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Anyone hear of expansion/merger plans for ECHL, CHL, SPHL FOR 2013-14?

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Old
05-10-2013, 12:47 AM
  #176
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Originally Posted by mfrerkes View Post
I agree regarding Brampton. It is (at best) an unproven commodity in AA hockey and was an abject failure in junior hockey. If the CHL survives another season, I think Brampton's attendance could go lower than the 1,762 Fort Worth averaged this past season.

I'd put Quad City or Bloomington ahead of Brampton for an ECHL franchise...not that either are particularly strong hockey markets. They just have a better overall history than Brampton does right now. They'd also work well enough to fit between the North or Central divisions.
The Victoria Salmon Kings succeeded in the ECHL, and they would still be around today if the owner of the Chilliwack Bruins decided to keep the team in Chilliwack. I have a feeling that the Beast may draw better than you all think they will.

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05-10-2013, 01:32 AM
  #177
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If Elmira, Wheeling and Trenton(until this year)can last year after year with losing all that kinda cash the ECHL might as well jump in hard for QC and Bloomy!

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05-10-2013, 03:06 AM
  #178
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CHL Arizona -- The ECHL has already tried and failed twice in the Phoenix area. Unclear if they'd go for a third attempt.

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05-10-2013, 12:05 PM
  #179
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Just merge already...

As for Arizona, they already have a team that theoretically is capable of surviving. Salaries may be higher in the ECHL, but travel would have to be so much lower.

So that leaves you with these little games where the CHL charges you for leaving and the ECHL charges you for joining. So no team goes anywhere. Stop the petty games and merge the leagues already. Forget capping the ECHL at 30. Take any team strong enough to join. It just make sense.

I say it's about time the ECHL significantly drops the cost to join. Lure the strong CHL teams, kill the league and be done with it.

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05-11-2013, 07:51 AM
  #180
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Originally Posted by Slowe View Post
Just merge already...

As for Arizona, they already have a team that theoretically is capable of surviving. Salaries may be higher in the ECHL, but travel would have to be so much lower.

So that leaves you with these little games where the CHL charges you for leaving and the ECHL charges you for joining. So no team goes anywhere. Stop the petty games and merge the leagues already. Forget capping the ECHL at 30. Take any team strong enough to join. It just make sense.

I say it's about time the ECHL significantly drops the cost to join. Lure the strong CHL teams, kill the league and be done with it.
I agree wholeheartedly. It sure would make my silly season much easier on my digestion. The silly season has been absolutely crazy every year since the Mavericks joined the CHL in 2009/10.

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05-11-2013, 08:27 AM
  #181
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any body know whats going on down in augusta last update was wednesday.

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05-13-2013, 02:11 AM
  #182
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Well the Allen Americans just won the CHL championship. Does this entice the ECHL to scoop them up? Any new update?

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05-13-2013, 06:08 AM
  #183
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Many people are waiting for the announcement of both Rapid City & Allen to say they are joining the ECHL - who knows if others teams have been invited - time will tell.

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05-13-2013, 09:44 AM
  #184
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The ECHL didn't need any enticing. This move was a done deal a while ago. It's just a matter of when it's announced.

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05-13-2013, 01:19 PM
  #185
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http://www.pjstar.com/news/x81143787...team-in-Peoria

Peoria and Bloomington going to SPHL next season. Could others be following shortly?

The CHL is looking very, very shaky. The end could be sooner rather than later.

2012-13 CHL teams and my guesses for the status of each next season:

Allen (ECHL)
Wichita (CHL/ECHL)
Fort Worth (junior/fold)
Rapid City (ECHL)
Missouri (CHL/ECHL)
Quad City (CHL/fold/junior/SPHL)
Arizona (CHL/ECHL/fold)
Denver (CHL/fold)
Bloomington (SPHL)
Tulsa (CHL/junior)

Expansion:
St. Charles (DOA/SPHL)
Brampton (CHL/DOA)

At most the CHL would have Wichita, Missouri, Denver, QC Arizona, Tulsa and the 2 expansion teams. I find this scenario very unlikely. Should Wichita and/or Missouri leave for the ECHL, then I believe the CHL would cease to exist.


Last edited by Cyclones Rock: 05-13-2013 at 02:14 PM.
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05-13-2013, 01:59 PM
  #186
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cyclones Rock View Post
http://www.pjstar.com/news/x81143787...team-in-Peoria

Peoria and Bloomington going to SPHL next season. Could others be following shortly?
Wow, didn't see Peoria and Bloomington to the SPHL! At least it's not the Fed and I'm glad the fans will have entertainment on the weekends.

I can't see Allen joining the ECHL unless Tulsa and Wichita join (if ever). Every road game for Allen would mean a flight. Mike Modano is somehow affiliated with the team, right? GM, owner, executive? Maybe he will fund the travel....

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05-13-2013, 02:08 PM
  #187
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Wow.... Peoria to the SPHL is honestly a shocking move. If they're able to keep that market, Peoria would be a big coup for the SPHL, even with the distance factor.

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05-13-2013, 03:17 PM
  #188
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It could be that the new owners of the Peoria franchise want to keep hockey alive and then possibly move to the ECHL next season when Indianapolis enters the league.

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05-13-2013, 03:30 PM
  #189
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SenorChifles View Post
It could be that the new owners of the Peoria franchise want to keep hockey alive and then possibly move to the ECHL next season when Indianapolis enters the league.
My hunch as well, even without Indy, though I'm sure that Peoria staying for the long haul is part of the SPHL's wishful thinking.

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05-13-2013, 06:04 PM
  #190
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You guys aren't giving the SPHl enough credit. the league has improved every year, and when the CHL goes away, that will basically replace it. It won't be the AHL but either will be the ECHL.

@SPHL_Nation

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05-13-2013, 06:57 PM
  #191
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Didn't say that the SPHL was a bad league, just stating the fact that the owners probably do not want to put the franchise on the shelf for a year until they can try and join the ECHL.
I think the fans in Peoria would want to have Indy, Ft. Wayne, Kalamazoo, Toledo, Cincy & Evansville as rivals as they are closer and have a history.
The SPHL fills a void for the Southern cities and they have grown each of the last few years. I am surprised they have not tried to go after Greensboro, Roanoke, Richmond and Birmingham to name a few.

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05-13-2013, 07:27 PM
  #192
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Originally Posted by CShuckWangGoAway View Post
You guys aren't giving the SPHl enough credit. the league has improved every year, and when the CHL goes away, that will basically replace it. It won't be the AHL but either will be the ECHL.

@SPHL_Nation
No one is knocking the SPHL...

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05-13-2013, 10:26 PM
  #193
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CShuckWangGoAway View Post
You guys aren't giving the SPHl enough credit. the league has improved every year, and when the CHL goes away, that will basically replace it. It won't be the AHL but either will be the ECHL.

@SPHL_Nation
No one's knocking the SPHL, but it is single A to the ECHL and CHL's AA (albeit the CHL is lower AA).

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05-13-2013, 10:47 PM
  #194
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Originally Posted by jeben51 View Post
I can't see Allen joining the ECHL unless Tulsa and Wichita join (if ever). Every road game for Allen would mean a flight. Mike Modano is somehow affiliated with the team, right? GM, owner, executive? Maybe he will fund the travel....
See it. It's happening. Modano, Craig Ludwig, and Ed Belfour are all part owners.

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05-14-2013, 08:12 AM
  #195
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Originally Posted by FrancoRussianAlaskan View Post
See it. It's happening. Modano, Craig Ludwig, and Ed Belfour are all part owners.
I guess if Alaska can survive then anywhere in North America a team can. Hopefully they will be in the western conference. Flights from Dallas-Denver, San Fran, LAX are probably cheaper than ATL, PHI, DET

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05-14-2013, 10:46 AM
  #196
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Originally Posted by SenorChifles View Post
Didn't say that the SPHL was a bad league, just stating the fact that the owners probably do not want to put the franchise on the shelf for a year until they can try and join the ECHL.
I think the fans in Peoria would want to have Indy, Ft. Wayne, Kalamazoo, Toledo, Cincy & Evansville as rivals as they are closer and have a history.
The SPHL fills a void for the Southern cities and they have grown each of the last few years. I am surprised they have not tried to go after Greensboro, Roanoke, Richmond and Birmingham to name a few.
I didn't say you were knocking it, I said people here weren't giving it enough credit.

I know you people have dreams of the ECHL again, but if they are going to own both teams, why would they move one to the ECHL? They're not going to move one of these teams away from the other when they own both of them.

And how do you know all of those teams are going to stay in the ECHL?

Me thinks some more moves are coming soon.

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05-14-2013, 12:43 PM
  #197
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Originally Posted by CShuckWangGoAway View Post
I didn't say you were knocking it, I said people here weren't giving it enough credit.

I know you people have dreams of the ECHL again, but if they are going to own both teams, why would they move one to the ECHL? They're not going to move one of these teams away from the other when they own both of them.

And how do you know all of those teams are going to stay in the ECHL?

Me thinks some more moves are coming soon
.
The SPHL just made a move which caught almost everyone off guard. I'd think that this is just a first step in a strategic plan to grow single A hockey in the midwest and the east along with their traditional southern base.

In the midwest, Quad City (CHL) and St. Charles (CHL expansion) come immediately to mind as future SPHL markets. In the east, Elmira (ECHL), Wheeling (ECHL), Danbury (FHL), Trenton (formerly ECHL) and, yes, Reading (ECHL). In the south, both South Carolina (ECHL), Greenville(ECHL) and even Gwinnett (ECHL) and Florida (ECHL) could be target SPHL markets as well. These markets-for various reasons-seem more suited to the single A model of hockey than the AA.

I agree, many more moves could be coming very soon. The Peoria move to the SPHL instead of the ECHL was a shocker, and Bloomington bolting the CHL for the SPHL set the groundwork for moves which weren't even on most peoples' radars just two days ago.


Last edited by Cyclones Rock: 05-14-2013 at 12:50 PM.
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Old
05-14-2013, 02:06 PM
  #198
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The Bloomington/Peoria move to the SPHL was a shock but not because Peoria didn't go to the ECHL. The ECHL wouldn't have gone into Peoria until at least 14-15 and Bloomington knew this so when the Canucks said "nope" they acted quickly and applied to the SPHL.

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05-14-2013, 04:44 PM
  #199
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CShuckWangGoAway;65961815[B
]You guys aren't giving the SPHl enough credit[/B]. the league has improved every year, and when the CHL goes away, that will basically replace it. It won't be the AHL but either will be the ECHL.

@SPHL_Nation
You can count me as someone who doesn't give the SPHL a lot of credit. I'll give them this, they've carved out their niche market in the deep south and succeeded as developing into the "only" single A league where the Mid-Atlantic Hockey League, AAHL, EPHL, and assuredly the FHL have/will fail. I'm sure they have a cult following in a few of their markets particularly Knoxville, Fayetteville, and Huntsville.

That being said, I've watched from a distance as two clubs, JAX and now Augusta played games in practice rinks where 800-1100 fans could watch. Jacksonville was in the SPHL finals when they played their games in their practice facility. That wasn't a pre-season game, that was the SPHL finals. Augusta's mess finished today with them throwing in the towel and bowing out when they could have announced their withdrawl from this upcoming season 2 months ago. No negotiations have been taking place between the owners and the James Brown arena managment regarding the ice system for some time but yet they waited until the SPHL needed a definitive answer before announcing the obvious which 90% of the people in this forum could have figured out.

It speaks volumes about how the SPHL upper crust runs their league. Since 2005-06, Combs has publicly stated that his ideal vision for the SPHL is a 10-12 team loop based in the South East. For the last 3 summers, Combs has stated publicly that between 1-3 teams will be joining for the following season. This hasn't happened for the last two seasons and don't fool yourself into thinking that the plan all along was to poach Bloomington and Peoria from the CHL and AHL. This has completely fallen into their lap and it takes them significantly out of their footprint in the South.

They have had a lopsided conference of 9 teams now for 2-3 seasons and although SPHL owners claim that they want to grow the league slowly and with purpose with the right owners, I think that they would have taken on markets as far-fetched as Tupelo and Talahassee in order to give them an even number of teams had their been any type of ownership options in those markets.

Attendance in some of their better markets has dropped the last number of years and the ownership in one of their more stable markets (Columbus) publicly wondered if it was worth it to come back for another season. My understanding is that the Mississipi Surge organization owned by Tim Kerr is very much in flux trying to secure a semi-legitimate number of season tickets to dictate whether it is worth coming back for another season and were struggling mightily to secure a pretty low number of season tickets. Then there's Pensacola and the ongoing debacle with Escambia County on whether it's feasible to make necessary upgrades to the facility on a money losing operation. Enough money in the treasury? Probably. But if that's your most recent league champ and there are serious questions regarding their long-term viability, I think this also speaks volumes about the league right now.

In short, straying significantly outside your geographic footprint to add two markets with one almost certainly hoping for a 1 year stop gap before the ECHL (and more natural rivalries) also says something. So perhaps your right. I'm not giving the SPHL that much credit at the moment....

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05-14-2013, 05:36 PM
  #200
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Augusta only played in that rink because their ice system went down.

They are so far above what they were since Jacksonville was in the league it's not even close to that.

I'm not saying it's NHL, and your post is just further proof that people don't give the league enough credit.

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