HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Eastern Conference > Metropolitan Division > New York Rangers
Notices

ECQF: New York Rangers @ Washington Capitals - 7:30 PM

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
05-10-2013, 11:26 AM
  #26
goalsequalvictory
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Posts: 462
vCash: 249
Just bet 100 vCash on the Rangers, they are the underdogs in Vegas(Caps are -140), which is sort of suprising to me, but just means more of a payday when we win! Rangers bets outnumber the Caps ones by a significant percentage(roughly 2 to 1) on vBookie.

goalsequalvictory is offline  
Old
05-10-2013, 11:36 AM
  #27
Clowes Line
Cally's Chicken Parm
 
Clowes Line's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: New Yawk
Country: United States
Posts: 12,544
vCash: 500
What exactly is the S conference?

Clowes Line is offline  
Old
05-10-2013, 11:36 AM
  #28
PJay NYR
Registered User
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Posts: 490
vCash: 50
This is....NOT a must-win!
LGR!

PJay NYR is offline  
Old
05-10-2013, 11:37 AM
  #29
Richter Scale
Registered User
 
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 893
vCash: 500
I thought this was an interesting discussion from the pre-game thread, so I wanted to carry it over to here...

Quote:
Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 View Post
I would like to look at the teams those players have played for. Hasek played for the Wings. Roy the Habs and the Avs. Broduer won how many Cups? That helps pad stats.
No doubt that every single one of those teams were great - but they all also lived or died with their goaltenders. And by bringing this up, you are right that there are a lot of factors that can influence whether a team goes far in the playoffs or not. Just because you have a hot goalie, doesn't mean the team is going to make a deep playoff run if the rest team in front of them isn't up to snuff.

But the one constant is that if you don't have a goalie that has elevated their game come playoff time, you generally won't be winning a Cup.

In the seasons that the Red Wings had subpar playoff goaltending, they didn't win cups. Same goes for the Devils and the Avs.

- If Brodeur doesn't play out of his mind in the playoffs, there is no way the Devils have all of those cups.

- If the Wings don't get career performances from Mike Vernon in 96-97 (.927 SV % and 1.76 GAA), Chris Osgood in 97-98 (.918 SV % and 2.12 GAA), and Ozzy again in 07-08 (0.930 SV %, 1.55 GAA) they don't win any of those cups.

- If Hasek doesn't become a brick wall, there is no way the Sabres make it to the Stanley Cup Finals against the Stars. On the Wings' most recent Cup win, Hasek actually got pulled in the playoffs, and Ozzy played amazingly for them for the remainder of the playoffs (.930 SV%, 1.55 GAA). That doesn't happen, the Wings don't win the cup in 07-08.

- In the seasons that Roy gave up bad goals in the late 90s (often against the Wings) in the playoffs, the Avs got knocked out. Those were amazing Avs teams.

Did it generally help that those goalies had good teams in front of them? Sure. But in the years that those goalies didn't put up stunning performances in the playoffs or gave up a few too many softies, their team didn't win the cup. They were still on great teams those years that they lost. That didn't change.

Of course, I'd agree the Rangers aren't on those teams' levels - at least not that we've been shown so far this year - but that just emphasizes the point all the more; in order for them to succeed, Hank needs to play lights out.


Some #s to add to the food for thought (and because I'm a stats nerd)...

Stats for the goalies of the teams you brought up in the years they won the cup compared to career #s (+ Dom's 98-99 run):

Goalie Team Season Career SV % Career GAA PO SV % PO GAA
Patrick Roy Canadiens 85-86 0.910 2.54 N/A 1.93
Canadiens 92-93 0.910 2.54 0.929 2.13
Avalanche 95-96 0.910 2.54 0.921 2.10
Avalanche 00-01 0.910 2.54 0.934 1.70
Mike Vernon Red Wings 96-97 0.890 2.98 0.927 1.76
Chris Osgood Red Wings 97-98 0.905 2.49 0.918 2.12
Red Wings 07-08 0.905 2.49 0.930 1.55
Dominik Hasek Sabres 98-99 0.922 2.20 0.939 1.77
Red Wings 01-02 0.922 2.20 0.920 1.86
Martin Brodeur Devils 94-95 0.913 2.23 0.927 1.67
Devils 99-00 0.913 2.23 0.927 1.61
Devils 02-03 0.913 2.23 0.934 1.65


The SC winners since 2000:

Team Goalie Season Career SV % Career GAA PO SV % PO GAA
LA Kings Jonathan Quick 11-12 0.915 2.32 0.946 1.41
Boston Bruins Tim Thomas 10-11 0.921 2.48 0.940 1.98
Chicago Blackhawks Antti Niemi 09-10 0.917 2.34 0.910 2.63
Pittsburgh Penguins Marc-Andre Fleury 08-09 0.910 2.66 0.908 2.61
Detroit Red Wings Chris Osgood 07-08 0.905 2.49 0.930 1.55
Anaheim Ducks J.S. Giguere 06-07 0.913 2.53 0.922 1.97
Carolina Hurricanes Cam Ward 05-06 0.910 2.74 0.920 2.14
Tampa Bay Lightning Nikolai Khabibulin 03-04 0.908 2.72 0.933 1.71
New Jersey Devils Martin Brodeur 02-03 0.913 2.23 0.934 1.65
Detroit Red Wings Dominik Hasek 01-02 0.922 2.20 0.920 1.86
Colorado Avalanche Patrick Roy 00-01 0.910 2.54 0.934 1.70


The only two teams to win in that time with goalies not beating their career (or season #s) were the 08-09 Penguins and the 09-10 Blackhawks. All the others elevated their performances significantly.

I love Hank, and I think he's great. But it is really true that he, in general, needs to find another gear in the playoffs. It is not a coincidence that the one year he put up monster #s in the playoffs which were even better than his regular season performance (career avg and in that particular season) was a year in which the Rangers made their deepest run in over a decade - last year. It is also not a coincidence that the one series in which his play dropped off that year, was the series that the Rangers lost (0.906 SV %, 2.5 GAA). If the Rangers want to go far, he needs to be stellar.


Last edited by Richter Scale: 05-10-2013 at 02:44 PM.
Richter Scale is offline  
Old
05-10-2013, 11:41 AM
  #30
Crease
Registered User
 
Crease's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 9,804
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clowes Line View Post
What exactly is the S conference?
SCQF = Stanley Cup Quarter Finals

Crease is offline  
Old
05-10-2013, 11:42 AM
  #31
Tanner Glass
Call me Nils
 
Tanner Glass's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: NYC
Country: Austria
Posts: 16,739
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Clowes Line View Post
What exactly is the S conference?
Stanley
Cup
Quarter
Finals

Although, that's not true

__________________
Tanner Glass is offline  
Old
05-10-2013, 11:42 AM
  #32
Fitzy
All Is Well
 
Fitzy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 19,889
vCash: 50
We're not going to win many playoff games when Hank lets in 3 goals. We've won two in a row, I wouldn't count on a third. Hank needs to keep it to two goals or less tonight.

Fitzy is offline  
Old
05-10-2013, 11:43 AM
  #33
JohnC
#FreeSteve
 
JohnC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: New York
Country: United States
Posts: 4,508
vCash: 500
A mod should change the title to ECQF before Elvis is run out of the building by an angry mob

JohnC is offline  
Old
05-10-2013, 11:47 AM
  #34
kovazub94
Registered User
 
kovazub94's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 742
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Elvis Presley View Post
This is my first attempt at one of these. Had some downtime this morning decided to give it a try.

What happened to LoFFeN?
Well done with GDT.

One small update needed: the Rangers total stat shows 2-2-1 instead of 2-1-1 and away stats show 0-2-1 instead of 0-1-1. Since in play-offs the 3rd column is irrelevant I'd prefer to see 2-2 and 0-2, respectively.

kovazub94 is offline  
Old
05-10-2013, 11:48 AM
  #35
GWOW
Two Pucks, One Cup
 
GWOW's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Country: United States
Posts: 13,952
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Richter Scale View Post
I thought this was an interesting discussion from the pre-game thread, so I wanted to carry it over to here...



No doubt that every single one of those teams were great - but they all also lived or died with their goaltenders. And by bringing this up, you are right that there are a lot of factors that can influence whether a team goes far in the playoffs or not. Just because you have a hot goalie, doesn't mean the team is going to make a deep playoff run if the rest team in front of them isn't up to snuff.

But the one constant is that if you don't have a goalie that has elevated their game come playoff time, you generally won't be winning a Cup.

In the seasons that the Red Wings had subpar playoff goaltending, they didn't win cups. Same goes for the Devils and the Avs.

- If Brodeur doesn't play out of his mind in the playoffs, there is no way the Devils have all of those cups.

- If the Wings don't get career performances from Mike Vernon in 96-97 (.927 SV % and 1.76 GAA), Chris Osgood in 97-98 (.918 SV % and 2.12 GAA), and Ozzy again in 07-08 (0.930 SV %, 1.55 GAA) they don't win any of those cups.

- If Hasek doesn't become a brick wall, there is no way the Sabres make it to the Stanley Cup Finals against the Stars. On the Wings' most recent Cup win, Hasek actually got pulled in the playoffs, and Ozzy played amazingly for them for the remainder of the playoffs (.930 SV%, 1.55 GAA). That doesn't happen, the Wings don't win the cup in 07-08.

- In the seasons that Roy gave up bad goals in the late 90s (often against the Wings) in the playoffs, the Avs got knocked out. Those were amazing Avs teams.

Did it generally help that those goalies had good teams in front of them? Sure. But in the years that those goalies didn't put up stunning performances in the playoffs or gave up a few too many softies, their team didn't win the cup. They were still on great teams those years that they lost. That didn't change.

Of course, I'd agree the Rangers aren't on those teams' levels - at least not that we've been shown so far this year - but that just emphasizes the point all the more; in order for them to succeed, Hank needs to play lights out.


Some #s to add to the food for thought (and because I'm a stats nerd)...

Stats for the goalies of the teams you brought up in the years they won the cup compared to career #s:

Goalie Team Season Career SV % Career GAA PO SV % PO GAA
Patrick Roy Canadiens 85-86 0.910 2.54 N/A 1.93
Canadiens 92-93 0.910 2.54 0.929 2.13
Avalanche 95-96 0.910 2.54 0.921 2.10
Avalanche 00-01 0.910 2.54 0.934 1.70
Mike Vernon Red Wings 96-97 0.890 2.98 0.927 1.76
Chris Osgood Red Wings 97-98 0.905 2.49 0.918 2.12
Red Wings 07-08 0.905 2.49 0.930 1.55
Dominik Hasek Sabres 98-99 0.922 2.20 0.939 1.77
Red Wings 01-02 0.922 2.20 0.920 1.86
Martin Brodeur Devils 94-95 0.913 2.23 0.927 1.67
Devils 99-00 0.913 2.23 0.927 1.61
Devils 02-03 0.913 2.23 0.934 1.65


The SC winners since 2000:

Team Goalie Season Career SV % Career GAA PO SV % PO GAA
LA Kings Jonathan Quick 11-12 0.915 2.32 0.946 1.41
Boston Bruins Tim Thomas 10-11 0.921 2.48 0.940 1.98
Chicago Blackhawks Antti Niemi 09-10 0.917 2.34 0.910 2.63
Pittsburgh Penguins Marc-Andre Fleury 08-09 0.910 2.66 0.908 2.61
Detroit Red Wings Chris Osgood 07-08 0.905 2.49 0.930 1.55
Anaheim Ducks J.S. Giguere 06-07 0.913 2.53 0.922 1.97
Carolina Hurricanes Cam Ward 05-06 0.910 2.74 0.920 2.14
Tampa Bay Lightning Nikolai Khabibulin 03-04 0.908 2.72 0.933 1.71
New Jersey Devils Martin Brodeur 02-03 0.913 2.23 0.934 1.65
Detroit Red Wings Dominik Hasek 01-02 0.922 2.20 0.920 1.86
Colorado Avalanche Patrick Roy 00-01 0.910 2.54 0.934 1.70


The only two teams to win in that time with goalies not beating their career (or season #s) were the 08-09 Penguins and the 09-10 Blackhawks. All the others elevated their performances pretty significantly.

I love Hank, and I think he's great. But it is really true that he, in general, needs to find another gear in the playoffs. It is not a coincidence that the one year he put up monster #s in the playoffs which were even better than his regular season performance (career avg and in that particular season) was a year in which the Rangers made their deepest run in over a decade - last year. It is also not a coincidence that the one series in which his play dropped off that year, was the series that the Rangers lost (0.906 SV %, 2.5 GAA). If the Rangers want to go far, he needs to be stellar.
Nice job on this.

The team excuse can only go so far. I can name dozens of goalies who have literally been brillaint through four rounds -- win or lose.

GWOW is offline  
Old
05-10-2013, 12:00 PM
  #36
Kershaw
 
Kershaw's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Country:
Posts: 25,519
vCash: 50
Jason Kay @JKTHN
We're hearing too much about Player 61 Montreal-Ottawa, and not enough about Player 61 in Rangers-Washington. Still no goals for Nash.

Kershaw is offline  
Old
05-10-2013, 12:00 PM
  #37
HatTrick Swayze
Tomato Potato
 
HatTrick Swayze's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: NJ
Country: United States
Posts: 9,240
vCash: 500
Richter Scale awesome post

__________________
"Here we can see the agression of american people. They love fighting and guns. when they wont win they try to kill us all." -HalfOfFame
HatTrick Swayze is offline  
Old
05-10-2013, 12:01 PM
  #38
ImIdaho
Choo-Choo-Choose me!
 
ImIdaho's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 4,151
vCash: 500
Rangers better not bring it like the Islanders did yesterday.

ImIdaho is offline  
Old
05-10-2013, 12:02 PM
  #39
nyr2k2
Can't Beat Him
 
nyr2k2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Washington, DC
Country: United States
Posts: 22,752
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by GWOW View Post
Nice job on this.

The team excuse can only go so far. I can name dozens of goalies who have literally been brillaint through four rounds -- win or lose.
As I mentioned earlier, Lundqvist was stellar in the SEL playoffs and also performed well in winning an Olympic Gold. He has demonstrated that he's capable of stepping up in big games--now he needs to do it consistently. If he's just "good," then we'll never win a damn thing.

__________________

It's just pain.
nyr2k2 is online now  
Old
05-10-2013, 12:02 PM
  #40
MrEctions
Willy Nilly
 
MrEctions's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Clinton, Ny
Country: United States
Posts: 4,448
vCash: 500
Am I the only one laughing about the Tom Wilson thread on the Caps board? He's the 2nd coming of Jesus to some of them, others are more reserved. I get that he's a shiny new prospect, much akin to Kreider last year for us. But this kid is coming from the OHL, and they are thinking he could take Clowe or Asham in a fight, really?

MrEctions is offline  
Old
05-10-2013, 12:04 PM
  #41
Fitzy
All Is Well
 
Fitzy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 19,889
vCash: 50
He's been up and down. He was lights out in the opening round of the 2012 Olympics and then gave up 3 goals in 7 shots against Slovakia.

He has won Olympic gold, which a lot of people tend to ignore when assessing his resume, and I can't criticize his playoffs when, like Hasek in Buffalo, he always has an average side in front of him. Still, I'm sure he wants to prove he can do it.

Fitzy is offline  
Old
05-10-2013, 12:05 PM
  #42
DudMan28
Registered User
 
DudMan28's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 872
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by silverfish View Post
Really? Seems obvious to me. Del Zotto points, Richards keeps coming. Del Zotto shifts towards the middle. Richards shifts towards the middle. Del Zotto "Oh ****" Ward has way too much space. Del Zotto tries to recover. Richards is on Perrault now. Ward has space. Power move around DZ to the net.

Not absolving anyone of blame here on this play, but it could have been avoided with better communication.
At the end of the day there was no need for MDZ to go down like a fish out of water. By the end of the play Richie was in position, and DZ just flopped around.

DudMan28 is offline  
Old
05-10-2013, 12:05 PM
  #43
ImIdaho
Choo-Choo-Choose me!
 
ImIdaho's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 4,151
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrEctions View Post
Am I the only one laughing about the Tom Wilson thread on the Caps board? He's the 2nd coming of Jesus to some of them, others are more reserved. I get that he's a shiny new prospect, much akin to Kreider last year for us. But this kid is coming from the OHL, and they are thinking he could take Clowe or Asham in a fight, really?
I don't who he is, so I Googled him and all I'm getting is the actor who played Biff in Back to the Future.

ImIdaho is offline  
Old
05-10-2013, 12:06 PM
  #44
Fitzy
All Is Well
 
Fitzy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 19,889
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by MrEctions View Post
Am I the only one laughing about the Tom Wilson thread on the Caps board? He's the 2nd coming of Jesus to some of them, others are more reserved. I get that he's a shiny new prospect, much akin to Kreider last year for us. But this kid is coming from the OHL, and they are thinking he could take Clowe or Asham in a fight, really?
A lot of posters here were pretty off their rocker about Kreider for a very long time. It goes around.

Fitzy is offline  
Old
05-10-2013, 12:10 PM
  #45
BlueshirtBlitz
Rich Nash
 
BlueshirtBlitz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: New York
Posts: 18,578
vCash: 500
I think the only really bad goals Hank has given up were in Game 1. In 2 he was lights out, and 3 and 4 he backed up letting in some goals with some otherworldly saves as well.

If Hank steals one of the next 2 games, though, we'll win the series.

BlueshirtBlitz is offline  
Old
05-10-2013, 12:20 PM
  #46
nevesis
#30
 
nevesis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: NY
Posts: 8,423
vCash: 500
"A goalie is only as good as the team in front of him" - Mike Richter

nevesis is offline  
Old
05-10-2013, 12:21 PM
  #47
GWOW
Two Pucks, One Cup
 
GWOW's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Country: United States
Posts: 13,952
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nyr2k2 View Post
As I mentioned earlier, Lundqvist was stellar in the SEL playoffs and also performed well in winning an Olympic Gold. He has demonstrated that he's capable of stepping up in big games--now he needs to do it consistently. If he's just "good," then we'll never win a damn thing.
He definitely has it in him. I will always stand by my belief that the 5-man collapse below the circles is detrimental to his style.

When he sees the puck he's almost invincible, and he's quick and long enough to stop guys at the side of the net for rebounds or tap ins.

GWOW is offline  
Old
05-10-2013, 12:22 PM
  #48
Crease
Registered User
 
Crease's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 9,804
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nevesis View Post
"A goalie is only as good as the team in front of him" - Mike Richter
There are plenty of examples to the contrary.

Crease is offline  
Old
05-10-2013, 12:23 PM
  #49
GWOW
Two Pucks, One Cup
 
GWOW's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Country: United States
Posts: 13,952
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by nevesis View Post
"A goalie is only as good as the team in front of him" - Mike Richter
Good teams get dominated over stretches. Richter bailed out several Rangers teams who forgot how to defend.

GWOW is offline  
Old
05-10-2013, 12:27 PM
  #50
nyr2k2
Can't Beat Him
 
nyr2k2's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Washington, DC
Country: United States
Posts: 22,752
vCash: 500
Awards:
Quote:
Originally Posted by nevesis View Post
"A goalie is only as good as the team in front of him" - Mike Richter
I was a soccer goalie, and I vehemently disagree. My absolute best games came on a couple occasions where the team in front of me forgot to show up.

nyr2k2 is online now  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:22 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.