HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > The History of Hockey
Mobile Hockey's Future Become a Sponsor Site Rules Support Forum vBookie Page 2
The History of Hockey Relive great moments in hockey history and discuss how the game has changed over time.

Jersey that Pronger will go into HOF with?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
05-07-2013, 11:28 AM
  #26
quoipourquoi
Goaltender
 
quoipourquoi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Hockeytown, MI
Country: United States
Posts: 3,116
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hobnobs View Post
He shouldnt go in at all. He is most likely the most overrated player atm.
So how many defensemen born in the 1970s and 1980s do you want to put in the Hall of Fame? Because, he's the second best one we're going to have.

quoipourquoi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 11:42 AM
  #27
Hobnobs
Pinko
 
Hobnobs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Country: Sweden
Posts: 3,096
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by quoipourquoi View Post
So how many defensemen born in the 1970s and 1980s do you want to put in the Hall of Fame? Because, he's the second best one we're going to have.
Why should we care about birthyears? I prefer Chara over Pronger tbh

Hobnobs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 11:45 AM
  #28
Chalupa Batman
Mod Supervisor
 
Chalupa Batman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 23,221
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hobnobs View Post
Why should we care about birthyears? I prefer Chara over Pronger tbh
You're sure making a great case. Try and stay focused.

Chalupa Batman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 12:00 PM
  #29
Killion
Global Moderator
 
Killion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Casablanca
Country: Morocco
Posts: 21,797
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taco MacArthur View Post
You're sure making a great case. Try and stay focused.
... Im thinkin Chara's got a ways to go yet, but its possible. His skatings' certainly improved.

Killion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 12:37 PM
  #30
Hobnobs
Pinko
 
Hobnobs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Country: Sweden
Posts: 3,096
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taco MacArthur View Post
You're sure making a great case. Try and stay focused.
Whats the case for Pronger except the hart? That he happened to play for teams at the right moment? Oilers catching lightning in a bottle, Ducks who played just as well without Pronger or Flyers where he was outplayed by Timonen in the finals and then broke the team up because he clashed with the captain.

Hobnobs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 01:04 PM
  #31
quoipourquoi
Goaltender
 
quoipourquoi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Hockeytown, MI
Country: United States
Posts: 3,116
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hobnobs View Post
Whats the case for Pronger except the hart? That he happened to play for teams at the right moment? Oilers catching lightning in a bottle, Ducks who played just as well without Pronger or Flyers where he was outplayed by Timonen in the finals and then broke the team up because he clashed with the captain.
Except the Hart? Are you trying to handicap the conversation by not talking about a HART TROPHY? Yeah, we're going to talk about the Hart Trophy; you said he shouldn't be a HOFer.

All of those teams you just named that made the Finals in their first season with Pronger also missed the playoffs in their first season without Pronger. Also, yes, he has a Hart Trophy. And yes, he was being talked about for the Hart in 2001 prior to getting injured by his own teammates twice. And not surprisingly, the Ducks did not play well without Pronger when he was injured in 2007.

Pronger's 2001 and 2007 are like Crosby's 2011 and 2013; you can't really give him a trophy, but he was the best player in the league in the first half of the season. It's a level (that in conjunction with the Hart that he did win) that Zdeno Chara has yet to reach... which is probably the first time anyone has ever accused that man of not being able to reach something.

quoipourquoi is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 01:09 PM
  #32
HabsByTheBay
Registered User
 
HabsByTheBay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: London
Country: United States
Posts: 1,172
vCash: 500
If you ignore all the time Pronger's been great, he's been terrible!

HabsByTheBay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 01:43 PM
  #33
Hobnobs
Pinko
 
Hobnobs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Country: Sweden
Posts: 3,096
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by quoipourquoi View Post
Except the Hart? Are you trying to handicap the conversation by not talking about a HART TROPHY? Yeah, we're going to talk about the Hart Trophy; you said he shouldn't be a HOFer.

All of those teams you just named that made the Finals in their first season with Pronger also missed the playoffs in their first season without Pronger. Also, yes, he has a Hart Trophy. And yes, he was being talked about for the Hart in 2001 prior to getting injured by his own teammates twice. And not surprisingly, the Ducks did not play well without Pronger when he was injured in 2007.

Pronger's 2001 and 2007 are like Crosby's 2011 and 2013; you can't really give him a trophy, but he was the best player in the league in the first half of the season. It's a level (that in conjunction with the Hart that he did win) that Zdeno Chara has yet to reach... which is probably the first time anyone has ever accused that man of not being able to reach something.
I said except for the hart because that is the obvious argument not that I meant we should exclude from his merits.

Ducks did fine without him in the playoffs, thats what I meant. Which is lucky for him. How would his legacy had looked if Wings made the finals instead of the Ducks because Pronger decided to elbow Homer or if they lost the finals because he decided to elbow McAmmond?

and Flyers didnt miss the playoffs without Pronger or do you believe that Prongers 13 games in '12 was the factor of getting them a playoff spot?

Hobnobs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 01:46 PM
  #34
Chalupa Batman
Mod Supervisor
 
Chalupa Batman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 23,221
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hobnobs View Post
and Flyers didnt miss the playoffs without Pronger or do you believe that Prongers 13 games in '12 was the factor of getting them a playoff spot?
What does this have to do with anything that's been said to this point?

If it's supposed to be a counterexample to teams missing the playoffs in their first season without Pronger, it's not satisfying.

Chalupa Batman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 01:54 PM
  #35
Hobnobs
Pinko
 
Hobnobs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Country: Sweden
Posts: 3,096
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taco MacArthur View Post
What does this have to do with anything that's been said to this point?

If it's supposed to be a counterexample to teams missing the playoffs in their first season without Pronger, it's not satisfying.
Edmonton was barely a playoff team with Pronger, so I dont get the Oilers missing the playoffs was because of Pronger. Rather it was Samsonov and Roloson that made them into a playoff team.

Hobnobs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 03:34 PM
  #36
Killion
Global Moderator
 
Killion's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Casablanca
Country: Morocco
Posts: 21,797
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hobnobs View Post
Edmonton was barely a playoff team with Pronger...
... there were some problems in Edmonton: http://www.canada.com/edmontonjourna...2-43fad1a44471

Killion is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 04:49 PM
  #37
Oscar Acosta
Bat Country
 
Oscar Acosta's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Country: United States
Posts: 3,961
vCash: 738
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hobnobs View Post
Edmonton was barely a playoff team with Pronger, so I dont get the Oilers missing the playoffs was because of Pronger. Rather it was Samsonov and Roloson that made them into a playoff team.
As a season ticket holder that year, I can tell you Pronger was amazing all year even with all his issues. Then of course he carried the team to the Finals, after which I could never afford season tickets again with the bandwagon filling and hasn't emptied since. Thanks Pronger!

Oscar Acosta is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 06:31 PM
  #38
Chalupa Batman
Mod Supervisor
 
Chalupa Batman's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 23,221
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hobnobs View Post
Edmonton was barely a playoff team with Pronger, so I dont get the Oilers missing the playoffs was because of Pronger. Rather it was Samsonov and Roloson that made them into a playoff team.
It's not a question of you "getting" it or not. It happened.

If it happened once, it'd be a coincidence. The more times that it happens, it becomes data.

Chalupa Batman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 06:43 PM
  #39
yave1964
22 and counting
 
yave1964's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Lexington ohio
Posts: 327
vCash: 500
Let me start this by making it clear I HATED Chris Pronger early in his career, he was second only to Claude Freakin Lemieux as the player I would most like to run over with a zamboni. Even more than Patrick statue of liberty Roy or Eric legion of broom Lindros, it was Pronger, second only to Lemieux.

Pronger broke in with the helpless Hartford Whalers, at the time a bad organization, Mike Keenan traded Brendan Shanahan from the Blues for Pronger, in one of the most unpopular trades in the organizations history. Iron Mike would not survive long enough in St. Louis to see his faith in this tall skinny blueliner prove sound, but Pronger would go on to be one of the most popular players in Blues history.
Pronger hit anyone and everyone, no respect for captains or untouchables, and he could score. I swear of the ten goals a year that he averaged with the blues five of them seemed to come against my Wings, and at the most back breaking times. And he would rough up Steve Yzerman more than any player ever, and would take the retaliation and go back and do it again. and again. And he would stand out there at center ice, just looking like a man with no fear.
We faced the Blues in the playoffs, he if anything upped his game. The man had no weaknesses.

After the lockout season he was dealt to the Oilers.The blues went from 91 points to 57, missing the playoffs for the first time since before Pronger had arrived. The Oilers went from 89 points and missing the playoffs to 95, Pronger in 24 playoff games scored 21 points, leading the oilers to upsets, first over my Wings as he humiliated Yzerman and made him look like an old man as Stevie was in his final season, then running over the Ducks and Sharks before losing the cup in seven games to the Hurricanes. Pronger seemed to play 40 minutes a game, was all over the ice, and his personal will carried a mediocre team much further than they deserved. He left after one season, and Edmonton has not returned to the playoffs since.

With anaheim he along with Neidermayer led the Ducks to their best two seasons ever, with 110 and 102 points, In 2007, the two of them willed this young talented team to a stanley cup, by force of will and body they destroyed the much more skilled Red Wing and Senator squads, Remember the two of them crushing Holmstrom against the boards so hard that he had no idea where he was. Pronger was suspended for a game for that viscious hit, as well as a stanley cup final game for destroying Dean Mcammond, knocking him out cold with as crushing a hit as you will ever see.

He left Anaheim and came to Philly, the ducks fell from 102 points to 91. The Flyers slipped during the regular season and with a very average team snuck in to the playoffs as Boucher bested Lundquist in a shootout. Pronger again carried a very average team to the cup finals, in 23 games scoring 18 points with 36 penalty minutes. They finally ran out of gas and goalies in the finals to Chicago. Philly was reestablished as a hockey power.
Pronger is of course a case in point for visors, as his concussion issues have derailed his career. Somewhere along the way in St. Louis I grew a deep grudging appreciation and respect for his game, he asked no quarter and gave none. He broke my heart in 2006, as a Wing fan we all wanted Yzerman to go out a winner, instead he went out being shoved off the ice by this tall skinny jerk who I had hated for ten years. 2007 was supposed to be revenge, but his Messier like will carried his team past us again. After losing for a decade to the Wings, he had finally learned that he had to acheive a higher gear, something that you would never have convinced me was possible, but the man did it. I rooted so hard for him in his impossible quest season in 2010, finally able to appreciate this great player after so many years of hating him. He is the ultimate warrior and needs to be held in the same pantheon as Esposito and Messier, a man capable of carrying a pedestrian team on his six foot six shoulders much further than they have any business going. He is a MAN. I sincerely wish him well in his recovery and with his life after hockey. Anyone who doesn't consider him a Hall of famer must have slept through a half dozen post seasons. There is a very, very short list of blue liners I would less want to see back there against my team with the game on the line.

yave1964 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 06:47 PM
  #40
jumptheshark
Give the dog a bone
 
jumptheshark's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: hf retirement home
Country: United Nations
Posts: 52,526
vCash: 1850
39 posts on a non-subject

__________________
not sure how--but the fish just jumped in the boat and put the hook in it's mouth
52299/14814
The twenty year rebuild is on!!! Embrace the suck
jumptheshark is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-07-2013, 06:48 PM
  #41
Soundwave
Moderator
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts: 24,185
vCash: 500
I'm an Oilers fan, so I have every reason to be angry at the guy, but him going into the HOF shouldn't even be a question of "if", just "when".

That 2006 run with the Oilers might be the most dominant stretch of hockey I've ever witnessed a d-man play in the last decade.

I remember thinking he was just completely outplaying Lidstrom, and then outplayed Neidermayer too. Definition of a monster. He was a beast for Philly and Anaheim obviously too.

Soundwave is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:03 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.