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2012 & 2013 NASCAR Sprint Cup, Nationwide Series & Camping World Truck Series Thread

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Old
04-23-2013, 07:44 PM
  #901
Fixed to Ruin
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Montoya will be driving the #42 Depend Chevrolet at Richmond


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04-23-2013, 07:54 PM
  #902
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He has had Huggies as a sponsor before.

Depend is a lot different though.


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04-24-2013, 07:08 AM
  #903
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Originally Posted by Classified View Post
Eh? Brad won 5 races last year, Gordon won 2 - one was rained out and the other was the race at Homestead, not the most competitive of the year.

Brad has only run like 200 races in his career, so comparing the 24 cars wins vs Brad is unfair.
Compare them at the same age. Gordon was about to win his 4th championship and already had a season with 13 wins. Championships were also tougher, you had to win AND be consistent over 36 races.

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04-24-2013, 02:32 PM
  #904
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So i guess when 1 of 8 connector rods is 3 grams underweight it means that you are the worst person in the world.

Unless you are with Hendrick Motorsports

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04-24-2013, 03:07 PM
  #905
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Rules are rules and I understand the need for some penalty. But 3 grams on one rod only makes it pretty obvious it was nothing more than an oversight with no benefit gained and no intent to gain an unfair advantage. A simple fine would have sufficed.

It's common knowledge that the engines come direct from the manufacturer and the crews install them without rebuilding them. Common sense would also tell you they didn't rebuild this one to save 3 grams. The suspensions and points penalties are a joke. All nascar has done is show their inconsistent at handing out discipline and setting themselves up for the next infraction that is intentional and more serious than 3 grams.

What a bunch of morons.

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04-24-2013, 04:42 PM
  #906
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Originally Posted by Eddie Shack View Post
Rules are rules and I understand the need for some penalty. But 3 grams on one rod only makes it pretty obvious it was nothing more than an oversight with no benefit gained and no intent to gain an unfair advantage. A simple fine would have sufficed.

It's common knowledge that the engines come direct from the manufacturer and the crews install them without rebuilding them. Common sense would also tell you they didn't rebuild this one to save 3 grams. The suspensions and points penalties are a joke. All nascar has done is show their inconsistent at handing out discipline and setting themselves up for the next infraction that is intentional and more serious than 3 grams.

What a bunch of morons.
It is the responsibility of the team. If you don't want problems like this, manufacture the engines in house.

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04-24-2013, 04:48 PM
  #907
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It is the responsibility of the team. If you don't want problems like this, manufacture the engines in house.
Agreed. Did you miss my first sentence? I said they were due a penalty. I just explained why the penalty did not fit the crime.

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04-24-2013, 07:18 PM
  #908
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Originally Posted by Eddie Shack View Post
Agreed. Did you miss my first sentence? I said they were due a penalty. I just explained why the penalty did not fit the crime.
Yes, I read your first sentence, but the bolded part makes it sound like you don't think the team is at fault for this.

The penalty is up for debate, as they all are, but their engine was illegal and it doesn't matter by how much.

As forgiving as NASCAR is sometimes with suspension and body penalties, and I don't think they should be, they don't screw around when something is found illegal in the engine compartment.

Anyways, I'm guessing someone at TRD is probably going to be out of a job.

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04-24-2013, 07:34 PM
  #909
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Good. No room in the sport for cheaters. Kudos for taking the 3 bonus points away too.

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04-24-2013, 07:58 PM
  #910
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Originally Posted by Smoke View Post
Yes, I read your first sentence, but the bolded part makes it sound like you don't think the team is at fault for this.

The penalty is up for debate, as they all are, but their engine was illegal and it doesn't matter by how much.

As forgiving as NASCAR is sometimes with suspension and body penalties, and I don't think they should be, they don't screw around when something is found illegal in the engine compartment.

Anyways, I'm guessing someone at TRD is probably going to be out of a job.
No, if I thought they weren't at fault I would have said that. They do deserve a penalty as I said. The question is what kind of penalty.

I was only trying to make the point that if they were intentionally trying to cheat they would have had to tear down an engine they didn't build. And if they were going to do that it wouldn't be to only shave 3 grams. The point therefore being that this truly was not a blatant attempt to circumvent the rules but really just an accident.

If you penalize a team that bad for an obvious accidental violation that in no way shape or form helped them win and in no way shape or form could be shown to be intentional, then what are you going to do to the team that gets caught really trying to cheat? That's my point/question. nascar has painted themselves into a box which is only going to cause them more grief at a later date. Is that not obvious?

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04-24-2013, 08:15 PM
  #911
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Does anyone know a good NASCAR message board? I can't seem to find a good active community that discusses NASCAR, is there one out there?

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04-25-2013, 12:32 AM
  #912
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zanzibar View Post
Does anyone know a good NASCAR message board? I can't seem to find a good active community that discusses NASCAR, is there one out there?
THIS IS THE BEST you're going to find, Zanzibar, a lot of those message boards have been neutralized or been discouraged just like most sites today....

and Eddie, how do we know the Engine was illegal if it wasn't found during the initial post race inspection, so who oversees the R & D inspections once those parts are confiscated, and how do we know NASCAR Inspectors themselves didn't intentionally do something between the Kansas post race initial inspection and now. Wouldn't they have noticed that by the time the 20 team arrived in Kansas.

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04-25-2013, 12:57 AM
  #913
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and Eddie, how do we know the Engine was illegal if it wasn't found during the initial post race inspection, so who oversees the R & D inspections once those parts are confiscated, and how do we know NASCAR Inspectors themselves didn't intentionally do something between the Kansas post race initial inspection and now. Wouldn't they have noticed that by the time the 20 team arrived in Kansas.
Your asking the wrong guy. I'm not defending nascar on this. But I guess the mystery deepens. Maybe Joe Gibbs should be asking them that.

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04-25-2013, 06:32 AM
  #914
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eddie Shack View Post
If you penalize a team that bad for an obvious accidental violation that in no way shape or form helped them win and in no way shape or form could be shown to be intentional, then what are you going to do to the team that gets caught really trying to cheat? That's my point/question. nascar has painted themselves into a box which is only going to cause them more grief at a later date. Is that not obvious?
Agreed. This penalty is an absolute farce. 3 grams is about the weight of 3 drops of water. I know everything in auto racing is measured down to the thousandth of a second, the thousandth of an inch, but there's just no way an error that size could possibly have impacted the outcome of the race.

I hope this gets mitigated on appeal, and that someone sane takes over discipline at NASCAR HQ.

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04-25-2013, 06:36 AM
  #915
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Agreed. This penalty is an absolute farce. 3 grams is about the weight of 3 drops of water. I know everything in auto racing is measured down to the thousandth of a second, the thousandth of an inch, but there's just no way an error that size could possibly have impacted the outcome of the race.

I hope this gets mitigated on appeal, and that someone sane takes over discipline at NASCAR HQ.
Rules are rules though. It's cheating, no need to make excuses. They are at fault here, not NASCAR

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04-25-2013, 12:03 PM
  #916
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Rules are rules though. It's cheating, no need to make excuses. They are at fault here, not NASCAR
Nobody is making excuses. How about you answer my question. What penalty do you now give the next guy who gets caught illeglly trying to improve his aero or mileage or handling or etc? With parts he intentionally put on the car that actually made a difference? What penalty does he get?

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04-25-2013, 04:28 PM
  #917
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Nobody is making excuses. How about you answer my question. What penalty do you now give the next guy who gets caught illeglly trying to improve his aero or mileage or handling or etc? With parts he intentionally put on the car that actually made a difference? What penalty does he get?
There's been, what, 4 guys the past 2 weeks caught cheating. They needed to make an example of someone. What do you expect them to do? Let all the cheaters keep cheating?

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04-25-2013, 04:58 PM
  #918
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There's been, what, 4 guys the past 2 weeks caught cheating. They needed to make an example of someone. What do you expect them to do? Let all the cheaters keep cheating?
This is the last time I'm going to say this because you seem not be paying attention to my point. You continue to not tell me what the next guy's penalty should be when obvious cheating is found.

They should penalize Gibbs. But relevancy matters. If the penalty Gibbs got for a minor (3 grams underweight), unintentional violation is that severe, what do you give the next guy who flat out is caught trying to cheat?

Gibbs broke the rules. Penalize him. But he did not try to cheat. There's a difference and penalties need to take that into account. If you can't see that then there is no point going further with this discussion.

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04-25-2013, 06:42 PM
  #919
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In the NHL. If you accidentally hit a guy with your stick you get a 2 min penalty. If you draw blood you get 4 min.

If you take a baseball type swing with your stick at a guys head. You get 5min +Match penalty+ a massive suspension.


Where does 3 grams on 1 of 8 connector rods fall in your rules are rules argument using my example ?

Nascar could learn a thing or two from the NHL when it comes to discipline. (Holy crap, I can't believe I said that )

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04-25-2013, 07:24 PM
  #920
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Illegal engine parts are a big deal to NASCAR for some reason.

I'm not sure how hard it is to figure that out.

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04-25-2013, 07:51 PM
  #921
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Illegal engine parts are a big deal to NASCAR for some reason.

I'm not sure how hard it is to figure that out.
They are and, like it or not, the fact he WON the race they felt they had to come down hard. If he finishes 5th I guarentee they do little.

Cheating + winning will equal a much bigger penalty

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04-25-2013, 11:59 PM
  #922
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They are and, like it or not, the fact he WON the race they felt they had to come down hard. If he finishes 5th I guarentee they do little.

Cheating + winning will equal a much bigger penalty
Just like like when JJ won Dover with those questionable shocks and nothing happened?

Still waiting for you to tell me what the next penalty is for really cheating.

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04-26-2013, 08:03 AM
  #923
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Just like like when JJ won Dover with those questionable shocks and nothing happened?

Still waiting for you to tell me what the next penalty is for really cheating.
How the **** would I know? Throw the book at them? What do you want me to say. 4 guys cheat in 2 weeks. No need to win races like this.

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04-27-2013, 09:32 AM
  #924
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Maybe cheat today Smoke win the race. Deal with it later.

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04-27-2013, 11:08 AM
  #925
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I don't think Addington could cheat and find success at this point..

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