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Old
04-23-2013, 10:06 AM
  #26
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I based part of the LW in a trade scenario based on an article Iread from a Toronto paper that cited that 'sources close to the situation ' cited that the Kings will be trading with an Eastern Con. team for Bernier, part of the come back was a solid LW. It said that the Kings were agreeable to the return but wouldn't give up Bernier until the season is done , so the deal didn't get done on trade day. I heard a similar rumor here in Philly from a friend who dates someone in the Flyers pub relations dept who said that Mason was being signed as a backup and the Flyers were going to get Bernier post season. So in that case, I'm guessing Matt Read comes back.

I'm curious to see how it plays out.

I can't see Penner back next year. He's just not reliable enough for 82 games and I don't think Sutter likes him much. That line deserves better and someone more stable.
I love the insight you bring to threads tg but this time from what ur saying i don't see read coming back. Every site i went to has read as either a center or rw I see either Ruslan Fedotenko or maybe a bigger trade with us adding martinez and another propect for the 1st and/ Hartnell

opps sorry i thought i was quoteing tg post dee

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04-23-2013, 10:35 AM
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Carey Price is not doing well at all here in Montreal. Talk of the town is that if he continues to underperform this week and into the playoffs, his days in Montreal will be counted. I would not be surprised if the Habs show interest in Bernier. Price will still want to be a number one goalie though.
That's just asinine if Montreal does that. Price is a great goalie.

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04-23-2013, 10:48 AM
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I'm honestly very confused as to who would even be in the market for Bernier at the moment. The playoffs will likely help sort that out, as any goalie that has a bad playoffs could be considered for replacement unless it's someone like Lundqvist.

The usual suspects seem to have elected to give other goalies a test run, such as Calgary (Berra and maybe Ramo), Tampa Bay (Bishop) and Philly (Mason), so they'll be out of the running until they've decided if those guys can handle the load or not. Toronto also seems infatuated with bringing in a veteran, as Nonis first publicly stated he wanted to add a veteran if he added anyone at all, and then pursued Kipper and Luongo.

New Jersey still seems like a good option, but both Hedberg and Broduer have NTC's, so I'm not sure how NJ would handle that, unless they wanted to waive/bury Hedberg.

I guess the Islanders could be a possibility if Nabokov doesn't resign there and they feel one of their other prospects isn't capable or ready to be a number one yet.

I know another poster (Holden perhaps) mentioned Winnipeg, but I'm not sure they'd abandon Pavalec just yet. He's been inconsistent, but he's great when he's on. Plus I'm not sure Winnipeg has anything we'd want that would also be available, outside of their 1st round pick, but it seems like DL's price exceeds a 1st.

If Buffalo deals Miller, then there could be a market for Bernier, but until he's moved that's a no go.

In the conference, Minnesota could be possible if Backstrom doesn't return, but they also have Harding who likely would be given first shot at the job anyways.

Phoenix could be possible as both Smith and LOLabarbera are UFA's after the season.

Varlamnov isn't doing so hot in COlorado either, but they may give him another season as well.

I just don't see a lot of markets for Bernier right now, but as I said, that could all change with a bad playoff showing, or a team missing the playoffs.

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04-23-2013, 11:28 AM
  #29
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I'm honestly very confused as to who would even be in the market for Bernier at the moment. The playoffs will likely help sort that out, as any goalie that has a bad playoffs could be considered for replacement unless it's someone like Lundqvist.

The usual suspects seem to have elected to give other goalies a test run, such as Calgary (Berra and maybe Ramo), Tampa Bay (Bishop) and Philly (Mason), so they'll be out of the running until they've decided if those guys can handle the load or not. Toronto also seems infatuated with bringing in a veteran, as Nonis first publicly stated he wanted to add a veteran if he added anyone at all, and then pursued Kipper and Luongo.

New Jersey still seems like a good option, but both Hedberg and Broduer have NTC's, so I'm not sure how NJ would handle that, unless they wanted to waive/bury Hedberg.

I guess the Islanders could be a possibility if Nabokov doesn't resign there and they feel one of their other prospects isn't capable or ready to be a number one yet.

I know another poster (Holden perhaps) mentioned Winnipeg, but I'm not sure they'd abandon Pavalec just yet. He's been inconsistent, but he's great when he's on. Plus I'm not sure Winnipeg has anything we'd want that would also be available, outside of their 1st round pick, but it seems like DL's price exceeds a 1st.

If Buffalo deals Miller, then there could be a market for Bernier, but until he's moved that's a no go.

In the conference, Minnesota could be possible if Backstrom doesn't return, but they also have Harding who likely would be given first shot at the job anyways.

Phoenix could be possible as both Smith and LOLabarbera are UFA's after the season.

Varlamnov isn't doing so hot in COlorado either, but they may give him another season as well.

I just don't see a lot of markets for Bernier right now, but as I said, that could all change with a bad playoff showing, or a team missing the playoffs.


All I ever hear from everyone is Philly and New Jersey. Allot of smoke with the Philly thing but then DL and Lou always seem to be talking about one thing or another so who knows. Me personally, I am with you in that there really isn't a cut and dried for certain type of deal out there.

For Philly they would have to buy out Ditz and then make us an offer that we like while keeping their team where they want it and while it looks good it doesn't look perfect. With NJ they would have to buy out Hedberg which isn't a big deal but not a great one and then take a good look at what they would want to give that we would want to bring back.

They do have a couple of kids who I like but do they want to move them? I think with NJ it comes down to how much of a retooling they actually do. Of course it looks like a perfect situation in having JB tutored for a season by one of the greatest goalies of all time but if the team in front of him isn't good enough to make the playoffs with MB in net what will that do to JB's confidence?

The only thing I had heard that made me think that a deal was going to happen was with New Jersey but that doesn't really mean anything. These things are liquid and don't really become solid until a landmark situation happens (the draft the deadline an injury or a major fail).

JB has been a truly great kid who has given his all and done a great job for the team and DL is a loyal man to the people who give their all as much as possible. Sending JB close to home like he wants will have to be a consideration. Maybe a lesser one but one that I think will come into play when the deal is done.

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04-23-2013, 11:49 AM
  #30
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I love the insight you bring to threads tg but this time from what ur saying i don't see read coming back. Every site i went to has read as either a center or rw I see either Ruslan Fedotenko or maybe a bigger trade with us adding martinez and another propect for the 1st and/ Hartnell

opps sorry i thought i was quoteing tg post dee
That's okay...and Matt Read plays LW for the Flyers, and is my favorite FLyer. Just a solid player in all 3 zones, positionally sound on both sides of the puick, high IQ, fast and great hands. Smart player. Would look great on the 2nd line.

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04-23-2013, 11:55 AM
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Originally Posted by Tonellisghost View Post
All I ever hear from everyone is Philly and New Jersey. Allot of smoke with the Philly thing but then DL and Lou always seem to be talking about one thing or another so who knows. Me personally, I am with you in that there really isn't a cut and dried for certain type of deal out there.

For Philly they would have to buy out Ditz and then make us an offer that we like while keeping their team where they want it and while it looks good it doesn't look perfect. With NJ they would have to buy out Hedberg which isn't a big deal but not a great one and then take a good look at what they would want to give that we would want to bring back.

They do have a couple of kids who I like but do they want to move them? I think with NJ it comes down to how much of a retooling they actually do. Of course it looks like a perfect situation in having JB tutored for a season by one of the greatest goalies of all time but if the team in front of him isn't good enough to make the playoffs with MB in net what will that do to JB's confidence?

The only thing I had heard that made me think that a deal was going to happen was with New Jersey but that doesn't really mean anything. These things are liquid and don't really become solid until a landmark situation happens (the draft the deadline an injury or a major fail).

JB has been a truly great kid who has given his all and done a great job for the team and DL is a loyal man to the people who give their all as much as possible. Sending JB close to home like he wants will have to be a consideration. Maybe a lesser one but one that I think will come into play when the deal is done.
To me, it just seems like Adam Henrique would be a great fit in here. I think NJ would have to add to him to make the deal work, but he'd be a great fit in our style and system, and he oozes character and hard work as well.

But would NJ want to part with him if they are an older team already? Granted, they'd be getting back a young kid in Bernier, but they could use to hold onto their youth as best they can.

Henrique and a 2nd for Bernier? I'd love to replace the 2nd with one of their D prospects like Boucher or Gelinas, but I doubt NJ would part with that much youth considering the overall age of that team.


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Old
04-23-2013, 12:14 PM
  #32
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Henrique and a 2nd for Bernier?
I can't see that happeneing. I love Henrique and was very impressed by him in the playoffs last year. He and Zajac are the future of that team at center. (which by the way the kings don't need another of, top heavy now)

They're not letting him go, he's far too valuable for their future.

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04-23-2013, 12:24 PM
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I can't see that happeneing. I love Henrique and was very impressed by him in the playoffs last year. He and Zajac are the future of that team at center. (which by the way the kings don't need another of, top heavy now)

They're not letting him go, he's far too valuable for their future.
Read plus would be such a natural and great fit of a return for JB. That is the deal that I am hoping goes down but it would require Ditz being bought out to make happen.

KF

I like Henrique but agree that I can't see the Devils giving him up due to their retooling and their need for him. I also think that we will look to taking back as little salary as possible. But I honestly don't know. I do like a couple of the Devils prospects allot but will they part with them and picks when they are looking at retooling? I am not certain.

Still, Read would be the perfect fit for us. The guy would slot in to the MR JC line and give us our top 6 set and loaded. He isn't a sniper but he will go out there work as hard as possible to get things done. I think that he could pop in 25g on that line.

Of course I would want Read and a seriously solid prospect plus a pick and that might put us out. Watch a deal actually be done with Montreal in the end.

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04-23-2013, 12:47 PM
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I can't see that happeneing. I love Henrique and was very impressed by him in the playoffs last year. He and Zajac are the future of that team at center. (which by the way the kings don't need another of, top heavy now)

They're not letting him go, he's far too valuable for their future.
If we were talking right after the playoffs, I'd agree. In fact, I'd suggest we'd have to add to Bernier to get Henrique.

Now though, I'm not as convinced. While I don't think NJ would move him anyways, the sophmore slump hit Henrique hard, and his numbers are down as a result. Granted, losing the sheltering affects of Parise and Kovalchuk for a short time didn't help, but he's not as valueable (price tag wise) as he was last June.

All in all though, it is likely a moot point for NJ, as I can't see them moving him.

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Originally Posted by Tonellisghost View Post
Read plus would be such a natural and great fit of a return for JB. That is the deal that I am hoping goes down but it would require Ditz being bought out to make happen.

KF

I like Henrique but agree that I can't see the Devils giving him up due to their retooling and their need for him. I also think that we will look to taking back as little salary as possible. But I honestly don't know. I do like a couple of the Devils prospects allot but will they part with them and picks when they are looking at retooling? I am not certain.

Still, Read would be the perfect fit for us. The guy would slot in to the MR JC line and give us our top 6 set and loaded. He isn't a sniper but he will go out there work as hard as possible to get things done. I think that he could pop in 25g on that line.

Of course I would want Read and a seriously solid prospect plus a pick and that might put us out. Watch a deal actually be done with Montreal in the end.
Philly just doesn't make any sense to me at the moment. I know it is Philly, where the universe can spin on a dime if Holmgren deems it so, but in order to bring in Bernier, three things have to happen:

1) They'd have to buy out Bryzgalov, as they aren't paying that type of money and cap hit to a guy that's a backup (and they can't send him to the minors as he has a NMC), and they wouldn't bring in Bernier to be the backup either. A compliance buy out is I believe 100% of the contract value, which would be $34.5 million following this season. I can't see even Philly being that silly to spend that amount of money though. If they elected to go for a regular buy out at I believe 66% of his remaining salary, it'd still cost them $22.77 million, and the cap hit would be about (I think) $2.85 million from next year until I believe 2026-2027. Holden can confirm that's correct, but I believe it is and if so, doesn't make much sense for Philly to do.

2) They'd have to give up on Mason as a possible starter. Since they just acquired him 20 days ago and he's been good in his five games with the club so far (2.09 GAA, .931 save percentage), it's doubtful they'd ignore him and acquire Bernier, especially since Mason has a better track record than Bernier, having been a former starter, having playoff experience (albeit limited) and having won the Calder. He had more wins in his rookie season than Bernier has in his entire NHL career so far.

3) Assuming they did the above two, they'd still have to pay the price to get Bernier, which is at a 1st-plus. Considering Philly's pick is slated right now to be eighth overall, I doubt they want to hand over that first to the Kings, meaning they will likely be handing over prospects. Scott Laughton looks nice, but beyond that, what does Philly have that we'd be interested in that's not going to impact their roster? And I can't see DL dealing Bernier for just Laughton.

NJ makes a lot of sense, but their lack of assets and the fact Hedberg and Broduer are on NTC's really complicates things.

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04-23-2013, 12:58 PM
  #35
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If we were talking right after the playoffs, I'd agree. In fact, I'd suggest we'd have to add to Bernier to get Henrique.

Now though, I'm not as convinced. While I don't think NJ would move him anyways, the sophmore slump hit Henrique hard, and his numbers are down as a result. Granted, losing the sheltering affects of Parise and Kovalchuk for a short time didn't help, but he's not as valueable (price tag wise) as he was last June.

All in all though, it is likely a moot point for NJ, as I can't see them moving him.



Philly just doesn't make any sense to me at the moment. I know it is Philly, where the universe can spin on a dime if Holmgren deems it so, but in order to bring in Bernier, three things have to happen:

1) They'd have to buy out Bryzgalov, as they aren't paying that type of money and cap hit to a guy that's a backup (and they can't send him to the minors as he has a NMC), and they wouldn't bring in Bernier to be the backup either. A compliance buy out is I believe 100% of the contract value, which would be $34.5 million following this season. I can't see even Philly being that silly to spend that amount of money though. If they elected to go for a regular buy out at I believe 66% of his remaining salary, it'd still cost them $22.77 million, and the cap hit would be about (I think) $2.85 million from next year until I believe 2026-2027. Holden can confirm that's correct, but I believe it is and if so, doesn't make much sense for Philly to do.

2) They'd have to give up on Mason as a possible starter. Since they just acquired him 20 days ago and he's been good in his five games with the club so far (2.09 GAA, .931 save percentage), it's doubtful they'd ignore him and acquire Bernier, especially since Mason has a better track record than Bernier, having been a former starter, having playoff experience (albeit limited) and having won the Calder. He had more wins in his rookie season than Bernier has in his entire NHL career so far.

3) Assuming they did the above two, they'd still have to pay the price to get Bernier, which is at a 1st-plus. Considering Philly's pick is slated right now to be eighth overall, I doubt they want to hand over that first to the Kings, meaning they will likely be handing over prospects. Scott Laughton looks nice, but beyond that, what does Philly have that we'd be interested in that's not going to impact their roster? And I can't see DL dealing Bernier for just Laughton.

NJ makes a lot of sense, but their lack of assets and the fact Hedberg and Broduer are on NTC's really complicates things.
We are seeing the same thing as to your first point. Buying out Dytz would be a huge investment and admitting to having made yet another HUGE mistake. I can't see them doing it either. I just really like Read. As to Philly's prospects I really really like Cousins and would happily take him and Laughton plus a highish pick for JB but I doubt DL would.

I think your right about AH's value being lower than it was and that it would positively effect his value in our favor. I am not certain DL would make a deal for a single player that we would have to add to around JB though. I think we are looking to add talent without adding too much salary (who isn't).

AH is going to get a nice contract so that is a consideration too. NJ makes the most sense to me for a trading partner like I have said but its going to be interesting to see how it all shakes out. The NJ deal is the one that seemed to have the most smoke around it but you just never know.

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04-23-2013, 01:14 PM
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There's no "possible" departure for Bernier, he is gone. He said in an interview the other day that he "knew it was my last year here" and that even at the deadline he wasn't totally sure he was staying. He will be in another uniform next year 100%.

I think Jones will get passed over and they will sign a veteran. Of the guys playing in the A right now, I don't think there are many guys ready for NHL duty, at least not that I have seen. Anaheim/Norfolk's Frederik Andersen might be an exception.

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04-23-2013, 01:21 PM
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That's just asinine if Montreal does that. Price is a great goalie.
agreed I have never heard that. Before the past two weeks Price was in consideration for the Vezna.

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04-23-2013, 01:24 PM
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There's no "possible" departure for Bernier, he is gone. He said in an interview the other day that he "knew it was my last year here" and that even at the deadline he wasn't totally sure he was staying. He will be in another uniform next year 100%.

I think Jones will get passed over and they will sign a veteran. Of the guys playing in the A right now, I don't think there are many guys ready for NHL duty, at least not that I have seen. Anaheim/Norfolk's Frederik Andersen might be an exception.
Yep I think everyone knows JB is gone. Nobody is contesting that.

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04-23-2013, 01:26 PM
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Read plus would be such a natural and great fit of a return for JB. That is the deal that I am hoping goes down but it would require Ditz being bought out to make happen.
THe Bryz situation is a curious one. I don't see him winning a Cup in Philly, I never liked him before he got here and thta hasn't changed. In pressure situations, he tends to be (historically) mentally weak and cracks under pressure. The team in front of him tends to play that way, that's what I saw int hte NJ Devils series last year. Holding their sticks too tight ,just waiting for that soft goal to come, and it did.

Ed wants a Cup and he's hitting 80 so he's running short on time. If he thinks there's a better option, he won't hesitate to buy out Bryz and rationalize it.

I'm not a Mason fan, so I don't see him as the answer either. If Mason is their guy, then Bryz has to go. And they can use that $$ for D. They are a CAP mess. Even buying out Briere, which most fans think wil lhappen, won't help.

There was a converstation on the FLyres boards awhile back about Read and hte Flyers CAP situation. With 13 Mill tied to Hartnell , Simmonds and Voracek, and Giroux, B Schenn and Coutiuer needing contracts next year, there was a question as to if the ycould afford Read, given their other salaries and need fora top 2 D. Giroux wil get Perry/Getzlaff money if not more, he'll probably get what Malkin gets, contracts up the same time, 8.5 to 9. That doesn't leave lot left.

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04-23-2013, 01:37 PM
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THe Bryz situation is a curious one. I don't see him winning a Cup in Philly, I never liked him before he got here and thta hasn't changed. In pressure situations, he tends to be (historically) mentally weak and cracks under pressure. The team in front of him tends to play that way, that's what I saw int hte NJ Devils series last year. Holding their sticks too tight ,just waiting for that soft goal to come, and it did.

Ed wants a Cup and he's hitting 80 so he's running short on time. If he thinks there's a better option, he won't hesitate to buy out Bryz and rationalize it.

I'm not a Mason fan, so I don't see him as the answer either. If Mason is their guy, then Bryz has to go. And they can use that $$ for D. They are a CAP mess. Even buying out Briere, which most fans think wil lhappen, won't help.

There was a converstation on the FLyres boards awhile back about Read and hte Flyers CAP situation. With 13 Mill tied to Hartnell , Simmonds and Voracek, and Giroux, B Schenn and Coutiuer needing contracts next year, there was a question as to if the ycould afford Read, given their other salaries and need fora top 2 D. Giroux wil get Perry/Getzlaff money if not more, he'll probably get what Malkin gets, contracts up the same time, 8.5 to 9. That doesn't leave lot left.

That's interesting for certain.

Wow at the idea of Giroux getting over $7.5 in the new CBA era but who knows? If Perry and Getzlaf can get big bucks then why couldn't Giroux? If it were anyone other than Philly I would say that Brytz is there for the duration but like you said, Ed is getting old so ya never know.

If it could work out where we ended up with Read plus I would be a happy fan.

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04-23-2013, 01:47 PM
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We have J-Dub, Carter, Nolan, and Lewis. Don't think we have enough room for another right winger.
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04-23-2013, 01:50 PM
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As of today, we have the best goaltending tandem in the league, bar none. LOL at the "experts" who pointed up north at Vancouver.

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04-23-2013, 02:34 PM
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There's no "possible" departure for Bernier, he is gone. He said in an interview the other day that he "knew it was my last year here" and that even at the deadline he wasn't totally sure he was staying. He will be in another uniform next year 100%.

I think Jones will get passed over and they will sign a veteran. Of the guys playing in the A right now, I don't think there are many guys ready for NHL duty, at least not that I have seen. Anaheim/Norfolk's Frederik Andersen might be an exception.
Bernier knew it because he controls things after this season. He's an RFA and can force the issue if he really wants to and odds are he's told DL as much. Trade me or I'll refuse to resign, or sign an offer sheet elsewhere that you won't want to match, yet it will give you less in return than you think I'm worth. Given what happened with ROR, it's a good plan.

Here are the RFA compensation guidelines for this year:

http://www.pensionplanpuppets.com/20...e-offer-sheets

They will likely drop for next year, since the cap is dropping as well, but they will go down roughly the same amount the cap is (8.4%).

Basically, if someone offers Bernier a deal with an average salary of $3 million, he'd only be worth a 2nd rounder in compensation. Yet at $3 million, I doubt DL could afford to match it as he'd likely have to find the cap room elsewhere, not to mention trying to justify spending $3 million on a backup that he can not trade for one full year. Not to mention a 2nd round pick is far less than what DL is asking, and far less than what the market value is for goalies in his situation. He should be able to get close to triple that, give or take.

It's in everyone's best interest to see Bernier dealt at the draft. We don't have to worry about an RFA bid, and Bernier doesn't have to worry we'd match one.

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