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Micheal Ryder : To sign or not to sign?

View Poll Results: What should we do with Ryder?
Make him a long term offer (3 years or more) with a cap hit of over $3,5 millions 11 5.45%
Make him a long term offer (3 years or more) with a cap hit of under $3,5 millions 10 4.95%
Make him a short term offer (1 or 2 years) with a cap hit of over $3,5 millions 58 28.71%
Make him a short term offer (1 or 2 years) with a cap hit of under $3,5 millions 41 20.30%
Let him walk 82 40.59%
Voters: 202. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
05-05-2013, 04:20 PM
  #51
BaseballCoach
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Originally Posted by 1993 View Post
No. He is soft and floating the last 10 games. Use the money elsewhere. Clarkson or Clowe.
It's not as easy as it sounds. Other teams will also be targeting Clarkson and Clowe. We have to be prepared, if we let Ryder walk, to end up with none of the three players. Not saying it's the end of the world, just that you can't assume that you will get the UFA you want. Statistically, the chances of that happening are low. So, if Ryder has a good playoff, and he wants to re-sign for a reasonable amount, it is very risky to say now and just HOPE to get another player for probably no less money and maybe fewer goals.

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Old
05-05-2013, 04:25 PM
  #52
Brainiac
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Originally Posted by King Niinimaa View Post
If habs want him for short term, it's going to be 2 years / 10 mills and even that would be a discount (accepting short term). This may be his last chance for a big contract, so no way he's going to stick with peanuts. I wouldn't like a 3-4 year contract, because even though he's been great for the last two years, I don't think he'd be worth it through the contract.
Agreed.

On the other hand, a 4 years contract may not be that bad. It turned out very well with Cole, for example.

If we can move Ryder in 2 years for a rental + a 3rd...

Vets with multi-years contracts also have some good value. But around here, it seems that only ELCs and 1 year rentals are worth something.

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05-05-2013, 04:31 PM
  #53
CN_paladin
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Well if we can't sign a replacement like Clowe or Clarkson, I'd like to see him resigned for a couple of years.

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05-05-2013, 04:31 PM
  #54
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The playoffs will go a long way towards clarifying Ryder's value.

Right now based on his regular season, I assume market value is approx. $4.5M per season for a guy like Ryder. I'd be good with that - maybe more - if it's a two-year deal that doesn't cripple us long-term. People calling Ryder "One-dimensional" forget that it's the most important dimension of all, and the hardest to replace.

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05-05-2013, 04:37 PM
  #55
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Next year, barring changes, we already have 2x Gallys, Pacioretty, Bourque, Gionta and Prust for the top 9 wingers. Let him walk. We're already full and there is bound to be a young guy who impress next training camp.

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05-05-2013, 04:46 PM
  #56
The Nightman
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BaseballCoach View Post
It's not as easy as it sounds. Other teams will also be targeting Clarkson and Clowe. We have to be prepared, if we let Ryder walk, to end up with none of the three players. Not saying it's the end of the world, just that you can't assume that you will get the UFA you want. Statistically, the chances of that happening are low. So, if Ryder has a good playoff, and he wants to re-sign for a reasonable amount, it is very risky to say now and just HOPE to get another player for probably no less money and maybe fewer goals.
Both options have their risks, on one side you have signing Ryder until he is 37 at 4.5 or trying to get Clarkson or Clowe and failing. Personally I'd rather try the Clarkson/Clowe option because it fills a bigger need and they are both younger even though Clowe seems to be slowing down.

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05-05-2013, 04:47 PM
  #57
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There are so many factors to consider. Can't really say right now.

One thing I'll say is that I'd be extremely wary of signing him to any deal longer than 2 years.

Preferably, I'd sign him to a 1 year deal, but for a lot of money. More than he is worth. Unless we have better options, which I doubt we will have. The reason I say pay him more than he's worth is because he would not sign here for 1 year at his proper value. He'd only want to sign here for 1 year if he were overpaid to compensate for the security of more years.

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05-05-2013, 04:56 PM
  #58
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[QUOTE=JesusBouillon;65351659]Next year, barring changes, we already have 2x Gallys, Pacioretty, Bourque, Gionta and Prust for the top 9 wingers. Let him walk. We're already full and there is bound to be a young guy who impress next training camp.[/QUOTE

Add Desharnais, and Pleks, and you have 8 guys for 9 jobs. Louis or Kristo or Mr. Surprise should be able to fill the last job.

The natural improvement from the two Gallys, plus the contributions from the new guy should be able to make up for the loss of Ryder.

Would we have cap space?

Ok, can I change my vote now?

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05-05-2013, 05:28 PM
  #59
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[QUOTE=Habbadasher;65353155]
Quote:
Originally Posted by JesusBouillon View Post
Next year, barring changes, we already have 2x Gallys, Pacioretty, Bourque, Gionta and Prust for the top 9 wingers. Let him walk. We're already full and there is bound to be a young guy who impress next training camp.[/QUOTE

Add Desharnais, and Pleks, and you have 8 guys for 9 jobs. Louis or Kristo or Mr. Surprise should be able to fill the last job.

The natural improvement from the two Gallys, plus the contributions from the new guy should be able to make up for the loss of Ryder.

Would we have cap space?

Ok, can I change my vote now?
Cap space is not a problem. We even had space for either Getzlaf or Perry, who were the last guys people were pencilling in as the replacement for Ryder or Gionta. But guess what? We didn't get either of them.

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05-05-2013, 05:31 PM
  #60
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Why would anyone want cap space instead of a 30 goal scorer...come on...

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05-05-2013, 05:34 PM
  #61
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playoffs are critical for ryder. he was on fire when we got him back. however, i do suspect he still has a lingering upper body injury. i know that doesn't related to his foot speed, but he's a scorer, nonetheless. has that uncanny positional anticipation and quick shot.

2-3 yrs max. 3.5.

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05-05-2013, 05:37 PM
  #62
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Originally Posted by Analyzer View Post
Not to sign.

When he's not scoring he's doing nothing.

For Boston in the playoffs he was huge.

On the side of reasons to sign he seems to consistently get 25-30 goals.
one year is my max

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05-05-2013, 05:40 PM
  #63
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[QUOTE=Habbadasher;65353155]
Quote:
Originally Posted by JesusBouillon View Post
Next year, barring changes, we already have 2x Gallys, Pacioretty, Bourque, Gionta and Prust for the top 9 wingers. Let him walk. We're already full and there is bound to be a young guy who impress next training camp.[/QUOTE

Add Desharnais, and Pleks, and you have 8 guys for 9 jobs. Louis or Kristo or Mr. Surprise should be able to fill the last job.

The natural improvement from the two Gallys, plus the contributions from the new guy should be able to make up for the loss of Ryder.

Would we have cap space?

Ok, can I change my vote now?
You forgot Eller.

We're full barring injuries, and in this case it would be an opportunity for a Collberg, Leblanc, Kristo, Hudon or someone else to get a shot.

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05-05-2013, 05:47 PM
  #64
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Originally Posted by Brainiac View Post
Ha ha... right! Let's sign Galchenyuk on a short term deal for the next 8 years! I also heard Jagr may sign a huge, extra-long term one year extension with the Bruins!

What kind of logic is this?

Short term: 1-2 years
Middle of the road: 3 years
Long term: 5+ years

Older players (35+) don't sign 'long term' deals for 2-3 years. They just sign short terms deals and that's it.

We could argue about it, but there's no way Ryder, at 33, considers a 3 years deal 'long term' and thus suited to lower AAV. It's short/middle term and show me the money.

So don't bother offering 3.5 for 3 years (10.5M total). He will very easily get the same amount for 2 years (@5.25M/y) on the UFA market.

No wonder why people are usually disappointed when we sign players.
There has to be a lot of owners out there that are glad you aren't the GM....

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05-05-2013, 05:48 PM
  #65
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These polls need to be done over the summer when the events of the entire season can sink in.

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05-05-2013, 05:49 PM
  #66
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Let him go and give a chance to Kristo and sign Bourdeleau and another big body for the 4th line...

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05-05-2013, 05:49 PM
  #67
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Keep him at 2.5 for 2 years. If someone wants a 33 year old small player for more? Have at it.

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05-05-2013, 05:53 PM
  #68
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Ryder will look for a jackpot contract coming off two good offensive seasons. So forget those 1 year 3.5m deals, It's not going to happen unless no other team wants him which is also not going to happen.

Personally i don't want the Habs to be the team to give him that long term contract so i'd let him walk.

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05-05-2013, 06:00 PM
  #69
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Originally Posted by BaseballCoach View Post

Cap space is not a problem. We even had space for either Getzlaf or Perry, who were the last guys people were pencilling in as the replacement for Ryder or Gionta. But guess what? We didn't get either of them.
There's still some interesting names out there, obviously depending on how much they ask.
Horton, Clarkson, Boyes, Penner, Clowe, Gordon, Stalberg, Bickell...
Different roles for sure, some could be potential comeback projects like Penner and Clowe. But Ryder should still be one of these options. He's a safe bet for some goals and isn't as bad defensively as he used to be.
I know he's a center, but if he does hit the market, I would definitely try to bring back Koivu so he can eventually retire where he should.

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05-05-2013, 06:02 PM
  #70
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He'll ask and get too much money

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05-05-2013, 06:17 PM
  #71
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we can answer better after the P.O. / Cup Parade

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05-05-2013, 06:26 PM
  #72
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Why would anyone want cap space instead of a 30 goal scorer...come on...
The only thing that wins more cups than cap space is draft picks

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05-05-2013, 06:27 PM
  #73
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Not to sign.

When he's not scoring he's doing nothing.

For Boston in the playoffs he was huge.

On the side of reasons to sign he seems to consistently get 25-30 goals.
25-30 goals a year ain't something you throw away lightly. I say offer him a decent deal depending on what he does in the playoff. Off course if you decided to bring him back you should sign him now just in case he goes all Conn Smythe in the next two months and price himself out of Montreal.

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05-05-2013, 06:54 PM
  #74
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Originally Posted by HCH View Post
There has to be a lot of owners out there that are glad you aren't the GM....
I sure don't want to be a GM! I'm just stating the obvious.

Michael Ryder, proven vet, 30 goals scorer, coming out of 2 good offensive seasons and at least 1 good playoff run (we don't know yet for this year).

Yeah right, 2 years at 3.5 per.

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05-05-2013, 07:05 PM
  #75
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Well if we can't sign a replacement like Clowe or Clarkson, I'd like to see him resigned for a couple of years.
The problem with guys like that they will get massively overpaid for their value and probably get 4-5-6 year deal which is a hard fit on our current roster and would ahve a high percetage of being a terrible contract.

If you spend 22.5 mil over 5 years on Clowe, odds are by the end he'll be a guy that will be worth only half his cap hit. He's already slow and slowed down this year and he's been banged up a lot diring his career. Plus, the Habs play a fast paced system where you ahve to overload the puck with pressure and having a guy slow as molasses like him makes it hard.

Clarkson is in a simialr boat, though he is a better skater but doesn't bring above average size(6'2" 225lbs vs 6'1" 200lbs) like Clowe, plus because the UFA market is pretty dry and he had 30 goals last year, he will also get around a 4.5 mil cap hit over 4-5-6 years and if the Habs have a good team, he'll be a 3rd liner. He isn't a top 6 guy on a top contender.

At least Ryder we may get a home town discount and he might sign for 3 years. Plus his odds of giving us top 6 forward production is quite a bit higher. Money spent on a scrapper or banger should be spent on a 4th liner.

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