HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > NHL Western Conference > Pacific Division > Vancouver Canucks
Notices

The Armchair GM Thread - XL

Closed Thread
 
Thread Tools
Old
05-17-2013, 03:37 AM
  #251
SgtToody
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 656
vCash: 500
Sedin-Sedin-Leino
Burrows-Boyes-Kassian
Higgins-Gaunce/Schroeder-Hansen
Comeau-Hendricks-wiese

Myers-Hamhuis
Garrison-Tanev
Smith-Corrado

Schneider
Griesse

Kesler and Ballard to buffalo for Myers, Leino and Gauthier-Leduc
Edler to Detroit for jinkrok, smith and 2nd round pick
Bieksa and Luongo to TB for Malone (buyout), 3rd round pick in 2013 and 1st round pick in 2014
FA signing - Boyce for $3.2 x 3 years

SgtToody is offline  
Old
05-17-2013, 03:46 AM
  #252
Verviticus
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 4,796
vCash: 695
i dunno dude i dont really want boyce or jinkrok on our roster and grease is not a good goalie anymore

that movies really old

Verviticus is offline  
Old
05-17-2013, 09:23 AM
  #253
shortshorts
The OG Kesler Hater
 
shortshorts's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Country: Canada
Posts: 10,610
vCash: 500
Transition Year

Sedin Sedin Burrows
Jensen Kesler X
Booth Schroeder Kassian
Higgins X Hansen
X X Weise

Hamhuis Garrison
Edler Corrado
Ballard Tanev
X

Schnieder
X

TRADE: Bieksa to fill holes and picks

See how Booth and Ballard do, and then determine their future with us from there.

shortshorts is offline  
Old
05-17-2013, 09:31 AM
  #254
The Kassian Train
228 LBS of Pain
 
The Kassian Train's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Posts: 2,123
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SgtToody View Post
Sedin-Sedin-Leino
Burrows-Boyes-Kassian
Higgins-Gaunce/Schroeder-Hansen
Comeau-Hendricks-wiese

Myers-Hamhuis
Garrison-Tanev
Smith-Corrado

Schneider
Griesse

Kesler and Ballard to buffalo for Myers, Leino and Gauthier-Leduc
Edler to Detroit for jinkrok, smith and 2nd round pick
Bieksa and Luongo to TB for Malone (buyout), 3rd round pick in 2013 and 1st round pick in 2014
FA signing - Boyce for $3.2 x 3 years
What? LOL.

The Kassian Train is offline  
Old
05-17-2013, 09:34 AM
  #255
PRNuck
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,027
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by SgtToody View Post
Sedin-Sedin-Leino
Burrows-Boyes-Kassian
Higgins-Gaunce/Schroeder-Hansen
Comeau-Hendricks-wiese

Myers-Hamhuis
Garrison-Tanev
Smith-Corrado

Schneider
Griesse

Kesler and Ballard to buffalo for Myers, Leino and Gauthier-Leduc
Edler to Detroit for jinkrok, smith and 2nd round pick
Bieksa and Luongo to TB for Malone (buyout), 3rd round pick in 2013 and 1st round pick in 2014
FA signing - Boyce for $3.2 x 3 years
IMO you're severely undervaluing all of our players in those trades. Also I lol'd at "jinkrok". I like the acquisition of Handtricks though!

PRNuck is offline  
Old
05-17-2013, 09:38 AM
  #256
y2kcanucks
Cult of Personality
 
y2kcanucks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Surrey, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 46,270
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to y2kcanucks
Quote:
Originally Posted by shortshorts View Post
Transition Year

Sedin Sedin Burrows
Jensen Kesler X
Booth Schroeder Kassian
Higgins X Hansen
X X Weise

Hamhuis Garrison
Edler Corrado
Ballard Tanev
X

Schnieder
X

TRADE: Bieksa to fill holes and picks

See how Booth and Ballard do, and then determine their future with us from there.
So our transition year involves keeping the core in tact?

__________________
http://www.vancitynitetours.com

Last edited by y2kcanucks: 05-17-2013 at 09:50 AM.
y2kcanucks is offline  
Old
05-17-2013, 09:48 AM
  #257
Bleach Clean
Registered User
 
Bleach Clean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 15,255
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
So our transition year involves keeping the core in tact? :facepalm/
...umm...Bieksa is traded in his line-up. The core is not intact.

Bleach Clean is offline  
Old
05-17-2013, 09:51 AM
  #258
arsmaster
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 16,257
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
So our transition year involves keeping the core in tact? :facepalm/
It's not as bad as Sgt Toody's.

I'd rather keep the core group together than move Bieksa for a 3rd round pick just to keep Keith Ballard.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleach Clean View Post
...umm...Bieksa is traded in his line-up. The core is not intact.
Bieksa out and Brad Boyes being the new #2C.

It's a bad proposal period.

Tyler Myers is 5'9" player trapped in a 6'8" body, don't want him.

arsmaster is offline  
Old
05-17-2013, 09:54 AM
  #259
PRNuck
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,027
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
It's not as bad as Sgt Toody's.

I'd rather keep the core group together than move Bieksa for a 3rd round pick just to keep Keith Ballard.


Bieksa out and Brad Boyes being the new #2C.

It's a bad proposal period.

Tyler Myers is 5'9" player trapped in a 6'8" body, don't want him.
I think you mean Boyce.

The thing with Myers is: If he gets the coaching he needs, in five years he'll probably be a fantastic D-man. But until then he's one of the worst contracts in the league. Lucky for him he got a coaching change. (unlike Edler, who is still a 5'9" player trapped in a big man's body)

PRNuck is offline  
Old
05-17-2013, 09:57 AM
  #260
arsmaster
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 16,257
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by PRNuck View Post
I think you mean Boyce.

The thing with Myers is: If he gets the coaching he needs, in five years he'll probably be a fantastic D-man. But until then he's one of the worst contracts in the league. Lucky for him he got a coaching change. (unlike Edler, who is still a 5'9" player trapped in a big man's body)
Myers makes Edler look like Scott Stevens.

I was trying to figure out why toody was giving Boyce a $3.2m/yr and then realized it was Boyes.

arsmaster is offline  
Old
05-17-2013, 09:57 AM
  #261
Bleach Clean
Registered User
 
Bleach Clean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 15,255
vCash: 500
^ I'm not altogether down on Myers. All depends on what the cost is.

But Dmen are the least of this teams worries. Have to address the forward corps. Booth or Roy, and then supplement from there. Going to be difficult without some good trades for younger players.

Still holding out hope that PHI kicking tires on Luongo at the deadline means something. The Bryz watch continues.

Bleach Clean is offline  
Old
05-17-2013, 09:58 AM
  #262
PRNuck
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,027
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by arsmaster View Post
Myers makes Edler look like Scott Stevens.

I was trying to figure out why toody was giving Boyce a $3.2m/yr and then realized it was Boyes.
I almost choked on my coffee, well said.

PRNuck is offline  
Old
05-17-2013, 09:58 AM
  #263
Proto
Registered User
 
Proto's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 9,383
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by PRNuck View Post
I think you mean Boyce.

The thing with Myers is: If he gets the coaching he needs, in five years he'll probably be a fantastic D-man. But until then he's one of the worst contracts in the league. Lucky for him he got a coaching change. (unlike Edler, who is still a 5'9" player trapped in a big man's body)
Maybe. I'm not sure I buy that it's all about coaching, though. Myers entire reputation has been built on a rookie campaign where he put up a bunch of power play points. Then everyone assumed he was the next Zdeno Chara. Myers could very well develop as he moves along, like a lot of young defensemen do -- and it could take longer than most, given how big he is. But you're right that right now his contract is Brygalovian.

I see a lot of proposals in this thread that seem a lot like moving major pieces just for the sake of moving them. I really don't think that's the direction the team will -- or should -- go.

Proto is offline  
Old
05-17-2013, 09:59 AM
  #264
y2kcanucks
Cult of Personality
 
y2kcanucks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Surrey, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 46,270
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to y2kcanucks
See, the problem is that we have a team built around a bunch of players who just aren't very good come playoff time. These players are all very expensive, and most have NTC's. These players have all been identified as guys who have failed tremendously at their assignments. Now, for whatever reason some people still feel committed to them. They also think that somehow this team will some way just magically transform into a dominant team again with the same core. Unless Criss Angel is out next coach, I'm not as easily convinced. Others are so committed to the core that they're willing to believe in them and expect a change amongst our fringe 4th liners to be enough. Ultimately people need to ask one question: What do we value more? Watching the same core group (that we have grown attached to) disappoint night after night, or bite the bullet and move on from our favorite players in an attempt to improve this organization? I don't think you can have it both ways, we already tried that and failed.

y2kcanucks is offline  
Old
05-17-2013, 10:08 AM
  #265
arsmaster
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 16,257
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleach Clean View Post
^ I'm not altogether down on Myers. All depends on what the cost is.

But Dmen are the least of this teams worries. Have to address the forward corps. Booth or Roy, and then supplement from there. Going to be difficult without some good trades for younger players.

Still holding out hope that PHI kicking tires on Luongo at the deadline means something. The Bryz watch continues.
I'm not down on him enough to not trade Ballard+ for him, but taking the heart and soul off this team for Tyler Myers and an extremely bad contract in Ville Leino makes we want to throw up.

Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
See, the problem is that we have a team built around a bunch of players who just aren't very good come playoff time. These players are all very expensive, and most have NTC's. These players have all been identified as guys who have failed tremendously at their assignments. Now, for whatever reason some people still feel committed to them. They also think that somehow this team will some way just magically transform into a dominant team again with the same core. Unless Criss Angel is out next coach, I'm not as easily convinced. Others are so committed to the core that they're willing to believe in them and expect a change amongst our fringe 4th liners to be enough. Ultimately people need to ask one question: What do we value more? Watching the same core group (that we have grown attached to) disappoint night after night, or bite the bullet and move on from our favorite players in an attempt to improve this organization? I don't think you can have it both ways, we already tried that and failed.
I heard David Blain was going to be our next coach, will that help.

arsmaster is offline  
Old
05-17-2013, 10:08 AM
  #266
Bleach Clean
Registered User
 
Bleach Clean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 15,255
vCash: 500
Armchair fantasies aside, this is a business, first and foremost. As such, a competitive team, even with holes, brings in more revenue than one that is not. That's first thing running through any GMs mind. So what is the best way to ensure the team _remains_ competitive? By keeping the core group and retooling around them? Or rebuilding? The answer is quite clear when we start to think in these terms.

Some don't want to accept that as a fact. Even when SJ did the exact same thing and subsequently ousted the Canucks in 4. But apparently that lesson doesn't open eyes? Basically, don't do what SJ did, the team that beat us, do something completely overt, so that the team may not see the playoffs in 5 years+.... Yup, makes a ton of sense.

Bleach Clean is offline  
Old
05-17-2013, 10:13 AM
  #267
y2kcanucks
Cult of Personality
 
y2kcanucks's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Surrey, BC
Country: Canada
Posts: 46,270
vCash: 500
Send a message via AIM to y2kcanucks
I don't get the fascination with wanting to emulate San Jose. So we copy them by keeping the core. Then what? If we get lucky enough to draw a lame team like how the Sharks drew us in round 1 we might win a round, but then proceed to get smashed in round 2 by a team that's proactive in bringing in talent to fill their holes? Is that what we want this organization to be?

y2kcanucks is offline  
Old
05-17-2013, 10:19 AM
  #268
Bleach Clean
Registered User
 
Bleach Clean's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 15,255
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
I don't get the fascination with wanting to emulate San Jose. So we copy them by keeping the core. Then what? If we get lucky enough to draw a lame team like how the Sharks drew us in round 1 we might win a round, but then proceed to get smashed in round 2 by a team that's proactive in bringing in talent to fill their holes? Is that what we want this organization to be?
What part about this being a business is not being understood? Are playoff rounds worth more, or is rebuilding worth more? And before this gets into the place where we automatically assume a rebuild nets a stronger team in the future, as a guarantee, let's stop it right here. Most rebuilding teams never make it back to match their initial state of success. Some take 5+ years to get there. It is not a given.

There's a reason Canadian teams try to squeeze every last ounce out of a competitive group before succumbing to a rebuild. It's about money.

So when a GM is faced with these two alternatives, undoubtedly, most go with the rational and conservative approach. As they should. Because this is about money and not delirious armchair fantasies.

Bleach Clean is offline  
Old
05-17-2013, 10:27 AM
  #269
SiCKNESS
Registered User
 
SiCKNESS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,348
vCash: 500
MacArthur and Gordon should be our main targets imo.

MacArthur for 2.5M, Gordon for 1.75M, try to get Antropov/Zubrus/Flippulla as 3C for like 3M? No need for Torres, unless we play to move Kassian to a top 6 role permanently..

Sedin - Sedin - Burrows
Booth - Kesler - MacArthur
Higgins - Zubrus/Antropov/Flippula - Hansen
Weise - Gordon - Kassian

SiCKNESS is offline  
Old
05-17-2013, 10:29 AM
  #270
Barney Gumble
Registered User
 
Barney Gumble's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 19,697
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bleach Clean View Post
But Dmen are the least of this teams worries.
As long as AV and Bowness aren't behind the bench it shouldn't be as much a problem (re: specifically icetime distribution and pairings - forget the "minor stuff" like who is in the #6 spot).

Barney Gumble is offline  
Old
05-17-2013, 10:29 AM
  #271
Vankiller Whale
Maybe HE can score
 
Vankiller Whale's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 23,928
vCash: 5555
Why do we want Macarthur in our top-6?

Vankiller Whale is offline  
Old
05-17-2013, 10:37 AM
  #272
LPH
[hello] :)
 
LPH's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Granduland
Country: United States
Posts: 38,640
vCash: 50
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Why do we want Macarthur in our top-6?
because he is actually pretty good offensively

LPH is offline  
Old
05-17-2013, 10:38 AM
  #273
PRNuck
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: Calgary
Country: Canada
Posts: 9,027
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Why do we want Macarthur in our top-6?
Trick question! We don't!

PRNuck is offline  
Old
05-17-2013, 10:42 AM
  #274
Alflives
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 2,374
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by y2kcanucks View Post
See, the problem is that we have a team built around a bunch of players who just aren't very good come playoff time. These players are all very expensive, and most have NTC's. These players have all been identified as guys who have failed tremendously at their assignments. Now, for whatever reason some people still feel committed to them. They also think that somehow this team will some way just magically transform into a dominant team again with the same core. Unless Criss Angel is out next coach, I'm not as easily convinced. Others are so committed to the core that they're willing to believe in them and expect a change amongst our fringe 4th liners to be enough. Ultimately people need to ask one question: What do we value more? Watching the same core group (that we have grown attached to) disappoint night after night, or bite the bullet and move on from our favorite players in an attempt to improve this organization? I don't think you can have it both ways, we already tried that and failed.
Agreed 100%. The Canucks need to make serious change to the core group. These are the guys that play the most minutes, and have the most impact on the game, especially in the playoffs. Y2K could you evaluate the Canuck's core in comparison to other teams' core groups? I see a lot of teams with better core groups: Chicago, LA, Pittsburgh - just to mention 3. If the goal is to win a CUP, the Canucks need to get younger, and BETTER in the core. That, it seems, is done through the draft. The equation looks to be: Core guys out = picks (young assets) back.

Alflives is offline  
Old
05-17-2013, 10:45 AM
  #275
SiCKNESS
Registered User
 
SiCKNESS's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,348
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vankiller Whale View Post
Why do we want Macarthur in our top-6?
At 2.5M, he gives us option to sign a good 3C through FA. MacArthur also a 20 Goal Scorer. Production dropped from 60 pts to 40 pts because he plays less minuets, but no doubt hes a solid player.

SiCKNESS is offline  
Closed Thread

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:11 AM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. 2014 All Rights Reserved.