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2013 Draft Thread | "Falling Flat for Horvat"

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05-13-2013, 11:05 AM
  #726
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Originally Posted by dnicks17 View Post
I think Philly would want to trade Couturier for a pick as much as we'd want to trade down.

Going to take a top-end NHL defenseman to get him, imo.
^This
Exactly what the flyers need to compete again in the east is defence and unfortunately
The oilers don't have any

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05-13-2013, 12:02 PM
  #727
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Listening to Lowetide today is scaring me. He believes that it's a center or bust. He thinks that with Musil, Klefbom, Gernat and Marincin in the system that we won't be looking at defencemen with our first pick. He believes that if Monahan is gone that we trade down and draft Lazar.

I like Lazar but this management group is getting ridiculous. We pass on Jenner to draft Musil (because we needed defence) and now were going to pass on Nurse for Lazar. I'd rather have Jenner an Nurse than Musil and Lazar.

I asked Pronman (on Lowetides show) about having Lazar ranked 29th and he basically just said that he questions his offensive upside.


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05-13-2013, 12:29 PM
  #728
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Originally Posted by DousedInOil View Post
Listening to Lowetide today is scaring me. He believes that it's a center or bust. He thinks that with Musil, Klefbom, Gernat and Marincin in the system that we won't be looking at defencemen with our first pick. He believes that if Monahan is gone that we trade down and draft Lazar.

I like Lazar but this management group is getting ridiculous. We pass on Jenner to draft Musil (because we needed defence) and now were going to pass on Nurse for Lazar. I'd rather have Jenner an Nurse than Musil and Lazar.

I asked Pronman (on Lowetides show) about having Lazar ranked 29th and he basically just said that he questions his offensive upside.
Say Lazar turned out to be Ryan O'Reilly and nothing more, nothing less, isn't that exactly what this team needs? People have been pining for an "O'Reilly type player" for two years, and now everyone wants to avoid choosing a guy who is a very solid bet to turn into exactly that?

If we miss out on guys with a better overall game, Barkov, Monahan, Lindholm, why not make the "safe" pick? The overall game, character, drive, enthusiasm, that Lazar brings to the rink is everything the Edmonton Oilers lack.

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05-13-2013, 01:15 PM
  #729
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I wouldn't be outraged if the Oilers trade down to get Lazar. Or if he's gone Horvat.

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05-13-2013, 01:28 PM
  #730
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Originally Posted by DousedInOil View Post
Listening to Lowetide today is scaring me. He believes that it's a center or bust. He thinks that with Musil, Klefbom, Gernat and Marincin in the system that we won't be looking at defencemen with our first pick. He believes that if Monahan is gone that we trade down and draft Lazar.

I like Lazar but this management group is getting ridiculous. We pass on Jenner to draft Musil (because we needed defence) and now were going to pass on Nurse for Lazar. I'd rather have Jenner an Nurse than Musil and Lazar.

I asked Pronman (on Lowetides show) about having Lazar ranked 29th and he basically just said that he questions his offensive upside.
For once I agree with Lowetide, the idea that we'd take a D and possibly wait 3-4 years for him to develop is a scary proposition given where our team if currently. That said I'd still be trying very hard to trade up and secure that center. Carolina is the perfect team to talk to in that regard. I'd happily overpay if it meant us walking away with Barkov or Monahan. I would be all in and nothing short of our big 5 would be on the table to land that player.

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05-13-2013, 01:32 PM
  #731
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I wouldn't be outraged if the Oilers trade down to get Lazar. Or if he's gone Horvat.
If only D is left on the board and we get a decent return, fine. That said no more misses/low potential players with our 2nd round picks. The only time that we've gone high skill in recent years in the 2nd round was Marincin. We've already got a pair of 2nd round picks and we have made 5 -2nd round picks and 5-3rd round picks in the last 3 drafts so in theory we shouldn't need to worry about prospect depth and restocking the cupboards unless Stu and co. should be down the road and in which case they shouldn't be the ones making the picks going forward.

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05-13-2013, 01:33 PM
  #732
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After listening to Stu on Oilers Now and Gregors show I'm pretty confident the Oilers like Monahan and then Nurse.

Also, I remember before Stu came on that Stauffer said he talks to the Oiler scouts all the time and said he knew the Oilers liked a dman. He wouldn't say which one at the time.....but said it was between Nurse, RR and Zadarov.

I think I fear more the possibility of passing on Lindholm if both Monahan and Nurse are gone when we pick then taking Lazar over Monahan or Nurse

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05-13-2013, 01:57 PM
  #733
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Not really for the draft, but in my opinion not worth a new thread.

Anyone who follows the NCAA have any ideas on who the big targets before next season will be? Anyone that the Oilers need to be in on?

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05-13-2013, 02:03 PM
  #734
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Originally Posted by Bryanbryoil View Post
For once I agree with Lowetide, the idea that we'd take a D and possibly wait 3-4 years for him to develop is a scary proposition given where our team if currently. That said I'd still be trying very hard to trade up and secure that center. Carolina is the perfect team to talk to in that regard. I'd happily overpay if it meant us walking away with Barkov or Monahan. I would be all in and nothing short of our big 5 would be on the table to land that player.
I would love to trade up and make sure we get that center. However, everyone wants to move up in the draft and its easier said then done. It's kind of funny watching the mock draft go from team to team on HF. Everyone is hoping for Monahan to drop to them and want to move up to try and get him.

As far as the weight goes for defencemen, we've been saying that for 3-4 years. They take a while to develop but top 4 defenceman are always a rarity. It's not like Lazar will jump right in either. I'd rather just trade the pick for immediate help to someone who does value Nichuskin or Nurse highly. (Philly comes to mind).

I'm just not a fan of trading down in general. I think you grab the best player available for your organization and fill need with other moves.

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05-13-2013, 02:12 PM
  #735
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bryanbryoil View Post
For once I agree with Lowetide, the idea that we'd take a D and possibly wait 3-4 years for him to develop is a scary proposition given where our team if currently. That said I'd still be trying very hard to trade up and secure that center. Carolina is the perfect team to talk to in that regard. I'd happily overpay if it meant us walking away with Barkov or Monahan. I would be all in and nothing short of our big 5 would be on the table to land that player.
I don't think that should really be a deterrent to drafting a defenseman.

We do need help now, but the extra help in 2-3 seasons might be even more valuable.

Take Klefbom for instance. If he steps into the NHL next season and plays like a solid second pairing defenseman, is anyone going to be disappointed that it took 2 seasons for him to get there?


MacT can't mortgage the future just to ice a competent line-up next season or the season after. If he trades down for Lazar, I hope it's because he thinks Lazar will be more valuable to the organization than Nurse and not that because he thinks Lazar will be in the NHL sooner than Nurse.

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05-13-2013, 02:19 PM
  #736
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Originally Posted by dnicks17 View Post
Pretty sure Florida plans to keep Huberdeau at wing.

Especially if they pick MacKinnon.
Only if he shows he can't play center...

You don't just take a good centerman and make him a winger.

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05-13-2013, 02:22 PM
  #737
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Only if he shows he can't play center...

You don't just take a good centerman and make him a winger.
If he's just as good(or better) on the wing and the team has a boatload of centers, I don't see why you wouldn't.

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05-13-2013, 02:33 PM
  #738
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DousedInOil View Post
Listening to Lowetide today is scaring me. He believes that it's a center or bust. He thinks that with Musil, Klefbom, Gernat and Marincin in the system that we won't be looking at defencemen with our first pick. He believes that if Monahan is gone that we trade down and draft Lazar.

I like Lazar but this management group is getting ridiculous. We pass on Jenner to draft Musil (because we needed defence) and now were going to pass on Nurse for Lazar. I'd rather have Jenner an Nurse than Musil and Lazar.

I asked Pronman (on Lowetides show) about having Lazar ranked 29th and he basically just said that he questions his offensive upside.
This has kinda been the indication for awhile now. Hasn't Tencer and Stauffer said the same with regards to taking a center, because management likes are depth at d in the system?

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05-13-2013, 02:36 PM
  #739
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If management is that high on Lazar, find a way to move up from one of the 2nds. Trading down just never works out.

Was it already posted about Tampa Bay having Nichushkin ranked #1, depending on how they're interviews go?

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05-13-2013, 02:38 PM
  #740
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Originally Posted by BK201 View Post
Only if he shows he can't play center...

You don't just take a good centerman and make him a winger.
Question, then why did Florida move him to wing? Not like Florida is littered with good centers.

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05-13-2013, 02:50 PM
  #741
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
Question, then why did Florida move him to wing? Not like Florida is littered with good centers.
Sometimes it's a temporary move because a team thinks a player isin't ready to handle the stress of centre ice. Sometimes because they think they're not strong enough or mentally ready to handle the position the Leafs did it with Kadri I know there are many more examples but he's the easiest to recall off the top of my head.

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05-13-2013, 03:06 PM
  #742
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
This has kinda been the indication for awhile now. Hasn't Tencer and Stauffer said the same with regards to taking a center, because management likes are depth at d in the system?
I didn't get that. Stu even said that you can never have enough good dmen. I think all of you are overreacting. We will take bpa....maybe we trade down if our management team believes there isn't much separating Monahan/Nurse from Lazar but like they said - depends what we get compensated for doing so (and then weighing it with what we are potentially giving up).

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05-13-2013, 03:10 PM
  #743
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
Question, then why did Florida move him to wing? Not like Florida is littered with good centers.
It's because Huberdeau played wing in junior. I didn't see him play this year in junior but the two previous years he was a winger (and Phillips his center).

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05-13-2013, 03:15 PM
  #744
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Originally Posted by jeremiahjones View Post
If management is that high on Lazar, find a way to move up from one of the 2nds. Trading down just never works out.

Was it already posted about Tampa Bay having Nichushkin ranked #1, depending on how they're interviews go?
I wonder if Nashville still goes for Bakov or draft Drouin if he falls to them.

1. Colorado- Jones
2. Florida- MacKinnon
3. Tampa- Nichuskin
4. Nashville- Barkov
5. Carolina- Drouin
6. Calgary- Lindholm
7. Edmonton- Monahan

Looks great to me

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05-13-2013, 03:21 PM
  #745
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Originally Posted by Redwood Original View Post
Say Lazar turned out to be Ryan O'Reilly and nothing more, nothing less, isn't that exactly what this team needs? People have been pining for an "O'Reilly type player" for two years, and now everyone wants to avoid choosing a guy who is a very solid bet to turn into exactly that?

If we miss out on guys with a better overall game, Barkov, Monahan, Lindholm, why not make the "safe" pick? The overall game, character, drive, enthusiasm, that Lazar brings to the rink is everything the Edmonton Oilers lack.
Lists of first round busts are littered with "safe" picks. And since when is Lazar a "solid bet" to be an O'Reilly type? No scouting service would have him out of the top ten if that was the case.

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05-13-2013, 03:27 PM
  #746
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Originally Posted by DousedInOil View Post
I wonder if Nashville still goes for Bakov or draft Drouin if he falls to them.

1. Colorado- Jones
2. Florida- MacKinnon
3. Tampa- Nichuskin
4. Nashville- Barkov
5. Carolina- Drouin
6. Calgary- Lindholm
7. Edmonton- Monahan

Looks great to me
I like this mock and think it is realistic.

Regarding Nsh and Drouin.....has Nsh ever drafted a winger in the 1st rd? (Or even the 2nd rd?)

They seem to be a team that values D and then centers so I would expect them to take Barkov over Drouin if given the choice.

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05-13-2013, 03:28 PM
  #747
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The 1st two rounds of a draft minimum you take the best player available. Having the 'we have lots of this type of player' attitude is what makes you do dumb things like pass on Parise. I could care less if we have no forward prospects and 10 d prospects if the best guy on my board on round 1 and 2 is a Dman I take him.

The best way to get a good team long term is by drafting talent and then filling in the gaps. If you have too many quality players of a certain type of position you use those assets to get other players. If we need to fill out a position of need then by all means after round 2 or 3 draft guys you like with an eye on position or size or such but the 1st few rounds should be purely talent.

I look at us taking Musil and passing on a guy like Rattie (whom I mocked to the Oilers that year.) and you have yet another small offensively skilled forward right? but who would you rather have in the prospect pool now? Rattie or Musil?

Best player available.

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05-13-2013, 03:33 PM
  #748
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Beerfish I agree with everything you said.....regarding Rattie and Musil I rather have Musil. I think he will be the better pro. Rattie looks good on Portland but not sure if he has the skating (speed) to be as good in the NHL. Also, in the big tournaments I've seen him, at times he's looked good and other times he really struggles (when playing with equally or more talented players). Again just my opinion

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05-13-2013, 03:39 PM
  #749
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DousedInOil View Post
I wonder if Nashville still goes for Bakov or draft Drouin if he falls to them.

1. Colorado- Jones
2. Florida- MacKinnon
3. Tampa- Nichuskin
4. Nashville- Barkov
5. Carolina- Drouin
6. Calgary- Lindholm
7. Edmonton- Monahan

Looks great to me
If it's between Drouin and Barkov, it feels more Nashville of a pick to take Barkov. If they do take Drouin, then this is a great scenario for our pick.

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05-13-2013, 03:41 PM
  #750
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Originally Posted by doubledown99 View Post
Beerfish I agree with everything you said.....regarding Rattie and Musil I rather have Musil. I think he will be the better pro. Rattie looks good on Portland but not sure if he has the skating (speed) to be as good in the NHL. Also, in the big tournaments I've seen him, at times he's looked good and other times he really struggles (when playing with equally or more talented players). Again just my opinion
Rattie's speed isnt a problem. Its one of his strengths.

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