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Loui Eriksson to CAR, EDM, STL or NYR (or anyone else)

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Old
04-30-2013, 10:15 PM
  #151
Morry83
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Originally Posted by Bobblehead View Post
Dillon was probably a stretch. We need I guy like him, desperately.

You're putting words in my mouth again. I never said he will improve EVERY year. I pointed out that he's not a 50 point player. He scored 50 points as a 19,20,22 year old. Guys are just developing at taht age and that this year is more likely what he'll be 65-75 point player. He hasn't reached his prime years yet. How can he be capped at 50 when his recent season is equal to 65 pts over an 82 game schedule. You guys have problems with math.

Now you're comparing Roussel's grit to Gagner's? Where that come from? we were comparing Luoi to Sam. You're all over the map. Try to stick to one line of discussion. Its like me saying Hall is way better than ERiksson. Not what we're discussion.
Because you mentioned Roussel as a piece going your way in the proposal. You said Gagner has grit and sandpaper, and I showed you someone who actually does have grit and sandpaper.

Loui isn't paid to be fight. And in fact, he's been decently physical as of late. Yeah he's not gonna fight, but he'll take the body and he'll go into the corners.

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04-30-2013, 10:36 PM
  #152
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Isles could offer Grabner or Okposo and Strome. But that's probably not enough.

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04-30-2013, 10:38 PM
  #153
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Originally Posted by patrick View Post
Isles could offer Grabner or Okposo and Strome. But that's probably not enough.
Finally, someone who is realistic. I like Grabner + Strome as a base, for sure. That's really solid, IMHO.

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04-30-2013, 11:20 PM
  #154
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Here are a couple of options. Rask, Dalpe, and the 5th for Eriksson and Fraser.

Dallas gets the centers they need and Carolina gets the wingers.

I love the idea of Grabner+Strome and NYI's 1st for Loui.

Eriksson to Buffalo for Grigorenko and Buffalo's 1st.

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05-01-2013, 12:39 AM
  #155
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I'd love to make a deal with NYI around Strome. With Ritchie coming up, can return the wonder twins on a line in Dallas.

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05-01-2013, 12:55 AM
  #156
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Originally Posted by Ambassador Of Fun View Post
With a new GM in town, no one is safe from trade in Dallas. Loui is definitely a top 3 most valuable piece the Stars have and arguably the most valuable piece. It is a battle between him, Benn and Lehtonen.

Loui has very similar (I'd say a tad bit more) value compared to Jeff Carter due to their similar offensive production, his better two way game, and no lifestyle or attitude problems that Carter exhibited in Philly and Columbus respectively. Carter had 10 years at 5.2 per left on his contract at the time of the first trade. 3 years of Loui at 4.25 is probably a wash compared to Carter's contract situation. Carter returned Voracek + 8th overall + 3rd round pick from Columbus and Jack Johnson + 1st from LA.

Some packages that would be similar to those would include

Skinner + 5th overall from CAR (Stars would probably have to add)

or

Gagner + 7th overall + ? from EDM

or

Shattenkirk + 1st round pick + ? from STL

or

Del Zotto + 1st round pick + ? from NYR

What do other people think or other teams want to offer for Loui?
Do you know who your GM is? He isn't going to trade players just to trade players. He's a GM who understands the value of players signed to great contracts.

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05-01-2013, 02:10 AM
  #157
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Originally Posted by detredWINgs View Post
Do you know who your GM is? He isn't going to trade players just to trade players. He's a GM who understands the value of players signed to great contracts.
Two things.

First, what that poster was getting at is that we have some major issues and Nill offers a fresh perspective. Everything should be looked at and weighed accordingly. Note, I'm not advocating trading Eriksson or proposing that Nill will.

Second, we really appreciate the input from Detroit fans regarding Nill but some of your assertions about how he will run our team are a bit heavy handed. Nill was the assistant GM in Detroit so we actually don't have a book on what he will do and how he will do it exactly. We know what he was around in Detroit but we don't know if he will be Ken Holland 2.0 and run things exactly the same. Also, this Stars team is in worse shape than the Wings have been in for a long, looong time. He wasn't part of remaking the team in Detroit the way he has to here.

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05-01-2013, 09:54 AM
  #158
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Originally Posted by Hull Fan View Post
Here are a couple of options. Rask, Dalpe, and the 5th for Eriksson and Fraser.

Dallas gets the centers they need and Carolina gets the wingers.

I love the idea of Grabner+Strome and NYI's 1st for Loui.

Eriksson to Buffalo for Grigorenko and Buffalo's 1st.
I would love that package from NYI (might be an overpayment for them) but seeing Ritchie and Strome side by side would be awesome haha

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05-01-2013, 11:44 AM
  #159
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Originally Posted by SolidusAKA View Post
I would love that package from NYI (might be an overpayment for them) but seeing Ritchie and Strome side by side would be awesome haha
Honestly I'd do Nino+Strome and NYI's first.

They may not want to move Grabner and that's fair because they want to add to their team not switch wingers. Nino's recovered, there'd be a chance for him to win a spot in Dallas and Strome would just be a god send to this organization. Perhaps you can still get Monahan or Lindholm or at the very worse Wennberg/Lazar with the Isles picks.

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05-01-2013, 03:08 PM
  #160
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I love Loui, but I don't think the Isles would part with that kind of package. Maybe something like Nelson, Nino and Mayfield/Pelech? That's still a quality package; Both forwards are NHL ready and Mayfield is probably a year of AHL hockey away/Pelech is probably 2 years away... I just don't see Strome going anywhere unless the target is a top pairing defenseman.

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05-01-2013, 03:47 PM
  #161
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Originally Posted by Bobblehead View Post
Since he came in the league..... check out hits and fighting stats. Eriksson career fights 0, Gagner 7. Hits this year ERiksson 6, Gagner 35.
I agree with you on a lot of your points, and I like everything Gagner brings to the table. I'm a fan of his and I wanted him to drop in the draft so we could land him (mostly because his dad was my favorite player for a bit). I think he's shown a ton of character and his compete level is maturing. He's not only a good offensive player, but he'll be a glue guy for whatever team he's with in the future - whether it's Edmonton or someone else. (Hopefully us )

I just don't agree with your statements that Gagner is "way more valuable than Loui". I think that's false. The +- numbers lie a bit this year. Loui is definitely a better defensive player than Gagner (Gagner's still young). Offensively they're not all that far off as of right now. Loui's a more refined player as he's been around a little longer, but he's also naturally a more rounded player.

I'd be hesitant to trade Loui straight up for Gagner. But I'd also be very tempted. That's a tough one for me. I think throwing in your 1st would be an over payment, but I'd gladly take it . We do need a center and as I said, I like everything Gagner brings and although this was kind of his breakout year so far, maybe he'll be like his pops and really explode once he throws on a Stars uni.

I expect you guys to draft Monohan, and that could allow you to trade Gagner for another piece needed to fill another hole. Squeezing Loui in on the wing (rid yourselves of Hemsky he's useless I've been saying it for years) would be a nice addition. You guys need size up front and people tend to forget that Loui is 6"2 just shy of 200 lbs.

So I think there's something there. Just not sure what.

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05-01-2013, 07:29 PM
  #162
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Originally Posted by tjcurrie View Post
I agree with you on a lot of your points, and I like everything Gagner brings to the table. I'm a fan of his and I wanted him to drop in the draft so we could land him (mostly because his dad was my favorite player for a bit). I think he's shown a ton of character and his compete level is maturing. He's not only a good offensive player, but he'll be a glue guy for whatever team he's with in the future - whether it's Edmonton or someone else. (Hopefully us )

I just don't agree with your statements that Gagner is "way more valuable than Loui". I think that's false. The +- numbers lie a bit this year. Loui is definitely a better defensive player than Gagner (Gagner's still young). Offensively they're not all that far off as of right now. Loui's a more refined player as he's been around a little longer, but he's also naturally a more rounded player.

I'd be hesitant to trade Loui straight up for Gagner. But I'd also be very tempted. That's a tough one for me. I think throwing in your 1st would be an over payment, but I'd gladly take it . We do need a center and as I said, I like everything Gagner brings and although this was kind of his breakout year so far, maybe he'll be like his pops and really explode once he throws on a Stars uni.

I expect you guys to draft Monohan, and that could allow you to trade Gagner for another piece needed to fill another hole. Squeezing Loui in on the wing (rid yourselves of Hemsky he's useless I've been saying it for years) would be a nice addition. You guys need size up front and people tend to forget that Loui is 6"2 just shy of 200 lbs.

So I think there's something there. Just not sure what.
Gagner is a good player and probably underrated by Dallas fans (myself included). Personally, I want nothing to do with a swap of Gagner and Eriksson as the two main pieces of a trade with Edmonton. Robbing Peter to pay Paul. If we're trading Eriksson for a center we should aim higher and be prepared to tinker with our side of the trade.

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05-02-2013, 10:03 AM
  #163
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Ottawa would be willing to pony up to get a quality player like Eriksson. Nice fit, plays our style of game - he'd be right at home in Sweden West.


Eriksson:
1st 2014
Noesen
Condra
Stone

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05-02-2013, 01:31 PM
  #164
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This thread makes me giggle.

First of all, Sam Gagner? The guy who had 8 points in a game once? For Loui Eriksson? Unless Nill is a double agent for Detroit, that never gets done.

Secondly, Loui is a core piece. Core pieces aren't usually dealt unless A) the team is doing a ground up rebuild, or B) The GM gets an offer that he can't say no to.

The Strome/Grabner offer is on the right track. So is the Marc Staal one. But Sam Gagner? Goodness dude.

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05-02-2013, 04:58 PM
  #165
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hull Fan View Post
Here are a couple of options. Rask, Dalpe, and the 5th for Eriksson and Fraser.

Dallas gets the centers they need and Carolina gets the wingers.

I love the idea of Grabner+Strome and NYI's 1st for Loui.

Eriksson to Buffalo for Grigorenko and Buffalo's 1st.
Staple is a very credible source. He's been accused of being a mouth piece for the organization, not asking tough questions.

He called it at the trade deadline: predicting the isles wouldn't move anybody, that signing Lee and adding him to the roster would be all Snow would do. He also wrote that Snow wants roster holes filled internally by prospects. That last info wasn't a huge surprise because Snow had told fans that last summer

Today he had a fanchat and was asked about ufas and trades.

http://www.newsday.com/sports/hockey...7071?qr=1&qr=1

1:30
Staple:
Well, I think it's looking more and more like Mark Streit won't be back. Without knowing much about Snow's plans yet, since he's focused on the current squad, I'd think Marek Zidlicky could fit a short-term plan on D. Big shot, PP experience. He's not terrific in his own zone, but he wouldn't be playing big EV minutes. I don't think there'll be many forwards the Isles will
overpay for, not with Strome/Nelson/Nino in the pipeline
.

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05-02-2013, 05:14 PM
  #166
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I can't figure out the lack of respect for Gagner. Maybe cause he's been around so long and is still only 23. Thought I'd leave you with a final thought as I'm off to Mexico, when you look at REAL stats, REAL data (and don't eliminate a guys worst two years because it furthers your argument) and you extrapolate over 82 games, here some things to consider about Gagner.

He was in the league @ 18. As an 18yr old, he had more points than Henrik Sedin, Jordan Staal, and Vinnie Lecavalier did as 18yrs olds.

As a 19yr old he still had more points than Henrik and JS, but less than Vinnie L.

As a 20 year old more points than Brendan Morrow, Henrik, Derek Roy and same as JS (but less than VL).

He scored more points than Loui Eriksson did as a 21 year old. In fact at 21 and at 22 AND at 23, Sam Gagner put up more points than Luoi did at 21, 22 and 23 respectively (extrapolated over 82 games).

51 vs 26
51 vs 37
65 vs 63

I Can't compare their results at 24, 25, 26 yet as Gagner isn't there yet. Eriksson has very good results there. We'll soon see about Gagner.

His stats at 23 are better than Henrik Zetterberg @ 23, LE at 23, Brednan Morrow @ 23, James Neal @ 23, Joe Pavelski @ 23, Pavel Datsyuk at 23 and Derek Roy @ 23. I'm not suggesting he's better than any of these players, just saying you seriously underestimate his ability and his potential value. The only reason Oiler fans suggest moving him is we can't have him and RNH down the middle and there's no way we're moving RNH.

If you had said not quite a good fit, I would've understood. But you guys are right he sucks. The stats lie. Cerrvesa por favor! (I can't spell in spanish!)

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05-02-2013, 07:12 PM
  #167
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Originally Posted by Bobblehead View Post
I can't figure out the lack of respect for Gagner. Maybe cause he's been around so long and is still only 23. Thought I'd leave you with a final thought as I'm off to Mexico, when you look at REAL stats, REAL data (and don't eliminate a guys worst two years because it furthers your argument) and you extrapolate over 82 games, here some things to consider about Gagner.

He was in the league @ 18. As an 18yr old, he had more points than Henrik Sedin, Jordan Staal, and Vinnie Lecavalier did as 18yrs olds.

As a 19yr old he still had more points than Henrik and JS, but less than Vinnie L.

As a 20 year old more points than Brendan Morrow, Henrik, Derek Roy and same as JS (but less than VL).

He scored more points than Loui Eriksson did as a 21 year old. In fact at 21 and at 22 AND at 23, Sam Gagner put up more points than Luoi did at 21, 22 and 23 respectively (extrapolated over 82 games).

51 vs 26
51 vs 37
65 vs 63

I Can't compare their results at 24, 25, 26 yet as Gagner isn't there yet. Eriksson has very good results there. We'll soon see about Gagner.

His stats at 23 are better than Henrik Zetterberg @ 23, LE at 23, Brednan Morrow @ 23, James Neal @ 23, Joe Pavelski @ 23, Pavel Datsyuk at 23 and Derek Roy @ 23. I'm not suggesting he's better than any of these players, just saying you seriously underestimate his ability and his potential value. The only reason Oiler fans suggest moving him is we can't have him and RNH down the middle and there's no way we're moving RNH.

If you had said not quite a good fit, I would've understood. But you guys are right he sucks. The stats lie. Cerrvesa por favor! (I can't spell in spanish!)
Your argument is flawed for one major reason. You are using raw age without regard to years of service. Neither is a perfect comparison tool but you can't simply use one and ignore the other. When Eriksson was 18 he was playing in Sweden; same with Zetterberg. A lot of those guys were either playing in a foreign country until they were 20 or in the minors, etc.

One thing you have to acknowledge before people will take you seriously is that it is possible to rush a prospect. It's possible that if Gagner had played another year or two of hockey before joining the big leagues that he could have been a more refined player from the outset. As it is, we have a player with a plethora of 40+ point seasons. What to make of that?...

You keep saying how young he is, which is true. The other side of the coin is that he is already a 6 year veteran. Some players do continue to improve after six years in the league, but many don't.

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05-03-2013, 10:32 AM
  #168
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Your argument is flawed for one major reason. You are using raw age without regard to years of service. Neither is a perfect comparison tool but you can't simply use one and ignore the other. When Eriksson was 18 he was playing in Sweden; same with Zetterberg. A lot of those guys were either playing in a foreign country until they were 20 or in the minors, etc.

One thing you have to acknowledge before people will take you seriously is that it is possible to rush a prospect. It's possible that if Gagner had played another year or two of hockey before joining the big leagues that he could have been a more refined player from the outset. As it is, we have a player with a plethora of 40+ point seasons. What to make of that?...

You keep saying how young he is, which is true. The other side of the coin is that he is already a 6 year veteran. Some players do continue to improve after six years in the league, but many don't.
Like I said, I'd be very hesitant. The reason it's tempting though is because we do get a younger player and an organizational need. You could argue we'd have another organizational need if we dealt Loui for Gagner, but we do have a lot of wingers both on the roster and in the system - a center is a priority and harder to find. For those reasons, it's tempting.

You're right though that although Gagner is only 23, he has been around for quite some time now so his years at this point can't be compared to guys who began at say age 21 or 22. I don't think Gagner is a #1 center, but a good #2.

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05-03-2013, 12:31 PM
  #169
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Your argument is flawed for one major reason. You are using raw age without regard to years of service. Neither is a perfect comparison tool but you can't simply use one and ignore the other. When Eriksson was 18 he was playing in Sweden; same with Zetterberg. A lot of those guys were either playing in a foreign country until they were 20 or in the minors, etc.

One thing you have to acknowledge before people will take you seriously is that it is possible to rush a prospect. It's possible that if Gagner had played another year or two of hockey before joining the big leagues that he could have been a more refined player from the outset. As it is, we have a player with a plethora of 40+ point seasons. What to make of that?...

You keep saying how young he is, which is true. The other side of the coin is that he is already a 6 year veteran. Some players do continue to improve after six years in the league, but many don't.
He showed his biggest improvement this last year. I don't think any player has ever went from taking a huge stride in development to reaching his peak in less than a year.

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05-03-2013, 02:14 PM
  #170
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Here are a couple of options. Rask, Dalpe, and the 5th for Eriksson and Fraser.

Dallas gets the centers they need and Carolina gets the wingers.
I think that's pretty fair but I think you need a modest draft pick coming back from Dallas or someone a little better than Fraser.

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05-03-2013, 04:58 PM
  #171
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I think that's pretty fair but I think you need a modest draft pick coming back from Dallas or someone a little better than Fraser.
Mmm, how about

Rask + Daple + 5th ov. + late round pick (a 5th?)

for

Eriksson + R. Smith

Smith is going to be less hit-and-miss than Fraser and would be a good bottom six option whereas if Fraser didn't make a top 6 role he's stuck in the AHL.

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05-03-2013, 05:05 PM
  #172
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Mmm, how about

Rask + Daple + 5th ov. + late round pick (a 5th?)

for

Eriksson + R. Smith

Smith is going to be less hit-and-miss than Fraser and would be a good bottom six option whereas if Fraser didn't make a top 6 role he's stuck in the AHL.
Given the need for more physical forwards, Fraser would be the better option between him and Smith. We're close though and let's keep Cole and Whitney out of the discussion.

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05-03-2013, 05:15 PM
  #173
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Given the need for more physical forwards, Fraser would be the better option between him and Smith. We're close though and let's keep Cole and Whitney out of the discussion.
Meh, you can take the late round pick then

Rask + Dalpe + 5th ov.

for

Eriksson + Fraser + 5th rder.

Get the GM's on the phone!

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