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Best forwards / goaltenders according to czech media

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05-02-2013, 06:23 PM
  #1
Martinson
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Best forwards / goaltenders according to czech media

http://hokej.idnes.cz/dominik-hasek-...hokej-2013_elv

GK
1. Dominik Hašek
2. Jacques Plante
3. Terry Sawchuk
4. Martin Brodeur
5. Jiří Holeček
6. Patrick Roy

7. Vladislav Treťjak
8. Seth Martin
9. Glenn Hall
10. Ken Dryden

Forwards
1. Wayne Gretzky
2. Sergej Makarov
3. Mario Lemieux
4. Jaromír Jágr
5. Gordie Howe
6. Anatolij Firsov
7. Bobby Hull
8. Vsevolod Bobrov
9. Tumba Johansson
10. Vladimír Zábrodský


Thoughts?

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05-02-2013, 06:25 PM
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JeffMangum
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The Czech media has bias for players from their county?

Nooooooo....

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05-02-2013, 06:30 PM
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TheDevilMadeMe
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I like how they went full-on pander and threw in the traditional first superstar of each of the three major hockey powers of Europe in the late 40s - 50s in spots 8-10

If you're going that route, might as well go all the way

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05-02-2013, 06:37 PM
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Canadian Gold X3
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Dryden at 10 is hilarious.

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05-02-2013, 06:38 PM
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Theokritos
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Lack of NHL knowledge/overrating of international hockey plus a shot of Czech homerism. Too obviously ill-informed to pass as anything but a curiosity. My favourite part:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Martinson View Post
6. Anatolij Firsov
7. Bobby Hull
8. Vsevolod Bobrov
9. Tumba Johansson
10. Vladimír Zábrodský

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Old
05-02-2013, 06:39 PM
  #6
Theokritos
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Dryden at 10 is hilarious.
If that only was the worst part or even close to it...

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05-02-2013, 06:39 PM
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BobbyAwe
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Makarov over Lemieux...sure why not?

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05-02-2013, 06:51 PM
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If that only was the worst part or even close to it...
They better Czech their lists.

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05-02-2013, 08:55 PM
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Hardyvan123
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an interesting list no doubt, but really is it any more interesting than Scotty Bowmans top 100 Canadian players of all time?

It probably is, but not as far off as one would think, or hope to expect from Bowman either.

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05-02-2013, 10:04 PM
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Rhiessan71
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Originally Posted by Hardyvan123 View Post
an interesting list no doubt, but really is it any more interesting than Scotty Bowmans top 100 Canadian players of all time?

It probably is, but not as far off as one would think, or hope to expect from Bowman either.
There's a big difference between a list done by a single man and a list compiled by a group heh.
At least with Bowman's list, you can pretty clearly see that he ranks players by their peaks.

This list is horrible period!
I honestly can't tell what criteria is being used from player to player here.
The only good thing I took out of this list is that they spared us their ranking of D-men heh

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05-03-2013, 12:12 AM
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Hammer Time
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhiessan71 View Post
There's a big difference between a list done by a single man and a list compiled by a group heh.
At least with Bowman's list, you can pretty clearly see that he ranks players by their peaks.

This list is horrible period!
I honestly can't tell what criteria is being used from player to player here.
The only good thing I took out of this list is that they spared us their ranking of D-men heh
Looks like a ranking based on play in IIHF tournaments and Canada Cups, with a few token NHLers added in. Then Makarov (best forward on the USSR dynasty of the 80s) > Lemieux becomes defensible and Seth Martin, Bobrov etc. aren't out of place.

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05-03-2013, 12:21 AM
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Hardyvan123
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rhiessan71 View Post
There's a big difference between a list done by a single man and a list compiled by a group heh.
At least with Bowman's list, you can pretty clearly see that he ranks players by their peaks.

This list is horrible period!
I honestly can't tell what criteria is being used from player to player here.
The only good thing I took out of this list is that they spared us their ranking of D-men heh
Both lists are horrible overall, Scotty had Trotts at 62 I believe and Savard ahead of Potvin who was 20th as I recall.

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05-03-2013, 02:51 AM
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alko
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Thats natural. You people from Canada will push your guys, and we from Europe ours.

but where to hell is Peter Stastny? And Jozef "The razor" Golonka?

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05-03-2013, 02:51 AM
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Morgoth Bauglir
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Thoughts?
The words "epic fail" come to mind

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05-03-2013, 05:17 AM
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Theokritos
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alko View Post
Thats natural. You people from Canada will push your guys, and we from Europe ours.
But some pushes are more reasonable than others.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Meteor View Post
Looks like a ranking based on play in IIHF tournaments and Canada Cups, with a few token NHLers added in.
And that's where the unreasonableness starts...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Meteor View Post
Then Makarov (best forward on the USSR dynasty of the 80s) > Lemieux becomes defensible and Seth Martin, Bobrov etc. aren't out of place.
Even from the stance you point out above it's ill-advised to put Bobrov and Zábrodský on the list (instead of Kharlamov and Martinec for example). It means you look at international hockey in a complete vacuum, as if it best European players of the 1950s were on the same level as the best European players of the 1970s. They're not.

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Old
05-03-2013, 08:49 AM
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Originally Posted by Rhiessan71 View Post
At least with Bowman's list, you can pretty clearly see that he ranks players by their peaks.
Yzerman is behind Messier, Pronger and Coffey are behind Scott Stevens, Guy Lapointe and Jacques Lemaire are in the top 40. That's not an argument for ranking by peak because Yzerman's peak was significantly higher than Messier's, Pronger's was at minimum equivalent to Stevens' an Coffey's well exceeded it. And the two Habs' players don't get anywhere near that spot on a "best peaks of all-time" list.

Bowman's top 100 is a pretty good argument as for why he was never a solo GM outside of Buffalo, where he didn't do too well in the role.

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Old
05-03-2013, 01:10 PM
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Uncle Rotter
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Who's this "Arkady cow-wheat" in the top 10 coaches list?
http://hokej.idnes.cz/dominik-hasek-...hokej-2013_elv

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05-03-2013, 05:53 PM
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Theokritos
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Who's this "Arkady cow-wheat" in the top 10 coaches list?
http://hokej.idnes.cz/dominik-hasek-...hokej-2013_elv
Arkady Chernyshev. Just take a look at the Czech original instead of the bull-wheat the Google Translator comes up with.

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05-03-2013, 10:51 PM
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DisgruntledGoat
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Originally Posted by eva unit zero View Post
Yzerman is behind Messier, not an argument for ranking by peak because Yzerman's peak was significantly higher than Messier's


There's no subject you can't twist into an Yzerman/Fedorov love-in, is there?

Its like you think if you can repeat Yzerman > Messier enough times, it will come true.

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05-03-2013, 11:05 PM
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pdd
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Originally Posted by DisgruntledGoat View Post
Its like you think if you can repeat Yzerman > Messier enough times, it will come true.
Why not? The Canadian and New York media managed the reverse.

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05-03-2013, 11:19 PM
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DisgruntledGoat
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eva unit zero View Post
Why not? The Canadian and New York media managed the reverse.
Yes. . . those Detroit players. . . always getting underrated by the media.

And yeah, do we hate Steve Yzerman up here in Canada!

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