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Anyone hear of expansion/merger plans for ECHL, CHL, SPHL FOR 2013-14?

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04-26-2013, 04:15 PM
  #151
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Originally Posted by Quacky View Post


Ticket info is (and has been) available....

Allen- tickets were being advertised tickets but no amount of games
34 games (33+1 preseason)

Brampton- tickets were advertised for 36 home game(standard in the ECHL)
Includes 36 games (33 regular season and 3 playoff games)

Denver- no ticket info
Season ticket info

Quad city- tickets were advertised but no amount of games were specified.
I'm from Quad City and a STHer who's already bought tickets for next season....it's 33 games

Rapid city- no ticket info
There is ticket info, but the Rush offered at 2-year pkg at the beginning of 2012-13 which most STHers took advantage of

Tulsa- tickets were advertised but no amount of games were specified.
[url-http://www.tulsaoilers.com/tickets/full-season/]33 games...menu at bottom of page[/url]

Fort Worth may move to juniors after this season, especially if they get a junior team in Houston with the Aeros gone.

Rapid City is questionable, but the franchise agreement for each team is valid for 10 years and doesn't include any type of buyout agreement. Rapid is in the 5th year of their 10-year agreement. Not sure how they'd get out, but they may have a plan!

St. Charles....who knows??!!
The link you provided for Allen is for 2012-2013 season tickets. I did not look at the others. There is information about renewals for next year http://www.allenamericans.com/articl...articleid=1384

I have not been a season ticket holder but did purchase tickets already for next year. The handout that I got from the ticket rep was for the 34 game season as posted. The prices did go up from last years and are quite a bit higher than they are for the renewals. If they kept the per game prices the same the price increase would all for the extra home games in the ECHL.

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04-27-2013, 12:34 PM
  #152
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Rumors currently floating around the Fort Worth Brahmas fan base:

At least Allen and Rapid City are off to the ECHL. I think it has to be more than Allen because they're no where near the Southeastern teams or the Western teams. Allen would basically be another Alaska.

If the Brahmas are back, it likely won't be in NYTEX. If they play 13-14, a move back to Fort Worth proper appears to be in the cards whether that's FWCC or Will Rogers.

Basically Brahmas fans are wondering if the team will play next season and if so, what league and where will be home.

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04-27-2013, 07:50 PM
  #153
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Originally Posted by FrancoRussianAlaskan View Post
At least Allen and Rapid City are off to the ECHL. I think it has to be more than Allen because they're no where near the Southeastern teams or the Western teams. Allen would basically be another Alaska.
I've heard about Allen and Rapid City going ECHL on several different forums. People can say it's just smoke right now, but I suspect there's a real fire burning. Once the CHL playoffs conclude, we're likely to hear about their departure.

Some people say this could be a death knell for the CHL, but I'm inclined to believe the league will attempt to soldier on without those two markets. Whether that attempt will be feasible is another question. With Bloomington's ownership situation hazy right now and Saint Charles totally MIA, there are way too many bumps in the road.

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04-28-2013, 07:21 PM
  #154
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http://centralhockeyleague.com/news/?article_id=9710
Brampton Beast logo revealed

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04-28-2013, 09:10 PM
  #155
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Originally Posted by CHRDANHUTCH View Post
what that person doesn't get is both Wheeling and Elmira aren't going anywhere, in fact most hockey fans should be thrilled now that Freeman and his partner have booted the Afr's out of team ownership for good, before Elmira went the way of Port Huron and Louisville.

I'm not sure Carver Arena wants to deal w/ a hockey team after having been bought out either, much like how IEC in Des Moines had to deal w/ the Schlegel debacle.
Explain Hutch my dear. Trenton just folded last I checked. This leaves in the "Northeast" Reading, Elmira and Wheeling. Two of these teams had awful attendance. If that continues long term they won't last, it's basic economics. You can only bleed red for so long. I'm not sure why most hockey fans would be that thrilled as far as the Northeast is concerned theres not much left in this league, they aren't a vital franchise to the league by any stretch of the imagination. They are no Florida, South Carolina, Gwinnett, Alaska or Cincinnati.

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04-28-2013, 10:28 PM
  #156
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Not awful.

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04-29-2013, 12:13 AM
  #157
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If the ECHL northeast can hang for a couple more seasons maybe they could put a team in the Bronx at the complex the Kingsbridge Armory and Danbury could get an ECHL quality arena.

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04-29-2013, 11:22 PM
  #158
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Originally Posted by FrancoRussianAlaskan View Post
If the ECHL northeast can hang for a couple more seasons maybe they could put a team in the Bronx at the complex the Kingsbridge Armory and Danbury could get an ECHL quality arena.
I'm liking that Kingsbridge Armory plan...

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04-30-2013, 10:10 AM
  #159
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any news on richmond getting a team in the sphl

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04-30-2013, 10:11 AM
  #160
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and how many teams will the FHL have next year?

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04-30-2013, 10:12 AM
  #161
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Not awful.
i think it looks cool could have been better.

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04-30-2013, 01:12 PM
  #162
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IMO its one of the best looking logos in Minor League Hockey.

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04-30-2013, 03:09 PM
  #163
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any news on richmond getting a team in the sphl
It's looking highly unlikely at this point. We should know the 13-14 makeup of the SPHL come May 15.

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05-07-2013, 10:30 AM
  #164
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CHL Death Watch Thread

An "official" news source in Rapid City is already publicly stating the Rush are off to the ECHL:

https://www.facebook.com/pages/KOTA-...ation=timeline

Quote:
From Sports Director Vic Quick. The Rush will make a major announcement next Wednesday, May 15th. It's expected the team will move up to the ECHL.
Allen is likely to join Rapid City based on most reliable accounts.

Bloomington does not have functioning ownership.

Saint Charles is almost certainly DOA this fall.

Fort Worth continues to have a hazy future/building issues.

I still say the CHL has a chance to return to this fall, but it won't be pretty at all.

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05-07-2013, 12:24 PM
  #165
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Originally Posted by mfrerkes View Post
An "official" news source in Rapid City is already publicly stating the Rush are off to the ECHL:

https://www.facebook.com/pages/KOTA-...ation=timeline


Allen is likely to join Rapid City based on most reliable accounts.
I know the ECHL made a cap on itself for 26 or something around that number but I think it should go to 30. I don't know all the business aspects but for next season the ECHL will most likely have 24 teams (addition of Allen and Rapid City, subtraction of Trenton). For the 2014-15 season the CHL should be gone by then and the ECHL should add Tulsa, Wichita, Brampton, Missouri along with the expansions of Indianapolis and Peoria. I know this is a lot so hang with me...

Atlantic: Elmira, Wheeling, Toledo, Reading, Brampton
North: Kalamazoo, Indianapolis, Evansville, Fort Wayne, Cincinnati
South: Florida, Greenville, Gwinnett, Orlando, South Carolina
Central: Peoria, Missouri, Wichita, Allen, Tulsa
Mountain: Alaska, Boise, Colorado, Rapid City, Utah
Pacific: Bakersfield, San Francisco, Las Vegas, Ontario, Stockton

So there's the 30-team league. I think the best way to have it is with 30 NHL, 30 AHL and 30 ECHL teams.


Last edited by JB51Hockey: 05-08-2013 at 02:32 PM.
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05-07-2013, 12:35 PM
  #166
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Still think that that "cap" is only there to prevent the ECHL from growing too big right now and thereby have room to gobble up a few CHL markets, like Rapid City, when the time comes. Making a 30-30-30 split across the NHL-AHL-ECHL just makes the most sense, but if they want to do that with a handful of CHL teams eventually joining they've got to artificially hold off immediate growth somehow.

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05-07-2013, 06:16 PM
  #167
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Originally Posted by jeben51 View Post
I know the ECHL made a cap on itself for 26 or something around that number but I think it should go to 30. I don't know all the business aspects but for next season the ECHL will most likely have 24 teams (addition of Allen and Rapid City, subtraction of Trenton). For the 2014-15 season the CHL should be gone by then and the ECHL should add Tulsa, Wichita, Brampton, Missouri along with the expansions of Indianapolis and Peoria. I know this is a lot so hang with me...

Atlantic: Elmira, Wheeling, Toledo, Reading, Brampton
North: Kalamazoo, Indianapolis, Evansville, Fort Wayne, Cincinnati
South: Florida, Greenville, Gwinnett, Orlando, Florida
Central: Peoria, Missouri, Wichita, Allen, Tulsa
Mountain: Alaska, Boise, Colorado, Rapid City, Utah
Pacific: Bakersfield, San Francisco, Las Vegas, Ontario, Stockton

So there's the 30-team league. I think the best way to have it is with 30 NHL, 30 AHL and 30 ECHL teams.
I'm kinda perplexed that you've chosen Brampton as a potential surviving team from the CHL over Denver, Bloomington, and most importantly Arizona. If Brampton for years couldn't succeed in drawing flies to see a successful junior franchise in a market where junior hockey is king, their future attendance will consist of the ushers, the hot-dog vendor, and a goal judge for borderline AA level minor pro hockey.

Arizona on the other hand have put together a wildly successful season ticket campaign and their spokesperson has said publicly that they will be icing a team next season but they're just not sure in what league. It won't be in the NAHL because why would they have 1000+ game pro and team captain Jason Morgan take part in being suspended above the ground in a wrench lift for days if they were planning on dropping to junior hockey?

Bloomington on the other hand have been given almost zero chance of being successful, as either the Prairie Thunder or the Blaze, due to horrible teams never being successful and equally horrible marketing in that city. If ever there was a catalyst that could change the fate of the franchise, it would be a move to the ECHL complete with new rivalaries with regional opponents like Peoria, Ft. Wayne, and Indy. If they could ever settle ownsership issues, I'd take them over Brampton for the ECHL at the drop of a hat. Victoria Salmon Kings struggled at the gate and so would Brampton. There's just no appetite in Canadian markets other than "the big show", junior, or CIS as proven by consistent attendance numbers in places like Abbotsford and Hamilton. Semi-Minor Pro has very little chance of being successful.

I will say this though, I think that the Denver Cutthroats were never meant to be more than just a one year stop gap to fill the void of the impending NHL labor impasse. Casper Wy. might be an eventual option for the ECHL too.

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05-07-2013, 07:34 PM
  #168
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Originally Posted by paul-laus View Post
I'm kinda perplexed that you've chosen Brampton as a potential surviving team from the CHL over Denver, Bloomington, and most importantly Arizona. If Brampton for years couldn't succeed in drawing flies to see a successful junior franchise in a market where junior hockey is king, their future attendance will consist of the ushers, the hot-dog vendor, and a goal judge for borderline AA level minor pro hockey.

I will say this though, I think that the Denver Cutthroats were never meant to be more than just a one year stop gap to fill the void of the impending NHL labor impasse. Casper Wy. might be an eventual option for the ECHL too.
I think minor league hockey will work there ONLY if they can land a Leafs affiliation. If Brampton can survive in the mid 2,000 for attendance next season I think they can make the jump to the ECHL with a Toronto affiliation. I don't see Arizona moving to the E after averaging 2,500 which would be a bottom 3 in the ECHL. Especially considering they are affiliated with PHX that is only an hour and 30 away... How can you justify 2,900 in Denver in an inaugural season as a success? I chose Brampton because the ECHL is desperate for northeastern franchises with Trenton ceasing operations. No way hockey in Wyoming works either...

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05-07-2013, 08:01 PM
  #169
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I was wondering too why you have Florida and then Florida in the South division? I know the Everblades are one of the teams and I see you have Orlando, but who is the other Florida team?

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05-07-2013, 08:36 PM
  #170
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Originally Posted by jeben51 View Post
I think minor league hockey will work there ONLY if they can land a Leafs affiliation. If Brampton can survive in the mid 2,000 for attendance next season I think they can make the jump to the ECHL with a Toronto affiliation. I don't see Arizona moving to the E after averaging 2,500 which would be a bottom 3 in the ECHL. Especially considering they are affiliated with PHX that is only an hour and 30 away... How can you justify 2,900 in Denver in an inaugural season as a success? I chose Brampton because the ECHL is desperate for northeastern franchises with Trenton ceasing operations. No way hockey in Wyoming works either...


You might be right about Casper Wy, but 4-5 years ago there was a lot of people scratching their heads about a professional hockey team coming to Rapid City thinking it would fail for sure. It was a non traditional hockey market too but the simple truth about the winter season in smaller prairie towns and cities is there isn't a hell of a lot to do and people still do want a night out and entertainment options for their hard earned dollar.

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05-07-2013, 10:12 PM
  #171
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I'm kinda perplexed that you've chosen Brampton as a potential surviving team from the CHL over Denver, Bloomington, and most importantly Arizona. If Brampton for years couldn't succeed in drawing flies to see a successful junior franchise in a market where junior hockey is king, their future attendance will consist of the ushers, the hot-dog vendor, and a goal judge for borderline AA level minor pro hockey.
I agree regarding Brampton. It is (at best) an unproven commodity in AA hockey and was an abject failure in junior hockey. If the CHL survives another season, I think Brampton's attendance could go lower than the 1,762 Fort Worth averaged this past season.

I'd put Quad City or Bloomington ahead of Brampton for an ECHL franchise...not that either are particularly strong hockey markets. They just have a better overall history than Brampton does right now. They'd also work well enough to fit between the North or Central divisions.

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05-08-2013, 11:59 AM
  #172
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North: Kalamazoo, Indianapolis, Evansville, Fort Wayne, Cincinnati
So hope this happens. Didn't get into hockey early enough to remember the Indy & Fort Wayne rivalry. Got into hockey around the CHL Indy Ice days when there really wasn't any close competition. Tried to like the USHL Ice but highly prefer going to Cincy and watching the ECHL. Really hoping with the renovation to what was Pepsi Coliseum, that Indy gets another pro hockey team. From what I read, future looks good for that.

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05-08-2013, 02:33 PM
  #173
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I was wondering too why you have Florida and then Florida in the South division? I know the Everblades are one of the teams and I see you have Orlando, but who is the other Florida team?
Whoops, got confused. One of the Florida's is supposed to be South Carolina

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05-09-2013, 04:53 PM
  #174
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Originally Posted by jeben51 View Post
I know the ECHL made a cap on itself for 26 or something around that number but I think it should go to 30. I don't know all the business aspects but for next season the ECHL will most likely have 24 teams (addition of Allen and Rapid City, subtraction of Trenton). For the 2014-15 season the CHL should be gone by then and the ECHL should add Tulsa, Wichita, Brampton, Missouri along with the expansions of Indianapolis and Peoria. I know this is a lot so hang with me...

Atlantic: Elmira, Wheeling, Toledo, Reading, Brampton
North: Kalamazoo, Indianapolis, Evansville, Fort Wayne, Cincinnati
South: Florida, Greenville, Gwinnett, Orlando, South Carolina
Central: Peoria, Missouri, Wichita, Allen, Tulsa
Mountain: Alaska, Boise, Colorado, Rapid City, Utah
Pacific: Bakersfield, San Francisco, Las Vegas, Ontario, Stockton

So there's the 30-team league. I think the best way to have it is with 30 NHL, 30 AHL and 30 ECHL teams.
I like the make up of the Central Division. With the exception of Allen, it looks a lot like the IHL of the early 1990's.

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05-09-2013, 10:27 PM
  #175
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It seems like most people on these boards and the Into The Boards forums have got the impression that the ECHL wouldn't touch CHL markets like Arizona, Ft. Worth, and Bloomington based on attendance alone. While the obvious options like Allen, Rapid City, and Missouri are up for grabs, it's not as if the ECHL haven't propped up their own failed markets for years at a time as well. The mere fact that Wheeling and Elmira are back this season suggests to me that it isn't that unthinkable that the ECHL might at least consider these CHL markets in a new league with better rivalries. The bigger issue for Bloomington is ownership as opposed to attendance and for Ft. Worth a building to play in.

All one has to do is check out ECHL attendance numbers on a weeknight to realize that 40-50% of the ECHL's markets attendance are pretty close to most of the CHL markets. Charleston and Cincinatti (who are considered to be pretty stable) seemed to to be barely above 3,000 most times I looked and some times under 2,000. To think that a few of the CHL markets couldn't make the jump to the ECHL based on attendance alone belies the fact that the ECHL has markets that have had horrendous attendance for years with a few owners that are prepared to eat the costs. If Trenton's owners were prepared to give it another go this year, the ECHL would have welcomed them back with open arms for another money losing season.

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