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Old
05-18-2013, 09:07 AM
  #351
bsl
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Originally Posted by durojean View Post
If you want to take the Hawks analogy you have to consider that Bergevin is in his first year so it's more like :

Toews - Galchenyuk
Kane - Gallagher
Hossa - Pacioretty
Keith - Subban
Seabrook - Tinordi
Bolland - Eller

I still give them a little edge ... Especially the Kane Gallagher comparison but wait 3 years and we'll talk.
Hossa was UFA pickup when Hawks were a serious contender. We can get our own Hossa when the time comes. In fact, when Habs turn the corner, what UFA will not want to win a cup in Montreal? They'll be gagging for it. That is a huge advantage of us in our cup window.

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05-18-2013, 09:13 AM
  #352
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Originally Posted by HabsDan93 View Post
Have you guys seen Dalton Thrower and Dietz ??
Why? Are they missing?

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05-18-2013, 09:15 AM
  #353
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Originally Posted by onemorecup View Post
Hello R U kidding me

I will take Cotourier ,Voracek , Brayden Schenn , and Simmonds

anyday of the week over Carter and Richards and those albatorss contracts

Voracek and Simmonds are 2 of the best young talents under 25 in this league

no GM right now takes those 2 over those youngsters
Carter and Richards won the cup last year.

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05-18-2013, 10:12 AM
  #354
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Originally Posted by Habs View Post
Nonis has always had a big pair of balls, you gotta like that.
These types of GM's rarely, if ever win a Cup...ala Holmgren and Bobby Clarke types, but they do make splashes now and then on what they do...it's entertaining for sure...

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05-18-2013, 10:56 AM
  #355
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People *****ed about Gauthier and Gainey not having plans, now we finally have a GM who has a plan and is clearly sticking to it and people still complain. Our best asset in the organization is probably Trevor Timmins and we finally have a general manager who will utilize Timmins' skills as much as possible.

We'll have some ups and downs in the next year or two but after that this team will be very, very good. We obviously need some size up front and on the back end but you don't build a contender over night and there isn't any point in giving up a bunch of assets to fill those needs right now when we aren't just one piece away from being a contender. Fans just need to be patient.

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05-18-2013, 01:10 PM
  #356
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Originally Posted by BLONG7 View Post
These types of GM's rarely, if ever win a Cup...ala Holmgren and Bobby Clarke types, but they do make splashes now and then on what they do...it's entertaining for sure...
They may not win a cup, but they sure as heck challenge for it a fair amount, which is admirable.

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05-18-2013, 01:15 PM
  #357
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Originally Posted by Monctonscout View Post
How is Phillie "loaded with prospects"? their system is one of the worst and most of the young players they have are via trade.

Holmgren has been GM for what, 6-7 years and they are further from a cup than 4-5 years ago, their defense has no puck mover and he signed a goalie to huge money who can't handle pressure. Holgren as a gm is a clear case of the "grass being greener on the other side".
I still consider Schenn, Simmonds and Couturier 'young prospects' from the Carter/Richards trades. I think they will be fine with that core. Philly has a way of going from the bottom, to the top, pretty quickly.

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05-18-2013, 01:31 PM
  #358
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Originally Posted by Habs View Post
They may not win a cup, but they sure as heck challenge for it a fair amount, which is admirable.
Those GM's seem to do things based on emotion, media and fan pressure...how happy would you be, if our GM signed Bryzgalov or Luongo to those insane contracts? Holmgren and Nonis are those guys...Luongo may have been Gillis, not sure, but just asking if we had a GM who pulled a knee jerk reaction every time people called for it, how good would we be?

Let's give MB 2-3 seasons to see what kind of GM he is going to be...he does seem to have a plan, but the draft is his main point...

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05-18-2013, 01:33 PM
  #359
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Originally Posted by Habs View Post
Nonis has always had a big pair of balls, you gotta like that.
What did Nonis do to be considered 'ballsy'? He said that he won't trade away future as a certain other GM that got flack for it here. He's not the type to make a huge moves either. Or are you just looking at the way people talk to the media...one of the most useless aspects of a GM's GM'ing skill.

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05-18-2013, 02:08 PM
  #360
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Originally Posted by bsl View Post
Carter and Richards won the cup last year.
... and the Flyers didn't qualify for the playoffs this year.

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05-18-2013, 02:43 PM
  #361
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Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
What did Nonis do to be considered 'ballsy'? He said that he won't trade away future as a certain other GM that got flack for it here. He's not the type to make a huge moves either. Or are you just looking at the way people talk to the media...one of the most useless aspects of a GM's GM'ing skill.
Nonis has a 'ballsy' attitude, always has. I never said this makes him a winner, just pointing out it could lead to a few crazy moves one way or another.

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05-18-2013, 02:53 PM
  #362
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bsl View Post
Carter and Richards won the cup last year.
So did Davis Drewiske..........

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05-18-2013, 04:09 PM
  #363
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Originally Posted by Habs View Post
Nonis has a 'ballsy' attitude, always has. I never said this makes him a winner, just pointing out it could lead to a few crazy moves one way or another.
Who cares about crazy moves? I want smart moves.

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05-18-2013, 04:39 PM
  #364
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Originally Posted by Habs View Post
Nonis has a 'ballsy' attitude, always has. I never said this makes him a winner, just pointing out it could lead to a few crazy moves one way or another.
Maybe you're confusing him for Burke because Nonis has a pretty conservative history. I do like GMs with the 'balls' to make trades like Burke did (ie. Phaneuf/Lupul) but I like that Bergevin has shown some patience.

This offseason will be likely when Bergevin makes his mark on the roster, will be interesting how big/small a move he makes and what direction he moves the team identity.

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05-18-2013, 05:29 PM
  #365
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Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
Maybe you're confusing him for Burke because Nonis has a pretty conservative history. I do like GMs with the 'balls' to make trades like Burke did (ie. Phaneuf/Lupul) but I like that Bergevin has shown some patience.

This offseason will be likely when Bergevin makes his mark on the roster, will be interesting how big/small a move he makes and what direction he moves the team identity.
I for one am eager to see who wins the Davis Drewiske sweepstakes!!

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05-18-2013, 06:33 PM
  #366
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Originally Posted by Watsatheo View Post
Maybe you're confusing him for Burke because Nonis has a pretty conservative history. I do like GMs with the 'balls' to make trades like Burke did (ie. Phaneuf/Lupul) but I like that Bergevin has shown some patience.

This offseason will be likely when Bergevin makes his mark on the roster, will be interesting how big/small a move he makes and what direction he moves the team identity.
Nah, I've watched Nonis from the sidelines for years, he's got balls. Anyways, I agree with you, I really want to see what MB thinks of this team at the draft, and the summer.

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Old
05-19-2013, 05:10 PM
  #367
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Originally Posted by FinnHab View Post
We have GM with clear vision, success via draft. Im fine with that.
Edmonton, even with the number one picks each year, is proving that route is a fools route.

You have to trade to fill needs. Or sign UFAs to fill needs. Waiting on a draft pick to develop to fill a need takes time. And during that time of wait, other needs tend to develop.

The Kings would not have won the Cup last year without the trades they made.

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05-19-2013, 05:14 PM
  #368
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Edmonton, even with the number one picks each year, is proving that route is a fools route.

You have to trade to fill needs. Or sign UFAs to fill needs. Waiting on a draft pick to develop to fill a need takes time. And during that time of wait, other needs tend to develop.

The Kings would not have won the Cup last year without the trades they made.
The problem is... the Habs has too much needs.

Which calls for too much trades.

Which can turn your initial stengths into weaknesses.

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05-19-2013, 05:41 PM
  #369
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Originally Posted by MXD View Post
The problem is... the Habs has too much needs.

Which calls for too much trades.

Which can turn your initial stengths into weaknesses.
Not really. One or two bigger wingers, a big tough guy/enforcer on the 4th line and a couple of bigger stay at home DMen. We already have one in Tinordi who needs to get physically stronger.

Two trades and a UFA signing and the Habs will be competitive.

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05-20-2013, 12:35 AM
  #370
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Edmonton, even with the number one picks each year, is proving that route is a fools route.

You have to trade to fill needs. Or sign UFAs to fill needs. Waiting on a draft pick to develop to fill a need takes time. And during that time of wait, other needs tend to develop.

The Kings would not have won the Cup last year without the trades they made.
I agree with you going solely on drafting is a fools route. It is an important aspect of a successful team but you need to make trades to make your team better. Alsosign some decent ufa's. The devils made a ballsy move trading for kovy and then signed him.

Then again gainey traded for tanguay didn't resign him. Traded for gomez and look what that brought us. I think this would be a good year to make some trades since the salary cap will be going down. Teams will be looking to get rid of players. Maybe we will be able to find an andrew ladd or dustin byflugien.

Standing by and not doing anything sounds like a lazy GM that doesn't want to work.

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05-20-2013, 01:19 AM
  #371
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Originally Posted by 2 Chainz View Post
People *****ed about Gauthier and Gainey not having plans, now we finally have a GM who has a plan and is clearly sticking to it and people still complain. Our best asset in the organization is probably Trevor Timmins and we finally have a general manager who will utilize Timmins' skills as much as possible.

We'll have some ups and downs in the next year or two but after that this team will be very, very good. We obviously need some size up front and on the back end but you don't build a contender over night and there isn't any point in giving up a bunch of assets to fill those needs right now when we aren't just one piece away from being a contender. Fans just need to be patient.
He doesn't have a plan, he's just flying by the seat of his pants.

He knows what people want to hear and that's what he talks about. And yes, he seems like a decent enough guy and all that but I think the less thinking he does the better I'll like him.

----------

If he hires really good people and let's them do their stuff, I'll be a happier camper.


Last edited by Frozenice: 05-20-2013 at 01:40 AM.
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Old
05-20-2013, 09:54 AM
  #372
Watsatheo
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Edmonton, even with the number one picks each year, is proving that route is a fools route.

You have to trade to fill needs. Or sign UFAs to fill needs. Waiting on a draft pick to develop to fill a need takes time. And during that time of wait, other needs tend to develop.

The Kings would not have won the Cup last year without the trades they made.
Bad management will be bad management. For every Oilers who have had incompetent management to struggle with the draft pick/depth philosophy there is the a post lockout Leafs or recent Flames who have/had incompetent management to recognize when and when not to go for it, trading away picks, etc.

If you look at the Kings you would also see they would not have been able to make those trades without stocking up on draft picks/prospects beforehand.

As explained before, picks aren't just for developing and playing on your team. Kings didn't just have Simmonds/Schenn fall from the sky. If the Habs trade away their top prospects, they turn into the 05-08 Leafs or Flames since they don't have much depth in the organization after the previous regime 'filled needs' with patch ups using picks. This draft hopefully fills that depth.

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05-20-2013, 10:34 AM
  #373
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Not really. One or two bigger wingers, a big tough guy/enforcer on the 4th line and a couple of bigger stay at home DMen. We already have one in Tinordi who needs to get physically stronger.

Two trades and a UFA signing and the Habs will be competitive.
But who knows what GM's want for those kinds of players? This isn't NHL 13, you can't just force teams to make trades with you for your scraps. Every GM in the league is trying to get better and if we don't have or can't spare what they want then a deal won't happen. That's why we need to build through the draft, so we have depth to spare for trades to make us cup contenders.

And if a UFA doesn't want to come here for whatever reason, there's nothing we can do to change that.

Saying "Two trades and a UFA signing" is much easier said than done.

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05-20-2013, 10:43 AM
  #374
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Originally Posted by SouthernHab View Post
Edmonton, even with the number one picks each year, is proving that route is a fools route.

You have to trade to fill needs. Or sign UFAs to fill needs. Waiting on a draft pick to develop to fill a need takes time. And during that time of wait, other needs tend to develop.

The Kings would not have won the Cup last year without the trades they made.
I agree you need trades along with drafting, but Edmonton's lack of success has everything to do with not having strong vets surrounding your young players.

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05-20-2013, 10:45 AM
  #375
Agnostic
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Originally Posted by bsl View Post
I am still confident in Price, but his moaning on not being able to get groceries is an indictment on:

******* idiot fans who have no sense of boundaries, and bother him in public. It's ****ing well creepy.

I would NEVER talk to a player on the street, ever.

Jaques Lemaire ate at the same pizza place as my family on Sundays for years in the seventies, and NO ONE bothered him. NO ONE.
Carey's problems are his own doing . Play better you can look anyone in the eye even an idiot fan .

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