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Lets talk about Dave Bolland

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Old
04-23-2013, 07:43 AM
  #451
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Originally Posted by Marotte Marauder View Post
Why can't he produce even quality 3C numbers while playing on the 2nd line? The out of position argument doesn't wash.
Quit placing reason and facts in front of Bolland supporters. Because this isn't the playoffs and when the playoffs start he will be awesome I hear. But in reality, he will be injured for the playoffs yet again and blow. Ten they will want him paid $5mm for that playoff performance because he is so valuable.

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04-23-2013, 09:19 AM
  #452
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its time hockey teams start operating like nfl teams and act based on expected future performance and not past performance. bolland is never healthy and i doubt that improves a he ages. he also hasn't played well consistently in a long time.

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04-23-2013, 09:30 AM
  #453
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Originally Posted by madgoat33 View Post
its time hockey teams start operating like nfl teams and act based on expected future performance and not past performance. bolland is never healthy and i doubt that improves a he ages. he also hasn't played well consistently in a long time.
I couldn't agree more.

...and people put way too much stock in his playoff performance. Last year he had 3 assists in 6 games and that was it.

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04-23-2013, 09:41 AM
  #454
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Bolland's fate will be decided based on his playoff performance this year. If its anything but spectacular i think he's gone.

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04-23-2013, 09:49 AM
  #455
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Originally Posted by xX Hot Fuss View Post
Bolland's fate will be decided based on his playoff performance this year. If its anything but spectacular i think he's gone.
That is what I am guessing. I think Bolland would have excelled with Bicks and Stalberg like he used to on the third line. But the last year or two he has just been meh.

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04-23-2013, 10:25 AM
  #456
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Way too much stock put into a playoff run. I don't want anything decided on his playoff performance this year. I hope that the decision to keep him or move him (under certain conditions) should have been made already.

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04-23-2013, 10:32 AM
  #457
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Originally Posted by hockeydoug View Post
Way too much stock put into a playoff run. I don't want anything decided on his playoff performance this year. I hope that the decision to keep him or move him (under certain conditions) should have been made already.
I'd say too little is focused on the playoffs around here. In the end, the regular season doesn't mean jack. This team is going to make the playoffs. They need playoff warriors that will step up their game. They need playoff warriors that will help will their team to victory in the direst of circumstances.

That is what Dave Bolland has been in the past. Can he do it again? I'll have to be honest - it looks unlikely this year. His game has been so far off. But we'll see.

And I'll say this also. I'll take a playoff stud 100 times out of 100 over a regular season stud who accomplishes nothing in the playoffs like Stalberg.

This is all about winning the Stanley Cup - not the President's trophy.

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04-23-2013, 10:41 AM
  #458
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Originally Posted by Sarava View Post
I'd say too little is focused on the playoffs around here. In the end, the regular season doesn't mean jack. This team is going to make the playoffs. They need playoff warriors that will step up their game. They need playoff warriors that will help will their team to victory in the direst of circumstances.

That is what Dave Bolland has been in the past. Can he do it again? I'll have to be honest - it looks unlikely this year. His game has been so far off. But we'll see.

And I'll say this also. I'll take a playoff stud 100 times out of 100 over a regular season stud who accomplishes nothing in the playoffs like Stalberg.

This is all about winning the Stanley Cup - not the President's trophy.
Wow i actually agree with Sarava on something! AND i agreed with him editing that stupid ass title for the "Oduya" thread. Thats two things in like 10 minutes!


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04-23-2013, 10:59 AM
  #459
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Originally Posted by Sarava View Post
I'd say too little is focused on the playoffs around here. In the end, the regular season doesn't mean jack. This team is going to make the playoffs. They need playoff warriors that will step up their game. They need playoff warriors that will help will their team to victory in the direst of circumstances.

That is what Dave Bolland has been in the past. Can he do it again? I'll have to be honest - it looks unlikely this year. His game has been so far off. But we'll see.

And I'll say this also. I'll take a playoff stud 100 times out of 100 over a regular season stud who accomplishes nothing in the playoffs like Stalberg.

This is all about winning the Stanley Cup - not the President's trophy.
Stalberg is gonna have a better career than Bolland. Bolland's best day are behind him because he is made of glass.

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04-23-2013, 11:08 AM
  #460
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Originally Posted by Sarava View Post
I'd say too little is focused on the playoffs around here. In the end, the regular season doesn't mean jack. This team is going to make the playoffs. They need playoff warriors that will step up their game. They need playoff warriors that will help will their team to victory in the direst of circumstances.

That is what Dave Bolland has been in the past. Can he do it again? I'll have to be honest - it looks unlikely this year. His game has been so far off. But we'll see.

And I'll say this also. I'll take a playoff stud 100 times out of 100 over a regular season stud who accomplishes nothing in the playoffs like Stalberg.

This is all about winning the Stanley Cup - not the President's trophy.
Bolland was a "playoff stud" 3 years ago. Now he can barely stay on the ice and is largely ineffective when he does play.

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04-23-2013, 11:13 AM
  #461
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Too much pining over 2010 and the like for Davey. He was injured in 2011 playoffs and is going into 2013 playoffs as well. This is the new Bolland standard.

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04-23-2013, 11:27 AM
  #462
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Originally Posted by madgoat33 View Post
Bolland was a "playoff stud" 3 years ago. Now he can barely stay on the ice and is largely ineffective when he does play.
2011 he was the Hawks best player in the playoffs - while only playing in 4 games. Again, I said it looks unlikely this year. But we're going to see whether we like it or not. So we may as well hope the old Dave comes back.


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Originally Posted by LetEmKnow View Post
Stalberg is gonna have a better career than Bolland. Bolland's best day are behind him because he is made of glass.
This may well be the case. Time will tell. That's not really relevant to my point, though.

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04-23-2013, 11:41 AM
  #463
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Dave Bolland overall year

35 GP = 7 goals + 7 assists with a -7

Bolland is only Hawk forward with a negative +/- rtg

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04-23-2013, 11:54 AM
  #464
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Well if Bolland harnesses his inner 2010 that'd be great but either way he should get the boot. Times like these why oh why did we not keep Ladd and sent Bolly packing. Bolland was never a consistent regular season player or good 2C and had missed half the season that Cup year. His stock was alot higher than Ladds in the summer 2010 fire sale.

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04-23-2013, 11:59 AM
  #465
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Its easy to say that in retrospect, but it was probably fair to classify a 24 year old who had 16 points in 22 playoff games while shutting down three of the top lines in the league as a core player post-Cup.

(and lets not forget that Bolland was injured and pretty much non-existent during that regular season as well)

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04-23-2013, 12:06 PM
  #466
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Originally Posted by Sarava View Post
I'd say too little is focused on the playoffs around here.
I would say the opposite. I think the playoffs are way too random with streaks/streaky play, matchups, familiarity after 3 games, injuries, etc. If their was a magic formula for sustained postseason success in the cap era, we would have seen it by now. I hope Chicago builds a good team that's capable of beating anybody. About 8 to 10 teams do that every year, make sure Chicago has one of those. I don't think there's a whole lot else to consider for team construction because of the randomness I mentioned before. The cap compounds the randomness.

Overpaying for Bollands, Wards, Downies, Vaneks, Halaks etc. because of posteason success is more likely to put a team out of that group of 8 to 10 even though they've been recent playoff studs (I disagree with Bolland, just using him as an example).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sarava View Post
This is all about winning the Stanley Cup - not the President's trophy.
But there's no magic formula for a cup. If you build a team that can outplay the rest of the league for the year, it means you're probably on a good track for that season and/or the next couple moving forward. The last time a Presidents' trophy winner missed the postseason the next years was the 92' Rangers. I think the Presidents' trophy is downplayed too much. It's solid affirmation that an organization is doing things well.

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04-23-2013, 12:28 PM
  #467
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Originally Posted by Bring Back GLR View Post
Bolland was never a consistent regular season player or good 2C and had missed half the season that Cup year. His stock was alot higher than Ladds in the summer 2010 fire sale.
I'm a Bowman fan, but keeping Bolland after 2010 and 2011 has been the decision I've found the most frustrating of them all since demand for a player like Bolland was so high. His defensive exploits of 2010 have been replicated by a number of other players. A good playoff run and I might retract my criticism of the decision to have kept him around.

Everything may still work out great though. Even though he's struggled this year and missed games because of injury, it's tough to argue with the results so far. I think his cap hit and play cost them pts and seeding in the previous 2 years, but keeping his cap hit and him on the roster this year may have made things better this year directly or indirectly.

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04-23-2013, 12:38 PM
  #468
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I understand the Bolland hate, really I do, but i dont understand how so many of you seem to think his elevated playoff play is irrelevant/useless/not worth retaining. This isn't Byfuglien who had one good year in the playoffs. Bolland was great in 08-09, PHENOMENAL in 09-10, and in 10-11 he missed the first 3 games of the Vancouver series and the Hawks went 0-3, the 4 games he came back the Sedins (at the height of their careers) had what, like 2 combined points and the Hawks took them to Game 7 OT. He had 3 points in 6 games against PHX, nothing phenomenal but its not like the dude disappeared.

CLEARLY Bolland has proven he elevates his game in the Playoffs. How can you NOT want that? How can you disagree with that or say he's riding on past post-season's success when he continually has played great 4 postseasons in a row???

Honestly, instead of calling up Pirri, why dont we try sending Bolland back down to the 3rd line these last few games and moving Shaw up?

Saad-Toews-Hossa
Sharp-Shaw-Kane
Bickell-Bolland-Stalberg

Its not like we're losing offense or faceoffs with Shaw as our 2C and Bolland gets to be back in his natural role again. I get he's not having an awesome year. The 2C experiment isn't working, but its disgusting from one Hawks fan to another to see how under appreciated this guy is from his own fanbase.

If he has a lackluster postseason this year then i'd be ok with getting rid of him due to our cap issues but otherwise, he is the type of player we need to win a cup.

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04-23-2013, 12:39 PM
  #469
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Playoffs should tell us if he stays or goes.

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04-23-2013, 02:21 PM
  #470
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Originally Posted by xX Hot Fuss View Post
I understand the Bolland hate, really I do, but i dont understand how so many of you seem to think his elevated playoff play is irrelevant/useless/not worth retaining.
It's not hate from all of us. I think he's a good player, but not as good as many people. It's weighing his overall worth in terms of cap hit, market value, production (winning hockey games), and what the liklihood of a stronger or weaker roster with him on it or off it.
Before the start of this year, I thought Chicago was better off moving him. I've been saying keep him since the start of the year. When I take all those things into consideration (and likelihood of a failed trade) I think it's better to just keep him unless there is a significant and specific chronic injury concern we don't know about.
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This isn't Byfuglien who had one good year in the playoffs. Bolland was great in 08-09, PHENOMENAL in 09-10, and in 10-11 he missed the first 3 games of the Vancouver series and the Hawks went 0-3, the 4 games he came back the Sedins (at the height of their careers) had what, like 2 combined points and the Hawks took them to Game 7 OT. He had 3 points in 6 games against PHX, nothing phenomenal but its not like the dude disappeared.
They lost the first round of the playoffs. Moving Bolland maybe keeps them out of the playoffs, or, more likely, gets them a better 1st round matchup because of healthier and stronger depth that would have likely been more reliable. 4 good playoff games doesn't offset an entire season and doesn't justify a contract slot and the cap space (when it was in short supply) when looking at things in the big picture for 2011 and moving forward from there.
Quote:
CLEARLY Bolland has proven he elevates his game in the Playoffs. How can you NOT want that? How can you disagree with that or say he's riding on past post-season's success when he continually has played great 4 postseasons in a row???
They lost in the first round the last 2 years, at that point it doesn't matter if they had a good postseason. The experience matters more than the production if a team is bowing out in the first round. It doesn't help that his injuries and underachievement set the Hawks up with a lower seed than if they had moved him.

Here's an example of what I mean, Danny Briere is an absolute playoff beast but I would argue his contract has done more to hurt the Flyers' likelihood of winning and winning the cup for the entire length of his contract except for 2011 (2010, the almost missed the show entirely, in large part, because of Briere's contract). Overall the value isn't there even though he's about as good as they come for a playoff game.

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04-23-2013, 02:25 PM
  #471
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If he has a lackluster postseason this year then i'd be ok with getting rid of him due to our cap issues but otherwise, he is the type of player we need to win a cup
Quote:
Playoffs should tell us if he stays or goes.
We haven't seen any of the better franchises react significantly to postseason results in terms of player movement. I can't imagine Bowman is going to do anything with Bolland he wasn't already planning to do whether they win the cup or take a dump in 5 games.

Detroit sticks to their guns, Wilson sticks to his guns, Lou has stuck to his, Shero, Chiarelli, and arguably Gillis. They'll add or pick up an insurance piece but they have not overreacted to favorable or unfavorable playoff results. I think Bowman (Bowmans) believe in a similar approach since a few goofy OT bounces can decide a first round exit in the playoffs or a cup.

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04-23-2013, 02:37 PM
  #472
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they are loyal, but thats still a business and they have other needs too. He may be expandable and his play so far this year was plain and simple bad

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04-23-2013, 03:52 PM
  #473
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Originally Posted by xX Hot Fuss View Post

Honestly, instead of calling up Pirri, why dont we try sending Bolland back down to the 3rd line these last few games and moving Shaw up?

Saad-Toews-Hossa
Sharp-Shaw-Kane
Bickell-Bolland-Stalberg.
Shaw is not a top 6 player ,, He Is a fringe 3rd liner at this point

Having him in top 6 role is pathetic

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04-23-2013, 04:31 PM
  #474
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Originally Posted by xX Hot Fuss View Post
Honestly, instead of calling up Pirri, why dont we try sending Bolland back down to the 3rd line these last few games and moving Shaw up?

Saad-Toews-Hossa
Sharp-Shaw-Kane
Bickell-Bolland-Stalberg
That's plain awful!

Saad - Toews - Hossa
Stalberg - Sharp - Kane
Bickell - Bolland - Frolik (playoff checking line)
Carcillo - Kruger - Shaw

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Its not like we're losing offense or faceoffs with Shaw as our 2C
Shaw is the worst faceoff man currently on the Chicago Blackhawks roster.

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04-23-2013, 04:45 PM
  #475
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Quit placing reason and facts in front of Bolland supporters. Because this isn't the playoffs and when the playoffs start he will be awesome I hear. But in reality, he will be injured for the playoffs yet again and blow. Ten they will want him paid $5mm for that playoff performance because he is so valuable.
Bolland has been maybe the Hawks best player in the playoffs over the last 3 series, in 2010 he was great, in 2011 he was the best player on the ice, in 2012 when the stars of the team weren't producing he was still out there doing his job well.

But let's ignore all of that because your a what have you done for me today kind of guy, Bolland has had a terrible year cut him, trade him, kill him. Who cares what he has done for his career and what he has already proven to be I don't like him.

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