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Habs' off-season moves (all trades, proposals & free agent talk here)

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Old
04-24-2013, 08:59 AM
  #226
Monctonscout
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Originally Posted by LePoche69 View Post
The more I see the games, the more I'm convinced Habs will need to sacrifice a good young forward and a pick to get a good #1.5/#2 d-man.

Markov has dangerously slowed down. He looks like a pilon out there. If I was Bergevin, I would hope a team hadn't noticed and dream about Markov's PP ability to try to trade him for a first rounder.

I would target d-men like Seabrook, Yandle... I would be willing to trade Eller for those guys, switching Galchenyuk to center next year.

Of course, I would prefer to trade Deasharnais, but he doesn't have the same trade value.

The need for a #1.5/#2 complete d-man is important since no kid will be able to do this job for another 2-4 years.
Yandle makes little sense for the Habs, he is another offensive d-man, we have tons of those in the pipeline, makes no sense to get a guy like that at what his cost will be. Poor use of assets.

Markov has lost a step, no doubt, but he is not a liability like you are trying to paint him. Losing Emelin hurts his game for sure as he needs a big body to do the heavy moving in the defensive zone. He is still one of the better PMD's and PP QB's around, he just needs more help than 3-4 years ago.

I could see a deal for Seabrook but I'm not sure he is on the market. I think the best option may be a 1 year fix on the UFA market to bridge until Tinordi Beaulieu and Pateryn are NHL ready. No point in trading valuable assets and blocking their path in a year or two.

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Old
04-24-2013, 09:02 AM
  #227
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Originally Posted by Draft View Post
Awesome to hear. I was always a big fan of his and think he's grown up enough to be able to fit in with the team. Haven't heard bad things from Canucks.



On the big board there's the Markov/Gionta/Desharnais thread. Couple of trades that were proposed and got okay reception.

Kristo + DD to the Sharks for Demers (RFA) + Tierney + Pittsburgh 2nd

as well as one I just threw out there now,

Markov + Moen + (Maybe a pick) to the Oilers for Paajarvi-Svenson (RFA)

Demers will be a very good two-way defenceman soon, San Jose has several high-profile defence prospects coming up through the system, making him expandable. He has decent size, can hit quite well, still young, from Quebec.

Edmonton has desperate need of vets and depth in their lineup, much speculation that Paajarvi is on his way out. I see him as a younger version of Stalberg that could end up being Bourque's replacement. Very good defensively, fast, can score, still young.

IF these were to go through, our lineup would look something like this:

Pacioretty-Plekanec-Gallagher
Bourque-Eller-Gionta
Paajarvi-Galchenyuk-XXX
XXX-Prust-XXX

Gorges-Subban
Diaz-Emelin
Demers-Bouillon
(XXX)

I think losing Markov for the PP would be very difficult to handle but hopefully with Diaz healthy and Demers contributing, it'd still stay afloat. I don't think anyone has a problem with trading Desharnais or Moen. Kristo will be a loss but we have several players in the same mould in our lineup and in our prospect pool. Another 2nd round pick and a pretty decent fwd prospect could hopefully fill Kristo's loss. I don't think it'll be too difficult to sign a 3rd liner, two 4ths and a 6th/7th dman.

What do you guys think?
Sure if we join the no hit no fight league. We don't need more soft players. We need size and grit and players to give more room to our skilled players. If we get Clowe, Clarkson, Bickell and Bieksa and eliminate Gionta, Ryder, DD, and Bourque then we could add Paajarvi.

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Old
04-24-2013, 09:28 AM
  #228
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Originally Posted by Bourne Endeavor View Post
Was about to post something like this, Draft. Few more additions I would make:

Weber 1st + 3rd (or late second) for Read + Talbot

This was brought up in the Flyers trade thread and something I feel with worth consideration. Read may be small but he brings a similar element of grit and feistiness we all adore Gallagher for. Likewise, he is a solid scorer (24/40). Simply put, he is an upgrade in every way on Gionta. We're likely not to draft a player of consequence that late in the draft and we have enough picks and prospects to make up the difference- get one back in the aforementioned Edmonton deal.

Talbot should speak for himself. We are far too reliant on Prust for any form of physicality and I feel in an eighty-two season, he will wear down - he is already. Teams are likely to target him in the future for this precise reason and Talbot would offset the load. A nice bonus is, like Prust, he can easily step into the third line and not miss a step should injuries be a concern.

Personally, I would then trade Bourque or Gionta and retain Ryder. The former had a spark to the early season, but I have little belief he can maintain that degree of consistency, even less now with the concussion. The latter he is more or less a one trick pony, who trick everyone's figured out.

Pacioretty - Plekanec - Read
Paajarvi - Galchenyuk - Gallagher
Bourque - Eller - Gionta/Ryder
Prust - Talbot - XXX

Demers - Subban
Beaulieu - Emelin
Diaz - Gorges

or

Demers - Subban
Diaz - Emelin
Gorges - Tinordi
I think that acquiring these type of players is possible through Free Agency. Not that I don't think Read is a good player, we just have too many players like him. Stalberg or Bickell put up very similar point totals plus a physical game.

Quote:
Originally Posted by LePoche69 View Post
The more I see the games, the more I'm convinced Habs will need to sacrifice a good young forward and a pick to get a good #1.5/#2 d-man.

Markov has dangerously slowed down. He looks like a pilon out there. If I was Bergevin, I would hope a team hadn't noticed and dream about Markov's PP ability to try to trade him for a first rounder.

I would target d-men like Seabrook, Yandle... I would be willing to trade Eller for those guys, switching Galchenyuk to center next year.

Of course, I would prefer to trade Deasharnais, but he doesn't have the same trade value.

The need for a #1.5/#2 complete d-man is important since no kid will be able to do this job for another 2-4 years.
Are we better suited to acquire a #1.5/#2 or just another top-4? It's not just because of the trade proposals that I think Demers would be a big acquisition. He plays a good defensive and physical game as well as adds offence. Markov is starting to wear out and we need someone to fill his spot, I don't think it's as drastic as needing to acquire a #1.5-#2. Gorges can play the minutes we need him to, depth throughout the defence is more valuable than a really strong top 2. That's just my opinion though.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Monctonscout View Post
You seriously want to trade Weber, a 1st and a 3rd for a 3rd liner and a 4th liner, both being under 6' and 200lbs?

That makes no sense on any level. Both guys are solid players, but no way in hell do I send Phillie a 1st rounder in any deal involving them unless one comes back.

The team is struggling, but let's not use a 2 week stretch as a reason to pull off Rejean Houle style trades.
Our 1st round pick will go a long way in keeping us a competitor in the future. Really hope we don't trade it for vets and players that will only help us short term.



My ideal acquisitions if these trades go through:

Pacioretty-Plekanec-Gionta
Bourque-Eller-Gallagher
Paajarvi-Galchenyuk-Stalberg/Bickell
Sestito-Lapierre-Prust
(Dumont)

Gorges-Subban
Demers-Emelin
Diaz-O'Byrne
(Bouillon)

They would all be fairly cheap, all add size and toughness, all realistic possibilities.

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Old
04-24-2013, 09:41 AM
  #229
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Originally Posted by 1993 View Post
Sure if we join the no hit no fight league. We don't need more soft players. We need size and grit and players to give more room to our skilled players. If we get Clowe, Clarkson, Bickell and Bieksa and eliminate Gionta, Ryder, DD, and Bourque then we could add Paajarvi.
Can everyone stop with the size??? We can't change our team identity in one year all that you proposed is worth more then what were giving up... Clarkson will cost at least 5mil/5years... Clowe at least 4mil/3-4years and bickell if we're lucky could get around 3mil/4years with bieksa and his 4.6million cap hit that's 16.6 million..

Cap space-2.3 million
Kaberle buyout +4.25
Gionta trade +5.0
Bourque trade +3.33
Markov trade +5.75
DD trade +0.8

Total cap room 22.1million
22.1-16.6= 5.5 million cap space remaining.... Sounds good right?

Problem is everyone is locked up long term at high cap now... The earliest contract to expire is Clowes but that won't be in time to pay the increases for both gallys, subban, Emelin, Diaz, beaulieu, tinordi...

We would be in total cap hell good idea but that's the price of trying to change everything in one year (cough gainey cough)

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Old
04-24-2013, 09:42 AM
  #230
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Originally Posted by Monctonscout View Post
You seriously want to trade Weber, a 1st and a 3rd for a 3rd liner and a 4th liner, both being under 6' and 200lbs?

That makes no sense on any level. Both guys are solid players, but no way in hell do I send Phillie a 1st rounder in any deal involving them unless one comes back.

The team is struggling, but let's not use a 2 week stretch as a reason to pull off Rejean Houle style trades.
Yes, because those are Houle trades.

Our first is late and the odds of it having any future consequence is slim. If Gallagher is effective in the top six, Read would be as well. He's having a fairly decent year on an awful Flyers squad. Meanwhile, Talbot is as much as a fourth line as Prust. Weber will never amount to anything in this organization nor will that third.

You have to give up something to get "solid players" otherwise why would Philly do us any favors? If we can find better options via other trades or FA, then by all means but we have more than enough picks and prospects that giving up even our first to improve the roster is not going to have a huge bearing.

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04-24-2013, 09:44 AM
  #231
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We need to get Clarkson. He is a lot better than I thought. He is like Hartnell V 2.0. He will get a big payout this summer though.

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04-24-2013, 09:47 AM
  #232
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Originally Posted by 1993 View Post
Sure if we join the no hit no fight league. We don't need more soft players. We need size and grit and players to give more room to our skilled players. If we get Clowe, Clarkson, Bickell and Bieksa and eliminate Gionta, Ryder, DD, and Bourque then we could add Paajarvi.
Bieksa is signed for three more years and apart of the Canucks core. The only way he's getting traded is if Eller goes the other way.

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04-24-2013, 09:47 AM
  #233
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Originally Posted by Monctonscout View Post
Yandle makes little sense for the Habs, he is another offensive d-man, we have tons of those in the pipeline, makes no sense to get a guy like that at what his cost will be. Poor use of assets.

Markov has lost a step, no doubt, but he is not a liability like you are trying to paint him. Losing Emelin hurts his game for sure as he needs a big body to do the heavy moving in the defensive zone. He is still one of the better PMD's and PP QB's around, he just needs more help than 3-4 years ago.

I could see a deal for Seabrook but I'm not sure he is on the market. I think the best option may be a 1 year fix on the UFA market to bridge until Tinordi Beaulieu and Pateryn are NHL ready. No point in trading valuable assets and blocking their path in a year or two.
We're just not saying it the same way, I think.

I agree Yandle may not fill such a big need because of his style, but he could do what Markov used to do but isn't doing anymore, is younger, and will be able to do it for many years. But of course I would prefer a Seabrook since he brings other elements to the table.

And I don't agree with your view on Markov. It's not just his physical ability in front of the net or near the ramps. He can't follow any winger with decent speed anymore.

And no, I don't think a stopgap will suffice. It would take many more years to a youngster to do what Markov used to do. A guy like Beaulieu may be able to do Markov's job on the PP in 2-3 years, but won't be able to play as intelligently as Markov was playing in his own territory for another 3-5 years. D-men take longer to develop a complete game -- see Diaz: beside PK, he's probably the most complete d-man on the team, but he's already 27 years old. And see Markov himself: it took him 5-7 years to become the complete d-man he was before his injuries.

At one point, a team must stop thinking "the guy will be good in 2-3 years". If you allready have youngsters performing, then you need to fill the voids to take the next step. And having a #1.5/#2 d-man short term is one of this void because Habs have nothing in the pipeline to do this job short term.

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04-24-2013, 09:50 AM
  #234
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Originally Posted by Draft View Post
I think that acquiring these type of players is possible through Free Agency. Not that I don't think Read is a good player, we just have too many players like him. Stalberg or Bickell put up very similar point totals plus a physical game.



Are we better suited to acquire a #1.5/#2 or just another top-4? It's not just because of the trade proposals that I think Demers would be a big acquisition. He plays a good defensive and physical game as well as adds offence. Markov is starting to wear out and we need someone to fill his spot, I don't think it's as drastic as needing to acquire a #1.5-#2. Gorges can play the minutes we need him to, depth throughout the defence is more valuable than a really strong top 2. That's just my opinion though.



Our 1st round pick will go a long way in keeping us a competitor in the future. Really hope we don't trade it for vets and players that will only help us short term.



My ideal acquisitions if these trades go through:

Pacioretty-Plekanec-Gionta
Bourque-Eller-Gallagher
Paajarvi-Galchenyuk-Stalberg/Bickell
Sestito-Lapierre-Prust
(Dumont)

Gorges-Subban
Demers-Emelin
Diaz-O'Byrne
(Bouillon)

They would all be fairly cheap, all add size and toughness, all realistic possibilities.
You know that it is next to impossible to make that many changes.

The only guys I would want from your list are O'Byrne ( that should been here already), and Bickell. Add a guy like Bordeleau as our 13th forward, and we are set. Lapierre could be an interesting option. Bourque should be dealt.

You're dreaming if you think that Markov, DD or Moen will disappear like that.

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04-24-2013, 09:52 AM
  #235
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Originally Posted by Richiebottles View Post
We need to get Clarkson. He is a lot better than I thought. He is like Hartnell V 2.0. He will get a big payout this summer though.
I would pay him what he asks. This type of player is hard to find and Habs have nothing like him in the pipeline. The Flyers overpaid a bit to get Hartnell few years ago, and they never regret it.

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04-24-2013, 10:33 AM
  #236
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Originally Posted by Maltese View Post
You know that it is next to impossible to make that many changes.

The only guys I would want from your list are O'Byrne ( that should been here already), and Bickell. Add a guy like Bordeleau as our 13th forward, and we are set. Lapierre could be an interesting option. Bourque should be dealt.

You're dreaming if you think that Markov, DD or Moen will disappear like that.
This was entirely based off a couple of posts before.

Markov + Moen + whatever for Paajarvi

and

Kristo + DD for Demers + Tierney + 2nd.

Both were moderately received on the big board, the Markov one less so. I would most definitely do the trade with the Sharks, awesome trade for both teams, proposed by a Sharks fan. Markov, DD, and Moen do not work with the Habs because we have too many players that play the same style as them. If your team doesn't have a problem with size, do you really think it would take a lot of thinking to decide whether or not you want a 50pt centre? If you need a veteran defenceman that can run the PP and a good bottom 6 player, doesn't it make sense to acquire Markov and Moen? We see all the bad things because we don't require what these players bring to the team, we have other players to fill the need. The fact that they aren't essential to our team does not mean they aren't valued elsewhere.

We need good, young players. Preferably ones that are of decent size and who have good speed. We don't need to get fighters like Clowe or Clarkson or Regehr as long as our players can play the way they need to. If we want fighters, sign them for the 4th line, don't overpay for the next 7 years just because they can play higher on the depth chart. Neither Clowe or Clarkson have great speed, offence, PP, PK, shootout, or defensive skills. They can fight and they can chip in a little offence, that's about it.

Paajarvi and Stalberg are the type of players that play the style this team is based around, fast, two-way hockey. Beating players to the puck, strong forecheck, still reliable defensively. Luckily, because they're bigger, both can play relatively physically, neither get pushed around too much. Players like that would fit in well with our system. Players don't need to fight to be tough to play against.

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Old
04-24-2013, 11:15 AM
  #237
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This was entirely based off a couple of posts before.

Markov + Moen + whatever for Paajarvi

If you need a veteran defenceman that can run the PP and a good bottom 6 player, doesn't it make sense to acquire Markov and Moen?.
As an Oilers fan I think this type of trade could work. I'd hate to give up Paajarvi as he's shown signs of taking that next step this year but a solid veteran on D who can move the puck is exactly what we need. 1 year left on his contract also leaves us options going forward when we will be getting into scary cap territory.

I propsed a trade on our board and am wondering what Montreal fans think of:

Oilers 2013 1st (Drouin still available) for Galchenyuk? I know you think very highly of Galchenyuk (and rightfully so) but would you be willing to part with him for a player like Drouin? I think Drouin would look amazing in a Habs jersey.

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04-24-2013, 11:21 AM
  #238
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Originally Posted by Draft View Post
This was entirely based off a couple of posts before.

Markov + Moen + whatever for Paajarvi

and

Kristo + DD for Demers + Tierney + 2nd.

Both were moderately received on the big board, the Markov one less so. I would most definitely do the trade with the Sharks, awesome trade for both teams, proposed by a Sharks fan. Markov, DD, and Moen do not work with the Habs because we have too many players that play the same style as them. If your team doesn't have a problem with size, do you really think it would take a lot of thinking to decide whether or not you want a 50pt centre? If you need a veteran defenceman that can run the PP and a good bottom 6 player, doesn't it make sense to acquire Markov and Moen? We see all the bad things because we don't require what these players bring to the team, we have other players to fill the need. The fact that they aren't essential to our team does not mean they aren't valued elsewhere.

We need good, young players. Preferably ones that are of decent size and who have good speed. We don't need to get fighters like Clowe or Clarkson or Regehr as long as our players can play the way they need to. If we want fighters, sign them for the 4th line, don't overpay for the next 7 years just because they can play higher on the depth chart. Neither Clowe or Clarkson have great speed, offence, PP, PK, shootout, or defensive skills. They can fight and they can chip in a little offence, that's about it.

Paajarvi and Stalberg are the type of players that play the style this team is based around, fast, two-way hockey. Beating players to the puck, strong forecheck, still reliable defensively. Luckily, because they're bigger, both can play relatively physically, neither get pushed around too much. Players like that would fit in well with our system. Players don't need to fight to be tough to play against.
Demers is a very average d man.

Ifyou can trade Bourque + ??? For Pajarvi or Stalberg, that's fine. But I would prefer Bickell, anytime to play on our third line.

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04-24-2013, 11:22 AM
  #239
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As an Oilers fan I think this type of trade could work. I'd hate to give up Paajarvi as he's shown signs of taking that next step this year but a solid veteran on D who can move the puck is exactly what we need. 1 year left on his contract also leaves us options going forward when we will be getting into scary cap territory.

I propsed a trade on our board and am wondering what Montreal fans think of:

Oilers 2013 1st (Drouin still available) for Galchenyuk? I know you think very highly of Galchenyuk (and rightfully so) but would you be willing to part with him for a player like Drouin? I think Drouin would look amazing in a Habs jersey.
Price for your 1st overall pick + Dubnick ?

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04-24-2013, 11:23 AM
  #240
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Price for your 1st overall pick + Dubnick ?
They're not getting a 1st overall pick for the 5th year in a row.

And it's Dubnyk.

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04-24-2013, 11:27 AM
  #241
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If improving the french canadian members on the team it is essential to get droin in a trade at draft time?If not the team has 5 or 6 good young players who will help team in future years

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04-24-2013, 11:29 AM
  #242
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They're not getting a 1st overall pick for the 5th year in a row.

And it's Dubnyk.
If it's one thing we know how to do it's win the draft lottery (hopefully we kept Tambos lucky tie when we turfed him). Almost a gaurantee our pick is 4,5 or 6 this year. I would do the trade for Price if this is the case.

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04-24-2013, 11:32 AM
  #243
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As an Oilers fan I think this type of trade could work. I'd hate to give up Paajarvi as he's shown signs of taking that next step this year but a solid veteran on D who can move the puck is exactly what we need. 1 year left on his contract also leaves us options going forward when we will be getting into scary cap territory.

I propsed a trade on our board and am wondering what Montreal fans think of:

Oilers 2013 1st (Drouin still available) for Galchenyuk? I know you think very highly of Galchenyuk (and rightfully so) but would you be willing to part with him for a player like Drouin? I think Drouin would look amazing in a Habs jersey.
No chance Galchenyuk is going anywhere. His work ethic + attitude + talent + physical attributes are just too damn exceptional to even consider trading him right now. Even for Drouin, who's less complete as a player, on the smaller side, and less of a proven commodity.

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04-24-2013, 11:35 AM
  #244
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If it's one thing we know how to do it's win the draft lottery (hopefully we kept Tambos lucky tie when we turfed him). Almost a gaurantee our pick is 4,5 or 6 this year. I would do the trade for Price if this is the case.
I know your 1st pick could be between 4th and 6th, but that would be good enough ( + your actual goalie) for me if the Oilers would take Price out of Montreal. It would be good for all parties involved.

If Oilers want to give Pajarvii too, that's fine.

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04-24-2013, 11:37 AM
  #245
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If improving the french canadian members on the team it is essential to get droin in a trade at draft time?If not the team has 5 or 6 good young players who will help team in future years
We aren't getting Drouin. We didn't have an exclusive right to French Canadian talent in the 60's and we definitely don't have one now. If only growing up a Habs fan gave us a right to players, we could have Drouin, Barkov and Crosby next year.

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04-24-2013, 12:24 PM
  #246
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Price for your 1st overall pick + Dubnick ?
Are you ****ing kidding me?

You want to replace Price with Dubnyk?

I guess if you want McDavid.

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Old
04-24-2013, 12:42 PM
  #247
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Are you ****ing kidding me?

You want to replace Price with Dubnyk?

I guess if you want McDavid.
I hope he's kidding or forgot the

If EDM wants Bergy to pick up the phone and ask about Price, he better start the discussion with 1st EDM 13 + RNH/Hall/Eberle or else Bergy hangs up right away..

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04-24-2013, 12:44 PM
  #248
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Originally Posted by WeThreeKings View Post
Are you ****ing kidding me?

You want to replace Price with Dubnyk?

I guess if you want McDavid.
Just check Dubnyk's save percentage this year. Way better than Price. Oliers have no defence, on top of that.


Edmonton 1st pick this year will be as significant as our own last season.

Of course, if Bergevin can get Yakupov, all the better.

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04-24-2013, 12:50 PM
  #249
Habster33
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Maltese View Post
Just check Dubnyk's save percentage this year. Way better than Price. Oliers have no defence, on top of that.


Edmonton 1st pick this year will be as significant as our own last season.

Of course, if Bergevin can get Yakupov, all the better.
Still can believe your comparing Dybnyk with Price..

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04-24-2013, 12:53 PM
  #250
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To moderator the 1993 habs had the most french Canadiens?More than 50's habs or 70's habs.How did Dave Keon end up as a leaf or how did Jean Rateele end up a ranger.So many children on this site.

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