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Trade Rumours and Proposals Thread Part 17: What does "bold" mean?

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Old
05-14-2013, 11:24 PM
  #476
Paralyzer008
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What a tough year to have a team need for d-men. I have a good feeling that any d-men is going to cost us a lot.

As I've posted before, my ideal lineup on D next year is:
Smid-Shattenkirk
Scuderi-J.Schultz
Hainsey-Petry

Shattenkirk is UNLIKELY
Scuderi is UNLIKELY
Hainsey is a MAYBE

I really am stressing about the D next year, because it never gets fixed and I doubt it gets fixed again. Can anyone think of maybe TWO d-men to add that are realistic, and provide your case? You would be adding to this:
Petry
Smid
J.Schultz
Potter

I'm thinking about more so getting D for picks/prospects/UFA rather than trading a body like Gagner/Hemsky, but if you feel that it's realistic that one of those two move for your guy, then present your case, though I'd rather see the above. Don't want to see someone say Klefbom is the answer, because I want him in OKC to start the year.

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05-14-2013, 11:32 PM
  #477
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Shattenkirk isn't happening without a mega overpay.
Also we kind of already have him in J Schultz.

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05-14-2013, 11:33 PM
  #478
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Ference to pair with Potter/Klefbom good defensively, not a bad puck mover, brings a little grit to his game as well, costs nothing but what we pay to move him.

Trade to NYR

7th overall
Harti
Musil +

Edm

Del Zotto - young puck moving LHD fills major need for Oilers.
JT Miller - upgrade for our 3rd line winger.

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05-14-2013, 11:34 PM
  #479
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I really hope we can eventually be like Ottawa. Those pucks were being cleared out of their end lightning quick. Methots a guy I wanted really bad, but now hes looking near untouchable

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05-14-2013, 11:45 PM
  #480
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Unless MacT has some pretty seriously comprimising pics of some other GM's significant others its going to be a pretty depressing off season.

No way are we pulling back a del zotto, shattenkirk, or insert whatever young top 4 dman with upside here without sending back something significant.

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05-15-2013, 12:06 AM
  #481
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“@JasonGregor: "Depending how Nill evaluates the lineup I could see Robidas, Daley and Goligoski available." Mike Heika on Stars off-season moves. #NHL”

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05-15-2013, 12:18 AM
  #482
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Groucho View Post
Unless MacT has some pretty seriously comprimising pics of some other GM's significant others its going to be a pretty depressing off season.

No way are we pulling back a del zotto, shattenkirk, or insert whatever young top 4 dman with upside here without sending back something significant.
I would consider the 7th overall pick something significant..I would even do a slight overpay like

7th overall + Musil + b prospect/2nd rounder for Del Zotto

or

7th overall + Harti + b prospect/2nd rounder

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05-15-2013, 12:42 AM
  #483
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Does Del Zotto want out of NY or something? I feel like I'm oblivious to the information that leads all these posters into thinking the hard-pressed-to-score Rangers who are in win-now mode would trade their young PP QB for a draft pick.

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05-15-2013, 01:05 AM
  #484
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Most of these proposals are far from bold, like any of those teams would give up a shattenkirk or del zotto or any other player whose stock is at a high. Bold is what ottawa does , trade for players with a potential to pay off (Turris, Anderson, Methot,) and give the young guns more responsibilty(which were finally doing).
And get a bad ass coach to boot, this aint the swiss national team.

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05-15-2013, 01:21 AM
  #485
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Most of these proposals are far from bold, like any of those teams would give up a shattenkirk or del zotto or any other player whose stock is at a high. Bold is what ottawa does , trade for players with a potential to pay off (Turris, Anderson, Methot,) and give the young guns more responsibilty(which were finally doing).
And get a bad ass coach to boot, this aint the swiss national team.
Clearly, we need a coach with a killer mustache.

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05-15-2013, 01:26 AM
  #486
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Clearly, we need a coach with a killer mustache.

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05-15-2013, 01:27 AM
  #487
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Saw this guy at MKT the other night. He's like 60 years old and has absolute babes showing up to sit at his booth. Must be the mustache.

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05-15-2013, 01:28 AM
  #488
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We're gonna hire Paul MacLean's doppleganger...

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05-15-2013, 02:20 AM
  #489
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“@JasonGregor: "Depending how Nill evaluates the lineup I could see Robidas, Daley and Goligoski available." Mike Heika on Stars off-season moves. #NHL”

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05-15-2013, 02:30 AM
  #490
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Originally Posted by Bergeron47 View Post
“@JasonGregor: "Depending how Nill evaluates the lineup I could see Robidas, Daley and Goligoski available." Mike Heika on Stars off-season moves. #NHL”
I don't know if Nill goes for it but if Goli's available and the Oilers have another deal in place for a 2C I'd make the move for Goligoski.

Only 27, LHD, can move the puck and man the PP. And him along with Dillon were eating most of the ES minutes for the Stars (>18min/night).

I wouldn't necessarily play him with J.Schultz but I think he could thrive with Petry.

Smid-J.Schultz isn't too bad of a second pairing IMO.

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05-15-2013, 03:27 AM
  #491
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Originally Posted by The Perfect Human View Post
I don't know if Nill goes for it but if Goli's available and the Oilers have another deal in place for a 2C I'd make the move for Goligoski.

Only 27, LHD, can move the puck and man the PP. And him along with Dillon were eating most of the ES minutes for the Stars (>18min/night).

I wouldn't necessarily play him with J.Schultz but I think he could thrive with Petry.

Smid-J.Schultz isn't too bad of a second pairing IMO.
While the majority of posters have grandiose plans for Shattenkirk, Del Zotto, Weber, ect. I think a more realistic acquisition could be a Goligoski or Robidas. 22+ min. A night and frankly we could use them both.
Goli would be a great puck-mover, and Robidas would be an upgrade on N. Schultz.

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05-15-2013, 05:29 AM
  #492
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Keeping in mind the division the Oilers are headed into the season, the outlook looks bleak given the core management has assembled. I'm not doubting the superstar potential of Hall/RNH/Eberle/Yakupov, but I just don't feel they are playing in a division where they'll be able to thrive.

If those 4 were in the East you could probably add 5-10pt over an 82 game season to their point totals. The style, system, and scoring in that conference is ridiculously different than the West.

When you have Hall/RNH/Yakupov/Eberle (avg weight 185) as your core forwards heading forward up against other teams' cores in Getzlaf/Perry/Etem/Ryan (avg weight 210), Thornton/Marleau/Couture/Pavelski (avg weight 209), and Kopitar-Brown-Carter-Richards (avg weight 212), you're bound to lose the match-up. These players are every bit as skilled and talented as our stars, and in some cases just as fast (Marleau/Richards/Brown). On top of it all they're taller, heavier, and stronger. It's why the Oilers struggled so poorly vs those California teams earlier this season.

You can add all the size and physicality you want to the bottom-2 lines, but the fact is in today's NHL people aren't using 3rd line checkers to play against top lines anymore. Top players are going head-to-head against top players, and the stronger, more complete C's are winning the matchup. RNH already had some exposure to it this year, and seemed to struggle with it as the season wore on. Gagner is dead meat - he is a player that will get CREAMED in this division. He needs to be shipped East ASAP. Hall's heart, RNH's unique style, and Yakupov's compact tough frame could withstand this division. MPS/Gagner/Eberle likely can't.

Even if you fill those spots with big, physical forwards, you're going to need much of the same (albeit with less offensive potential) in your bottom-6. Horcoff likely has to go.

And let's not forget the Oilers' #1 need, and perhaps the most unfixable issue for NHL teams right now, a #1 defenseman. I'm not even going to address that like it's a possibility. I'd be happy with a strong top-4 (SJS/VAN follow this model). But when Beauchemin, Doughty, and OEL are all in your division, you're already in trouble. On top of the hulking forwards our scoring F's have to deal with, you have Norris-quality defensemen being matched up against them in shut-down roles. Their versatility allows them to turn any mistakes into instant transition offense. Let's not forget the steady crop of #2-level Dmen in the division. Fowler, Hamhuis, Edler, Garrison, Voynov, and Mitchell are all better than any defenseman the Oilers have to offer.

And I'm a big pro-Dubnyk guy - but Niemi/Quick/Hiller are 3 significantly better goaltenders than him as well.

The outlook's bleak. I know Mac-T said he was looking to introduce 6-8 new players for this upcoming season but that may not be enough. And I can't think of a time in the past where a team was able to turn-over about 10-11 players in an off-season.

But that's what it's going to take this team to be successful. I don't see SJS/LAK dropping out of contention anytime soon. VAN with whatever changes it makes is likely going to be ahead of the Oilers as well. ANA has an uncertain future here with Selanne headed to potential retirement, but has assets and money to re-tool (Sbisa on the 3rd pairing, ).

Oiler fans have gone through a lot already, landing in this division is the worst news possible for a rebuild that has already been geared to follow the PIT/CHI model...


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Old
05-15-2013, 05:38 AM
  #493
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Heading into the off-season, I'd go forward with a framework like this and look to add around it:

Hall-RNH-____
___-____-Yakupov
____-____-____
Brown-____-____
Lander

____-Petry
Smid-_____
N.Schultz-J.Schultz
Potter

Dubnyk
______

Trade assets: Gagner, Eberle, MPS, N.Schultz, Hemsky, Hartikainen, Belanger, Smyth, draft picks
Possible internal additions: Monahan, Klefbom, Marincin
Buy-out: Horcoff, whichever of Belanger/Smyth is untradeable, potentially N. Schultz

The rest is UFA signings.


Last edited by The Perfect Human*: 05-15-2013 at 09:57 AM.
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05-15-2013, 09:12 AM
  #494
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Perfect Human View Post
Heading into the off-season, I'd go forward with a framework like this and look to add around it:

Hall-RNH-____
___-____-Yakupov
____-____-____
Brown-____-____
Lander

____-Petry
Smid-_____
N.Schultz-J.Schultz
Potter

Dubnyk
______

Trade assets: Gagner, Eberle, MPS, N.Schultz, Hartikainen, Belanger, Smyth, draft picks
Possible internal additions: Monahan, Klefbom, Marincin
Buy-out: Horcoff, whichever of Belanger/Smyth is untradeable, potentially N. Schultz

The rest is UFA signings.
So you are trading Eberle but keeping N Schultz and Dubnyk?

Pfffffft.

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05-15-2013, 09:17 AM
  #495
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Originally Posted by The Perfect Human View Post
Keeping in mind the division the Oilers are headed into the season, the outlook looks bleak given the core management has assembled. I'm not doubting the superstar potential of Hall/RNH/Eberle/Yakupov, but I just don't feel they are playing in a division where they'll be able to thrive.

If those 4 were in the East you could probably add 5-10pt over an 82 game season to their point totals. The style, system, and scoring in that conference is ridiculously different than the West.

When you have Hall/RNH/Yakupov/Eberle (avg weight 185) as your core forwards heading forward up against other teams' cores in Getzlaf/Perry/Etem/Ryan (avg weight 210), Thornton/Marleau/Couture/Pavelski (avg weight 209), and Kopitar-Brown-Carter-Richards (avg weight 212), you're bound to lose the match-up. These players are every bit as skilled and talented as our stars, and in some cases just as fast (Marleau/Richards/Brown). On top of it all they're taller, heavier, and stronger. It's why the Oilers struggled so poorly vs those California teams earlier this season.
I agree with you on the whole size but it's not a fair comparison in terms of physical maturity. The Oiler core is made up of kids. We have to give em time to bulk up and grow into their bodies. No they won't ever be as big as those other teams but adding 10-15 lbs of muscle in the next couple years or so will go a long way.

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05-15-2013, 09:22 AM
  #496
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So you are trading Eberle but keeping N Schultz and Dubnyk?

Pfffffft.
Nobody is trading Eberle. It's redonk and ain't happennin. We have 2 potential studs in Klefbom and Marincin coming down the pipe. Let's see how that works out first. This team can keep it's core together and get better with some lower level acquistions of guys that can actually play in the bottom 6.

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05-15-2013, 09:56 AM
  #497
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Nobody is trading Eberle. It's redonk and ain't happennin. We have 2 potential studs in Klefbom and Marincin coming down the pipe. Let's see how that works out first. This team can keep it's core together and get better with some lower level acquistions of guys that can actually play in the bottom 6.
Yeah perhaps what I said was a bit too drastic. Give it a couple years then. One year with a beefed up bottom-6 and 2 additional top-4 D just to see how the team does with "no excuses" for it's top-6 or top-pairing D.
If they look like duds by a) not making the playoffs or b) being completely out-classed in the divisional rounds of the playoffs, I think it's time to start reconsidering who is part of the "core"

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05-15-2013, 09:57 AM
  #498
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So you are trading Eberle but keeping N Schultz and Dubnyk?

Pfffffft.
Yes, because 0.920 save percentage goaltenders grow on trees...

And I'd accidentally slipped Schultz into that lineup. Had listed him under tradeables on the list. Also forgot to include Hemsky, going to add him as well.

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05-15-2013, 10:24 AM
  #499
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I don't know if Nill goes for it but if Goli's available and the Oilers have another deal in place for a 2C I'd make the move for Goligoski.

Only 27, LHD, can move the puck and man the PP. And him along with Dillon were eating most of the ES minutes for the Stars (>18min/night).

I wouldn't necessarily play him with J.Schultz but I think he could thrive with Petry.

Smid-J.Schultz isn't too bad of a second pairing IMO.
looking at the Star's roster for next year, they are going to be a lottery team for sure. They have zero depth beyond Benn and Erikssen. They are a perfect team for one of our surplus smaller forwards like Hemsky or Gagner.

I am not certain how strong the local hockey fan base is so they probably want to avoid a complete tank.

Hemsky for Daley might work for both teams, especially if we eat some of Hemsky's salary. We may have to include a B level prospect or one of our 2nd round picks

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05-15-2013, 10:34 AM
  #500
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looking at the Star's roster for next year, they are going to be a lottery team for sure. They have zero depth beyond Benn and Erikssen. They are a perfect team for one of our surplus smaller forwards like Hemsky or Gagner.

I am not certain how strong the local hockey fan base is so they probably want to avoid a complete tank.

Hemsky for Daley might work for both teams, especially if we eat some of Hemsky's salary. We may have to include a B level prospect or one of our 2nd round picks
Rebuilding teams don't trade to get older, especially when the main piece is a guy who may or may not be healthy after x-mas.

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