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Why Don't The Habs Ever Get Any Credit?

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Old
05-18-2013, 05:18 AM
  #26
25get
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Originally Posted by WakeUpNHL View Post
No credit? Twenty years if futility might explain it.
Plus being the ROC favorite whipping boys suits CBC just fine. Healy, Cherry, PJ Stock... all haters/losers that blame the Habs organization for their own shortcomings.
I agree. Since 1993, who won a cup in Canada?

Nucks, Leafs (1967), Ottawa (before second world war), Winnipeg, Calgary (won one in 1989!), Edmonton (Won four with Gretzky back in the 80's)?

What team has the most win since 1990 in Canada?

We are being hated because we have a tradition that no team in the league has. This is the reason why many team come to Montreal and give and extra effort.
We would have given a much better opposition to the Pens than Ottawa will but they beat us in 5 games.

Winning against the Habs is only second to winning the cup.
That's how it is for other teams.


Last edited by 25get: 05-18-2013 at 02:18 PM.
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Old
05-18-2013, 05:30 AM
  #27
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
If we want to get more credit, we'll have to ice better teams. We've been terrible for years. It's only now that we finally have some young elite players to build around. As we get better it will get recognized.

As for us not getting credit, Subban and Gallagher are up for individual awards and the only reason Theodore beat Iginila for the Hart was because he was from Montreal.

As for the Leafs... they've been ripped on for years now.
Terrible for years?

In the last twenty years this team has made the playoffs 13 times (7 times in the last 9)and has a Stanley Cup, President's Trophy, multiple division titles, and a Conference final to show for it......that may not be the glory years but is certainly well above average and definitely not terrible.

Perspective is a wonderful thing when it is not being overlooked.

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05-18-2013, 08:25 AM
  #28
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Why Don't The Habs Ever Get Any Credit

What are you talking about? Last year we got credit for finishing 28th.

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05-18-2013, 09:11 AM
  #29
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Why is anyone even focused on this? Win and the credit will come.

Stop living in the past, we WERE the most successful organization in the NHL. It hasn't been like that for 20 years and counting. That wont change, no matter how many times we walk down memory lane, no matter how many times we puff our chests out about 24 Stanley cups.

How arrogant are we to expect fawning from any other media outlets than out own.

Just win, none of this fluff is worth anything.


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05-18-2013, 09:22 AM
  #30
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
In what world have the Leafs gotten more admiration? They've been laughed at for a long time now.
But, still talked about, way too much...

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05-18-2013, 09:31 AM
  #31
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Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
Terrible for years?

In the last twenty years this team has made the playoffs 13 times (7 times in the last 9)and has a Stanley Cup, President's Trophy, multiple division titles, and a Conference final to show for it......that may not be the glory years but is certainly well above average and definitely not terrible.

Perspective is a wonderful thing when it is not being overlooked.
Yes terrible. We've had terrible teams with goalies that would get us to 8th place. Usually by the skin of our teeth.

We've routinely finished in the bottom 3rd for goals scored, had soft teams and have relied on goaltending and special teams to take us anywhere. Our teams have been very weak. The analysts have called us weak because... that's exactly what we've been.
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Originally Posted by BLONG7 View Post
But, still talked about, way too much...
Based on what the analysts have said I'm sure they'd have preferred to have been talked about less. It's been a constant stream of jokes and criticisms.

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05-18-2013, 09:36 AM
  #32
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Forgetting about external factors for a moment, the Habs don't get respect because they don't deserve it:
  • 20 years of futility.
  • Their best player, Carey Price, has been inconclusive at best in the playoffs and he's been in the league for ages already.
  • They have a small, incoherently assembled team that does not evoke any intimidation or envy from any other team in the league.
  • No star talent up front to focus on.
  • No team identity - they're not "tough team", they're not the "skilled team", they're not the "character team" - for nearly 20 years. Management coasted on Koivu's personal victories as if the entire organization had his conviction and acted in kind.
  • No cutting edge in the management - yeas of "nearly" getting that piece or this piece have rendered them bit-players at every deadline and in free agency (and when they do dabble in free agency or trades they turn into the laughingstock of the league. Gomez, Gionta, Spacek, Gill, Moen, and Cammalleri all in one week. Thanks Bob, you shouldn't have.)
  • Years of tending to the gluttonous local media have led to this symbiotic relationship of bs fed back and forth - though this could be a metaphor for Montreal public works.

The media doesn't care about us on the ice because our team hasn't been very interesting and we still have the stank of Jacques Martin's awful negative-hockey only just starting to fade but still lack any established game-breaking dynamism that neutrals love to watch. The media don't care about our back-office dealings because we're very boring in everything we do: we don't draft off the board, we don't trade for or sign marquee players and half of the noise we generate is in French and is therefore non-existent for the rest of the league.

I say, instead of blaming everyone except the Habs, maybe the fans should reconsider what makes their great organization so great because they've been anything but great in everything except pomp and excess - capitalized when the reigning GM retired his own number in an extravagant show of insouciant pride and pale arrogance.

I started reading columns critical of the Canadiens organization and the general gist of it is: we have our heads firmly up our own ***** when it comes to our organization and on-ice product. Mediocrity and pomp all the way through.

And I say this as a die-hard fan who has faith in the team and even during Gainey/Gauthier/Present saw upward development and progression - it's just taking way too long and we're close to spoiling the current batch of mid-20s players like we did the last one. How many years longer will Price, Gorges, Patches and Pleks be at 100%?
Great post. Bergevin blew it by not making moves before the playoffs to address glaring needs. It may take years to get back to where we were this season.

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05-18-2013, 10:00 AM
  #33
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Cause the team is already in debt

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05-18-2013, 10:15 AM
  #34
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24...

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05-18-2013, 10:45 AM
  #35
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Kevin Weekes is always quick to give the Habs credit

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05-18-2013, 10:49 AM
  #36
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Great post. Bergevin blew it by not making moves before the playoffs to address glaring needs. It may take years to get back to where we were this season.
What are you talking about? You really would've wanted us to mortgage the future this year?

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05-18-2013, 11:58 AM
  #37
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What are you talking about? You really would've wanted us to mortgage the future this year?
No need to be overly dramatic. A couple of draft picks and/or a couple of 2nd tier prospects is not mortgaging the future.

The Pens GM strongly disagrees with your play for the future strategy. They are playing for this year. There are no Cups issued for potential good years at some point in the future.

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05-18-2013, 12:02 PM
  #38
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
No need to be overly dramatic. A couple of draft picks and/or a couple of 2nd tier prospects is not mortgaging the future.

The Pens GM strongly disagrees with your play for the future strategy. They are playing for this year. There are no Cups issued for potential good years at some point in the future.
If we had the team that Pittsburgh has, I'm sure MB would've traded away futures for roster players.

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05-18-2013, 12:19 PM
  #39
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
No need to be overly dramatic. A couple of draft picks and/or a couple of 2nd tier prospects is not mortgaging the future.

The Pens GM strongly disagrees with your play for the future strategy. They are playing for this year. There are no Cups issued for potential good years at some point in the future.
That's because the Penguins were perfectly set up to make a Cup Run this year. Crosby and Malkin are healthy, Iginla was available, why not make a big push to win it all?

I don't see who we could've added at the deadline to make us better than Pittsburgh, Chicago or LA.

MB is setting us up so that we have the organizational depth to make a splash at the deadline in future years like Pittsburgh is doing now.

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05-18-2013, 12:36 PM
  #40
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Great post. Bergevin blew it by not making moves before the playoffs to address glaring needs. It may take years to get back to where we were this season.
So basically, you think this team was over-performing and a few 2 months rental would have made us a cup contender this year?

So we have needs and you think we should address them on the short term?

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05-18-2013, 12:44 PM
  #41
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teams who win consistently get the credit as they should.canadiens arent that team.

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05-18-2013, 01:33 PM
  #42
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
Yes terrible. We've had terrible teams with goalies that would get us to 8th place. Usually by the skin of our teeth.

We've routinely finished in the bottom 3rd for goals scored, had soft teams and have relied on goaltending and special teams to take us anywhere. Our teams have been very weak. The analysts have called us weak because... that's exactly what we've been.

Based on what the analysts have said I'm sure they'd have preferred to have been talked about less. It's been a constant stream of jokes and criticisms.
So much drama........

Since when does above average (which is 100% irrefuteable) equate to terrible.

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05-18-2013, 01:50 PM
  #43
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Originally Posted by Estimated_Prophet View Post
So much drama........

Since when does above average (which is 100% irrefuteable) equate to terrible.
I explained it to you. You only hear what you want to hear though. We've had brutal teams and the analysts have been right. We've had great goaltending and special teams... that's it. You aren't going to get praise when your team sucks and you depend on your goalies to get you into the post season by the skin of your teeth.

We had one fluke great season a couple of years back but it's been mostly a crap sandwich feast.

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05-18-2013, 02:14 PM
  #44
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Many will NOT like what I have to say but the truth is the truth.
Thier are a few reasons why some people hate the Habs.
Yes some because the Habs have 24 cups and they don't.
Yes some because they are small and skilled and don't fight as much a to put on a show. It's about the type of hockey the Habs play vs the Wild west version a lot of people like.
Yes some because the Habs are the Quebec team and deep down inside some are just plain sick and tired of Quebec and sick and tired of the PQ. Always percieved as whiners for extra stuff. OH they know that they should never show predjudice so instead they attack the Habs ever time.
Yes some just hate every team that is NOT theirs at all costs.
And finally lots of TV people just go with the flow. The rateings go up in Toronto when all the TV guys dump on the Habs just to make the Leaf nation watch the show. It's about money and keeping thier jobs.
In other cities it's the same thing. Just hate the visiting team at all costs to sell the home fans on hockey.
You don't like what I say? Well I know it's not cool to be known as a bias reporter of fan so they love to hide the truth and show outrage at any suggestion of bias.
As I said, thier are a lot of reasons for the hatred. I would never say that all haters of the Habs are one thing or another, but as a whole each has their reasons for BEING BIAS. This is NO different on the ice. When things heat up sometimes, the old anti French of anti Quebec slers are thrown in the face still. It takes a LONG time for people to forget what was taught to them when they were kids.
Things are getting better on that subject but it ain't over yet.

Just remember the vast majority of fans are NOT loud bias fans and these people don't hate anybody. These are not the fans that voice a hatred or bias againts the Habs but you never hear from these fans. It seems very one sided, it seems everybody hates the Habs at times, but it is only the HATERS that you hear.

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05-18-2013, 02:27 PM
  #45
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Here's where other fans get it wrong:

- They think we walk around with a sense of entitlement to Stanley Cups. The reality is that Montreal fans don't expect much, especially those under 30 who don't remember a single Cup. Most Habs fans are more familiar with frustration than they are with victory. We don't look at our team and see Cups, we see problems.

- They think Montreal fans whine/complain more than others. The reality is Habs fans are every bit as melodramatic as other fans, but not any worse. It's just such a big fan base that our melodrama adds up to more noise than theirs. And yeah, we do make a lot of noise.

- They think the team is bad. The reality is that Montreal's last 20-year report card mark is a C+. No Cups, but plenty of playoff years, along with a few great seasons. We've had a few really bad years, but mostly we've seen mediocre to good to occasionally very good Montreal teams. Stop comparing us to the 70s - those dynasties aren't coming back for us or any team. If you measure every team since '93 - Montreal's overall track record has been better than the majority of NHL teams.

Here's where other fans get it right (but for the wrong reason):

- They think we spend too much energy on our history. Well, we do. But that's because the sport's built on history and we have more of it than anyone else. Characterizing that as a fault comes from plain ol' jealousy.

Here's the bottom line:

As long as we have 24 Cup banners hanging in the rafters, other fans will resent our team. Success breeds jealousy. Yes, 20 years since a Cup may seem long to us, but when successful teams are now measured by one Cup in 41 years, Habs will never be seen as an underdog. If it was 20 years of total failure, maybe we'd get more sympathy, but we've survived Houle and Gathier and have almost always put up a good fight. And we're currently on an upswing. Don't expect to be loved.

As a fan who's seen the Habs win nine Cups, do I want to see another one? Of course. But it's much, much harder than it used to be, because it takes many more variables and luck to win a Cup than it used to. But I haven't seen a management devote this much energy to prospects and player development. It's a great sign and we have every reason to be hopeful.

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05-18-2013, 02:58 PM
  #46
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That's because the Penguins were perfectly set up to make a Cup Run this year. Crosby and Malkin are healthy, Iginla was available, why not make a big push to win it all?

I don't see who we could've added at the deadline to make us better than Pittsburgh, Chicago or LA.

MB is setting us up so that we have the organizational depth to make a splash at the deadline in future years like Pittsburgh is doing now.
But we do not have a Malkin or a Crosby in the system.

So what do we do? Stand pat year after year until we have another last place season to hopefully draft first like Edmonton has been doing for the last several years?

No offense to you but Bergevin adopted a losers mentality in his first season. And true to form, a losers mentality always ensures one thing.....losing.

LA does not have Crosby or Malkin.

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05-18-2013, 03:08 PM
  #47
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But we do not have a Malkin or a Crosby in the system.

So what do we do? Stand pat year after year until we have another last place season to hopefully draft first like Edmonton has been doing for the last several years?

No offense to you but Bergevin adopted a losers mentality in his first season. And true to form, a losers mentality always ensures one thing.....losing.

LA does not have Crosby or Malkin.
No, but we try to develop players we have and make sure we draft properly. Did we know Subban was going to be a Norris nominee when we drafted him in the 2nd round? No, but it's drafting like that that makes team's contenders.

It's not a loser's mentality, it's a patient mentality. Bergevin wants to set us up to be contenders for years, not like the previous regime that made terrible trades where we sacrificed our future (Mcdonagh) for guys past their prime (Gomez).

LA does have a #1C, #1D and #1G that they got through a rough period where they drafted high (Kopitar, Doughty) along with a later round steal (Quick). Then when the time was right they went all in by trading for guys like Carter and Richards to round out their team.

Building a team like that doesn't happen overnight, you're not going to go from 15th to Stanley Cup Winner in one season. If you can't be patient then you'll be very disappointed.

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05-18-2013, 03:33 PM
  #48
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Originally Posted by Lafleurs Guy View Post
I explained it to you. You only hear what you want to hear though. We've had brutal teams and the analysts have been right. We've had great goaltending and special teams... that's it. You aren't going to get praise when your team sucks and you depend on your goalies to get you into the post season by the skin of your teeth.

We had one fluke great season a couple of years back but it's been mostly a crap sandwich feast.
Hey, you were as excited as the rest of us over this past season. Now you and many others are acting like that division win and 2nd seed never happened, or worse - that it doesn't count. I get the massive disappointment over those final two playoff games - shoulda' been tied 2-2 but a game later the series is finished. WTF?? - but we need to regain some perspective on how far the team has come.

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05-18-2013, 03:35 PM
  #49
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No, but we try to develop players we have and make sure we draft properly. Did we know Subban was going to be a Norris nominee when we drafted him in the 2nd round? No, but it's drafting like that that makes team's contenders.

It's not a loser's mentality, it's a patient mentality. Bergevin wants to set us up to be contenders for years, not like the previous regime that made terrible trades where we sacrificed our future (Mcdonagh) for guys past their prime (Gomez).

LA does have a #1C, #1D and #1G that they got through a rough period where they drafted high (Kopitar, Doughty) along with a later round steal (Quick). Then when the time was right they went all in by trading for guys like Carter and Richards to round out their team.

Building a team like that doesn't happen overnight, you're not going to go from 15th to Stanley Cup Winner in one season. If you can't be patient then you'll be very disappointed.
Nicely said. Totally logical. I think most of the pessimists will eventually agree with you after the sour taste of the playoffs has gone away. In the meantime, don't stop reminding us.

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05-18-2013, 08:11 PM
  #50
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Hey, you were as excited as the rest of us over this past season. Now you and many others are acting like that division win and 2nd seed never happened, or worse - that it doesn't count. I get the massive disappointment over those final two playoff games - shoulda' been tied 2-2 but a game later the series is finished. WTF?? - but we need to regain some perspective on how far the team has come.
You must've missed my earlier post... I think we're finally on the right track. I'm happy with the team we have and excited about the future. We can finally score and that's a minor miracle.

We've still got to get bigger, we can still improve the D... but the core of a winning team IS there for the future in my opinion.

In the past though? We've been a trainwreck for the most part. I don't see how anyone could say we weren't. Theodore, Price, Halak, Huet... they bailed us out all the time. Our clubs in front of them mostly sucked.

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