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The PowerPlay: discussion

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Old
01-02-2004, 02:54 PM
  #1
G Man 77
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The PowerPlay: discussion

I've seen a lot of people knocking players by saying "a lot of their points come off the PP".

Well guys who can make our PP work are very important, because most can't on this team... so I don't see the fact that certain players have success on the PP as something that should be seen in a negative light.

Dagenais can split time on the 2nd line with Ward 5-on-5, then get the PP time... Perreault is another one who while he's still here can play on the 4th yet still help the PP.

The problem with having these types of "PP specialists" though is that most coaches like to use PP time as a reward for lines that are playing well... but what's more important, having the best PP players on the ice or keeping your best 5-on-5 players happy?

I say this team is so lacking offensively they have to play their best possible PP... leave the rewards for when the games are out of hand one way or the other.

Another problem I have is that on some nights we have our 1st PP unit that is very effective, but the 2nd unit is just awful and doesn't generate a thing.
Why not keep your 1st PP unit on the whole 2 minutes then?... when you're settled into the offensive you barely skate at all, fatigue is not an issue.

Some of the best players in the league like Mario, McInnis at the point, etc.. stay for practically the whole penalty. I agree with that, especially on teams where the 2nd wave just isn't effective.
I'd like to see Souray stay there the whole time, ditto any other player who is making the PP work on a given night.

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01-02-2004, 03:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by G Man 77

Another problem I have is that on some nights we have our 1st PP unit that is very effective, but the 2nd unit is just awful and doesn't generate a thing.
Why not keep your 1st PP unit on the whole 2 minutes then?... when you're settled into the offensive you barely skate at all, fatigue is not an issue.
I think it is an issue. In addition to making the PP unit vulnerable to breakouts by fresh PKs, skating for 2 minutes affects your stamina for a few minutes until you recover, and in the meantime all the lines are disrupted. The players who are left on for 2 minutes usually are the horses who are stronger and fitter than the average player. Didn't CJ have an issue with Ribeiro's skating longer shifts? He's no Gordie Howe.

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01-02-2004, 07:53 PM
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RE-HABS
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Being a good PP guys isn't bad for a team, sometimes your quite valuable to your team because of it. But if you live by the sword you also die by the sword, Andy Delmore has made a career in the NHL for his PP time and scoring there, but it has disappeared and he is now on waivers and maybe out of the NHL, not just Buffalo.

I think the best players out there are players who get as many points or more points even and short handed combined over PP points.

Look at John Madden, he has 79 goals in 354 career games to date only 3 of them are PP. His play is very valuable to a team because he is reliable 5 on 5 and short handed, given the opportunity to play more PP he would even get more goals. I think I remember John Davidson saying one time that when John Madden got 23 goals a couple of years ago that he never even got PP time, imagine if he did?

If guys like Madden don't score they aren't pointed out so much because they are so valuable in other aspects of the game. But when players like Audette and Delmore don't score or get points...well we all saw what happened there. Unless your a truly exceptenal player or a great point producer you really can't just live with PP points, plus you'll never make a career out of trying to live on our PP!!!

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01-02-2004, 08:20 PM
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with the entire league playing more and more a defensive game approach , i would be curious to know what is the percentage of the goals scored in a pp situation...

is it a stat that m Bettman keep for himself or is it something we can find ?

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01-02-2004, 08:43 PM
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Well stated reHabs.

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Old
01-03-2004, 02:14 AM
  #6
G Man 77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mark0v
with the entire league playing more and more a defensive game approach , i would be curious to know what is the percentage of the goals scored in a pp situation...

is it a stat that m Bettman keep for himself or is it something we can find ?
Took a few seconds to calculate... 28% of the goals so far this season have been scored on the PP, 4% short-handed, 2% in OT... so that leaves 66% scored 5-on-5 (or 4-on-4 during regulation).

I also saw not too long ago on tv that the success rate of PPs has been going down steadily since the 80s... from around 25% then to around 16% today.

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01-03-2004, 02:28 AM
  #7
G Man 77
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Corey
I think it is an issue. In addition to making the PP unit vulnerable to breakouts by fresh PKs, skating for 2 minutes affects your stamina for a few minutes until you recover, and in the meantime all the lines are disrupted. The players who are left on for 2 minutes usually are the horses who are stronger and fitter than the average player. Didn't CJ have an issue with Ribeiro's skating longer shifts? He's no Gordie Howe.
Sorry but on the PP you are NOT skating for 2 minutes... players are mostly static once they settle into the offensive zone, and that's what effective PPs do.

So as I said, if your #1 PP unit is effective, it can afford to stay on the whole 2 minutes without a problem.

And as I said this is even more important if a) you're 2nd unit sucks on a regular basis and b) your team has a lot of trouble scoring 5-on-5... as is the case with the Habs.
I can no longer stomach Koivu & Souray heading to the bench with a minute left in the PP, to see Juneau or Rivet or even Quintal come man the point. It just kills me.

Powerplays are an exceptional opportunity to increase your chances of winning the game... and I feel most teams seem to take that for granted.

It's like shortening your bench, your players will be a little more tired but you increase you chances by having your best elements on the ice more often... same should be done on the PP, when the conditions are as I said above.

Of course if the PP has been ineffective and they've been running around for half the penalty don't do it... but if all they've been doing is passing the puck around and coming real close to scoring LEAVE THEM THERE!
If one or two are tired, go change... but if some of the key players can manage it, stay on the ice.

I'm mainly thinking of Souray as I write this, I think this is quite obvious... but it applies to anyone who is a constant threat on that given night.

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01-04-2004, 02:48 AM
  #8
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In a related story... Kovalchuk played 11:23 of Atlanta's 12 minutes of PP time against the Habs.

Now that's what I'm talking about.

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01-04-2004, 04:04 AM
  #9
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Another problem I have is that on some nights we have our 1st PP unit that is very effective, but the 2nd unit is just awful and doesn't generate a thing.
Why not keep your 1st PP unit on the whole 2 minutes then?... when you're settled into the offensive you barely skate at all, fatigue is not an issue.

Some of the best players in the league like Mario, McInnis at the point, etc.. stay for practically the whole penalty. I agree with that, especially on teams where the 2nd wave just isn't effective.
I'd like to see Souray stay there the whole time, ditto any other player who is making the PP work on a given night.[/QUOTE]
im a bit on tha mellow and high mind of state from the NL...
in the game with atlanta, i could have sworn that souray was on the ice for the whole pp, i saw the pp changing its times in that game. i mean man our pp is actually pretty explosive at times, soo many games i see with souray taking a crazy a$$ slapshot, and the players who crash the net get to chip it in, i mean its freeky how souray is shooting right now, we havnt had this element of the game for a long time, i feel we have to utilize this and keep'em on for the whole 2 mins for our spea...l tea.s, players in the 70's use to play for over 2-3 mins all the time, and we have the fitest generation of hockey players right now. not a factor. at all,,

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