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Even With New Player Safety Efforts, Discipline In The NHL Is Still A Huge Joke

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Old
04-24-2013, 09:49 PM
  #1
FrozenRoyalty
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Even With New Player Safety Efforts, Discipline In The NHL Is Still A Huge Joke

Even With New Player Safety Efforts, Discipline In The NHL Is Still A Huge Joke

The Dustin Brown suspension just illustrates how broken the NHL supplementary discipline system really is, and that applies regardless of what one might think of the decision in this case.

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04-24-2013, 11:25 PM
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04-25-2013, 10:39 AM
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etherialone
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Aside from the content which as usual I think is great this article is very well written. Thanks for writing it as always they are appreciated.

As to the content its sad that this is what the NHL has become. I remember back in the day when Tiger butt ended someone (the old let your hand slip down your stick as you went into the corner with someone schtik) and I believe the commish was the Eagle said something to the effect of if you butt end someone your gonna sit your butt down for a week, maybe more. It seemed to have the desired result.

Now people can run around and deliberately throw an intentional elbow that takes a player out for weeks and end up with a one or two game suspension and then DB gets two games for an errant elbow.

Its just such a sham and happens on such a random bullcrap basis. Shany and co spin the wheel and whatever it lands on is what they do. So sadly inconsistent.

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04-25-2013, 03:02 PM
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Not really sure what the point of that article is.

Shanahan never mentions social media or that the hit was "dirty", so all of that is irrelevant when it comes to how the NHL hands out discipline. It's not the NHL's fault that the internet is full of tools.

He does however mention that Pominville did NOT "put himself in a vulnerable position immediately prior to or simultaneously with the hit" so clearly he was addressing rule 48.1. Bottom like is you can't lead with an elbow straight to someone's face, just like you have to be in control of your stick at all times and can't whack someone in the head with it, accidentally or otherwise. Does anyone really think that's a bad stance to have?

Honestly, that we keep complaining about it makes us look bad as fans. It was a careless (not dirty) play by Brown, and he got suspended for a couple games. We should just accept it and move on.

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04-25-2013, 03:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bandit View Post
Not really sure what the point of that article is.

Shanahan never mentions social media or that the hit was "dirty", so all of that is irrelevant when it comes to how the NHL hands out discipline. It's not the NHL's fault that the internet is full of tools.

He does however mention that Pominville did NOT "put himself in a vulnerable position immediately prior to or simultaneously with the hit" so clearly he was addressing rule 48.1. Bottom like is you can't lead with an elbow straight to someone's face, just like you have to be in control of your stick at all times and can't whack someone in the head with it, accidentally or otherwise. Does anyone really think that's a bad stance to have?

Honestly, that we keep complaining about it makes us look bad as fans. It was a careless (not dirty) play by Brown, and he got suspended for a couple games. We should just accept it and move on.
He might not have mentioned it but you almost must figure what happens in social media affects what is done. Because that is just human nature. I remember seeing a video of how Shanahan does things. And he sends out a text to all the members to look at something and then respond back to him. Well if there are many within twitter that are within the media calling said hit dirty. It is going to have an affect on how you view said play.

And I don't think he lead with the elbow. He was making what would be a normal follow through of a hit but because of how JP was it hit his face square and the shoulder didn't make contact. His timing was off. But if JP had been upright going for a hit I think his shoulder would have hit his chest and the arm coming out on the follow through would have knocked him on his ass.

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04-25-2013, 04:12 PM
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KINGS17
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Gann FTW

As someone commenting on the article pointed out. Brown's intent and subsequent suspension is a joke when compared to the intent of the Smith slash on Brown in last year's playoffs.

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04-25-2013, 04:43 PM
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The league got what it wanted....Brown on the repeat offender list.

The League had just been waiting for a close enough hit to happen.

Well it did....

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04-25-2013, 05:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bandit View Post
Not really sure what the point of that article is.

Shanahan never mentions social media or that the hit was "dirty", so all of that is irrelevant when it comes to how the NHL hands out discipline. It's not the NHL's fault that the internet is full of tools.

He does however mention that Pominville did NOT "put himself in a vulnerable position immediately prior to or simultaneously with the hit" so clearly he was addressing rule 48.1. Bottom like is you can't lead with an elbow straight to someone's face, just like you have to be in control of your stick at all times and can't whack someone in the head with it, accidentally or otherwise. Does anyone really think that's a bad stance to have?

Honestly, that we keep complaining about it makes us look bad as fans. It was a careless (not dirty) play by Brown, and he got suspended for a couple games. We should just accept it and move on.
Did Dustin "lead" with his elbow though? Brown like any other player on the ice is entitled to occupy his current position and that is why this was a totally bullpuckey call. Had Brown raised his elbow and targeted JP's head then sure, no troubles at all on the suspension.

As it sits Brown was playing the puck and not leading with his elbow. He should have dropped it but that is a secondary issue.

Either way the fact that this situation is being discusses and criticized by several people around the hockey world is only a good thing. It can only help to establish the manner in which these sort of situations are handled and of course continue to put at least some pressure on the infractions committee to at least show some reasonable cause for their actions.

They are one of the biggest jokes in professional sports as they sit today.

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04-25-2013, 05:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tsanuri View Post
He might not have mentioned it but you almost must figure what happens in social media affects what is done. Because that is just human nature. I remember seeing a video of how Shanahan does things. And he sends out a text to all the members to look at something and then respond back to him. Well if there are many within twitter that are within the media calling said hit dirty. It is going to have an affect on how you view said play.
Well, you always hope that people in positions of authority do not let the opinions of others affect their judgement. Can it happen? Sure.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tsanuri
And I don't think he lead with the elbow. He was making what would be a normal follow through of a hit but because of how JP was it hit his face square and the shoulder didn't make contact. His timing was off. But if JP had been upright going for a hit I think his shoulder would have hit his chest and the arm coming out on the follow through would have knocked him on his ass.
I don't disagree with you that had Pominville been skating more upright then the outcome would have been different, but you could say that about anything. "If x had been slightly different then y would have been a, not z".

Also, Brown's elbow was the first thing that hit Pominville. In one of the angles you see Brown swing his arm, elbow out, at the guy. If that's not leading with it, I don't know what is. I don't think that anyone really disputes that the right way to hit someone is with your elbows tucked in, do they? If Brown's shoulder had been what hit Pom, I don't think he would have even had a hearing, let alone a suspension.

Quote:
Originally Posted by damacles1156 View Post
The league got what it wanted....Brown on the repeat offender list.

The League had just been waiting for a close enough hit to happen.

Well it did....
You honestly believe the league has been out to get Brown? Why?

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04-25-2013, 05:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bandit View Post
Not really sure what the point of that article is.

Shanahan never mentions social media or that the hit was "dirty", so all of that is irrelevant when it comes to how the NHL hands out discipline. It's not the NHL's fault that the internet is full of tools.


He does however mention that Pominville did NOT "put himself in a vulnerable position immediately prior to or simultaneously with the hit" so clearly he was addressing rule 48.1. Bottom like is you can't lead with an elbow straight to someone's face, just like you have to be in control of your stick at all times and can't whack someone in the head with it, accidentally or otherwise. Does anyone really think that's a bad stance to have?


Honestly, that we keep complaining about it makes us look bad as fans. It was a careless (not dirty) play by Brown, and he got suspended for a couple games. We should just accept it and move on.
The point Shanahan makes that Pom-egranate did not put himself in a vulnerable position is not supported by the video evidence. If you look and Pom's leg angle and skates it is clearly showing that he is doing one of the following: trying to Stop or trying to slide into Brown (or trying to slide into home )
I would instead direct people's attention to Pom's snow he's directing to Brown. I don't know a lot about skating but i would wager Pom was trying to stop. Brown was obviously going to counter check from his posture waaaaay before Pom-egranate decided to change his direction. I would propose that Pom changed did in fact change his angle of "attack" and made himself vulnerable to the counter check.

Go ahead and flame me for only viewing the evidence and trying to make sense of why in the world Pom's feet are at Brown's planted foot before contact is made.

I'm not arguing "class", "dirtyness" or the fact Brown used his elbow (which he did). I'm only trying to point out Pom did in fact make himself vulnerable because his angle of "attack" as supported by his leg angle.

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04-25-2013, 07:25 PM
  #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KINGS17 View Post
Gann FTW

As someone commenting on the article pointed out. Brown's intent and subsequent suspension is a joke when compared to the intent of the Smith slash on Brown in last year's playoffs.
That was one of the points of the story, even though I didn't mention specific incidents.

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04-25-2013, 07:35 PM
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I'm not against the Brown ruling but I am shocked in how Shanny has handled things. There is rarely any sense to any of his rulings.

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04-25-2013, 09:54 PM
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I don't necessarily think that the reasoning behind the ruling was illogical or wrong so much as I think that, taken alongside all the other suspensions and non-suspensions that have happened, it's misguided and ineffectual.

The goal SHOULD be to discourage blatantly dangerous behavior (like Del Zotto whipping around elbow-first) and punish players whose intent was malicious (like Mike Smith's 2-handed hack job). Instead, suspensions seem to be based only on how "bad" it looked and whether the player was injured which, IMO, are both collateral to the real point of disciplinary action. If someone shoots at you and misses they still go to jail. If someone drops a bucket of bananas on the sidewalk and you slip and get a concussion, they're not liable for anything because there was no intent regardless of your injury and their role in it.

In other words, players should be punished for what they DID, not for what they CAUSED. Even aside from the frustrating inconsistency, this is why I think that the league's disciplinary body is misguided. Punishment should come as the result of actions by players and an action is good or bad of its own merit, not because of what happens as a result of it.

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04-26-2013, 12:04 AM
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Originally Posted by KingsCorona View Post
I don't necessarily think that the reasoning behind the ruling was illogical or wrong so much as I think that, taken alongside all the other suspensions and non-suspensions that have happened, it's misguided and ineffectual.

The goal SHOULD be to discourage blatantly dangerous behavior (like Del Zotto whipping around elbow-first) and punish players whose intent was malicious (like Mike Smith's 2-handed hack job). Instead, suspensions seem to be based only on how "bad" it looked and whether the player was injured which, IMO, are both collateral to the real point of disciplinary action. If someone shoots at you and misses they still go to jail. If someone drops a bucket of bananas on the sidewalk and you slip and get a concussion, they're not liable for anything because there was no intent regardless of your injury and their role in it.

In other words, players should be punished for what they DID, not for what they CAUSED. Even aside from the frustrating inconsistency, this is why I think that the league's disciplinary body is misguided. Punishment should come as the result of actions by players and an action is good or bad of its own merit, not because of what happens as a result of it.
I think I said that. :-)

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04-26-2013, 01:08 AM
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The fonts on that site are too small! TURN IT UP!

Isn't there something upside down when you are writing a blog complaining about social media?

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04-26-2013, 05:18 PM
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The discipline system runs secondary to the NHLs agenda.

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