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The Carey Price Discussion Thread (part 2)

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Old
04-24-2013, 10:05 PM
  #751
Mrb1p
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Nice. I believe you
Well, bub. When everything you do is tell everybody how I don't watch enough hockey you have to expect answers like that

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04-24-2013, 10:10 PM
  #752
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So The teams which are unhappy campers with bargain goaltending would be very happy to shell out $7M and become happy campers.

But they would not be happy to trade asset (rumored 2 x 2nd) to acquire a 5 333 333$ one.

i just dont know....the step doesnt seem that big...
I guess you didn't read. Too busy being happy. 43 matters too. It all matters. In degree.

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..or maybe it have something to do with the chance that even if they doesn't do anything, there is a non negligible chance they will become happy with their cheap goalie or the chance that even an high paid goalie with good reputation wont necessary bring them happiness. (Khalibulin, Huet, Bryzgalov).
Exactly. You still have to evaluate. But if you _believe_ you're going to be happy with the expensive option, the price tag rarely fazes. Teams will want Ryan Miller. There are issues with Luongo that complicate his desirability. Teams would want Carey Price too, btw. At $6.5M.
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btw i like all this whole happiness thing, it bring me joy just writing the word.
See, this thread needs more of that!

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Old
04-24-2013, 10:20 PM
  #753
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Originally Posted by E = CH² View Post
You guys don't want to acknowledge it but Palindrom has a really good point. For a team that spends to the cap, money is invested much better in a foward or dman than a goalie.

There are two reasons for this.

#1 Goalie performances fluctuate ridiculously
#2 There are only 30 #1 spots, and there are more and more quality goaltenders. As a result, nearly every team has a goalie that is currently doing very well OR who is a big name and has done well in the past.

Logically, and I'm not saying this is the case, but if there are 30 really good goalies and no phenoms, the team paying the most for their goalie would be at a disadvantage compared to the team that would pay the least considering there wouldn't be much difference between the #30 and the #1.
He would have a point if the Habs had no cap room, but in reality they have $3.3m remaining, if you subtract Drewiske they would have had 3.9ish. More then enough to sign a good dman or forward.

It makes absolutely no sense to have a revolving door for goalies.

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04-24-2013, 10:46 PM
  #754
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He would have a point if the Habs had no cap room, but in reality they have $3.3m remaining, if you subtract Drewiske they would have had 3.9ish. More then enough to sign a good dman or forward.
Which is why I added "for a team that spends to the cap (or works with a budget)". Also, I'll add that the money that you'd save has to be used in some way. It's not because you have 4-5M available that you can necessarily get a player worth that kind of cap hit.

For the habs, I think it wasn't very relevant this season but it could be relevant next season with the lower cap. I just think it's an interesting point.

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It makes absolutely no sense to have a revolving door for goalies.
Why not though? Why is it a problem specifically ?

Because then you don't know what to expect from year to year ? But if you pay top dollar for one guy, it doesn't guarantee results either unless the guy you're paying is Lundqvist. So is that really a good argument ?

And it makes absolutely no sense to have a steady overpaid goalie who isn't playing to his contract either.

Besides, let's not exaggerate. Not wanting to invest 5-6M in your goaltending doesn't mean changing both of your goalies every year. The term revolving door is a bit strong in what it portrays.

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04-24-2013, 10:46 PM
  #755
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Originally Posted by compile View Post
He would have a point if the Habs had no cap room, but in reality they have $3.3m remaining, if you subtract Drewiske they would have had 3.9ish. More then enough to sign a good dman or forward.

It makes absolutely no sense to have a revolving door for goalies.
Consider Kaberle gone this summer as well and we can sign good free agents.

Habs are in a good cap position for now and years to come because it will reasonably go up.

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Originally Posted by E = CH²
Why not though? Why is it a problem specifically ?

Because then you don't know what to expect from year to year ? But if you pay top dollar for one guy, it doesn't guarantee results either unless the guy you're paying is Lundqvist. So is that really a good argument ?

And it makes absolutely no sense to have a steady overpaid goalie who isn't playing to his contract either.

Besides, let's not exaggerate either. Not wanting to invest 5-6M in your goaltending doesn't mean changing both of your goalies every year either. The term revolving door is a bit strong in what it portrays.
It pretty much does. No goalie with potential to be good is going to sign long term for minimal salary. You'll end up with one or two year contract goalies that you end up having to let go once they do good because they'll ask for the moon afterwards (especially in a high profile market like Montreal). The risk of having to constantly throw assets away to find that one good cheap goalie is also non-negligible. Furthermore high salary goalies, like Price, can usually play the vast majority of the season leaving only a few easy games to the backup. Thus the backup is paid minimal salary which is rarely the case when you count on a cheap no1 goaltender as you need a good backup for insurance.

There is another problem with the ''cheap goalie'' system - sometimes its difficult to know who the no1 really is and it does lead to a revolving door, especially in Montreal. Goalie controversies galore. Anyone remember the Huet era?

Anyways have some damn confidence in Price people. He's having problems but nothing he can't fix. Nothing permanent. Trading Price (the very idea makes me chuckle) only makes sense if we have a very strong goalie prospect pool. Sadly we might have the worse in the NHL.


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04-24-2013, 11:31 PM
  #756
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stop the price bashing please.he ll be fine.

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04-24-2013, 11:41 PM
  #757
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Originally Posted by E = CH² View Post
Which is why I added "for a team that spends to the cap (or works with a budget)". Also, I'll add that the money that you'd save has to be used in some way. It's not because you have 4-5M available that you can necessarily get a player worth that kind of cap hit.

For the habs, I think it wasn't very relevant this season but it could be relevant next season with the lower cap. I just think it's an interesting point.



Why not though? Why is it a problem specifically ?

Because then you don't know what to expect from year to year ? But if you pay top dollar for one guy, it doesn't guarantee results either unless the guy you're paying is Lundqvist. So is that really a good argument ?

And it makes absolutely no sense to have a steady overpaid goalie who isn't playing to his contract either.

Besides, let's not exaggerate. Not wanting to invest 5-6M in your goaltending doesn't mean changing both of your goalies every year. The term revolving door is a bit strong in what it portrays.
What did Lundqvist accomplish?

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04-24-2013, 11:45 PM
  #758
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Originally Posted by FlyingKostitsyn View Post

Goalie controversies galore. Anyone remember the Huet era?
Yes, i remember having a season of 104 points, 3th in the NHL in 2007-2008 with Huet and Price sharing starting duty, We was eliminated in the second round of the playoff.

what was so wrong with this controversies?

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04-25-2013, 12:41 AM
  #759
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Originally Posted by FlyingKostitsyn View Post
Aaaaaand Palindrom returns with the same old arguments. I swear I should keep a text file with all the arguments against around.

He was laying in ambush waiting for Price to have a bad sequence. We sure won't hear about all of that stuff when Price leads us to playoff wins.



And there is at least one massively overpaid forward or defensemen on nearly every NHL roster. Is there a difference?
actually, there's a huge difference... your 6Mil+ goalie pretty much guarantees you a career backup on the cheap side ala Budaj, someone not good enough to be a starter (not even an average one), meaning that if there's ONE player not living up to his potential/salary, namely the #1 G, your season is done and over with.

While if you have ONE forward having a sucky season, there's 11 others who can contribute and help the team win. Same for D, ONE having a bad season is manageable as others can help out and you can change his "role" and icetime.

And you can even adjust your system based on who's performing and who's not. Can't adjust to a goalie making or not making saves.


And huh, forget about Theodore or Vokoun for a moment, think more Anderson (Bishop also), Niemi and the likes, capable goalies who have proven to be good enough to be #1 on good teams. Well these goalie average 4Mil per year...

the two or three millions saved, for a team able to spend to the limit means two or three millions more on D or F corp...

example (even salaries or close) : you'd prefer 1. Price and Gorges or 2. Anderson and Karlsson ?

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04-25-2013, 02:10 AM
  #760
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Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
actually, there's a huge difference... your 6Mil+ goalie pretty much guarantees you a career backup on the cheap side ala Budaj, someone not good enough to be a starter (not even an average one), meaning that if there's ONE player not living up to his potential/salary, namely the #1 G, your season is done and over with.
But then you need an expensive backup, that will want more games. The first one who's contract is up is going to leave asking for more money. Its not a long term solution.

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Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
While if you have ONE forward having a sucky season, there's 11 others who can contribute and help the team win. Same for D, ONE having a bad season is manageable as others can help out and you can change his "role" and icetime.
The goaltender is like any star player. Say Subban begins to ''suck'', are we going to make the playoffs next year?

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And you can even adjust your system based on who's performing and who's not. Can't adjust to a goalie making or not making saves.
Of course, but I doubt Price is suddenly going to become an ECHL goaltender. Moot point imho, at ''worse'' he'll have a season like he had this year, which is still sufficient enough for us to finish 2nd or 4th in the East. Sure he's been quite bad lately but that could happen to anyone on a short lapse of time. You seem to assume the expensive goaltender is more likely to have a down year than the cheap one. The risks are the same, in fact the more expensive one having a down year is less likely since usually more proven and/or displaying sufficiently superior athletic&technical abilities that people consider them to be of elite stock.

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Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
And huh, forget about Theodore or Vokoun for a moment, think more Anderson (Bishop also), Niemi and the likes, capable goalies who have proven to be good enough to be #1 on good teams. Well these goalie average 4Mil per year...
But then you need another 3mil to get a backup goalie to support them (which does not make it cheaper, in the end0. Or maybe the goalie you acquire turns out sucking, which is even worse.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ECWHSWI
example (even salaries or close) : you'd prefer 1. Price and Gorges or 2. Anderson and Karlsson ?
Its a false dichotomy. We don't have such a choice to make because we don't have Karlsson or equivalent players waiting to join us and we are not using all our cap space.

What would you prefer? Price and Gorges or Anderson (or equivalent) and Gorges? Ask the Sens board if they would refuse a Price for Anderson trade, straight up!

3mil in cap space is nothing. Its not even Kaberle. Its not even Bourque. Its not even Gionta. We can let go of a lot of dead weight before having to downgrade our goaltending if somehow we stock up on star players. There is no urgency to save 2-3mil in cap space whatsoever and we don't get better players automatically if we do it, we still need to acquire them and that is the hard part by far.


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04-25-2013, 03:53 AM
  #761
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Originally Posted by FlyingKostitsyn View Post
But then you need an expensive backup, that will want more games. The first one who's contract is up is going to leave asking for more money. Its not a long term solution.
our goalie tandem is costing us 8 Mil a year, pretty sure if your starter were to make around 4 Mil, an upgrade on backup wouldnt cost you another 4 Mil

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The goaltender is like any star player. Say Subban begins to ''suck'', are we going to make the playoffs next year?
that's the thing, P.K. could have an off year and we could manage to make it still, now, let's say Price is injured or suck, any chance we make the P.O. ? awnser is NO. (I mean, Price is bad right now, do we look like a P.O. team?)

It's also not as any other star, simply because you can have more than one star on D or F while you cannot have two star goalie (well, technically you can but, 14 Mil on goalie ? you know)



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Of course, but I doubt Price is suddenly going to become an ECHL goaltender. Moot point imho, at ''worse'' he'll have a season like he had this year, which is still sufficient enough for us to finish 2nd or 4th in the East. Sure he's been quite bad lately but that could happen to anyone on a short lapse of time. You seem to assume the expensive goaltender is more likely to have a down year than the cheap one. The risks are the same, in fact the more expensive one having a down year is less likely since usually more proven and/or displaying sufficiently superior athletic&technical abilities that people consider them to be of elite stock.
doesnt matter actually, besides, I doubt Price would ever regress that much, but it's not important.

So, what you're saying is, at worst Price will be average and will still be good enough for us to finish top 4 in the East ? god damn! why are we spending so much on goaltending if an average goalie is sufficient enough for us to finish top 4 ? seriously ? why ?

(and it's not a knock on Price by the way, Q would still be relevant if our goalie was Lundqvist or Rinne)

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Originally Posted by FlyingKostitsyn View Post
But then you need another 3mil to get a backup goalie to support them (which does not make it cheaper, in the end0. Or maybe the goalie you acquire turns out sucking, which is even worse.
every 4 Mil goalie who are doing just fine are backed up by (relatively) cheap goalies, none of those are making close to 3 Mil...


that we never know, we could have our D playing like AHLers, have tons of injuries, players no clicking, there's always a risk, no matter what.

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Originally Posted by FlyingKostitsyn View Post
Its a false dichotomy. We don't have such a choice to make because we don't have Karlsson or equivalent players waiting to join us and we are not using all our cap space.

What would you prefer? Price and Gorges or Anderson (or equivalent) and Gorges? Ask the Sens board if they would refuse a Price for Anderson trade, straight up!
It was just an example, if the Org had his mind set in not needing a superstar calibre (potentially) goalie, chances are Price is not drafted by us #5, for all we know Habs end up picking up Quick (72th that year) as a goalie prospect, and a very good forward or d prospect with our #5.


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Originally Posted by FlyingKostitsyn View Post
3mil in cap space is nothing. Its not even Kaberle. Its not even Bourque. Its not even Gionta. We can let go of a lot of dead weight before having to downgrade our goaltending if somehow we stock up on star players. There is no urgency to save 2-3mil in cap space whatsoever and we don't get better players automatically if we do it, we still need to acquire them and that is the hard part by far.
3 Mil is the difference in salary between Kaberle and JayBo
3 Mil is the difference in salary between Bourque and H. Sedin
3 Mil is the difference in salary between Gionta and Rick Nash

3 Mil is a LOT of money for a good GM.


That's a given, but having a GM who can deliver, no matter the philosophy used is a necessity anyway.


Last edited by ECWHSWI: 04-25-2013 at 04:22 AM.
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04-25-2013, 04:23 AM
  #762
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stop the price bashing please.he ll be fine.
Stop trying, montreal have had some of the best goalies in nhl history, but habs fans can never seem to respect them. Or begin to understand the position of goaltending and what it entails. A shame really, it's no wonder why price asked for 6.5m.

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04-25-2013, 04:41 AM
  #763
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I haven't seen too many occasions to "point the finger" at Price, so to speak, but there really is only so much you can do to dress up being ranked 52nd in SV% and 40th in GAA on a playoff team with home advantage. Interesting that Quick is having almost the same season over in L.A., though (in terms of improving in the standings - making the playoffs with home advantage, even - despite dramatic dips in goaltending stats compared to '11/12).

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04-25-2013, 06:07 AM
  #764
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Stop trying, montreal have had some of the best goalies in nhl history, but habs fans can never seem to respect them. Or begin to understand the position of goaltending and what it entails. A shame really, it's no wonder why price asked for 6.5m.
Is it your way of saying he isnt worth 6.5 ?

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04-25-2013, 06:32 AM
  #765
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Well, bub. When everything you do is tell everybody how I don't watch enough hockey you have to expect answers like that
Well bub, I never said you didn't watch hockey. I said its obvious your oblivious to what is going on in TO. They have a negative shot differential of 5-6 shots, meaning on average over the season they are getting outplayed, their goaltending has been their single largest reason for their success.

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04-25-2013, 06:49 AM
  #766
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So you're saying that aside from the 3 goals last night that the Habs had no defensive break-downs? That Price did not save them multiple times throughout the night despite their horrid defensive stats?

I'm sorry to break it to you. But Hockey is a team game, much more than any other sport (save Running Back plays in the NFL). If the defense is constantly giving up grade A chances, the goalie can't stop them all.

If you're expecting miracles, you're going to hate every goalie we're ever going to have.
The defensive breakdowns came over the last few games. Price was not all that special before that either. The D has been "horrid" but so has the goaltender. You don't see anyone blaming the goalie for the defensive struggles. Why are you and others blaming the D for all of Price's struggles? The guy has been letting in a lot of goals that should be routine saves.

And don't get smart with me. Hockey is a team game but the goalie is required to make a key save or two...and if that goalie is paid as an elite goalie, he needs to be elite. You expect more from certain players...

If Price wasn't so babied by the organization and fans alike maybe he would be a better goalie. There's always an excuse

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04-25-2013, 06:53 AM
  #767
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Quick question...

When Price on his entry level deal...were your expectations any lower

His salary is really irrelevent in this conversation.

Price just has to be better, not because he now makes 6.25M/yr...but because this team needs him to be on form to have any chance at making any damage in the playoffs
In a salary cap world it is very relevant. And yes, on his entry level deal my expectations were lower.

Every team needs their goalie to be on form to have a chance at doing any damage in the playoffs. Price is supposed to be our star (he's paid like one too). He needs to play like that...especially in the playoffs. You do not do any damage in the playoffs with poor goaltending.

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04-25-2013, 08:42 AM
  #768
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In a salary cap world it is very relevant. And yes, on his entry level deal my expectations were lower.

Every team needs their goalie to be on form to have a chance at doing any damage in the playoffs. Price is supposed to be our star (he's paid like one too). He needs to play like that...especially in the playoffs. You do not do any damage in the playoffs with poor goaltending.
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04-25-2013, 08:59 AM
  #769
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The defensive breakdowns came over the last few games. Price was not all that special before that either. The D has been "horrid" but so has the goaltender. You don't see anyone blaming the goalie for the defensive struggles. Why are you and others blaming the D for all of Price's struggles? The guy has been letting in a lot of goals that should be routine saves.

And don't get smart with me. Hockey is a team game but the goalie is required to make a key save or two...and if that goalie is paid as an elite goalie, he needs to be elite. You expect more from certain players...

If Price wasn't so babied by the organization and fans alike maybe he would be a better goalie. There's always an excuse
That had to be the dumbest comment I've ever read. A defenseman doesn't rely on a goaltender. A goaltender is at the mercy of his defense. Do you have any understanding of the game? Just stop talking.

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04-25-2013, 09:03 AM
  #770
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Originally Posted by hockeyfan2k11 View Post
The defensive breakdowns came over the last few games. Price was not all that special before that either. The D has been "horrid" but so has the goaltender. You don't see anyone blaming the goalie for the defensive struggles. Why are you and others blaming the D for all of Price's struggles? The guy has been letting in a lot of goals that should be routine saves.

And don't get smart with me. Hockey is a team game but the goalie is required to make a key save or two...and if that goalie is paid as an elite goalie, he needs to be elite. You expect more from certain players...

If Price wasn't so babied by the organization and fans alike maybe he would be a better goalie. There's always an excuse
I havent been blaming the D for all of his struggles. It's clear the guy is having a rough stretch which isnt uncommon for any athlete in any sport, elite or not. However, normally when you have your franchise goalie struggling like that, the team should be working extra hard to ensure not so many breakdowns are happening to help him out, which is the opposite as we're seeing porous defence as the norm.

You seem to be mistaking me for someone else because I am always honest when Price lets in a bad goal. I don't make excuses for anyone in my position, if you let in a bad goal, if I let in a bad goal for my team, I call it as it is. You, however, are ignoring the fact that Price is coming up with some big saves on the breakdowns then ignore them saying he isnt making a big save. He's made plenty but you can't stop them all, no one can.

And how is Price babied by the fans? For **** sakes, the guy got booed like Roy during a play-off series we got swept by the Bruins without half our team. He got booed in the teams first pre season game after Halak. There's articles being written about how he's not Roy, the best goalie in the history of the NHL.. but yeah, we're coddling him.

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04-25-2013, 09:24 AM
  #771
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The defensive breakdowns came over the last few games. Price was not all that special before that either. The D has been "horrid" but so has the goaltender. You don't see anyone blaming the goalie for the defensive struggles. Why are you and others blaming the D for all of Price's struggles? The guy has been letting in a lot of goals that should be routine saves.

And don't get smart with me. Hockey is a team game but the goalie is required to make a key save or two...and if that goalie is paid as an elite goalie, he needs to be elite. You expect more from certain players...

If Price wasn't so babied by the organization and fans alike maybe he would be a better goalie. There's always an excuse
Honestly one of the dumbest comments made... If you can't see how the goalie's performance over a long stretch is directly influenced by the play of his defence, then I think you need to sit down and go back to playing NHL 13 gm mode... Seriously, "don't see the defense blaming the goalie for they're bad play".....that's just plain retarded.

Lets be honest here people, this is a hockey message board full of nobodies who have the most knees jerk reactions in the world. Ever play a fantasy hockey league? Ever play nhl 13? That's what this is.... Unrealistic trades, stupid analysis, stat watching, etc.. There's a reason so many trades happen in a videogame or fantasy league compared to real life... So many people here don't know their ass from their elbow, and they all think they can do a better job, coaching/managing, or even playing...

Just go look at the trade proposal section on HF, one bad game and the player is up there. It's ridiculous. I wouldn't be surprised to see Crosby up there if ever he has a bad playoff run and gets swept in 4... You don't trade franchise players. So get your heads out of your ***** and let the hockey people do their jobs, while you do yours (considering you have one).

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04-25-2013, 09:29 AM
  #772
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Originally Posted by compile View Post
Detroit Red Wings say hi.
When is the last time Detroit went anywhere in the playoffs despite "poor" goaltending? I'm not a huge Osgood fan by any stretch, but when they made the Final in '08/09 Osgood's stat line was 2.00 GAA, 0.926 SV%. They won the Cup in the previous year with him posting 1.55 GAA, 0.930 SV%. When they got ousted in the Conference Final the year before that, Hasek put up a 1.79 GAA, 0.923 SV%. Etc, etc.

On that statistical note, I think the trend in Price's results leading up to the playoffs is more concerning than anything else:

January: 5 GP, 1.98 GAA, 0.925 SV%
February: 11 GP, 1.87 GAA, 0.924 SV%
March: 12 GP, 2.81 GAA, 0.903 SV%
April: 10 GP, 3.67 GAA, 0.872 SV%

It was fun to believe that Price would turn out to be some invincible workhorse, who wouldn't be affected by things like workload and compressed schedules, but it still doesn't quite seem to be the case.

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04-25-2013, 09:30 AM
  #773
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And I think the most annoying comments made are the ones saying Price doesn't make the big saves.... He does... A lot... But the scoring chances also happen... A whole lot... So they're gonna go in. People have goldfish memory, they watch a game where price lets in 3 goals, but plays real solid... A week later they look back at the scoresheet and say, he let in 3 goals that game, Unnacceptable for an elite goalie!! Even though during that same game, everyone could have agreed he play as good as humanly possible, made the big saves, but defence left him hanging....

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04-25-2013, 09:33 AM
  #774
hockeyfan2k11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MTLSandman View Post
Honestly one of the dumbest comments made... If you can't see how the goalie's performance over a long stretch is directly influenced by the play of his defence, then I think you need to sit down and go back to playing NHL 13 gm mode... Seriously, "don't see the defense blaming the goalie for they're bad play".....that's just plain retarded.

Lets be honest here people, this is a hockey message board full of nobodies who have the most knees jerk reactions in the world. Ever play a fantasy hockey league? Ever play nhl 13? That's what this is.... Unrealistic trades, stupid analysis, stat watching, etc.. There's a reason so many trades happen in a videogame or fantasy league compared to real life... So many people here don't know their ass from their elbow, and they all think they can do a better job, coaching/managing, or even playing...

Just go look at the trade proposal section on HF, one bad game and the player is up there. It's ridiculous. I wouldn't be surprised to see Crosby up there if ever he has a bad playoff run and gets swept in 4... You don't trade franchise players. So get your heads out of your ***** and let the hockey people do their jobs, while you do yours (considering you have one).
Price has been very inconsistent his ENTIRE CAREER. I'm not talking about this stupid stretch. He has had issues focusing his whole career. Don't call someone dumb when you have no bloody clue what you're talking about. Actual unbiased analysis is sorely lacking here.

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04-25-2013, 09:50 AM
  #775
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfan2k11 View Post
Price has been very inconsistent his ENTIRE CAREER. I'm not talking about this stupid stretch. He has had issues focusing his whole career. Don't call someone dumb when you have no bloody clue what you're talking about. Actual unbiased analysis is sorely lacking here.
You're damn right it is. I think it escapes you that his entire career has begun 2-3 seasons earlier than it does for most goaltenders. You don't see a lot of goalie prospects break into the league without spending an entire year in the AHL. I think he should have, but he didn't, we can't go back in time.

Of course he has been inconsistent over his entire career. He's been a young goalie playing in the toughest goalie market in the league the entire time. Since Halak left he has been consistent, he was dominant the first season after and the second season he was one of the lone bright spots on a team that finished 15th. This year, he has been solid but unspectacular before this stretch. He's now trying to get out of the funk that he is in and the team isn't doing anything to help, not even doctoring their philosophy to get their defensive game straightened away before the play-offs.

You want to have a debate with me about any other aspect of hockey, sure, let's have it. You're not going to out-duel me on the topic of goaltending. It's just not going to happen. There's so much more to goaltending then stats and if you used your eye then you'd probably see that. Unfortunately, you don't see that. All the big saves on breakdowns in the Philly, Devils and Tampa games but you will ignore those to push your agenda that he doesn't make the big saves. When, he has.. he let in a goal against the Devils which was a stylistic error which I believe will be changed in the off-season. That's the only goal you can fault him on. However, I'm sure you'd come up with some ridiculous idea in your head as to why Price should have stopped the Elias break-away or the Sullivan high slot tip.

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