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General Predators Talk Part III

View Poll Results: Will we see any games for the 12-13 season?
Yes 12 32.43%
Nope 8 21.62%
Partial season 17 45.95%
Voters: 37. You may not vote on this poll

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Old
05-14-2013, 05:54 AM
  #576
AtlantaWhaler
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NoNecksCurse View Post
im gonna go ahead and say the franson trade was poile's worst. franson and lombardi for lebda (buyout)... we didn't even use the cap space from getting rid of lombardi
Didn't we use the cap space to sign Rinne?

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05-14-2013, 06:56 AM
  #577
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Originally Posted by NoNecksCurse View Post
im gonna go ahead and say the franson trade was poile's worst. franson and lombardi for lebda (buyout)... we didn't even use the cap space from getting rid of lombardi
I know you sent this before the game was over, but just to point out that Franson was on the ice for 3 of the Leafs goals and was -2 for the game. That's why he was traded.

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05-14-2013, 08:20 AM
  #578
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Originally Posted by AtlantaWhaler View Post
Didn't we use the cap space to sign Rinne?
if over a year later counts for you... IIRC we pretty much had no moves of significance that summer after poile kept talking about all the free space.


Last edited by NoNecksCurse: 05-14-2013 at 08:30 AM.
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05-14-2013, 08:22 AM
  #579
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Originally Posted by jlsg View Post
I know you sent this before the game was over, but just to point out that Franson was on the ice for 3 of the Leafs goals and was -2 for the game. That's why he was traded.
his defense is suspect at times but toronto has him in a role a little too big. he would be perfect here on a lesser role / pp unit... hindsight of course

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05-14-2013, 09:09 AM
  #580
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Originally Posted by NoNecksCurse View Post
his defense is suspect at times but toronto has him in a role a little too big. he would be perfect here on a lesser role / pp unit... hindsight of course
So basically the same protected role Ellis and Blum play in.

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05-14-2013, 09:23 AM
  #581
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Originally Posted by AtrickhayOrnqvistpay View Post
So basically the same protected role Ellis and Blum play in.
not even close.. franson can play 2nd pair, although he is best suited for 3rd pair imo. his PP play isnt even comparable to the two.

honestly if we're lucky at this point, ill be tickled if blum/ellis blossom to a franson caliber defenseman.

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05-14-2013, 10:00 AM
  #582
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Originally Posted by NoNecksCurse View Post
not even close.. franson can play 2nd pair, although he is best suited for 3rd pair imo. his PP play isnt even comparable to the two.

honestly if we're lucky at this point, ill be tickled if blum/ellis blossom to a franson caliber defenseman.
looking at Cody stat line from last night ... all I can say is
NO. PLAYER POS G A P +/- PIM S HITS BKS GVA TKA FO% TOI
4 C. FRANSON D 2 0 2 -2 0 3 8 0 1 0 - 27:31

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05-14-2013, 10:35 AM
  #583
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Originally Posted by Dave is a killer View Post
looking at Cody stat line from last night ... all I can say is
NO. PLAYER POS G A P +/- PIM S HITS BKS GVA TKA FO% TOI
4 C. FRANSON D 2 0 2 -2 0 3 8 0 1 0 - 27:31
almost 28 minutes TOI proves my point. just too much ice time for franson.. the guy is still developing though. would take him over blum/ellis as everyone should at this point

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05-14-2013, 11:29 AM
  #584
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Originally Posted by NoNecksCurse View Post
almost 28 minutes TOI proves my point. just too much ice time for franson.. the guy is still developing though. would take him over blum/ellis as everyone should at this point
26 in August, I'd say his development arc is done

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05-14-2013, 11:49 AM
  #585
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26 in August, I'd say his development arc is done
i disagree. his play has developed tremendously from last year. some guys have career years in their 30s.. maybe we should hear this advice on ellis/blum but franson isnt a midget either at 6'5

just look at klein.. he will be 29 in december.. think its fair to say he was still developing at 25, which is franson's current age

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05-14-2013, 11:56 AM
  #586
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Franson has been very good for the Leafs this year. You can scrutinize his minutes, but we took a gamble trading him based on Blum's strong debut.

To date, it looks like we kept the wrong defenseman.

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05-14-2013, 11:59 AM
  #587
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Originally Posted by OurGocIsAnAwesomeGoc View Post
Franson has been very good for the Leafs this year. You can scrutinize his minutes, but we took a gamble trading him based on Blum's strong debut.

To date, it looks like we kept the wrong defenseman.
agreed, blum looks to be gone. lets hope ellis develops into an adequate defenseman

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05-14-2013, 12:10 PM
  #588
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Originally Posted by NoNecksCurse View Post
not even close.. franson can play 2nd pair, although he is best suited for 3rd pair imo. his PP play isnt even comparable to the two.

honestly if we're lucky at this point, ill be tickled if blum/ellis blossom to a franson caliber defenseman.
I certainly hope not. I'm hoping that they become real NHL defensemen.

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05-14-2013, 12:35 PM
  #589
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Originally Posted by jlsg View Post
I certainly hope not. I'm hoping that they become real NHL defensemen.
lol disagree there. but i see what you did

looks it will no longer be both as i see one gone this summer.

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05-14-2013, 01:01 PM
  #590
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Originally Posted by NoNecksCurse View Post
im gonna go ahead and say the franson trade was poile's worst. franson and lombardi for lebda (buyout)... we didn't even use the cap space from getting rid of lombardi
Hard to estimate the value of getting out from under the cost of the Lombardi contract; it was about actual out-of-pocket dollars, not cap-space. We had a bunch of similar Dmen; Co*y is the one they settled on - don't know if that was the one DP wanted or if it was what Burke wanted.

However, on a more offensively gifted team than ours in a considerably higher ice-time role, Co*y did an OK O job; but just like last night, his awful (lack of) D cannot be overcome, no matter how nice an O game he plays. 4th season, still has to play PP and protected 3rd-pair minutes; how would that work, exactly - Gill and Co*y?

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05-14-2013, 01:20 PM
  #591
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Originally Posted by NoNecksCurse View Post
i disagree. his play has developed tremendously from last year. some guys have career years in their 30s.. maybe we should hear this advice on ellis/blum but franson isnt a midget either at 6'5

just look at klein.. he will be 29 in december.. think its fair to say he was still developing at 25, which is franson's current age
Can you not use the exact same arguement for a 24 year old blum? Or because he plays for us he is done and gone?

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05-14-2013, 02:16 PM
  #592
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Originally Posted by token grinder View Post
Can you not use the exact same arguement for a 24 year old blum? Or because he plays for us he is done and gone?
your answer is in the quoted post.

i agreed maybe we should hear this advice on blum/ellis

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05-14-2013, 04:15 PM
  #593
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Ellis is 22; I'd be willing to bet he's no worse in 3 years than Co*y is now at age 25. Age-wise, Blum is a just turned 24 and Franson is an almost 26 - they are 20months apart.

Plus, Blum has played 2 less-than half seasons before this; Co*y played a full and 2 other 3/4 seasons - they aren't even close to the same stage, so hard to say Co*y hands-down better - for the long-term - at this point.

Today - Co*y is a fairly accomplished PP specialist 3rd pair guy, certainly more accomplished than either Blum or Ellis. However, Co*y still doesn't look like he'll ever be more than that, even with a whole lot more development time than the other 2 have had.

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05-14-2013, 04:20 PM
  #594
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Originally Posted by NoNecksCurse View Post
if over a year later counts for you... IIRC we pretty much had no moves of significance that summer after poile kept talking about all the free space.
Again, Mike Fisher. It's not a sexy name, but the money did get used. He's a significant upgrade over Lombardi.

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05-14-2013, 04:55 PM
  #595
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Originally Posted by Paranoid Android View Post
Again, Mike Fisher. It's not a sexy name, but the money did get used. He's a significant upgrade over Lombardi.
i was referring to the summer. thought that was during the season.. guess it depends on person's opinion.. but im not so short-sighted to not see your point.

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05-15-2013, 09:32 AM
  #596
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Someone made the point that we seem to be hammering our guys a little hard; maybe to offset the normal overly optimistic bias toward "our guys".

Anyhow - Spaling. Dirk hammered him hard on OTF, guys here, too, other reviews did - rated him out as pretty miserable. However, check out the DeadThings board and they're moaning about missing Helm; his strong forecheck, etc. Of course, that's Nick's game. When you look at the numbers - Spals is a little younger and doesn't have quite the same number of seasons, but.... sure look similar, although Spals assists down this year.

So - are they nuts and overrating Helm, or are we maybe hammering on some of our guys a little much? Lot of them still awfully young and still in development time - which is also kinda' what Marty said (or at least alluded to) on his way out.

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05-15-2013, 10:18 AM
  #597
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Anyone that hammers on Spaling is not watching the game. I think why he gets chastised so much is because of a comment Poile made and people have turned it into something else. The top 6 comment blurs everyone's vision of what Spaling is. Poile never said Spaling is a top 6 but people have taken it that way and expect those kinds of numbers from him. He's not going to do that. Funny thing is, check out our record when he does net a goal, pretty impressive numbers. That notwithstanding, Spaling is a solid number 3 center. He's great defensively, chips in offensively from time to time, I think Cooper or Willie pointed out this year was his best ppg average of his career, is a team guy, plays hurt, does all the little things a team needs to win games and is a great penalty killer. If he nets around 30-40 points a year that should be just about right over the term of his career. He's a team guy and one of those guys that is underrated more often than not because he's not spectacular on the ice with big hits or beautiful goals. He's a lunch pail sort of guy that gets it done and to be honest, is a valuable piece moving forward to this team competing at the highest level.

While it's great to have high end guys, you need solid bottom 6 guys as well and he's about as solid as you get. I think what also gets hammered on with this point is he's redundant on our roster. Well, there are other guys that play the same game as him so I take them as the redundant pieces. I think it would be a huge mistake not to re-sign him this offseason. Good thing is, you can slide him into the 4th line center role as well and he doesn't complain about less ice time, he just goes out and does his job.

So if the guys on OTF want to rip on Spaling, let them, I find those guys to be windbags to the extreme. Anyone can blog these days and unfortunately people buy into the hype of these ignorant bloggers. These are probably the same guys that wanted Klein gone years ago too. All I know is I watch the game and see what I see. Do I see it all, of course not but what I've seen over the years concerning Spaling tells me he's a Predator type player for sure.

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05-15-2013, 10:32 AM
  #598
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15th season of the Preds coming up. Yes 15 including the lockout. Fact the Preds are .563 all time winning percentage

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05-15-2013, 10:37 AM
  #599
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AtrickhayOrnqvistpay View Post
Anyone that hammers on Spaling is not watching the game. I think why he gets chastised so much is because of a comment Poile made and people have turned it into something else. The top 6 comment blurs everyone's vision of what Spaling is. Poile never said Spaling is a top 6 but people have taken it that way and expect those kinds of numbers from him. He's not going to do that. Funny thing is, check out our record when he does net a goal, pretty impressive numbers. That notwithstanding, Spaling is a solid number 3 center. He's great defensively, chips in offensively from time to time, I think Cooper or Willie pointed out this year was his best ppg average of his career, is a team guy, plays hurt, does all the little things a team needs to win games and is a great penalty killer. If he nets around 30-40 points a year that should be just about right over the term of his career. He's a team guy and one of those guys that is underrated more often than not because he's not spectacular on the ice with big hits or beautiful goals. He's a lunch pail sort of guy that gets it done and to be honest, is a valuable piece moving forward to this team competing at the highest level.

While it's great to have high end guys, you need solid bottom 6 guys as well and he's about as solid as you get. I think what also gets hammered on with this point is he's redundant on our roster. Well, there are other guys that play the same game as him so I take them as the redundant pieces. I think it would be a huge mistake not to re-sign him this offseason. Good thing is, you can slide him into the 4th line center role as well and he doesn't complain about less ice time, he just goes out and does his job.

So if the guys on OTF want to rip on Spaling, let them, I find those guys to be windbags to the extreme. Anyone can blog these days and unfortunately people buy into the hype of these ignorant bloggers. These are probably the same guys that wanted Klein gone years ago too. All I know is I watch the game and see what I see. Do I see it all, of course not but what I've seen over the years concerning Spaling tells me he's a Predator type player for sure.
I'm normally a pretty big Spaling fan, but he DID have a rough season. He's supposed to be a defensive specialist\checking forward...but his penalty killing and defense seemed to take a big step back this year. Hopefully it rebounds next season.

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05-15-2013, 04:43 PM
  #600
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Originally Posted by OurGocIsAnAwesomeGoc View Post
I'm normally a pretty big Spaling fan, but he DID have a rough season. He's supposed to be a defensive specialist\checking forward...but his penalty killing and defense seemed to take a big step back this year. Hopefully it rebounds next season.
I sorta felt this way too, but I begin to wonder if it was just the general malaise the whole team suffered from that made his season seem worse by comparison than it really was. Lack of progression? Yes, think that is fair. Setback? no, probably too much. In all the injuries he was asked to play up the roster too far I think.
I agree having a huge appreciation for the role Nick fills on this team. He is great glue for this team, a real heart and soul player. The redundant player in my mind is Halischuck, and I think somehow he is off the team. Hali is less consistent than Nick. He also has potential, perhaps he can realize it elsewhere, or perhaps he will always be a fringe player. At any rate the Preds roster needs someone who can play higher than Nick and Matt to help fill out this roster.

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