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Check out this move. Is that legal in a SO?

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Old
09-14-2006, 10:41 AM
  #1
wereback
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Check out this move. Is that legal in a SO?

mms://media.tsn.ca/nhl/hotdog_hi.wmv#0

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09-14-2006, 10:47 AM
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HockeyBasedNYC
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If you can pull it off while you are skating forward and not come to a stop you can try it. You cant go past the goal line or bring it above the crossbar though which would make it very difficult. Picking it up at center ice is your best bet but i douct you could skate that far without losing it

There was a goal by a prospect named Hainsey where he did a spin-a-rama and picked the puck up while spinning and backhanded it in which was unbelievable. Thats the closest version of that i could see happening.

Im gonna try and find that video

Can you supply a different link to that video? having trouble with it


Last edited by HockeyBasedNYC: 09-14-2006 at 11:02 AM.
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Old
09-14-2006, 10:47 AM
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wereback
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Still pretty cool!!!

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09-14-2006, 10:48 AM
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Tawnos
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Stick looks above the crossbar, I'd assume that those rules still apply in a shootout.

Fun move... of course... the craziest thing about that video is how freakin young Jamie McLennan looks. He doesn't look much older than 17.

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09-14-2006, 10:54 AM
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trench23
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Great post-- interesting vid.. thanks man!

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09-14-2006, 11:00 AM
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HockeyBasedNYC
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that first one, mike legg from michagan... was the first time i saw that and i remember my whole team in practice was trying it and the coach went nuts and made us do suicides for like an hour.

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09-14-2006, 11:35 AM
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Ola
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The puck must be kept in motion towards the goal line all the time on a SO. The rules in the NHL are the same as under IIHF. In Europe I've seen refs dissalow goals because the puck is beeing pulled back, away from the goal line. For example if a shooter takes a curve and comes in from the wing and moves the puck in a direction away from the goalline to go around the goalie it should be dissalowed. Haven't seen a goal be dissalowed cause of the rule in the NHL though. Marek Maliks goal where for example a real border line case. He kinda pulled the puck back to get it between his legs. If I where Capitals coach I would have had big issues with the goal.

Schremp speed doesn't make up for the backward movements he does with the stick. He moves the stick so fast (often it looks like a player is moving the puck backwards before he shots, but when he is skating forward at normal speed, his own motion often more then makes backward motion he makes with the stick, it was a big subject in Sweden awhile back when a Espen Knutsen used a break-and-shot kind of move with allot of success and they looked pretty close at it on slowmotion) so there is no way his skating would make up for it.

2nd, Schrempy obviously have allot of what we call "balltalent" here in Sweden. Some guys are just born with it. Though while a goalie might have a hard time finding someone to practise the move against, instead of stopping a puck gooing 100mph the goalie must get in the way of a moving stick, its not that hard. It will defenitly not revolutionary change the SO's, thats for sure. Could work once in a decade if he catches a goalie off guard on a SO, otherwise its useless...

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Old
09-14-2006, 11:44 AM
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HockeyBasedNYC
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Quote:
Rule 30 Penalty Shot

Any infraction of the rules which calls for a "PENALTY SHOT" shall be taken as follows:
The Referee shall ask to have announced over the public address system the name of the player designated by him or selected by the Team entitled to take the shot (as appropriate). He shall then place the puck on the center face-off spot and the player taking the shot will, on the instruction of the Referee, play the puck from there and shall attempt to score on the goalkeeper. The puck must be kept in motion towards the opponent's goal line and once it is shot, the play shall be considered complete. No goal can be scored on a rebound of any kind (an exception being the puck off the goal post, then the goalkeeper and then directly into the goal), and any time the puck crosses the goal line, the shot shall be considered complete.
http://www.nhl.com/rules/rule30.html

thats all it says -

Quote:
(an exception being the puck off the goal post, then the goalkeeper and then directly into the goal)
thats interesting, didnt know that

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Old
09-14-2006, 02:00 PM
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nyrmessier011
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its a high stick

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09-14-2006, 04:53 PM
  #10
n8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ola View Post
The puck must be kept in motion towards the goal line all the time on a SO. The rules in the NHL are the same as under IIHF. In Europe I've seen refs dissalow goals because the puck is beeing pulled back, away from the goal line. For example if a shooter takes a curve and comes in from the wing and moves the puck in a direction away from the goalline to go around the goalie it should be dissalowed. Haven't seen a goal be dissalowed cause of the rule in the NHL though. Marek Maliks goal where for example a real border line case. He kinda pulled the puck back to get it between his legs. If I where Capitals coach I would have had big issues with the goal.
one thing you are overlooking is the player's momentum from skating forward, so although relative to his own position, the puck is being "pulled back" in realitiy, the puck is being slowed down and in many cases is still actually moving forward. i think it's a silly rule. as long as the skater doesn't skate backwards or come to a stop it should be good. you sometimes will pull the puck "backwards" to cockup for a wrister don't you? been so long since i've shot a puck

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09-14-2006, 05:18 PM
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thats a cool move, but its not legal if the blade is over the crossbar while touching the puck.

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09-14-2006, 05:19 PM
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XploD
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Quote:
Originally Posted by n8 View Post
one thing you are overlooking is the player's momentum from skating forward, so although relative to his own position, the puck is being "pulled back" in realitiy, the puck is being slowed down and in many cases is still actually moving forward. i think it's a silly rule. as long as the skater doesn't skate backwards or come to a stop it should be good. you sometimes will pull the puck "backwards" to cockup for a wrister don't you? been so long since i've shot a puck
He didn't overlook that. Read the whole post.

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Old
09-14-2006, 05:51 PM
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xeric716x
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wereback View Post
mms://media.tsn.ca/nhl/hotdog_hi.wmv#0

hahah HOTDOG

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Old
09-14-2006, 06:25 PM
  #14
Finest
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legal or not, that was freaking cool!!!!

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09-14-2006, 07:50 PM
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Heat McManus
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If the puck can't be moving backward then I think a few of Jussi Jokinen's goals were illegal.

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Old
09-15-2006, 09:01 AM
  #16
WheresBarnaby
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vakar Lajos View Post
If the puck can't be moving backward then I think a few of Jussi Jokinen's goals were illegal.
I believe the puck can be brought backwards. The skater can't stop, or reverse foward motion with his feet. Malik's goal had to be brought backwards, to bring the stick and puck through his legs.

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09-15-2006, 09:24 AM
  #17
Ola
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WheresBarnaby View Post
I believe the puck can be brought backwards. The skater can't stop, or reverse foward motion with his feet. Malik's goal had to be brought backwards, to bring the stick and puck through his legs.
For me beeing a law student, "keeping the puck in motion towards the goalline" can only mean one thing...

Don't know if the refs are aware of it, though I've in person seen refs in europe dissalow goals because a player have stopped, pulled the puck back and then shot.

Though like I, with some help, pointed out a player gooing forward 30 mph must pull the puck back with the speed of atleast 31 mph to no keep "the puck in motion towards the goalline".

The rule is not just a paper product. Scoring a goal on a breakaway if you are allowed to go in from the side and around the goalie is allot easier then dooing it the traditional way.

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Old
09-15-2006, 12:27 PM
  #18
RothmanHockey
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that's incredible.

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09-15-2006, 01:11 PM
  #19
BigE
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There's no way the NHL prevents a player from doing this in a shoot-out as long as the stick doesn't go above the cross bar, or come from behind the goal-line.

Whether you're a fan of this or not, it's been coming for a few years now and that move is just one of many that you're going to see in the next while. The reason it's coming so slowly is because hockey is such a traditionalist sport (especially in the minds of most coaches) and as Schremp said he'd likely get benched for something like that. The first guy that can take it from high risk/high reward to low risk/high reward is going to open a whole-nother can of worms.

My bet is you're likely going to see something like what schremp did with the golf ball in a shootout before you'll actually see what he tried in the charity game; a simple flip up of the puck to disorientate the goaltender and his square postion to the puck, then slapping in mid-air that sends it into one of the many vacant areas of the goal (possibly even a bounce shot that goes fivehole...it's happened to me before and these are just major junior and ahl guys, not even NHL level players...).

As a goaltender I shudder when thinking of all these possibilities - I've played goal in lacrosse for one game and BLOODY hated it(!) because of all the ridiculous **** they could do with the ball and that's what this reminds me of.

As Rolly said one option is to pokecheck the S.O.B. and hope he loses his balance and the puck; another option is to come up in your stance a bit puffing your chest and trying to cover the reach of the stick with your hands but that leaves your fivehole wide open. Luckily their ability to change directions isn't as flexible as a lax player and thus the hockey goalie might have an edge on his lax cousin.

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09-15-2006, 01:55 PM
  #20
in the hall
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that was very cool, if anyone wants to save it.. here's the link

http://media.tsn.ca/nhl/hotdog_hi.wmv

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Old
09-16-2006, 01:13 PM
  #21
WheresBarnaby
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I think in a game it's going to be real hard to pull that one off. The player would have to be completley untouched to do it. That being said if it does, hopefully it doesn't start happening all the time. I hate to see that being hockey's version of the slam dunk . Then the NHL would really see goals increasing LOL.

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Old
09-16-2006, 02:38 PM
  #22
broadwayblue
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigE View Post
,,,a simple flip up of the puck to disorientate the goaltender and his square postion to the puck, then slapping in mid-air that sends it into one of the many vacant areas of the goal (possibly even a bounce shot that goes fivehole...
just curious...at what point does a "shot" occur? conceivably the "simple flip up of the puck" could be considered a shot, no?

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Old
09-16-2006, 02:46 PM
  #23
BigE
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This is certainly something that the boys over at NHL HQ will have to address, but both actions are easily distinguishable.

Re-writing the rules in terms of shoot-out etiquette might be required however, and at some point I imagine it will happen - likely after some kid scores an amazing goal that makes it number 1 on all the reels (even ESPN) only for the ref to wave it off, and the NHL to experience some pretty severe public backlash.

From my observational standpoint the NHL is really only capable of taking action well after the fact. The foresight in that office is extremely limited, there's no anticipation, and those two factors play a large role in the development of the game in the US.

Unfortunate, eh.

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