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Habs' off-season moves (all trades, proposals & free agent talk here)

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Old
05-05-2013, 11:44 PM
  #476
windycity
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Originally Posted by gusfring View Post
Book it. Bickell will stay with CHI.
Yup. Stahlberg will be gone but Bickell will stay.

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Old
05-05-2013, 11:49 PM
  #477
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Originally Posted by windycity View Post
Yup. Stahlberg will be gone but Bickell will stay.
is Stalberg a great 2 way or only an energy player?

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Old
05-05-2013, 11:53 PM
  #478
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Originally Posted by Frozenice View Post
I never said we shouldn't sign, trade or draft players that can fight, rather I thought we shouldn't waste valuable draft picks on scrap, rental pieces with the faint hope we can go on a Cup run.

I find the Hab's board amusing. On the draft board I'm loco for wanting to draft bigger, stronger players and here I'm a pasty, vegan pacifist. Whatever.
Clowe is not scrap. Maybe to you, but to Gallagher he would be a weapon that allows him to play his game and score.

If you recall, Clowe was interested in a sign and trade. No "valuable draft pick" wasted there.

Murray is going to cost Pittsburgh ONE 2nd round draft pick. Not two, since it is doubtful that the Pens re-sign him. ONE 2nd rounder.

But yeah, ONE 2nd rounder is too "valuable".

BTW, that 2nd round MIGHT make it to the Habs in 4 or 5 years and then its still a very small percentage chance that that player will be anything more than an average "scrap" third liner.

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Old
05-05-2013, 11:56 PM
  #479
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we are managing a plan to build a team in the next year to come and at the same time trying to compete a high level ... i guess we burn our thumb a bit this year!!

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Old
05-05-2013, 11:59 PM
  #480
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Originally Posted by Habitant le colon View Post
is Stalberg a great 2 way or only an energy player?
He's a big winger with amazing speed esp for his size, pretty much a north-south guy with decent skill. Not particularly physical but not bad, can't fight worth crap. 3rd liner, can fill in on 2nd in a pinch. Somebody, hopefully not us, will way overpay for him. I'd actually like to have him but not for the dumb money he will likely get.

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Old
05-06-2013, 12:06 AM
  #481
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Pacioretty Plekanec Bourque
Galchenyuk Eller Gallagher
Prust DD (a 6f03 215lbs)
Moen (a 6f01 210 faceoff specialist) White
Dumont

Gorges Subban
Emelin (a New PPQB)
Tinordi Bouillon
Diaz

Get rid of Markov and Gionta ?!! why not!

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Old
05-06-2013, 12:14 AM
  #482
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Clowe is not scrap. Maybe to you, but to Gallagher he would be a weapon that allows him to play his game and score.

If you recall, Clowe was interested in a sign and trade. No "valuable draft pick" wasted there.

Murray is going to cost Pittsburgh ONE 2nd round draft pick. Not two, since it is doubtful that the Pens re-sign him. ONE 2nd rounder.

But yeah, ONE 2nd rounder is too "valuable".

BTW, that 2nd round MIGHT make it to the Habs in 4 or 5 years and then its still a very small percentage chance that that player will be anything more than an average "scrap" third liner.
We've traded away something like 10 2nd round draft picks in the same amount of years and to me that is enough. Every year, or rather almost every year there is a reason to trade them away. One year it's the Wiz, the year before it's Domenic Moore, the year before it's this guy or that guy.

Those percentages add up and the players teams tend to draft in the 2nd round are the ones we are desperately short of.

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Old
05-06-2013, 12:19 AM
  #483
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Originally Posted by Frozenice View Post
We've traded away something like 10 2nd round draft picks in the same amount of years and to me that is enough. Every year, or rather almost every year there is a reason to trade them away. One year it's the Wiz, the year before it's Domenic Moore, the year before it's this guy or that guy.

Those percentages add up and the players teams tend to draft in the 2nd round are the ones we are desperately short of.
Look at the last 10 years of our drafting. We have had 1st and 2nd rounders...........and no Cup.

Mistakes of the past should not be predictors of the future and cause a GM to have his hands tied.

Wiz should have been re-signed. Moore was a waste, so were the other band-aids that really did not add anything to help the team other than filling a spot and were not impact players.

Drewiske is an example of a wasted signing.

Clowe and Murray would have made an immediate impact on this team.

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Old
05-06-2013, 12:20 AM
  #484
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We need to get bigger. Gionta, Boullion, Desharnais, must go. I like to ship Carey Price out as well as Moen and Diaz.

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Old
05-06-2013, 12:21 AM
  #485
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Look at the last 10 years of our drafting. We have had 1st and 2nd rounders...........and no Cup.

Mistakes of the past should not be predictors of the future and cause a GM to have his hands tied.

Wiz should have been re-signed. Moore was a waste, so were the other band-aids that really did not add anything to help the team other than filling a spot and were not impact players.

Drewiske is an example of a wasted signing.

Clowe and Murray would have made an immediate impact on this team.
Drewiske was procured for a 5th. he's UFA after the year

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Old
05-06-2013, 12:21 AM
  #486
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Originally Posted by Laboeuf View Post
We need to get bigger. Gionta, Boullion, Desharnais, must go. I like to ship Carey Price out as well as Moen and Diaz.
Who do you propose as our #1 goalie?

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Old
05-06-2013, 12:23 AM
  #487
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Moore should have been re-signed. Wiz as well..but I can kinda understand why he wasn't. Our D got very soft and small very quickly.

At one point we had:

Hamr
Wiz
Gill
PK
Mara
Sopel
Spacek
Weber
Markov (injured)

That's a lot of size and grit.

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Old
05-06-2013, 12:24 AM
  #488
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Originally Posted by CHill Seeker View Post
Drewiske was procured for a 5th. he's UFA after the year
A complete waste of a pick.

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Old
05-06-2013, 12:43 AM
  #489
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Look at the last 10 years of our drafting. We have had 1st and 2nd rounders...........and no Cup.

Mistakes of the past should not be predictors of the future and cause a GM to have his hands tied.

Wiz should have been re-signed. Moore was a waste, so were the other band-aids that really did not add anything to help the team other than filling a spot and were not impact players.

Drewiske is an example of a wasted signing.

Clowe and Murray would have made an immediate impact on this team.
Wiz or Moore were "more" important than either Clowe or Murray because after all who would of filled their spot on the roster at the time. Every year an extra player or two is critical, it never seems to change. The drama never ends.

Who are the 2nd rounders you are talking about? We drafted Kristo, P.K. and Maxwell and that's all I can remember from the last decade.

We'll see what Clowe wants this summer and maybe a trade and sign wasn't as easy or feasible as you think.

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Old
05-06-2013, 05:37 AM
  #490
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From snooping around for the past while, I made up a diluted list of what we posters generally think we need and what our surplus is.

Our needs (Suggestions):
4th line goon (Bordeleau, Sestito)
Power Forward (Top-9) (Clowe, Clutterbuck, Malone, C.Stewart, Umberger)
Top-4/#2 Dman (Coburn, R.Murray, M.Staal, Seabrook, Demers, Myers)
Top-6 Skilled Forward/Ryder (Brunner, Cammy, C.Stewart, Horton)
Tough #5/6 dman (O'Byrne, Murray, Regehr)

Surplus:
Defensive prospects
Centers
Skilled fwd prospects
Skilled forwards
Draft picks

Roster players/prospect I would tentatively support moving at the right cost:
Plekanec
Markov
Gionta
Desharnais
Gorges
Diaz
Bourque
Kristo
Moen
Bouillon

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Old
05-06-2013, 05:42 AM
  #491
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Look at the last 10 years of our drafting. We have had 1st and 2nd rounders...........and no Cup.

Mistakes of the past should not be predictors of the future and cause a GM to have his hands tied.

Wiz should have been re-signed. Moore was a waste, so were the other band-aids that really did not add anything to help the team other than filling a spot and were not impact players.

Drewiske is an example of a wasted signing.

Clowe and Murray would have made an immediate impact on this team.
please, enlighten us, we really want to know what kind of (positive) impact Clowe is having in the NYR right now...

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Old
05-06-2013, 06:24 AM
  #492
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Originally Posted by windycity View Post
Who do you propose as our #1 goalie?
Ray Emery, obviously. You know, he can fight !

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Old
05-06-2013, 06:30 AM
  #493
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Originally Posted by hockeyfan2k11 View Post
A complete waste of a pick.
Yep. Seems small for some, but that's a bad move by Bergevin. Who needs 5th rounders right though? It's not like guys like Darren Helm, Jamie Benn, Matt Martin, Gabriel Bourque, Marcus Kruger, Brendan Gallagher, Andrew Shaw could play in this league either....I have nothing against acquiring guys....Just that incredibly enough 5th round is still a good round, and we go and get a guy who can't be in the top 6 of one of the softest D group in the league. Makes no sense. And we KNOW that Drewiske is not back next year. Start to wonder which trade of a 5th round pick was more useless....Drewiske or Mara....

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Old
05-06-2013, 06:59 AM
  #494
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So how do we make another dynasty.... Or at least a year in, year out competitive team?

Really hope Bergevin makes some big moves this year and puts his mark on the team. I know we may not need it to be competitive in the short term but I think the team could really benefit from a change in direction. A couple of things we seem to be lacking are high-impact or dominant players. Galchenyuk looks like he could end up being there but isn't ready yet, Subban is likely there, Pacioretty hasn't shown it this year with Desharnais, Markov is too old, Price has it inconsistently, Gallagher sometimes, Bourque has it this playoffs, Emelin before he was injured, Eller is slowly showing flashes, Plekanec off and on...etc.

I think if there was a time to move on from Plekanec, Markov, Gorges, and Gionta, the time is now. This is Martin's leadership group, successful players but potentially not in our future plans. If we were to truly commit to a rebuild, Plekanec and Gorges should be moved now while their value is highest and Markov and Gionta should be moved now so we don't lose them for nothing. I am a big fan of these players and I think Plekanec is a huge part of the team, I just don't think our offence can sustain being built around him for the next four years.

The returns for Plekanec and Gorges would be quite significant, Gionta and Markov could also potentially have good returns. Gorges + for a #2 dman, too scared to make a proposal around Plekanec, Gionta/Markov for 1sts or prospects?

So, some questions for anyone interested:

Is the team capable of doing a full-on restructuring? Is it the best plan of action? Should we build through the draft? Blow it up and go for a top-5 player in the draft or move up and draft Mantha and Gauthier ? Can we be successful adding to the team we have now? Other than Free Agency, how can we get bigger/tougher? Potential homes for Plekanec/Gionta/Markov/Gorges?

This isn't Bergevin's team, I hope he changes that.

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Old
05-06-2013, 07:02 AM
  #495
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I am going to take a different tack on this game.
I look up at Bergervin and he is taking a lot of notes.

In the past, PG thought nobody fights anymore in the playoffs no need to look for bigger good players, just look for talent.

The Bruins won a cup with a lot of grit. Other teams got bigger.
PG told everyone " dont worry it's a passing thing"

The Habs do have good players. Bergervin added some grit but as he looked down from the press box last night and saw his team lose the game, lose the fights, lose respect all in 3 hours. He took notes.

If there is one thing GOOD about last night it's that Bergervin has seen what EXACTLY the team needs for next year. The good part of this revelation is that it is a LOT easier to add BIG GRIT then a 50 goal scorer. BIG GRIT is still a cheap asset and Bergervin will have a war chest to go BUY 3-4 BIG GRIT players to exchange the smaller semi-grit 4th liners on the current team. Last night proves that more attention must be paid to GRIT players that can WIN A FIGHT. Bergervin will not be fooled into thinking that the current version has enough grit. Habs need BETTER GRIT.

Most everyone already know the Habs are still in rebuild. They had a great year. They won't win a cup this year but the core is good and the future looks very good indeed.

Now just think ahead, let MB hunt for the needed assets this summer.
Let Timmons do HIS THING, he is really good at it.

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Old
05-06-2013, 07:37 AM
  #496
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What do we do with Markov? He still have a certain value on the market? if we keep markov Diaz might have to go because we need a stay at home def now. Weber is already out to.

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Old
05-06-2013, 07:51 AM
  #497
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Originally Posted by ECWHSWI View Post
please, enlighten us, we really want to know what kind of (positive) impact Clowe is having in the NYR right now...
Plus he is looking for a 3-4 yaer deal at a time where his skills look to have declined. A 3-4 year deal is a lot more risky than juast a draft pick.

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05-06-2013, 07:54 AM
  #498
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What do we do with Markov? He still have a certain value on the market? if we keep markov Diaz might have to go because we need a stay at home def now. Weber is already out to.
Ideally you send Tinordi to Hamilton to start the year and you sign a big stay at home guy for 1-2 years. Tinordi is insurance if Emelin isn't ready to start the season.

Keep Subban Markov Diaz as your 3 skill guys. Markov is worth more in the lineup than what you'll get in a trade with only 1 year left on his contract.

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05-06-2013, 08:13 AM
  #499
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Originally Posted by Monctonscout View Post
Ideally you send Tinordi to Hamilton to start the year and you sign a big stay at home guy for 1-2 years. Tinordi is insurance if Emelin isn't ready to start the season.

Keep Subban Markov Diaz as your 3 skill guys. Markov is worth more in the lineup than what you'll get in a trade with only 1 year left on his contract.
He would be a huge acquisition for many teams. He brings more of an impact than many of the deadline deals this year. I think he could get a 1st and prospects from a playoff team. Kaberle was traded for Colbourne + 1st + Cond. 2nd. I'd argue that Markov would bring more to a team than Kaberle did when this trade happened.

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05-06-2013, 08:19 AM
  #500
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What do we do with Markov? He still have a certain value on the market? if we keep markov Diaz might have to go because we need a stay at home def now. Weber is already out to.
You can see what is available out there, but to me people are way too harsh on Markov. He's definitely not as solid as he once was, but this is his first year back after missing so much hockey in the past few years. I think he'll be better next season after some well needed rest, and another summer of good training.

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