HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Islanders
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
Notices

Good conversations between Nino + NYI

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
05-06-2013, 08:20 PM
  #76
Richie Daggers Crime
Fistie Daggers Crime
 
Richie Daggers Crime's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: NYI fan in Atl
Posts: 9,240
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by redbull View Post
and then there's Luongo. He's the guy I'd target.

His contract is atrocious and there's zero way to get out from under it.

Richie Daggers Crime is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-06-2013, 08:22 PM
  #77
PWJunior
Beware the POOP!
 
PWJunior's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Watertown, MA
Country: United States
Posts: 13,449
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richie Daggers Crime View Post
His contract is atrocious and there's zero way to get out from under it.
Not unless Vancouver buys him out and he's available on the open market. It is certainly a possibility.

PWJunior is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-06-2013, 08:43 PM
  #78
redbull
BeLIeve in miracles!
 
redbull's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,659
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richie Daggers Crime View Post
His contract is atrocious and there's zero way to get out from under it.
So they can take DP's contract back

Luongo's a sure fire superstar in net....almost everyone else available comes with more uncertainty or a hgh price tag (players and salary)

redbull is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-06-2013, 09:03 PM
  #79
Riseonfire
R+L=J
 
Riseonfire's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Posts: 5,639
vCash: 500
I made the Bernier to NYI thread in the trade forum.

2 deals were agreed upon by mult. Kings fans.

1. Nino for Bernier straight up (I'd rather pass, Nino has had development time and is close to contributing.)

2. 1st rounder (Maybe a 3rd or 4th as well) for Bernier. (Kings fans like this better because they get to pick whoever THEY like)

Riseonfire is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-06-2013, 09:11 PM
  #80
KingLio21093
Casey Zeeky
 
KingLio21093's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: Garden City, NY
Country: United States
Posts: 2,831
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riseonfire View Post
I made the Bernier to NYI thread in the trade forum.

2 deals were agreed upon by mult. Kings fans.

1. Nino for Bernier straight up (I'd rather pass, Nino has had development time and is close to contributing.)

2. 1st rounder (Maybe a 3rd or 4th as well) for Bernier. (Kings fans like this better because they get to pick whoever THEY like)
I honestly like #2 better too. We have enough solid prospects in our system right now, and giving a few draft picks is not a bad idea. Plus we keep Nino as well.

KingLio21093 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-06-2013, 09:13 PM
  #81
PWJunior
Beware the POOP!
 
PWJunior's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Watertown, MA
Country: United States
Posts: 13,449
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riseonfire View Post
I made the Bernier to NYI thread in the trade forum.

2 deals were agreed upon by mult. Kings fans.

1. Nino for Bernier straight up (I'd rather pass, Nino has had development time and is close to contributing.)

2. 1st rounder (Maybe a 3rd or 4th as well) for Bernier. (Kings fans like this better because they get to pick whoever THEY like)
I'd rather keep Nino, he's a homegrown kid who is nearing NHL readiness. We drafted him for a reason and he still projects to be that big, goal scoring winger that we've been looking for.

I'd be ok with a draft pick package for Bernier. He'd fit nicely with the core and he could blossom as the #1 guy.

redbull's mention of Luongo is interesting though. Let's say the Canucks buy him out, would he be willing to join a young team on the rise? To the organization that originally drafted him and should never have traded him in the first place (yeah, thanks Milbury - you tool). Money wouldn't be an issue since he's gonna get his money from the buyout anyway. If Snow could somehow pull it off, we're suddenly a legit contender. He'd only cost money. Eh, he'll probably sign in Florida, but it's still interesting.

PWJunior is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 12:56 AM
  #82
drive45
Registered User
 
drive45's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: closer than I appear
Country: Isle of Man
Posts: 452
vCash: 500
Nino in Intrntnl

Switzerland is 3-0 in the IIHF, and has beaten Sweden, Czech R.,and Canada. Nino leads the team in Goals (3) and has scored 27.25% of the team's goals. Tied for team lead in +/-, with a +4. I want him. And if we don't get him, I want a lot for him.

drive45 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 03:45 AM
  #83
jonas2244
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 1,199
vCash: 500
Nino plays very good, he wins so many battles, he checks, he makes great plays with the puck and also plays very solid in defense. Just no comparison from what I saw one year ago. Plays with a lot of confidence, like the rest of the team.

He's still not the best skater, probably one of the weaker skaters on the swiss team.

jonas2244 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 07:18 AM
  #84
Beastrt
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 290
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Riseonfire View Post
I made the Bernier to NYI thread in the trade forum.

2 deals were agreed upon by mult. Kings fans.

1. Nino for Bernier straight up (I'd rather pass, Nino has had development time and is close to contributing.)

2. 1st rounder (Maybe a 3rd or 4th as well) for Bernier. (Kings fans like this better because they get to pick whoever THEY like)
I would only do the 2nd one i think that we are a team with leverage here i would give up the 1st rounder and maybe a 3rd or poulin.

I was looking at cap geek and the only teams in the league who really need goalies are the devils, coyotes, and flames. There may be a couple other teams interested like the leafs but i dont think any other team would be willing to give up a 1st rounder or a top prospect.

Beastrt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 09:34 AM
  #85
redbull
BeLIeve in miracles!
 
redbull's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,659
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by jonas2244 View Post
Nino plays very good, he wins so many battles, he checks, he makes great plays with the puck and also plays very solid in defense. Just no comparison from what I saw one year ago. Plays with a lot of confidence, like the rest of the team.

He's still not the best skater, probably one of the weaker skaters on the swiss team.
thanks for the update! I see many of the same things. There's one glaring problem with Nino's skating, it's a combination of his first-step/quickness AND his balance/strength. I'm not sure if it's his strength-on-his-skates or overall body/man-strength or BOTH but he doesn't seem to be able to use his size to fight through and battle big defenders - YET.

If he can improve in that area alone, he will be deadly in the NHL.

He'll never have breakaway speed or acceleration to win many foot races but that won't matter. He has the potential to dominate games down low and his net presence is outstanding. Like Anders Lee but with much better hands & NHL shot.

I've been one of Snow's biggest critics of late but one thing I give him full credit for is in how he's drafted and the patience he's shown with players - specifically Joensuu, Petrov, Kabanov, Bailey, Okposo, Niederreiter, Rakhshani even. Maintaining their rights, allowing them to play and develop.

I hated Bailey playing at 18 and Nino playing at 18 and I think there were other thing$ going on at the time - but seeing some of these guys at 22-23-24 is pretty special. There's a whole wave of players coming along nicely, great problems to be had, soon.

Reminds me of the Blues.

redbull is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 10:15 AM
  #86
scott99
Registered User
 
scott99's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 6,566
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by redbull View Post
thanks for the update! I see many of the same things. There's one glaring problem with Nino's skating, it's a combination of his first-step/quickness AND his balance/strength. I'm not sure if it's his strength-on-his-skates or overall body/man-strength or BOTH but he doesn't seem to be able to use his size to fight through and battle big defenders - YET.

If he can improve in that area alone, he will be deadly in the NHL.

He'll never have breakaway speed or acceleration to win many foot races but that
won't matter. He has the potential to dominate games down low and his net presence is outstanding. Like Anders Lee but with much better hands & NHL shot.

I've been one of Snow's biggest critics of late but one thing I give him full credit for is in how he's drafted and the patience he's shown with players - specifically Joensuu, Petrov, Kabanov, Bailey, Okposo, Niederreiter, Rakhshani even. Maintaining their rights, allowing them to play and develop.

I hated Bailey playing at 18 and Nino playing at 18 and I think there were other thing$ going on at the time - but seeing some of these guys at 22-23-24 is pretty special. There's a whole wave of players coming along nicely, great problems to be had, soon.

Reminds me of the Blues.
It's funny you mentioned the skating. The first impression I got of Nino, back before we drafted him, while he was playing at the WJHC in 2010, was that he was a poor man's Ovechkin minus the skating. He's big, he can score, he loves to hit, and has a love for the game. IF he improves his skating, he's gonna be a beast. Still quite impressed he scored 28 goals as a 20 year old in the AHL.

scott99 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 11:07 AM
  #87
OlTimeHockey
Registered User
 
OlTimeHockey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: home
Country: China
Posts: 15,850
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by PWJunior View Post
I'd rather keep Nino, he's a homegrown kid who is nearing NHL readiness. We drafted him for a reason and he still projects to be that big, goal scoring winger that we've been looking for.
five words I am relieved to hear/read. When a fan is willing to let a kid become a man, we have a chance. When a kid types, "let's see what he can do/he's done all he could at that level/he was great in camp, so..../he's better than Boyes," I see someone trying hard to ruin a young player's development.

Well, through magic internet powers.

Maybe someone all gung ho to bring up Reinhart can read the above statement and focus on the word, "ready."

A soufflé is always best when it's done. Think about that fact a bit.

OlTimeHockey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 11:32 AM
  #88
Richie Daggers Crime
Fistie Daggers Crime
 
Richie Daggers Crime's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: NYI fan in Atl
Posts: 9,240
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by OlTimeHockey View Post
When a kid types, "let's see what he can do/he's done all he could at that level/he was great in camp, so..../he's better than Boyes," I see someone trying hard to ruin a young player's development.
My favorite is "Hey, why not"

Richie Daggers Crime is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 11:39 AM
  #89
OlTimeHockey
Registered User
 
OlTimeHockey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: home
Country: China
Posts: 15,850
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richie Daggers Crime View Post
My favorite is "Hey, why not"

nice!

and to that answer......imagine a girl saying that to you. Or guy.

Maybe an 18 year old girl/guy's done all they could in the minors and needs a chance and so on.....why not.

OlTimeHockey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 11:47 AM
  #90
Brunomics
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Medford
Country: United States
Posts: 5,296
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by OlTimeHockey View Post
nice!

and to that answer......imagine a girl saying that to you. Or guy.

Maybe an 18 year old girl/guy's done all they could in the minors and needs a chance and so on.....why not.
Remember when Milbury proudly proclaimed he was going to throw Fichaud to the wolves and see how he would do when he wasn't even remotely ready to start in the NHL? That's my favorite saying.

Brunomics is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 11:54 AM
  #91
OlTimeHockey
Registered User
 
OlTimeHockey's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: home
Country: China
Posts: 15,850
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brunomics View Post
Remember when Milbury proudly proclaimed he was going to throw Fichaud to the wolves and see how he would do when he wasn't even remotely ready to start in the NHL? That's my favorite saying.
and his career might as well have ended with the wolves.

Chicago Wolves, that is.

OlTimeHockey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 12:44 PM
  #92
Yashin for President
Registered User
 
Yashin for President's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Bestchester
Posts: 1,064
vCash: 500
Nino for Bernier makes too much sense. Im not confident in Poulin at all. I know he is young but in the games he has played so far he doesnt strike me as the kind of goalie that will be a #1 in the future. Nilsson on the other hand looked great last season but this season being sick etc. kind of throws a wrench into his development. Bernier would give the Isles confidence and they can sign Nabby to be a backup. For the people that are worried about giving away a potential star in Nino dont you think the Kings feel the same way about giving up Bernier?

Yashin for President is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 12:56 PM
  #93
Veteran journeyman
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 379
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Yashin for President View Post
Nino for Bernier makes too much sense. Im not confident in Poulin at all. I know he is young but in the games he has played so far he doesnt strike me as the kind of goalie that will be a #1 in the future. Nilsson on the other hand looked great last season but this season being sick etc. kind of throws a wrench into his development. Bernier would give the Isles confidence and they can sign Nabby to be a backup. For the people that are worried about giving away a potential star in Nino dont you think the Kings feel the same way about giving up Bernier?
I think the team still needs a big power forward that can fill the net with pucks. The hope is Nino can be that guy. If they do move him, I hope it's as part of a package for an established player that already is what we hope Nino can become...Vanek, for example (although, if I was going to part with significant assets for him, part of the deal would have to be having an agreement for an extension in place, or something like that).

If it's not part of a package for a true power forward, then I would rather hang onto Nino and see if he can become that player. Having watched him in the Bridge this season, there's already a lot to like about his game, but still a lot of growing and improving to do. But the potential is there.

Goaltending will probably be easier to come by when a potential starter no longer believes he'll be automatically shuffled to backup whenever DP is ready to take starts. The Pens got Vokoun for a song. I'm not saying it'll be a cakewalk to get a goalie, and indeed it may take some assets to trade for a young starter if the Isles go that route. I would just prefer it not be Nino. They drafted him because the skill set he will hopefully offer once he develops is something the organization sorely needs.

My concerns about Nino are not with his ability, but rather his relationship with management. We only hear bits and pieces. Maybe the Isles have not communicated well enough with him. Maybe it's just him being a drama queen. I'm not going to point fingers either way, but I hope if he is traded it's done for hockey reasons and not because of conflicting egos and attitudes.

Veteran journeyman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 01:33 PM
  #94
doublechili
Registered User
 
doublechili's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 5,447
vCash: 600
Quote:
Originally Posted by OlTimeHockey View Post
five words I am relieved to hear/read. When a fan is willing to let a kid become a man, we have a chance. When a kid types, "let's see what he can do/he's done all he could at that level/he was great in camp, so..../he's better than Boyes," I see someone trying hard to ruin a young player's development.

Well, through magic internet powers.

Maybe someone all gung ho to bring up Reinhart can read the above statement and focus on the word, "ready."

A soufflé is always best when it's done. Think about that fact a bit.
I do think it's okay to give a young player a try under the right conditions. First you look at 2 things:

1. Is he physically mature enough to survive/thrive?

2. Is he emotionally mature enough?

If those are both "yes", then the next question is:

3. Is his game mature enough (primarily, is his skating and thinking good/quick enough to keep up)?

So if the answer to the first 2 is "yes", and the answer to 3 is "yes" or even "maybe", then I think a trial run is a no-lose proposition.

For example, Anders Lee was a "yes" on 1 and 2, but in his 2 games is was apparent that the answer to 3 was "no". The benefit to him is that he got a taste of the NHL and now knows that he's got to work really hard. He might work harder this summer than if he had gone to the AHL and transitioned pretty easily (who was it that had a great week or two in the AHL - Ryan O'Marra maybe?).

Nino is the poster boy for failing the 3 part test. He may have been physically mature enough, but likely was not emotionally mature enough to be in the NHL. And his skating wasn't ready. Probably not his thinking either. And to compound matters, it wasn't a trial but a full season.

doublechili is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 01:50 PM
  #95
kasper11
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: New York
Posts: 6,734
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by duster19 View Post
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/l...026722013.html

couple guys there with similar seasons. Nino had a good yr, but its crazy to think other orgs dont have prospects that had equal or better seasons then Nino. Personally, im more excited about Nelson...
When you factor in age, not many prospects in the AHL compare with Nino. Of the top-20 goal scorers in the AHL, Nino is the youngest and most of them are career AHL players not legit prospects. Only 2 other players drafted in 2010 made the top-20 (Connolly and Toffoli) and only one drafted in 2009 (Morin).

I think people tend to forget that Nino won't even turn 21 until September.

kasper11 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 02:08 PM
  #96
duster19
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 1,375
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by kasper11 View Post
When you factor in age, not many prospects in the AHL compare with Nino. Of the top-20 goal scorers in the AHL, Nino is the youngest and most of them are career AHL players not legit prospects. Only 2 other players drafted in 2010 made the top-20 (Connolly and Toffoli) and only one drafted in 2009 (Morin).

I think people tend to forget that Nino won't even turn 21 until September.
I think the point of it all was to show that LA has prospects that are in the same grade as Nino. La isnt all of a sudden going to drop everything for Nino because he is slightly younger then their prospects. Some of them are out performing Nino statistically, others are having similar or slightly worse years.

28 goals in 74 goals, while it is impressive for a 20 year old, is not a tremendous stat for the AHL. Lots and lots of players produce at a better clip then that. ie Nelson.

Edit: Lots of love going on for Nino - who threw a tantrum and wanted out - while a kid like Nelson goes under the radar. IMO, much more impressive season from Nelson then Nino, as a true rookie.


Last edited by duster19: 05-07-2013 at 02:13 PM.
duster19 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 02:50 PM
  #97
blinkman360
Back to Basics
 
blinkman360's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Guido Central
Country: United States
Posts: 8,900
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by OlTimeHockey View Post
five words I am relieved to hear/read. When a fan is willing to let a kid become a man, we have a chance. When a kid types, "let's see what he can do/he's done all he could at that level/he was great in camp, so..../he's better than Boyes," I see someone trying hard to ruin a young player's development.

Well, through magic internet powers.

Maybe someone all gung ho to bring up Reinhart can read the above statement and focus on the word, "ready."

A soufflé is always best when it's done. Think about that fact a bit.
Is this the part where you start to talk about Detroit?

blinkman360 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 02:53 PM
  #98
blinkman360
Back to Basics
 
blinkman360's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Guido Central
Country: United States
Posts: 8,900
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by duster19 View Post
I think the point of it all was to show that LA has prospects that are in the same grade as Nino. La isnt all of a sudden going to drop everything for Nino because he is slightly younger then their prospects. Some of them are out performing Nino statistically, others are having similar or slightly worse years.

28 goals in 74 goals, while it is impressive for a 20 year old, is not a tremendous stat for the AHL. Lots and lots of players produce at a better clip then that. ie Nelson.

Edit: Lots of love going on for Nino - who threw a tantrum and wanted out - while a kid like Nelson goes under the radar. IMO, much more impressive season from Nelson then Nino, as a true rookie.
It's probably because Nino's upside is 10X higher than Nelson's.

BTW, Nelson as a "true rookie" is still almost a full year older than Nino.

blinkman360 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 03:00 PM
  #99
redbull
BeLIeve in miracles!
 
redbull's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,659
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by blinkman360 View Post
Is this the part where you start to talk about Detroit?
he mentioned souflee already. There's a good chance OTH is making himself a meal. I'm thinking ribs, but since he's excited to watch hockey tonight, and stay awake, he may settle for a "sanGwich"

DET is far from his mind.

redbull is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 04:00 PM
  #100
blinkman360
Back to Basics
 
blinkman360's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Guido Central
Country: United States
Posts: 8,900
vCash: 500
I know everyone likes to pretend that there is an exact science to developing players, but in reality it's evaluating where a player is at, whether you think they can adapt to the speed, strength and skill of the NHL, and then ultimately taking the risk of actually giving them a shot.

I know everyone, not just OTH, likes to bring up Detroit and how they develop guys the right way, but the only time I remember them having a top-5 pick(Steve Yzerman, 4th overall) they brought him straight to the NHL. We currently have 3 former top-5 picks in our system.

Even Lidstrom only had to wait 2 years. Fedorov waited one. Neither of them were even 1st rounders.

The fact is, top-5 picks generally don't need more than 2 years of seasoning before cracking an NHL lineup. Just from looking at that 2011 draft, out of that entire top-10, all but 2 prospects are not only NHLers, but solid/key contributors to their respective teams this season. RNH, Landeskog, Huberdeau, Larsson, Zibanejad, Couturier, Hamilton, Brodin. One has already won the ROY and is an NHL Captain(Landeskog); One is a ROY candidate this year(Huberdeau); One went to the Stanley Cup Finals last year(Larsson); One helped his team advance in the playoffs last year(Couturier); One is currently a bonafide top line center(RNH); and the other 3 are currently playing for playoff teams(Zib,Hamilton,Brodin).

Based on the stats, I wouldn't rule Strome out for next season... much less a kid like Nino.

blinkman360 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:12 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.