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Subban and that bridge contract..(what to expect with his next extension)

View Poll Results: Bridge contract
Bridge contract was a smart deal. It was a good move for both parties 107 54.04%
Should have signed him long term (likely cheaper) when we had the chance. Bit of a blunder by MB. 91 45.96%
Voters: 198. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
05-10-2013, 04:40 PM
  #151
Millpool
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Originally Posted by Frozenice View Post
....Is this because we'll have $2 million or so less cap space every single year for the next 5 or 6 years?

I guess this new math isn't my thing because I thought if we had more cap space it would be easier to construct a whole roster. Who knows, maybe in a couple of years, I'll get "it".

To me the bridge deal was a stupid thing and I wanted to sign him to Markov-type money instead of what transpired.
Ultimately I don't believe $2 million should make the difference between contending and not. And it saved us more cap space than that in these first two years, which is important when deciding on the structure of your team. Now there is time to get rid of bad contracts and there will be plenty of money for PK on the other end.

I don't understand this mindset. If you really want a player on your team, and you think he's worth $7 million per, what's the problem with paying him $7 million per? Sure, you might have had him for a little less, but I have no issue with giving him the money he's earned.

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05-10-2013, 04:59 PM
  #152
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I don't get how half the people who voted don't think it was smart to make sure we have PK locked up for pretty much all of his prime years. I am very happy with the initial deal which gives us cap room to better surround our young players while we let a few contracts run out.

PK should well be worth that 7M per year for the duration of the contract and it will kick it at an optimal time for management. MB's looking at the long term, he wants this team to compete year in/year out and the only way he can achieve that is with the proper timing. All we need to look at are teams like Detroit and Chicago, they mostly build from inside and have added key players via trade at the right moments.

Some people may think I've got rose colored glasses, but I think the vast majority of Bergevin's decisions have been the right ones. The future is bright and for once I really believe the Habs will have long term success, no more of this flash in the pan BS.

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05-10-2013, 05:12 PM
  #153
25get
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We were looking at 5 or 6M.

2 X 2.875 + 5 X 7 = 5.82
or
2 X 2.875 + 7 X 7 = 6.08

Seems a good deal for both parties.

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05-10-2013, 09:12 PM
  #154
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Millpool View Post
Ultimately I don't believe $2 million should make the difference between contending and not. And it saved us more cap space than that in these first two years, which is important when deciding on the structure of your team. Now there is time to get rid of bad contracts and there will be plenty of money for PK on the other end.

I don't understand this mindset. If you really want a player on your team, and you think he's worth $7 million per, what's the problem with paying him $7 million per? Sure, you might have had him for a little less, but I have no issue with giving him the money he's earned.
Why do you think the cap space we saved over these first 2 years is important. We finished with well over 3m in unused cap space, so it did absolutely nothing this year. And next year after buying out Kaberle we will have over 10m in cap space and only a few roster spots open on the lower lines.

Paying PK what he's worth is not a problem but we had the chance to get him at a discount which would've given us an advantage going forward. It was a missed opportunity.

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05-10-2013, 10:14 PM
  #155
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People talk about "motivation"......yet....where was DD's motivational contract? This is what makes the whole PK "motivational contract" thing complete nonsense. If we're all about players earning contract, then why was DD given a wonderful contract after one good year when anyone with sense could see he was a severely limited hockey player?

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05-10-2013, 10:25 PM
  #156
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Originally Posted by hockeyfan2k11 View Post
People talk about "motivation"......yet....where was DD's motivational contract?
In your dreams.

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05-11-2013, 10:28 AM
  #157
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sorinth View Post
Why do you think the cap space we saved over these first 2 years is important. We finished with well over 3m in unused cap space, so it did absolutely nothing this year. And next year after buying out Kaberle we will have over 10m in cap space and only a few roster spots open on the lower lines.

Paying PK what he's worth is not a problem but we had the chance to get him at a discount which would've given us an advantage going forward. It was a missed opportunity.
I think it's important to have as much organizational flexibility as possible at this early stage of a new management group as it evaluates and begins re-structuring the team. That's all.

And yeah, you can call it a missed opportunity, but it was an opportunity traded. You gave up the $1.5-$2M in cap for more guaranteed years in his prime and to stick to what I think is a smart organizational philosophy. That's my take.

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05-11-2013, 10:30 AM
  #158
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hockeyfan2k11 View Post
People talk about "motivation"......yet....where was DD's motivational contract? This is what makes the whole PK "motivational contract" thing complete nonsense. If we're all about players earning contract, then why was DD given a wonderful contract after one good year when anyone with sense could see he was a severely limited hockey player?
? It's a completely different situation. This was DD's 4th contract with the organization, just coming off a 2 year deal. Whether or not he deserved the extension he got is obviously another matter, but this is apples and oranges.

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05-11-2013, 10:41 AM
  #159
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The contract was a message that got threw Subbans thick skull.. that it's not because he's "good" that he'll actually have what ever he wants.

Learnt that he has to follow the system imposed by Marc Bergevin. The guy now wants 6 to 7 Millions? He deserves it and trust me when I say that Marc Bergevin will not care when he signs his next contract. He'll rather be happy.

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05-11-2013, 10:50 AM
  #160
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Millpool View Post
I think it's important to have as much organizational flexibility as possible at this early stage of a new management group as it evaluates and begins re-structuring the team. That's all.

And yeah, you can call it a missed opportunity, but it was an opportunity traded. You gave up the $1.5-$2M in cap for more guaranteed years in his prime and to stick to what I think is a smart organizational philosophy. That's my take.
It only worked because Subban played along and didn't call Bergevin's bluff.

Subban should of been playing in Europe instead of playing tv commentator on sportsnet and then it would of been a lot easier for Subban to say, " thanks for the offer but I think I'll stay here". Or, Subban could of listened to other teams make their offer sheet pitches.

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05-11-2013, 11:00 AM
  #161
Lionel Mandrake
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No, no. The bridge contract MADE subban the player he is right now. You just don't understand.
Although I get the sarcastic tone, I think there's something to not being handed the key to the city on a silver platter too soon and having to fight through adversity as a real character builder. I also like the overly prudent GMs rather than the ones who are overly aggressive with their management style (ie Brian Burke). No matter if Subban breaks the bank in a year, if the salary structure is coherent and well managed, that shouldn't prevent us from remaining competitive, and Subban won't be playing on a contract he might feel underpays him in a couple years as well. Subban's the unchallenged best D on this team and will be for many years. I don't have a problem paying North of 7M for that kind of player. What I have a problem is paying average supporting cast, non difference makers like Gionta 5M.

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05-11-2013, 01:18 PM
  #162
Guilliam
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Originally Posted by Strik_IX View Post
I don't get how half the people who voted don't think it was smart to make sure we have PK locked up for pretty much all of his prime years. I am very happy with the initial deal which gives us cap room to better surround our young players while we let a few contracts run out.

PK should well be worth that 7M per year for the duration of the contract and it will kick it at an optimal time for management. MB's looking at the long term, he wants this team to compete year in/year out and the only way he can achieve that is with the proper timing. All we need to look at are teams like Detroit and Chicago, they mostly build from inside and have added key players via trade at the right moments.

Some people may think I've got rose colored glasses, but I think the vast majority of Bergevin's decisions have been the right ones. The future is bright and for once I really believe the Habs will have long term success, no more of this flash in the pan BS.
I agree with you regarding P.K. (as for Bergevin's decisions, I have to admit that I really don't like DD's contract).

It's fairly simple. We can sign him for 8 years max. We could have signed him in january for eight years and make sure we have him for his years 23 to 31. The at 31, he's still at his peak and he's a UFA so he can sign anywhere for anything.

Or we sign him to a discount deal the first two years and then he's still RFA so we can sign him until he's 33. No brainer to me.

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05-11-2013, 02:03 PM
  #163
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The bridge contract is going to cost us dearly. And then to lock up DD, Moen, and Gorges instead?

I think 6.5 million a year is the base for Subbans next contract. And apperntly he was willing to sign for 4.5....

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05-11-2013, 02:04 PM
  #164
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Hindsight is 20/20, but predictions and decisions aren't. That's why I voted for option #1.

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05-11-2013, 02:17 PM
  #165
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Originally Posted by Guilliam View Post
I agree with you regarding P.K. (as for Bergevin's decisions, I have to admit that I really don't like DD's contract).

It's fairly simple. We can sign him for 8 years max. We could have signed him in january for eight years and make sure we have him for his years 23 to 31. The at 31, he's still at his peak and he's a UFA so he can sign anywhere for anything.

Or we sign him to a discount deal the first two years and then he's still RFA so we can sign him until he's 33. No brainer to me.
We could have signed him to a 10 years deal last summer.

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05-11-2013, 02:25 PM
  #166
hockeyfan2k11
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The contract was a message that got threw Subbans thick skull.. that it's not because he's "good" that he'll actually have what ever he wants.

Learnt that he has to follow the system imposed by Marc Bergevin. The guy now wants 6 to 7 Millions? He deserves it and trust me when I say that Marc Bergevin will not care when he signs his next contract. He'll rather be happy.
Just like Price and DD....hmm?

Subban is and was our best player....but Price got a sweetheart deal that IMO he didn't earn. DD as well.

So play hardball with your best player...and then give other guys overpriced contracts...yet people are cool with that.

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05-11-2013, 02:28 PM
  #167
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How much money can he ask for............
He's not good enough to make Canada's Olympic team

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05-11-2013, 02:30 PM
  #168
Des Louise
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How much money can he ask for............
He's not good enough to make Canada's Olympic team
Weird post. It's got to be a joke but I don't see the humor.

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05-11-2013, 02:34 PM
  #169
Millpool
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Originally Posted by hockeyfan2k11 View Post
Just like Price and DD....hmm?

Subban is and was our best player....but Price got a sweetheart deal that IMO he didn't earn. DD as well.

So play hardball with your best player...and then give other guys overpriced contracts...yet people are cool with that.
Again, different situations. Price signed a 2 year bridge before his 6 year deal. Whether or not he earned the extension is another discussion. This is Desharnais' 4th contract with the organization too. Patches also signed a 2 year bridge.

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05-11-2013, 02:34 PM
  #170
AntonCH
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Weird post. It's got to be a joke but I don't see the humor.
Renaud Lavoie tweeted today that PK was not invited to the WC
The twitterverse ran with that and turned it into:
If he's not invited to the WC then he must not be in the plans for Sochi
or something to that effect

Does everything need a

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05-11-2013, 02:38 PM
  #171
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and melnick followed with:

Mitch Melnick ‏@HunterZThompson

Maybe we shouldn't be all that surprised by Subban snub. As GM in Tampa, Yzerman has made team worse.

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05-11-2013, 02:41 PM
  #172
Des Louise
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Originally Posted by AntonCH View Post
Renaud Lavoie tweeted today that PK was not invited to the WC
The twitterverse ran with that and turned it into:
If he's not invited to the WC then he must not be in the plans for Sochi
or something to that effect

Does everything need a
See now that makes sense !

I wasn't aware of that whole thing. Isn't it weird that Subban hasn't been invited?

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05-11-2013, 02:43 PM
  #173
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This will be an interesting contract for everyone in the league.

Doughty, Karlsson were signed long term before the cap drop this offseason.

I wonder how much of an impact it (the 1 time drop in cap) will have and how many agents will recognize this?

How many other young talented defensemen will be looking for a contract at the same time (or even this offseason) as Subban? What do they get?

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05-11-2013, 03:21 PM
  #174
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I think money is not a problem, and MB will have more money to spend in one year, he will pay the price and i'm sure that was part of the plan

Bridge contract had a really good effect on Subban, I always was a fan of Subban, but this year he grow up a lot as a player, as a proffessional, as a teammate ( never speak of him this year, always speak of the the team ) he admit that he learn a lot and gain maturity this year, he also addmit that he appreciate the fact that MB took the time to go speak face to face with Subban this summer explaining his point of view, also that now team have great leadership.

I really dont think Subban is piss at all with the organizaton about that, I think that both of them knew that MB will have to pay big money for the next contract, I would not be suprised if they agree to a extension this summer, like a 8 years contract with Karlsson type of money

Making Subban sign a bridge contrat make a statement that is the way that the canadiens allow contract, it will be the same thing for Gally and Chucky. so was for Price, Pacioretty...That will give the team a good way to manage the salary cap giving a chance to sign more good player because they know they will have room under the cap knowing that Gally, Chucky, Tinordy,Beaulieu.. will not cost big money until there 6 season.

In my opinion , its a good way to have a great young core for many years. of course maybe we had a chand to save 1 or 1.5 milion per year on Subban, but gave like 3 milion for two years to the team, it will be the same for Chucky....

well that was my two cent

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05-11-2013, 03:24 PM
  #175
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Originally Posted by Stripper View Post
The contract was a message that got threw Subbans thick skull.. that it's not because he's "good" that he'll actually have what ever he wants.

Learnt that he has to follow the system imposed by Marc Bergevin. The guy now wants 6 to 7 Millions? He deserves it and trust me when I say that Marc Bergevin will not care when he signs his next contract. He'll rather be happy.
The only problem is we now are pretty close to the cap. Not signing Subban, and signing Gorges, Moen, and Desharnais instead is going to cost us about 11 million dollars a season for the forseeable future. That's a big chunk of the cap.

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