennart Petrell, Ryan Smyth, Ben Eager and centres Eric Belanger and Jerred Smithson

All together 10 guys. Our minor league system cannot replace them. We will see Paajarvi and Hartikainen in NHL Teubert is not upgrade and it wise to keep Lander one more year in minors. Omark is playing well in Europe but he is probably primadoona type of locker room cancer.

Ii is a lot of work to do for McCleaner. I hope he can take care of the mosto of the business during the off season but I know that cleaning goes beoyon next season. There is not such a miracle maker who can clean this ****

One thing what we should consider is sending players out with picks and get back minor leaguers.
i don't always agree with staples, but he is pretty spot on in this article.... the 10 players he mentioned are clearly, by stat and by eye, the worst players on the team... the group of 8 are also the players that should be looked at for trades, as they are not terrible players and will some at least some trading value.... hemsky + our 1st rounder may land us a top-pairing defenceman for example

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04-22-2013, 10:35 AM
  #159
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i don't always agree with staples, but he is pretty spot on in this article.... the 10 players he mentioned are clearly, by stat and by eye, the worst players on the team... the group of 8 are also the players that should be looked at for trades, as they are not terrible players and will some at least some trading value.... hemsky + our 1st rounder may land us a top-pairing defenceman for example
Out of curiosity though, how did/would Souray rank on this list (a player who is now a +/- leader in the league)?

Or other players, including Brodziak, Cogliano, etc?

At what point do you blame the system? Or is this stat objective enough that it could see past that? Our system has not fundamentally changed so did these players have a positive influence and we moved them anyways? What about the leadership core?

I am also not sure how a player like Smid could get a positive result in this, as his game is not to generate scoring, but to limit it.

Interesting list, and bottom line, I think it reinforces that the kids need to stay and virtually the rest need an overhaul.

Also, I think Horcoff needs to go, and his value relative to his stat shows that even more clearly. Staples seems to have him in the middle group, but his price tag is also the highest of the group, and therefore brings the lowest return on the ice.

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04-22-2013, 11:44 AM
  #160
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Originally Posted by jadeddog View Post
i don't always agree with staples, but he is pretty spot on in this article.... the 10 players he mentioned are clearly, by stat and by eye, the worst players on the team... the group of 8 are also the players that should be looked at for trades, as they are not terrible players and will some at least some trading value.... hemsky + our 1st rounder may land us a top-pairing defenceman for example
But they are suppose to be the worse 10. Hence why they aren't top 6 players or top 4 d-men.

I'd like to see how the stats are on other teams. Does anyone really expect your 4th line center to have a good Neilson number?

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04-22-2013, 12:00 PM
  #161
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Originally Posted by jadeddog View Post
i don't always agree with staples, but he is pretty spot on in this article.... the 10 players he mentioned are clearly, by stat and by eye, the worst players on the team... the group of 8 are also the players that should be looked at for trades, as they are not terrible players and will some at least some trading value.... hemsky + our 1st rounder may land us a top-pairing defenceman for example
The sheer number of players needed to become a cup contending team is ridiculous. That is where management has been a complete failure. The Oilers have not added a single player through trade or free agency that can be considered a core player going forward, other than Justin Schultz.

That is not building a team. That is sitting on you ass doing ****-all. That is why I believe the whole management team should have been part of the "house cleaning."

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04-22-2013, 12:33 PM
  #162
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The sheer number of players needed to become a cup contending team is ridiculous. That is where management has been a complete failure. The Oilers have not added a single player through trade or free agency that can be considered a core player going forward, other than Justin Schultz.

That is not building a team. That is sitting on you ass doing ****-all. That is why I believe the whole management team should have been part of the "house cleaning."
I don't think they were really looking at doing that until maybe this year.

When you are going through a complete tear down and rebuild you don't usually try add core guys, you like at adding players just to get you through the years.

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04-22-2013, 12:46 PM
  #163
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But they are suppose to be the worse 10. Hence why they aren't top 6 players or top 4 d-men.

I'd like to see how the stats are on other teams. Does anyone really expect your 4th line center to have a good Neilson number?
this was kinda my thinking as well: it sure would be nice to see a good teams numbers as a reference point... cause yeah, those players are bad, but how do they compare to the bottom players on a good team?

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04-22-2013, 12:59 PM
  #164
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I don't think they were really looking at doing that until maybe this year.

When you are going through a complete tear down and rebuild you don't usually try add core guys, you like at adding players just to get you through the years.
I understand what you're saying, (core players) was wrong wording, but useful player additions could have been made. The current roster provides little shelter or help to the young players. I think better support for the young core allows for more positive player development than just throwing them to the wolves, so to speak.

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04-22-2013, 01:57 PM
  #165
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But they are suppose to be the worse 10. Hence why they aren't top 6 players or top 4 d-men.

I'd like to see how the stats are on other teams. Does anyone really expect your 4th line center to have a good Neilson number?
Agreed, I mean what are the expectations for the bottom eight players... on a lottery team? Of course they're bad, if they weren't then they would be playing in the top 9 forwards or top four dmen.

I do note however that Corey Potter is an exception, he's played pretty well for a third pairing guy and considering that his salary is the second lowest on the team (Mike Brown makes the least). Even rookies make more money than him playing in the NHL.

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04-22-2013, 03:22 PM
  #166
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That is not building a team. That is sitting on you ass doing ****-all. That is why I believe the whole management team should have been part of the "house cleaning."
I love your comment. I would have brought Burke here(he did better job in Toronto with less and lower picks comparing KLowe). Now I would not be surprised that Gretzky is the next head coach and if h is not available he will be Jari Kurri. Glen Anderson might be a perfect piece in the puzzle as an associate coach.

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04-22-2013, 03:31 PM
  #167
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04-22-2013, 03:33 PM
  #168
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I understand what you're saying, (core players) was wrong wording, but useful player additions could have been made. The current roster provides little shelter or help to the young players. I think better support for the young core allows for more positive player development than just throwing them to the wolves, so to speak.
I don't know last year the kids were sheltered. Smyth-Horcoff-Hemksy played a lot early on, and all we heard was how the kids were getting shafted.

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04-22-2013, 04:02 PM
  #169
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I don't think they were really looking at doing that until maybe this year.

When you are going through a complete tear down and rebuild you don't usually try add core guys, you like at adding players just to get you through the years.
Chicago added a big piece in Brian Campbell, which in hindsight, gave them a legit D, a veteran presence and a big signing in FA. They also made a big signing in Huet.

Looking back, even though Campbell handicapped them cap-wise, he instantly gave them a legit piece that was able to shelter the kids. They looked outside their own veteran core to get him.

I honestly don't think we have that piece. Horcoff etc is not what this team needs. The Oilers need to announce to the NHL that they will bring in a big piece from the outside and give the room some perspective. Campbell came from solid teams that were somewhat contending in Buffalo and San Jose.

If you overpay and need to deal with the consequences cap-wise later, you still do it.

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04-22-2013, 04:07 PM
  #170
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I don't know last year the kids were sheltered. Smyth-Horcoff-Hemksy played a lot early on, and all we heard was how the kids were getting shafted.
Development is more than just ice-time. Anyways, this is getting away from the point I was making originally, which was more along the lines that the Oilers have not added any players to the roster who add any value to the team. Who have they acquired, by trade or through free agency, in the last 4 years that you see being a part of a contending team? Justin Schultz is the only one that I can see. Not a very stellar record of accomplishment as far as I can see.

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04-22-2013, 04:13 PM
  #171
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An elite centre will cost upwards of 5M and will refuse to play 4th line duties. Would you mind letting me know of an elite centre that plays 4th line duties?
He isn't elite, but Grabovski has been stuck on the4th line all season in Toronto. He is easily a 2nd liner

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04-22-2013, 04:15 PM
  #172
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Development is more than just ice-time. Anyways, this is getting away from the point I was making originally, which was more along the lines that the Oilers have not added any players to the roster who add any value to the team. Who have they acquired, by trade or through free agency, in the last 4 years that you see being a part of a contending team? Justin Schultz is the only one that I can see. Not a very stellar record of accomplishment as far as I can see.
If we added a better support cast we probably wouldn't have been picking as high as we were.

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04-22-2013, 07:46 PM
  #173
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Too funny. You good people of Edmonton should trade for havlat, heatley, pronger, even nylander didn't want to go to Edmonton. NYLANDER! Worst part is, I always thought the fans deserved a winning club. I honestly can't say that anymore. The same fans that ran leading point getter Penner out of town, Souray, anyone remember that Lupul guy? If I'm Hall, I'd pity all you, not play for you. I can't wait to see the free agents that go to Edmonton to play for the fans the deserve a winning hockey club.

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04-22-2013, 07:49 PM
  #174
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Too funny. You good people of Edmonton should trade for havlat, heatley, pronger, even nylander didn't want to go to Edmonton. NYLANDER! Worst part is, I always thought the fans deserved a winning club. I honestly can't say that anymore. The same fans that ran leading point getter Penner out of town, Souray, anyone remember that Lupul guy? If I'm Hall, I'd pity all you, not play for you. I can't wait to see the free agents that go to Edmonton to play for the fans the deserve a winning hockey club.
Penner was our leading point scorer for exactly one year. And given how he's played since being traded, the trade probably wasn't a bad idea.

Lupul's been crap everywhere except in Toronto.

And Souray, well... 1 good year out of 3 doesn't make you a very valuable commodity.

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04-24-2013, 08:20 AM
  #175
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For me, it is time to seriously address Hemsky on the team. While everyone is bashing Horcoff and saying kick him to the street--Hemsky has been worse then Horcoff. Hemsky was the guy who we called our go to guy--but he has not done too much over the past 5 years

HOrcoff has scored more goals than Hemsky over the past 5 years

67 to 63

Hemsky has never been the guy to stand before the media and taken the **** kicking Horcoff has done over the past 5 years-- I think Hemsky and how he handles himself off the ice is rubbing off wrongly on the young players. Atleast Horcoff stands up and takes a beating on a regular basis

time for Hemsky to go

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