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Trade Rumours and Proposals Thread Part 17: What does "bold" mean?

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Old
05-10-2013, 12:37 PM
  #126
MinnesotaFats
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
Is there really one NHLer that is that?
Yeah, its apparently the player that we take 7th overall this year.

I feel pretty confident that MacT deals that pick. He needs to improve this team and we don't have the depth needed to add pieces by dealing roster players while improving at the same time. The 7th overall pick is MacT's best asset in terms of being able to make a deal that doesnt simply create another hole. That pick is on the table and I fully expect he'll do everything he can to move it for a good piece that can help us immediately.

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05-10-2013, 12:38 PM
  #127
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
Tough to say, if it were a 82 game schedule and we had a GM willing to move some players around we could've made the playoffs.

As for the Leafs, they probably would've been close at the very least.
This is where finding deals to work from a position of strength is so important. Teams up against the cap this coming off season are going to be holding weak, weak hands, and everyone knows it. Look at Luongo. Couldn't get it done for what? 2 2nd rounders? Making moves midseason this year would have been more risky than waiting until the offseason where teams are going to be put to it.

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Old
05-10-2013, 12:39 PM
  #128
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
Ridiculous is assuming Berglund would suck because others have sucked here.

I mean do I say lets trade for Evander Kane and you use the same response?

Really useless comment on your part. Don't expect that from a mod.

Don't want Berglund because he doesn't fit, fine but don't make crap up.
It's ridiculous to assume there's a chance Berglund might disappoint?

Really?

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05-10-2013, 12:41 PM
  #129
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Originally Posted by Conkanen View Post
Arguable but I would sure love a spin at a potential Jeff Skinner or Ryan Suter.
And if we had 9th Phaneuf or Couture

11th Kopitar or Iginla

Where does it end?

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05-10-2013, 12:41 PM
  #130
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Originally Posted by dnicks17 View Post
It's ridiculous to assume there's a chance Berglund might disappoint?

Really?
I think he's saying it's ridiculous to assume Berglund WILL disappoint because in reality it's obvious that every player has a chance to bust. You're not really saying anything by saying that there's a CHANCE he will bust.

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05-10-2013, 12:43 PM
  #131
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Originally Posted by dnicks17 View Post
It's ridiculous to assume there's a chance Berglund might disappoint?

Really?
Of course there is a chance he doesnt do as well with the Oilers. And there is also a chance that he becomes a 30-30 guy playing on a line with Yak.

Just like there is a chance that whoever we get at 7th OA never becomes anything for us. Or that he is the next Mark Messier.

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05-10-2013, 12:46 PM
  #132
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Nich having a contract in Russia for the next two seasons is a plus for us actually, IMO. It means we won't be capable of rushing him over to NA and messing up his development as we seem to do with almost every Euro. It's two years of development in a pro league without burning any ELC years, I think.
The downside is that Moscow apparently gave up $10 million to get him which means they'll probably pay to keep him. If there's any question about playing in the AHL he wont comeover, he'll stay in Russia and they will pay him.

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05-10-2013, 12:46 PM
  #133
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Whoah, this got out of hand fast.

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05-10-2013, 12:47 PM
  #134
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Originally Posted by dnicks17 View Post
It's ridiculous to assume there's a chance Berglund might disappoint?

Really?
Never said otherwise, but you can say that about every single player that ever comes up in a trade proposal.

What needs to be done is use some judgement when looking at potential targets. In his five years he's been pretty consistent as a whole. Even back to the two years post draft in the SEL. Given the chance to play with Eberle or yak I don't see his numbers drastically dropping.

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05-10-2013, 12:49 PM
  #135
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matt Ryan View Post
I think he's saying it's ridiculous to assume Berglund WILL disappoint because in reality it's obvious that every player has a chance to bust. You're not really saying anything by saying that there's a CHANCE he will bust.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MinnesotaFats View Post
Of course there is a chance he doesnt do as well with the Oilers. And there is also a chance that he becomes a 30-30 guy playing on a line with Yak.

Just like there is a chance that whoever we get at 7th OA never becomes anything for us. Or that he is the next Mark Messier.
Bingo.

There's a chance that trading the 7th overall pick for Berglund doesn't even make the team better at all.

That's all I'm saying.

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05-10-2013, 12:55 PM
  #136
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Originally Posted by MinnesotaFats View Post
Yeah, its apparently the player that we take 7th overall this year.

I feel pretty confident that MacT deals that pick. He needs to improve this team and we don't have the depth needed to add pieces by dealing roster players while improving at the same time. The 7th overall pick is MacT's best asset in terms of being able to make a deal that doesnt simply create another hole. That pick is on the table and I fully expect he'll do everything he can to move it for a good piece that can help us immediately.
I was about to write this whole Berglund for 7th pick debate is nonsense because if you are dealing the #7 pick it will part of a package to bring in something better than Patrik Berglund. And that's no offence to Berglund.

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05-10-2013, 12:57 PM
  #137
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
And if we had 9th Phaneuf or Couture

11th Kopitar or Iginla

Where does it end?
Dude, what tangent are you going off on? Follow along. Those are examples of high upside draft picks drafted in the #7 spot over the last 10 years. I didn't make it that complicated for a reason. Sheesh.

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05-10-2013, 12:59 PM
  #138
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Lol you guys are awesome. Love the passion.

I think both sides aren't speaking in absolutes. Their is no way to know to know what would happen if we traded the pick for Berglund. I don't think it's safe to assume a best case or a worst case scenario. At the end of the day it comes down to probability.

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05-10-2013, 01:01 PM
  #139
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Originally Posted by Conkanen View Post
Dude, what tangent are you going off on? Follow along. Those are examples of high upside draft picks drafted in the #7 spot over the last 10 years. I didn't make it that complicated for a reason. Sheesh.
My point was there is good guys drafted at every position so at what point do we want to move our pick?

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05-10-2013, 01:01 PM
  #140
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Originally Posted by dnicks17 View Post
Bingo.

There's a chance that trading the 7th overall pick for Berglund doesn't even make the team better at all.

That's all I'm saying.
And that is a risk inherent in every move a GM makes.

So what is your point? Never make a move?!

Good GMs know when to take that risk; they know when its a good gamble to make. MacT realizes that. As he said, its time to start taking risks, which is exactly what Tambellini appears not to have had the cojones to do. The 7th OA pick is gone, which is why I havent gotten caught up in this "who should we take?" nonsense. Its a waste of time.

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05-10-2013, 01:04 PM
  #141
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Originally Posted by DousedInOil View Post
Lol you guys are awesome. Love the passion.

I think both sides aren't speaking in absolutes. Their is no way to know to know what would happen if we traded the pick for Berglund. I don't think it's safe to assume a best case or a worst case scenario. At the end of the day it comes down to probability.
This is what I can agree with. I see both sides, I see we can get Suter or whoever, but every year we want these draft picks or complain that we didn't trade up to get Fowler or Gormley or Forsberg or Grigorenko or Hamilton or Couturier etc...

At what point are we done protecting our 1st round pick like it's the solution to all our problem?

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05-10-2013, 01:09 PM
  #142
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Yes. Let's talk chances shall we. There is a .000001% chance the Oilers 7th overall is being traded for Berglund.

My breakdown:

We pick at #7 (70%).
We trade down /package #7 as part of bigger trade(30%)

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05-10-2013, 01:09 PM
  #143
dnicks17
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Originally Posted by MinnesotaFats View Post
And that is a risk inherent in every move a GM makes.

So what is your point? Never make a move?!

Good GMs know when to take that risk; they know when its a good gamble to make. MacT realizes that. As he said, its time to start taking risks, which is exactly what Tambellini appears not to have had the cojones to do. The 7th OA pick is gone, which is why I havent gotten caught up in this "who should we take?" nonsense. Its a waste of time.
My point is the opinion that trading the 7th overall pick for Berglund immediately makes this team better and that that trade has a better chance of making the team better than choosing a player at 7th overall isn't as likely as some are implying.

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05-10-2013, 01:15 PM
  #144
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Originally Posted by dnicks17 View Post
My point is the opinion that trading the 7th overall pick for Berglund immediately makes this team better and that that trade has a better chance of making the team better than choosing a player at 7th overall isn't as likely as some are implying.
OK. What makes us better next year: a line-up with Berglund in it, or a line-up that may or may not have a rookie C or D in it?

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05-10-2013, 01:20 PM
  #145
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The downside is that Moscow apparently gave up $10 million to get him which means they'll probably pay to keep him. If there's any question about playing in the AHL he wont comeover, he'll stay in Russia and they will pay him.
I heard the number was 3 million. Either way they've made quite an investment and will probably look to offer him more to stay. It's making me nervous about him.

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05-10-2013, 01:20 PM
  #146
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Eakin and Dillon.

What would it take?

Gotta remember Eakin was part of the Ribeiro deal.

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Old
05-10-2013, 01:22 PM
  #147
dnicks17
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Originally Posted by MinnesotaFats View Post
OK. What makes us better next year: a line-up with Berglund in it, or a line-up that may or may not have a rookie C or D in it?
Obviously Berglund.

But what makes the organization stronger...adding a top-end(borderline elite) prospect, Nurse, to the pipeline who you have 7+ years of contractual control of and has the potential to be better than anything on your current roster or a minimum of two years of Berglund who is only arguably better than the 5th or 6th best forward you already have in place?

Or swap in Monahan/Nischushkin...two guys who could be as good as Berglund now, but with 7-9 years of contractual control.

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05-10-2013, 01:35 PM
  #148
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Originally Posted by Conkanen View Post
Yes. Let's talk chances shall we. There is a .000001% chance the Oilers 7th overall is being traded for Berglund.

My breakdown:

We pick at #7 (70%).
We trade down /package #7 as part of bigger trade(30%)
What about the other 10 percent??

-Smyth

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05-10-2013, 01:58 PM
  #149
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Originally Posted by Conkanen View Post
Yes. Let's talk chances shall we. There is a .000001% chance the Oilers 7th overall is being traded for Berglund.

My breakdown:

We pick at #7 (70%).
We trade down /package #7 as part of bigger trade(30%)
My breakdown:

We trade the pick seperately or part of a package to acquire a player to help now - 80%.
We trade down - 10%..
We trade the 7th and a pick/prospect to move up - 10%..

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05-10-2013, 02:02 PM
  #150
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Originally Posted by Oilfan2 View Post
My breakdown:

We trade the pick seperately or part of a package to acquire a player to help now - 80%.
We trade down - 10%..
We trade the 7th and a pick/prospect to move up - 10%..
So no chance we pick at 7 and keep him?

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