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It seems very likely we will be facing the leafs...

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04-22-2013, 01:17 PM
  #76
izzy75
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Originally Posted by HiggsBozon View Post
If we're to lose to the Leafs, I want it short and painful. So at least the management gets to know they have some MAJOR issues to take care of.
Oh, it will be painful. People keep talking about the last 4 games... but for years we've crumbled under tight checking and chippy play. I'm hoping the pain stings long into the summer, and years of pathetic, soft playing will be a bad memory.

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04-22-2013, 01:17 PM
  #77
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Originally Posted by HiggsBozon View Post
It's not important when your players are scared ****less and don't seem to give a damn against a particular opponent.

If we're to lose to the Leafs, I want it short and painful. So at least the management gets to know they have some MAJOR issues to take care of.
Haha, it sounds to me like you are more scared than anyone. I imagine the players will look forward to an opportunity to take their respect back. The Habs not showing up at this point is the only saving grace. It would be worse if they had shown for all the games against the leafs and still had the same results.

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04-22-2013, 01:19 PM
  #78
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Originally Posted by HiggsBozon View Post
There's a huge difference between being optimistic, and laughing at those who have their reserves on the team and its global framework.

In fact, would you say the 06-07 team proved they were contenders? Because they started off the year on fire, kind of like we did this season, but then fell off the charts in the next few months. The fact we have a 48 games season help smallish, injury-prone teams.

This team is on the right path,but they still have a long way to go before we can say we have THE winning recipe for long-term success. And those who suggest we don't certainly shouldn't get laughed at and shown ridiculous pictures of some stats picked out of context on small samples.
How are we injury-prone? Just because we are smaller? I really don't understand why everyone thinks that because we are smaller, we will get more tired in the playoffs. As if getting hit by a bigger guy instead of a guy the same size as you is going to make you infinitely more tired. Call me optimistic but I think being a smaller team in the playoffs is not as bad as people make it out to be. The size issue is overrated. The only place it will hurt us is on defense, but if we can get back to how we played all season in our own zone with the puck-side attack, then the effects of size discrepancies are severely minimized.

Also, a long way to go before we are close to long-term success? Come on, man. This roster has so many outstanding young players and effective veterans who have succeeded in the playoffs. We are on that path right now. We are legitimate threats in the playoffs. As I said, we have the right make-up of offense and our goaltending has the potential to be the very best. Our only weak aspect is our defense, where we are dealing with injuries, but if we get back to our game plan and play better team defense as we have all season, we are much better off.

It's odd how you say you are optimistic but then deny that this team is close long-term success, right after finishing as a top team in the league with a roster comprised of so many young players.

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04-22-2013, 01:20 PM
  #79
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Hard to say who we play, but bottom line is, we really don't control it any longer...
This is where the coaches become more important during the playoffs...if it's the Leafs, so be it, it would make for a great series...

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04-22-2013, 01:21 PM
  #80
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Originally Posted by Habs 4 Life View Post
Not the team I wanted to face but whatever, I don't think we match up well against them and don't really ant to face them. Going to be a really long summer if we lose to them!!
We must face Toronto. We must overcome our worst fears and smash them into oblivion.... and if we lose, then maybe, Bergevin will wake up and get some toughness on the habs.

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04-22-2013, 01:22 PM
  #81
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I imagine the players will look forward to an opportunity to take their respect back.
990 AM was bang-on this morning... basically saying many of our injuries were the result of rough play to which our team is not built. As a result, the remaining (and returning) players start to play more cautious and soft. In other words, this is our (limping) team going into the playoffs

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04-22-2013, 01:25 PM
  #82
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Originally Posted by izzy75 View Post
990 AM was bang-on this morning... basically saying many of our injuries were the result of rough play to which our team is not built. As a result, the remaining (and returning) players start to play more cautious and soft. In other words, this is our (limping) team going into the playoffs
You can read into it as much as you want, but in the end its called a slump. When the Habs showed up, they dominated the play against the Leafs. Not to mention, fighting disappears in the playoffs, so the Habs won't have to 'worry' about that.

From the sounds of it you might as well stop watching hockey now. You've seemed to have it all figured out and know what the future holds.

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04-22-2013, 01:29 PM
  #83
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...but in the end its called a slump
This is far from a slump. It's the sum total of a very average team, playing way over their heads, in a shortened season.

Of course, this debate is silly. This will all be over very soon. Praise Allah.

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04-22-2013, 01:29 PM
  #84
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How are we injury-prone? Just because we are smaller? I really don't understand why everyone thinks that because we are smaller, we will get more tired in the playoffs. As if getting hit by a bigger guy instead of a guy the same size as you is going to make you infinitely more tired. Call me optimistic but I think being a smaller team in the playoffs is not as bad as people make it out to be. The size issue is overrated. The only place it will hurt us is on defense, but if we can get back to how we played all season in our own zone with the puck-side attack, then the effects of size discrepancies are severely minimized.

Also, a long way to go before we are close to long-term success? Come on, man. This roster has so many outstanding young players and effective veterans who have succeeded in the playoffs. We are on that path right now. We are legitimate threats in the playoffs. As I said, we have the right make-up of offense and our goaltending has the potential to be the very best. Our only weak aspect is our defense, where we are dealing with injuries, but if we get back to our game plan and play better team defense as we have all season, we are much better off.

It's odd how you say you are optimistic but then deny that this team is close long-term success, right after finishing as a top team in the league with a roster comprised of so many young players.
We have an history of being injury-prone. It's been like this for quite a few years now.

We have a long way to go before being close to long-term success, simply because we lack major ingredients. Markov is going downhill. Subban is our only top-pairing worthy d-man out there. We lack of grit big time. And our defense is on the small side. Some of these aspects will improve as the prospects grow up, but some of them, we don't know for a fact if we have anything to fix it within the system.

Our goaltending has potential. So far though, it's only this; potential. We don't know if it's ever going to be any more concrete than that. Maybe, maybe not. But it's not a sure thing that Price is going to bring home the Cup. He still hasn't shown he has the ability to do it.

Every team is dealing with injuries. We are no exception to the rule. But our injuries hurt us more, which suggests we might lack depth at some point.

Our offense doesn't have the best make up. Too many players remain from the old reign and are just not efficient at forechecking, which is an essential part of Therrien's system. Plus, we actually have a bunch of offensive "meh" prospects in the system. Guys like Bournival, Holland, Leblanc, Vail who are never going to end up as being anything more than bottom sixers, if anything at all. And they all have weaknesses which could prevent them to become NHLers at all. We also are short on gritty offensive prospects and goaltender prospects.

We're missing a lot.

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04-22-2013, 01:31 PM
  #85
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Haha, it sounds to me like you are more scared than anyone. I imagine the players will look forward to an opportunity to take their respect back. The Habs not showing up at this point is the only saving grace. It would be worse if they had shown for all the games against the leafs and still had the same results.
I'm not scared. Because I know what to expect. I might be surprised, but the Leafs, to me, are a team that is built for playoffs hockey. Much more than ours. Kessel is a Habs killer and their defense, while on the slow side, is huge and might cause us problems.

The players though, are playing like they are scared ****less. One game? Ok. It's all right, **** happens.

Two games? This is no coincidence...

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04-22-2013, 01:45 PM
  #86
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"bring on the Leafs". Eh...they have a very punishing D. All very big guys...and I haven't even talked about the muscle at forward. Carlyle teams are very rough. I'd be very surprised if we didn't lose the series in 4 or 5 games.

Where is the analysis with this fanbase? I keep hearing "oh it's 4 games". No. This team has not been good in certain areas for a very long time.

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04-22-2013, 01:51 PM
  #87
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Originally Posted by hockeyfan2k11 View Post
Where is the analysis with this fanbase? I keep hearing "oh it's 4 games". No. This team has not been good in certain areas for a very long time.
Montreal fans - a lot of them anyway - are driven by emotion and make comments that lack context.

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04-22-2013, 01:56 PM
  #88
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Originally Posted by HiggsBozon View Post
We have an history of being injury-prone. It's been like this for quite a few years now.

We have a long way to go before being close to long-term success, simply because we lack major ingredients. Markov is going downhill. Subban is our only top-pairing worthy d-man out there. We lack of grit big time. And our defense is on the small side. Some of these aspects will improve as the prospects grow up, but some of them, we don't know for a fact if we have anything to fix it within the system.

Our goaltending has potential. So far though, it's only this; potential. We don't know if it's ever going to be any more concrete than that. Maybe, maybe not. But it's not a sure thing that Price is going to bring home the Cup. He still hasn't shown he has the ability to do it.

Every team is dealing with injuries. We are no exception to the rule. But our injuries hurt us more, which suggests we might lack depth at some point.

Our offense doesn't have the best make up. Too many players remain from the old reign and are just not efficient at forechecking, which is an essential part of Therrien's system. Plus, we actually have a bunch of offensive "meh" prospects in the system. Guys like Bournival, Holland, Leblanc, Vail who are never going to end up as being anything more than bottom sixers, if anything at all. And they all have weaknesses which could prevent them to become NHLers at all. We also are short on gritty offensive prospects and goaltender prospects.

We're missing a lot.
I think it just comes down to many points where we just don't agree. I think the mix of veterans and youth on our top three forward lines is very impressive, and the depth at the forward position is pretty unreal. You bring up prospects and say "meh", but that's mainly because all the most recent top offensive prospects JUST made the team recently. Lack of offensive prospects is not a weakness right now.

Our goaltending has proven he is among the elite in the NHL. He has done that. He had an outstanding rookie season and was pretty much one of our best players durign the most awful season in recent Habs history. He just hasn't proven himself in the playoffs yet. He has had a couple games of experience, though, which is always a good thing. Again, goaltending depth is not a concern when you have a young starter and an excellent backup already in the NHL, and a mid-level goalie prospect as your start in the AHL.

On defense, you say we don't have depth. That is straight-up false. We have Subban, Markov, Emelin, Diaz, Gorges, Bouillon, Drewiske, Weber, Kaberle, and then Tinordi, Beaulieu and Pateryn in the AHL. Pretty much, we have the depth. If you are concerned about quality depth, then that is another story. Not many teams have to deal with losing two top-4 defense during their seasons, but we have enough players who are decent in the NHL to make up for it.

Finally, we have a huge draft coming up and didn't give up any of our important picks. Considering this is a young team, these picks are important to us. It is better that we didn't trade them away for immediate rentals on defense or other positions, which seems to be what you suggest. With a young team that just finished atop the league standings, these picks are huge for us and will make our team even stronger.

See how our outlooks differ completely? That is why I had come to the conclusion that you were simply pessimistic. This team really does have a bright future ahead of it, however successful they happen to be this post-season.

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04-22-2013, 02:07 PM
  #89
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Originally Posted by hockeyfan2k11 View Post
"bring on the Leafs". Eh...they have a very punishing D. All very big guys...and I haven't even talked about the muscle at forward. Carlyle teams are very rough. I'd be very surprised if we didn't lose the series in 4 or 5 games.

Where is the analysis with this fanbase? I keep hearing "oh it's 4 games". No. This team has not been good in certain areas for a very long time.
Here's some analysis: Slow, bulky defense is pretty much the dream opposition for our quick, speedy forwards.

So what if they have big bodies? Just because we are smaller, their hits will hurt us more? This mindset doesn't make sense. Size is overrated in the playoffs. The only fanbase that consistently concerns themselves with size in the playoffs is our fanbase. Size in the playoffs isn't as important as grittiness, going to the tough areas to win pucks. The Habs have a surplus of these players, from Gionta and Gallagher to Moen and Prust, to Bourque, PK, Gorges and Armstrong. I love how you say "Carlyle teams are rough, so I'd be surprised if we won any games this series" Your correlation makes zero sense, and then you go on to complain that other have no analysis... lol

Next point is the fact that we have much more playoff experience than they do. Hell, their starting goaltender has never played an NHL game! We have three* players who have won Stanley Cups as key components on their rosters, and a bunch of guys who have been in many playoff games as Montreal Canadiens. They don't have a single player who has ever played a playoff game as a Toronto Maple Leaf, and none of them have ever won a Stanley Cup. Experience in the playoffs is crucial.


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04-22-2013, 02:13 PM
  #90
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Originally Posted by hockeyfan2k11 View Post
"bring on the Leafs". Eh...they have a very punishing D. All very big guys...and I haven't even talked about the muscle at forward. Carlyle teams are very rough. I'd be very surprised if we didn't lose the series in 4 or 5 games.

Where is the analysis with this fanbase? I keep hearing "oh it's 4 games". No. This team has not been good in certain areas for a very long time.
Any momentum gains made in the regular season is put aside come game 1.

It's not that hard to beat them. Have a look at our vets and experience versus theirs, and if the Pleks, Markovs come to play, with Subban, all we need is to have Price/Budaj to get a.905 sv/pct.

You're really overrating the Leafs. Their big guys can look awfully slow and stupid vs a shiftier team with higher hockey iq and skill.

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04-22-2013, 02:18 PM
  #91
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Playoff hockey is different hockey than regular season.

It will come down to the goaltending, for both teams.

I keep telling Leaf fans not to overlook any team they face, including the Habs, even if I think the Leafs are superior(sorry, too much fire-power) anything can happen if a goalie get's hot.

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04-22-2013, 02:36 PM
  #92
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The only thing annoying about the leafs right now is probably their fanbase thinking they're gonna break the habs down. Other than the pride of the fans, there are games to be played out there, in a totally different context than a regular season game.

In my crystal ball :the first minutes of game 1, the leafs are gonna lay hits on everything that's moving, then we'll score the first goal. Leafs are gonna lay back a little and nobody is gonna outplay anybody. The critical part of this series will be who dictates game 3. Mental toughness might not be in leafs favor btw.

The leafs biggest mistake would be to salivate at the thought of destroying our players, before they realize that the game is actually who score the most goals after 3 periods.

It will for sure, however, be a tight series.

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04-22-2013, 02:40 PM
  #93
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If you look at the home ice and road records of both teams and the goals for and against, there isnt anybody in there right mind that cant say this would be one hell of a series.

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04-22-2013, 02:49 PM
  #94
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Look at it this way.

If we're still slumping in theses last 3 games, what better team than the team we have been having the most trouble against to motivate our guys to their maximum? Hockey is a motivation and momentum game. If they beat the Leafs, we're gonna be hot for the next series. A lot more than if we go into the playoffs against the Islanders and that the guys think that ''we should beat them if all goes well''.


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04-22-2013, 02:52 PM
  #95
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Look at it this way.

If we're still slumping in theses last 3 games. What better team than the team we have been having the most trouble against to motivate our guys to their maximum? Hockey is a motivation and momentum game. If they beat the Leafs, we're gonna be hot for the next series. A lot more than if we go into the playoffs against the Islanders and that the guys think that ''we should beat them if all goes well''.
Well said. And if you trust MT and the players just a lil, it becomes easy to figure they're gonna play their hearts out.

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04-22-2013, 02:53 PM
  #96
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Playoff hockey is different hockey than regular season.

It will come down to the goaltending, for both teams.

I keep telling Leaf fans not to overlook any team they face, including the Habs, even if I think the Leafs are superior(sorry, too much fire-power) anything can happen if a goalie get's hot.

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04-22-2013, 02:57 PM
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Here's some analysis: Slow, bulky defense is pretty much the dream opposition for our quick, speedy forwards.

So what if they have big bodies? Just because we are smaller, their hits will hurt us more? This mindset doesn't make sense. Size is overrated in the playoffs. The only fanbase that consistently concerns themselves with size in the playoffs is our fanbase. Size in the playoffs isn't as important as grittiness, going to the tough areas to win pucks. The Habs have a surplus of these players, from Gionta and Gallagher to Moen and Prust, to Bourque, PK, Gorges and Armstrong. I love how you say "Carlyle teams are rough, so I'd be surprised if we won any games this series" Your correlation makes zero sense, and then you go on to complain that other have no analysis... lol

Next point is the fact that we have much more playoff experience than they do. Hell, their starting goaltender has never played an NHL game! We have three* players who have won Stanley Cups as key components on their rosters, and a bunch of guys who have been in many playoff games as Montreal Canadiens. They don't have a single player who has ever played a playoff game as a Toronto Maple Leaf, and none of them have ever won a Stanley Cup. Experience in the playoffs is crucial.
What about our D? How is it any quicker than theirs? And how are the Leafs forwards not at least as quick as ours?

On a pure hockey standpoint, I'd keep our team before taking theirs. That being said, too many of our players looked too scared in our last few games against them to be comfortable heading into a Toronto Montreal matchup. Would we be 100% sure to lose? No. But to say the Leafs are a matchup made in heaven for the Habs is living in pure denial. Based on both who would win, and in which state (physically, but mostly emotionally) we would get out of that series looking forward to the next one.

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04-22-2013, 03:05 PM
  #98
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What about our D? How is it any quicker than theirs? And how are the Leafs forwards not at least as quick as ours?

On a pure hockey standpoint, I'd keep our team before taking theirs. That being said, too many of our players looked too scared in our last few games against them to be comfortable heading into a Toronto Montreal matchup. Would we be 100% sure to lose? No. But to say the Leafs are a matchup made in heaven for the Habs is living in pure denial. Based on both who would win, and in which state (physically, but mostly emotionally) we would get out of that series looking forward to the next one.
I think Toronto has a better defense than ours, but if we are comparing the speed of both, then Montreal would probably win. Subban is very quick, Diaz and Weber have some solid footspeed and Bouillon is pretty fast himself. Markov is very slow, though. We aren't nearly as physical as they are, either, but at least we would hopefully stand a chance against their quick forwards. I can't exactly say the same for their defense.

Do you really think the Habs players look scared? And if they did, do you think it is really because they're scared of the playoffs or the Leafs? It is very common for NHL teams to lower their level of compete right after clinching; see the Hawks, Ducks or even Habs of '93. Their focus after clinching is now to ensure that they are healthy for the playoffs. Subconsciously, these games don't mean as much to them anymore. They just want to guarantee they will make it to the show. Even Ovechkin said after the game "They just made the playoffs and want to make sure they are healthy" when asked to remark about our play. It's not a rare thing, and I think what you have interpreted as playing scared is really the Habs losing focus, getting away from their game and not playing with as much heart as they have been.

I never said the Leafs was a match made in heaven, but I think it is a favorable one for the Habs. That team hasn't played in the playoffs in nine years, and most of their roster has never stepped foot on the ice for an NHL playoff game. They may have been the better team this season, but as others keep repeating, the NHL playoffs are a whole new season.

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04-22-2013, 03:06 PM
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Playing the leafs, all it boils down to is a bunch of IFs (for both teams).

And even IF we beat the leafs, I don't know where some people get that MB is not looking to add toughness. Please refer to his original mantra about looking to the future and building through the draft. When it's the right time to trade for players who will cost us, he'll do it, like Shero just did.


IF we lose to the leafs, I might have to go into witness protection. IF we win, I will own the souls of 50% of my friends and have the biggest bragging right I've ever had, I won't know what to do with them.

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04-22-2013, 03:23 PM
  #100
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It's all in how you execute the game to your advantage. If you let bigger teams play "their" game and tire you out via physical play then you might get more tired as a team collectively as you get deeper in the playoffs. However if you use your speed correctly to overcome the bigger teams physicality it offsets that. Tampa in 2011 was 1 goal away from being in the finals and they were a small team. Just got to play to your strengths I guess. Bruins fan in peace!

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