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Who will the Canes Draft at #5?

View Poll Results: Who do you think the Canes will end up drafting?
Jones 1 1.28%
MacKinnon 0 0%
Druin 0 0%
Barkov 9 11.54%
Nichushkin 20 25.64%
Lindholm 4 5.13%
Monahan 28 35.90%
Ristolainen 2 2.56%
Zadorov 0 0%
Nurse 10 12.82%
They will trade the pick 3 3.85%
Other 1 1.28%
Voters: 78. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
05-02-2013, 02:06 AM
  #76
Finnpin
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Originally Posted by Vagrant View Post
but that league has deteriorated to the point where you have to look at stats coming out with a real discerning eye.
Still a top 3 league in Europe even some top players leave to go to KHL. It just gives room more to the younger talents and other players can take the bigger ice minutes and hit the "show lights". Plus this season the FEL league had lots of NHL lockout players and Barkov competed well against them.

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05-02-2013, 02:49 AM
  #77
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Still a top 3 league in Europe even some top players leave to go to KHL. It just gives room more to the younger talents and other players can take the bigger ice minutes and hit the "show lights". Plus this season the FEL league had lots of NHL lockout players and Barkov competed well against them.
Yes, still a fantastic league. I didn't mean to imply it had fallen out of the Top 3 leagues in Europe for sure. I just meant that it seems that the competition level in the SEL and KHL has gotten a lot closer, not to mention the money in those two leagues being more available, and the big ticket talent in Finland, foreign or native, has migrated towards the Top 2 leagues with the KHL in particular being a draw for financial reasons.

Much has been made about the fact that Finland seems to be falling out of their golden age of producing elite talent on a steady basis and that seems to be a contributing factor in why the average skill level of a player in the Men's league has dropped a bit. Would Barkov have produced these points in the Men's league even in the early 2000's? I personally don't think he would have. Around the time Tuomo Ruutu was drawing some interest as "the best player outside North America", he was scoring at a very low rate.

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05-02-2013, 03:06 AM
  #78
Sasha Cares
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Is there a solid defenseman worth taking after Jones? I mean, even long term we are in dire straights to find a top pairing D guy in our system outside of Faulk

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05-02-2013, 03:12 AM
  #79
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Originally Posted by Sasha Cares View Post
Is there a solid defenseman worth taking after Jones? I mean, even long term we are in dire straights to find a top pairing D guy in our system outside of Faulk
There are no gamebreakers after Jones. People are trying to fit a round peg into a square hole with Darnell Nurse, but he's not a legitimate first half of the first round kind of pick, even in a year that isn't as strong as this one. He'll end up being overdrafted in the 8-11 range, potentially if Edmonton is interested at the high end of that spectrum... but he's not a very bright kid by all accounts and his game is ridiculously raw.

There is better value in taking a defenseman at 35th. After the initial wave of forwards come off the board, there will be some solid guys that are legit second rounders available. I like Ian McCoshen out of Waterloo.

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05-02-2013, 04:11 AM
  #80
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Originally Posted by Vagrant View Post
Would Barkov have produced these points in the Men's league even in the early 2000's? I personally don't think he would have. Around the time Tuomo Ruutu was drawing some interest as "the best player outside North America", he was scoring at a very low rate.
The thing is no other Finnish prospect has been as matured (at playing) as Barkov in such a young age. It's hard to compare. Tuomo in his youth wasn't as good as Barkov is. Mikko Koivu for example too, not even close. I see Barkov playing in NHL next season.

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05-02-2013, 06:00 AM
  #81
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Flames fan here, what kind of return do you think the Hurricanes would want to flip picks?

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05-02-2013, 07:13 AM
  #82
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Flames fan here, what kind of return do you think the Hurricanes would want to flip picks?
Every team will want to flip picks with the Canes because they have their pick of the 1b tier of this Draft or will catch the faller. As a Canes fan, no 2nd round pick is worth switching out of that luxury.

The only reason the Flames would want to jump the Canes is to take their pick. Why would the Canes want that or why would the Flames want to give up assets to secure a player the Canes don't want anyway?

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05-02-2013, 08:32 AM
  #83
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The only reason the Flames would want to jump the Canes is to take their pick. Why would the Canes want that or why would the Flames want to give up assets to secure a player the Canes don't want anyway?
That theory is flawed. With that line of thinking, you'd think there never is or would be a draft day trade. There are plenty.

Now JR never trades back because I quite honestly do not think he knows how to do it. The NFL's Belichek is the opposite. He does it constantly.

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05-02-2013, 08:44 AM
  #84
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I'm shocked that you guys think we need another center in the ranks. We need big wingers. Say what you want about Russians. But they are physical and with Semin now here long-term it could add some incentive to want to play here. I have never had a problem with Russians.

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05-02-2013, 08:51 AM
  #85
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Originally Posted by FlyingSquirrels View Post
That theory is flawed. With that line of thinking, you'd think there never is or would be a draft day trade. There are plenty.

Now JR never trades back because I quite honestly do not think he knows how to do it. The NFL's Belichek is the opposite. He does it constantly.
Belichek does do it constantly, to the point that he forgets at some point he actually has to use those draft picks at some point. I swear the Patriots had about 5 years in a row with 4 picks or less, 1 year with about 13 and then another year of 4. And trading back in the NFL is a lot different than in the NHL. You don't see as much movement in the NHL draft because everything after round 1 is less than a 25% chance of sniffing the NHL, where as football any guy drafted has a decent chance of being on the roster in the fall. The dynamics are totally different. The NFL actually has a chart of some kind that guides executives on the value of picks.

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05-02-2013, 08:54 AM
  #86
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Originally Posted by bluedevil58 View Post
I'm shocked that you guys think we need another center in the ranks. We need big wingers. Say what you want about Russians. But they are physical and with Semin now here long-term it could add some incentive to want to play here. I have never had a problem with Russians.
How many times do people have to say that Nich has been a center his whole life until this season and any other center drafted could be shifted to wing when they start playing in the pros?

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05-02-2013, 08:56 AM
  #87
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How many times do people have to say that Nich has been a center his whole life until this season and any other center drafted could be shifted to wing when they start playing in the pros?
Still the guy most people want is this Mo guy. He screams center to me. What about Nash, Welsh, and even Rask? We don't need centers.

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05-02-2013, 09:01 AM
  #88
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Any of those players can easily be shifted to wing. Wings often struggle being swapped to center. Having a lot of good centers is a good problem to have.

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05-02-2013, 09:02 AM
  #89
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With our current needs Nicsh or Barkov makes the most sense. That's just my opinion though.

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05-02-2013, 09:30 AM
  #90
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Still the guy most people want is this Mo guy. He screams center to me.
This poll isn't who WE want, it's who we think JR will take. YOU may not have a problem with Russians, but until JR changes his stripes, I won't be convinced he'll take someone like Nichushkin (especially with uncertainty surrounding his contract).

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05-02-2013, 09:40 AM
  #91
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Still the guy most people want is this Mo guy. He screams center to me. What about Nash, Welsh, and even Rask? We don't need centers.
Skinner was a center, so was Ruutu, so was Tlusty, hell so were about half the wingers in the NHL at one time. The best junior players are often centers and make the switch when they get to the big time according to where they fit best.

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05-02-2013, 09:44 AM
  #92
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Someone tell the Sharks they have too many centers when they are running a line of Thornton, Marleau and Pavelski.

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05-02-2013, 10:30 AM
  #93
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Originally Posted by FlyingSquirrels View Post
That theory is flawed. With that line of thinking, you'd think there never is or would be a draft day trade. There are plenty.

Now JR never trades back because I quite honestly do not think he knows how to do it. The NFL's Belichek is the opposite. He does it constantly.
Teams very rarely trade up only ONE slot because it doesn't make sense.

The one situation it makes sense is of the Canes would be wanting to trade down anyway and the Flames were afraid whoever else we traded with would take the guy they want, so they would spend the assets to secure that spot.

If the Canes plan to keep the pick, the only reason the Flame would need to trade up is if they wanted the same guy we did, in which case the Canes wouldn't want to give up the pick.

One exception, if JR was tricksy enough to convince the Flames we want their guy, even though we didn't, and eventually "gave in" to a good offer. We would get free picks. Unfortunately, that is not at all JRs style. One of his flaws is his transparency and "I'm a part of the good ole boys club" mentality.

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05-02-2013, 10:35 AM
  #94
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Someone tell the Sharks they have too many centers when they are running a line of Thornton, Marleau and Pavelski.
The Sharks have too many centers.

And I sorta-kinda agree with the point that we need some big wingers. It's not as easy as everyone says to move a guy off center. Skinner is struggling with it big time. He got a few games at center at the end of the year and it's obvious he's significantly more comfortable there.

This is going to be a big training camp for the Canes. I think everyone -- JR, Muller, most of the staff -- gets one more year. We need to sort out the lines and where Jordan Staal and Skinner fit. We didn't have a camp this year, so we couldn't try the Staals together or Skinner at center in games that didn't count.

But yeah, Eric, Jordan, possibly Skinner, Nash, Brett Sutter (becomes the fourth liner with Brent gone, right?), Jeremy Welsh, Dalpe and Rask. I think we should take BPA, but I think it's OK to say we have a bit of a logjam at center and a dearth of wingers (maybe three legit NHLers: Ruutu, Semin, Tlusty and Phillip DiGiuseppe? Brock McGinn? Evgenii Dadonov?).

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05-02-2013, 10:48 AM
  #95
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Flames fan here, what kind of return do you think the Hurricanes would want to flip picks?
There's no way to answer this unless you know who the Canes really want. They have a very tight list, from what I understand. If they don't think a guy will play at the NHL level or if they have doubts about him -- personally, physically, availability -- they won't put him on the list at all. Of the top five guys, I have no clue (nor does anyone else) what they really think of these guys. There may be a red flag about any one of them that could have them on the Canes' "don't draft" list.

Without knowing who the Canes are actually targeting, there's no way to guess about their trade potential. We suspect they are targeting Monohan because of their past draft tendencies -- safe pick, Canadian juniors, forward, close to NHL-ready -- but it's entirely possible (though highly unlikely) that they have targeted a guy like Anthony Mantha or Rasmus Ristolainen and would be willing to slide down.

Usually, the Canes just pick the best guy available at their slot, without much thought of moving around. Knowing what we know, they'll probably take whomover of MacKinnon, Drouin, Barkov or Monohan is available at No. 5.

So to answer your question, it's exceedingly unlikely that trading back a slot is something JR would do.

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05-02-2013, 11:39 AM
  #96
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Originally Posted by FlyingSquirrels View Post
That theory is flawed. With that line of thinking, you'd think there never is or would be a draft day trade. There are plenty.

Now JR never trades back because I quite honestly do not think he knows how to do it. The NFL's Belichek is the opposite. He does it constantly.
The trades are typically leapfrogs.

Calgary wants the player they think Carolina is going to draft, so they make a trade with a team that picks right before Carolina.

In the NFL, rookie salaries were linked to their draft position? Trading down was a way to manipulate your cap space. It was nice to have a high pick. But at the same time, you had to pay them as much as many top players at the position.

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05-02-2013, 12:27 PM
  #97
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I hope we grab the Russian winger.

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05-09-2013, 08:31 AM
  #98
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Misfit Semin View Post
I think if the Semin connection with agents and such could be worked out that Nich would come over next season and play, he is the no brainer pick. If not, Monahan is the obvious next pick.

My lines:

Tlusty // Eric // Semin
Nich // Jordan // Ruutu
Welsh // Skinner // Dwyer
Westgarth // Nash // Jared(or other Checker)

Gleason // Faulk
Pitkanen // Murphy
Harrison // Bellemore
MAB

Ward
Peters (or other back up)
So much for the Defensive "overhaul" huh?!?!

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05-09-2013, 09:25 AM
  #99
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So much for the Defensive "overhaul" huh?!?!
It's the "We Like Our Group" overhaul.

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