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2013-14 Flyers Overhaul

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Old
05-17-2013, 11:49 AM
  #876
TheKingPin
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Originally Posted by DownieFaceSoftener View Post
It is, but I love roster/lineup posts. Always fun to muse. Not interested in helping Toronto win another trade, either (shh, everyone was right that it should have been JVR for Schenn + Kadri).
JVR finally started playing well in Toronto but I think the true value of schenn comes in the playoffs. That kind of player helps win championships.

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05-17-2013, 11:54 AM
  #877
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Ryan scores .21 more PPG than Hartnell, and must take a lot less dumb penalties.

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05-17-2013, 02:53 PM
  #878
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Originally Posted by Rolex View Post
This Ryan to Philly thing has been going on for a while. With Anaheim claiming that they are going to make some major changes, how do you feel about Ryan and Sbisa to Philly for Hartnell and Coburn?
Personally I would love it, don't know about everyone else. I've never been a huge fan of either of them, I like Hartsy but he takes too many dumb penalties and I've never thought that Coburn would really reach his full potential here. I can see the value for both sides though, I think it would be a good trade.

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05-17-2013, 03:27 PM
  #879
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Originally Posted by Flyers2point0 View Post
Personally I would love it, don't know about everyone else. I've never been a huge fan of either of them, I like Hartsy but he takes too many dumb penalties and I've never thought that Coburn would really reach his full potential here. I can see the value for both sides though, I think it would be a good trade.
It's kind of like this:

Ryan > Hartnell
Sbisa < Coburn

It could work itself out?

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Old
05-17-2013, 03:35 PM
  #880
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If that's the deal, I actually feel that maybe Anaheim would have to add a little. Coburn>>>>Sbisa right now, but Ryan>Hartnell, but not by much. The one thing Ryan has on Hartnell is age, but Hartsy plays a more all around game.
Coburn is not that much greater than Sbisa. The only thing that Coburn has on Sbisa is experience. Sbisa might not be as good a skater, but is more physical than Coburn and handles the puck much better. Sbisa has come a long way from his first year in the league. He also just turned 23, so he's not even prime yet. He's just getting his feet wet.

If Anaheim came calling and were offering Ryan and Sbisa for Coburn and Hartnell, I'd certainly hope that Holmgren would be all over that.

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05-17-2013, 03:37 PM
  #881
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Hartnell and Coburn give the Ducks more grit. In the West, against teams like the Kings, Sharks and 'Hawks, they could use a bit more of that. Sbisa would help the Flyers with his skating and puck moving skills. Ryan seems destined to be a Flyer. It might be best for Anaheim to face it and get that off of their plate. I know that the salaries don't match up evenly, Anaheim would be taking on tome money here, but as far as team needs go its looks like a fit.

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05-17-2013, 03:41 PM
  #882
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Originally Posted by BobbyClarkeFan16 View Post
Coburn is not that much greater than Sbisa. The only thing that Coburn has on Sbisa is experience. Sbisa might not be as good a skater, but is more physical than Coburn and handles the puck much better. Sbisa has come a long way from his first year in the league. He also just turned 23, so he's not even prime yet. He's just getting his feet wet.

If Anaheim came calling and were offering Ryan and Sbisa for Coburn and Hartnell, I'd certainly hope that Holmgren would be all over that.
Yeah I like the idea of targeting d-men with 1st round pedigrees that are finally getting over the steep learning curve of becoming an NHL defenseman. Just look at what we got with Schenn.

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Old
05-17-2013, 03:45 PM
  #883
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I am also in favor of a Coburn for Sbisa deal(we could debate Ryan and Hartnell as well) because of cap ramifications. Coburn for Sbisa+(they need to add somewhat, nothing big I feel) would save us 2.4 million in cap space as well. Now Coburn+Hartnell for Ryan+Sbisa would save us over 2 million as well. I think we would need another banger in our lineup if that did happen though.

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Old
05-17-2013, 03:51 PM
  #884
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Originally Posted by BobbyClarkeFan16 View Post
Coburn is not that much greater than Sbisa. The only thing that Coburn has on Sbisa is experience. Sbisa might not be as good a skater, but is more physical than Coburn and handles the puck much better. Sbisa has come a long way from his first year in the league. He also just turned 23, so he's not even prime yet. He's just getting his feet wet.

If Anaheim came calling and were offering Ryan and Sbisa for Coburn and Hartnell, I'd certainly hope that Holmgren would be all over that.
Flyers get considerably softer. I like Ryan but Hartnell is the only top 9 player that other teams hate to play against. When I watch the playoffs i have trouble seeing the Flyers going deep without adding some size (Ryan, Horton, Clowe, Malone) rather then giving up a guy like Hartnell.

Depsite this season i don't think the Flyers are that far off of being a contender. Several improvements in small areas (faceoffs, d zone coverage, and a goalie that can handle the puck) could help the team make huge strides.

I would hope they could add to Hartnell and Coburn rather then really starting over again with more young players still finding their way (Sbisa).

Sorry, I think we had this conversation yesterday.

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05-17-2013, 03:55 PM
  #885
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Originally Posted by Prongo View Post
I am also in favor of a Coburn for Sbisa deal(we could debate Ryan and Hartnell as well) because of cap ramifications. Coburn for Sbisa+(they need to add somewhat, nothing big I feel) would save us 2.4 million in cap space as well. Now Coburn+Hartnell for Ryan+Sbisa would save us over 2 million as well. I think we would need another banger in our lineup if that did happen though.
I am not crazy about the trade. I think it is more lateral then improving but if they are going to do that would adding Winnik be enough?

4th line

McGinn/Rosewood - Winnik - Rinaldo

I have heard Winnik can be a pain for mgmt to deal with but i think he is signed for a few more years.

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05-17-2013, 04:44 PM
  #886
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I don't see why Anaheim would give Sbisa + for Coburn.

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Old
05-17-2013, 06:40 PM
  #887
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Originally Posted by PhilaFlyers View Post
I don't see why Anaheim would give Sbisa + for Coburn.
Because a lot of people are unhappy with the way he's turned out. I don't include myself with this group of people because they're idiots that don't understand he's only 23 years old and he's not even close to his prime.

That being said, we've got plenty of young defensive prospects that are close to the NHL and getting a guy like Coburn makes sense because it stabilizes our defensive corps immediately. So in this particular setting, I'd be more than happy to deal him.

As far as Ryan goes, I'm willing to say I'm probably the biggest Ryan defender we've got on our forum. Everyone is losing their minds because he's not the first guy in on the forecheck every shift as if he's ever been that guy. The fact is, he's got one of the best shots you'll see and he can dance with the puck like a ballerina. Unfortunately, because we're ways away from the glory days that were the Stanley Cup champions, our fans seem to believe there's no place for a goal scorer unless he's exhausting himself every shift and parked in front of the net. They'll call me blind for saying he was fine in the playoffs, even though the effort was there. He scored when he needed to. But these same fans will tell you that Perry showed up when he was the one that was dancing with the puck and shooting it into Howard's chest every chance he got.

I'd be perfectly fine with Sbisa+ (nothing too big) for Coburn. I'd be even more ecstatic with the Ryan/Sbisa for Hartnell/Coburn deal a few of you are mentioning here. 1) Because I'm just as big a Philly fan so I'd still get to cheer each guy on. 2) Added experience and grit. That's exactly what we need.

All of this being said, I doubt Homer moves Hartnell and/or Coburn (let alone in the same deal), but if he did, I guarantee you there's a deal to be worked out with Anaheim.

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Old
05-17-2013, 07:20 PM
  #888
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I think the value's there on the Hartnell/Coburn for Ryan/Sbisa swap and I would lean torwards doing it. My only concern is that's some grit and toughness leaving the lineup. I would hope Homer would other ideas to try and replace that. I know some aren't for the kind of stuff but I wouldn't want our team to get softer and pushed around.

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Old
05-17-2013, 07:22 PM
  #889
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Coburn + Hartnell for Ryan + Sbisa???


Where do I sign up? I am all over that. I would love for that to happen.

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Old
05-17-2013, 08:17 PM
  #890
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I like it on paper but that's a lot of vets out the door in the last couple years. Matt Read would be like the oldest guy on the team.

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Old
05-17-2013, 08:23 PM
  #891
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Surprised no one put up on the trade thread for Hartnell + Coburn for Ryan + Sbisa.

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Old
05-17-2013, 08:29 PM
  #892
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Ryan+Sbisa for Coburn+Hartnell is a no brainer. Youth, cap space, production. Lacking in leadership though. An obvious trade for fantasy hockey, but in the corners and in the dressing room is where guys like Hartnell shine. Coburn too, as he's now the longest serving Flyer.

I think the obvious move is to put Timonen and Coburn back together. Let that be our #1 pair but not by much, and have Luke Schenn anchor the 2nd pairing.

Coburn - Timonen
Gustafsson - L. Schenn
Grossmann - Meszaros/xxx

Looks pretty good, IMO. Solid goaltending and some health and I think they'll be fine for next season. 2014-15 should be the offseason that they really build around Giroux and his $7mil+ caphit, so I hope there aren't that many big changes. Edler or Yandle, while keeping cap space even, would be really nice if the price is right. Rundblad or another young gun would be preferred though, especially given the cap situation. Maybe we can snag Ristolainen and he comes right over?

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Old
05-17-2013, 09:15 PM
  #893
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Originally Posted by ahthorne View Post
Ryan+Sbisa for Coburn+Hartnell is a no brainer. Youth, cap space, production. Lacking in leadership though. An obvious trade for fantasy hockey, but in the corners and in the dressing room is where guys like Hartnell shine. Coburn too, as he's now the longest serving Flyer.

I think the obvious move is to put Timonen and Coburn back together. Let that be our #1 pair but not by much, and have Luke Schenn anchor the 2nd pairing.

Coburn - Timonen
Gustafsson - L. Schenn
Grossmann - Meszaros/xxx

Looks pretty good, IMO. Solid goaltending and some health and I think they'll be fine for next season. 2014-15 should be the offseason that they really build around Giroux and his $7mil+ caphit, so I hope there aren't that many big changes. Edler or Yandle, while keeping cap space even, would be really nice if the price is right. Rundblad or another young gun would be preferred though, especially given the cap situation. Maybe we can snag Ristolainen and he comes right over?
Yeah I agree with what Meltzer has been saying, Gus seems like he might be a legit home grown option. Let's give him a chance to be a real contributor before we start making drastic moves.

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Old
05-17-2013, 10:39 PM
  #894
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Phaneuf has one year left on his contract, any interest from the Flyers if he makes it to free agency?

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05-17-2013, 11:15 PM
  #895
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Phaneuf has one year left on his contract, any interest from the Flyers if he makes it to free agency?
he'd love it here. we got a city full of sloppy seconds here waitin for him.

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05-17-2013, 11:27 PM
  #896
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Originally Posted by Rolex
This Ryan to Philly thing has been going on for a while. With Anaheim claiming that they are going to make some major changes, how do you feel about Ryan and Sbisa to Philly for Hartnell and Coburn?
It doesn't do a damned thing to help this team's problem with the defensive group, Anaheim's giving up the best player, taking on salary, and getting older in the process. Sounds like the perfect EA trade.

Quote:
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Phaneuf has one year left on his contract, any interest from the Flyers if he makes it to free agency?
Hah, I'll pass. He's a glorified Meszaros.

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Old
05-17-2013, 11:28 PM
  #897
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Phaneuf has one year left on his contract, any interest from the Flyers if he makes it to free agency?
Too feminine.

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Old
05-17-2013, 11:55 PM
  #898
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Phaneuf has one year left on his contract, any interest from the Flyers if he makes it to free agency?


hell no

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Old
05-18-2013, 03:01 AM
  #899
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I'd do Hartnell, Coburn and our 2nd for Ryan and Sbisa.

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Old
05-18-2013, 08:14 AM
  #900
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Anybody who thinks Hartnell and Coburn will get us Ryan and Sbisa is on drugs. Hartnell also has a NTC, aside from how bad of a deal that is for Anaheim.

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