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Domi Vs. Horvat Vs. Lazar Vs. Gauthier Vs. Wennberg

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Old
05-19-2013, 06:34 PM
  #26
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DKQ View Post
Offensive upside
Wennberg
Domi
Lazar
Gauthier
Horvat

Defensive play
Horvat
Lazar
Gauthier
Wennberg
Domi

Physicality
Lazar
Horvat
Domi
Gauthier
Wennberg

Skating (speed, acceleration, and agility)
Domi
Wennberg
Lazar
Gauthier
Horvat

Passing
Wennberg
Domi
Gauthier
Horvat
Lazar

Shot selection
Lazar
Wennberg
Domi
Gauthier
Horvat

Hockey IQ
Wennberg
Gauthier
Horvat
Domi
Lazar

Bust Potential (from lowest to highest)
Horvat
Lazar
Domi
Gauthier
Wennberg

Edit: Ill add that I don't see Wennberg and Domi making the NHL as centers
I think you may be underrating Horvat in some areas.

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Old
05-19-2013, 06:39 PM
  #27
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
I think you may be underrating Horvat in some areas.
I've seen a lot of Horvat over the last few years (I live in London). Very solid player, one of my favourite Knights ever, but despite his solid playoff run I have questions about his offensive tools (which most of the categories I ranked him poorly in were). I also think most of the categories are pretty close, so Horvat being last on skating for instance doesn't mean he's a bad skater, just that there are four better skaters on the list

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05-19-2013, 07:41 PM
  #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DKQ View Post
I've seen a lot of Horvat over the last few years (I live in London). Very solid player, one of my favourite Knights ever, but despite his solid playoff run I have questions about his offensive tools (which most of the categories I ranked him poorly in were). I also think most of the categories are pretty close, so Horvat being last on skating for instance doesn't mean he's a bad skater, just that there are four better skaters on the list
Thanks for that, but still, last in offensive upside? And second last in passing? He seems to be a pretty good playmaker whenever I have seen him.

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05-19-2013, 07:43 PM
  #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
The "defensive" rankings are out to lunch. As are the "skating" rankings. This poster clearly doesnt have a handle on Lazar's game.
The way I see it is the difference in some of these players, in certain categories, is not big enough to throw a fit over exactly where they are ranked against one another. The only ones that are set in stone, in my eyes, are the obvious ones like Domi with the highest offensive upside, and Gauthier with the lowest skating ability. And one other point, just because I'd rank Gauthier with the lowest offensive ceiling doesn't mean I think he is garbage offensively. And that goes for all of them in each category.

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Old
05-19-2013, 08:14 PM
  #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kimahri View Post
The way I see it is the difference in some of these players, in certain categories, is not big enough to throw a fit over exactly where they are ranked against one another. The only ones that are set in stone, in my eyes, are the obvious ones like Domi with the highest offensive upside, and Gauthier with the lowest skating ability. And one other point, just because I'd rank Gauthier with the lowest offensive ceiling doesn't mean I think he is garbage offensively. And that goes for all of them in each category.
Nobody is throwing a fit, but the "list" that you quoted, and seemed to largely agree with, is easily the worst so far.

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05-19-2013, 08:23 PM
  #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Nobody is throwing a fit, but the "list" that you quoted, and seemed to largely agree with, is easily the worst so far.
I'm wrong because my opinion is different than yours? These are all junior level players who play in different leagues. Nobody's list is going to be "right" because they are all opinion based.

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05-19-2013, 08:36 PM
  #32
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Love when guys sit here and critique the lists made by others but can't make one themselves...



Anyway. Of the guys mentioned in the thread title, Wennberg is the guy that intrigues me the most because he's the guy I've seen the least. I was aware of him at the U20's but I was so focused on other players that I barely noticed him. Same thing with the U18's I was focused on guys like Dansk, Forsberg, Bystrom, Collberg, and both Lindholms that I didn't really pay attention to him.

Fail on my part I suppose

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Old
05-19-2013, 09:18 PM
  #33
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Nobody is throwing a fit, but the "list" that you quoted, and seemed to largely agree with, is easily the worst so far.
If you know so much more than everyone you should be a scout. Give your own list before saying that a list is terrible.

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05-19-2013, 10:24 PM
  #34
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Originally Posted by Adam Tilander View Post
Love when guys sit here and critique the lists made by others but can't make one themselves...
This.

If you disagree with something, fine. But at least be decent enough to do it respectfully.

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Old
05-20-2013, 01:56 AM
  #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kimahri View Post
I'm wrong because my opinion is different than yours? These are all junior level players who play in different leagues. Nobody's list is going to be "right" because they are all opinion based.
I dont know "why" you are wrong, and I dont pretend to be an expert on all these players by any means, but I have a decent handle on most of them and I know one very well. I know enough to know that the guy who ranked Lazar last defensively and skating and near the bottom of physicality (three of his strengths) has no idea wtf they are talking about when it comes to THAT player.

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Old
05-20-2013, 02:03 AM
  #36
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Originally Posted by LeHabsMan View Post
If you know so much more than everyone you should be a scout. Give your own list before saying that a list is terrible.
I gave my thoughts on the players to the extent that I have some idea and some viewings to give a reasonable assessment. Im not going to "make a list" of players I dont know or havent really seen.

I will comment on the players I have seen and do know about as well as pointing out obvious mistakes. The OP is trying to get an idea/handle on the various players and their strengths/weaknesses. I would hope that only helpful/relevant info would be provided.

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Old
05-20-2013, 03:04 AM
  #37
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Originally Posted by Bryanbryoil View Post
Sorry for the mother of all Vs. threads, but it seems like there are quite a few quality centers in this draft compared to recent drafts. How would you rank these players from top to bottom in terms of:

Offensive upside

Defensive play

Physicality

Skating (speed, acceleration, and agility)

Passing

Shot selection

Hockey IQ

Bust Potential (from lowest to highest)
Offensive upside:
Domi
Wennberg
Lazar
Horvat

Defensive Play:
Horvat
Lazar
Wennberg
Domi

Physicality:
Lazar
Horvat
Domi
Wennberg

Skating:
Domi, Lazar, and Wennberg are fantastic skaters. Horvat doesn't have quick feet.

Passing:
Domi
Horvat
Wennberg
Lazar

Shot:
Lazar
Domi
Wennberg
Horvat

Hockey IQ:
They're all good in that dept.

Bust Potential:
I'd say Lazar is least likely to bust. He's followed by Horvat.

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Old
05-20-2013, 03:07 AM
  #38
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Now that is a pretty good list. Well done sir.

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Old
05-20-2013, 04:54 AM
  #39
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rt, out of curiosity why did you omit Gauthier on your lists? Great stuff though guys, there seems to be some very knowledgeable posters here and I really appreciate the insight.

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Old
05-20-2013, 05:45 AM
  #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Morgan Gardiner View Post
Offensive upside

Horvat
Domi
Lazar
Gauthier
Wennberg

Defensive play

Horvat
Gauthier
Wennberg
Domi
Lazar

Physicality

Domi
Gauthier
Horvat
Lazar
Wennberg

Skating (speed, acceleration, and agility)

Wennberg
Gauthier
Horvat
Domi
Lazar

Passing

Horvat
Domi
Gauthier
Lazar
Wennberg

Shot selection

Horvat
Domi
Lazar
Gauthier
Wennberg

Hockey IQ

Horvat
Domi
Gauthier
Wennberg
Lazar

Bust Potential (from lowest to highest)

Horvat
Domi
Gauthier
Lazar
Wennberg
Wow! Honestly, you're so far off on pretty much every ranking! Highly doubt you've seen these guys play.

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Old
05-20-2013, 05:47 AM
  #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rt View Post
Offensive upside:
Domi
Wennberg
Lazar
Horvat

Defensive Play:
Horvat
Lazar
Wennberg
Domi

Physicality:
Lazar
Horvat
Domi
Wennberg

Skating:
Domi, Lazar, and Wennberg are fantastic skaters. Horvat doesn't have quick feet.

Passing:
Domi
Horvat
Wennberg
Lazar

Shot:
Lazar
Domi
Wennberg
Horvat

Hockey IQ:
They're all good in that dept.

Bust Potential:
I'd say Lazar is least likely to bust. He's followed by Horvat.
This list on the other hand is very accurate. I would have Wennberg higher (tied with Domi) in passing, but other than that, very solid list.

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Old
05-20-2013, 06:33 AM
  #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rt View Post
Offensive upside:
Domi
Wennberg
Lazar
Horvat

Defensive Play:
Horvat
Lazar
Wennberg
Domi

Physicality:
Lazar
Horvat
Domi
Wennberg

Skating:
Domi, Lazar, and Wennberg are fantastic skaters. Horvat doesn't have quick feet.

Passing:
Domi
Horvat
Wennberg
Lazar

Shot:
Lazar
Domi
Wennberg
Horvat

Hockey IQ:
They're all good in that dept.

Bust Potential:
I'd say Lazar is least likely to bust. He's followed by Horvat.
I don't know Wenberg at all but WRT Domi, Horvat and Lazar I'd pretty much agree with this. I do waiver back and forth on the offensive upside of Lazar vs Horvat. Draftwise, being an Oiler fan I'd rank them Lazar, Horvat, and then Domi. For me Gauthier would be below all three of these guys. Other than the U18's I have not been as impressed with him.

I am pretty surprised anyone would rank Lazar down the list in physicality and in skating. He loves to hit and hits very hard. His little tilt with Nurse in the prospect game also shows what he is made of.

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Old
05-20-2013, 07:19 AM
  #43
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Originally Posted by Fourier View Post
I don't know Wenberg at all but WRT Domi, Horvat and Lazar I'd pretty much agree with this. I do waiver back and forth on the offensive upside of Lazar vs Horvat. Draftwise, being an Oiler fan I'd rank them Lazar, Horvat, and then Domi. For me Gauthier would be below all three of these guys. Other than the U18's I have not been as impressed with him.

I am pretty surprised anyone would rank Lazar down the list in physicality and in skating. He loves to hit and hits very hard. His little tilt with Nurse in the prospect game also shows what he is made of.
I was surprised by this, too! Makes you wonder if the people attempting to rank them have actually watched them play.. Having Lazar near the bottom of these guys is laughable.


Last edited by The Ultimate Warrior: 05-20-2013 at 02:45 PM.
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Old
05-20-2013, 07:41 AM
  #44
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As a Leaf fan really hoping to get a potential high end two-way centre, I find this thread very intriguing.

And then I read it and realize all the disagreement/bickering lol, and feel like Ive learned nothing from it. Im a bit behind on my draft knowledge this year, have to catch up.

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Old
05-20-2013, 08:38 AM
  #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Morgan Gardiner View Post
Offensive upside

Horvat
Domi
Lazar
Gauthier
Wennberg

Defensive play

Horvat
Gauthier
Wennberg
Domi
Lazar

Physicality

Domi
Gauthier
Horvat
Lazar
Wennberg

Skating (speed, acceleration, and agility)

Wennberg
Gauthier
Horvat
Domi
Lazar

Passing

Horvat
Domi
Gauthier
Lazar
Wennberg

Shot selection

Horvat
Domi
Lazar
Gauthier
Wennberg

Hockey IQ

Horvat
Domi
Gauthier
Wennberg
Lazar

Bust Potential (from lowest to highest)

Horvat
Domi
Gauthier
Lazar
Wennberg
Horvat has very little offensive upside.

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Old
05-20-2013, 08:55 AM
  #46
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Originally Posted by wally31 View Post
I was surprised by this, too! Makes you wonder if the people attempting to rank them have actually watched me play.. Having Lazar near the bottom of these guys is laughable.
Lazar, is that you?

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Old
05-20-2013, 09:02 AM
  #47
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Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
I gave my thoughts on the players to the extent that I have some idea and some viewings to give a reasonable assessment. Im not going to "make a list" of players I dont know or havent really seen.

I will comment on the players I have seen and do know about as well as pointing out obvious mistakes. The OP is trying to get an idea/handle on the various players and their strengths/weaknesses. I would hope that only helpful/relevant info would be provided.
So you havent seen some play but complain because players that you havent seen are above them? Alright then.

What is so wrong with my list?

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05-20-2013, 09:21 AM
  #48
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So you havent seen some play but complain because players that you havent seen are above them? Alright then.

What is so wrong with my list?
Lazar should be first on the defensive list, not second last like you have him. But mistakes are probably going to happen when you are pissing in the dark.

I havent seen Wennberg. I have seen the Swedish team at the WJC, but dont particularly recall him. So Im not going to pretend I know what I am talking about and "include" him in some list. Apparently that doesnt stop others from doing so.

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Old
05-20-2013, 10:46 AM
  #49
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Originally Posted by Bryanbryoil View Post
rt, out of curiosity why did you omit Gauthier on your lists? Great stuff though guys, there seems to be some very knowledgeable posters here and I really appreciate the insight.
I've never seen Gauthier play. London and Edmonton have had a lot of exposure the last couple of years, so I've seen a fair bit of Lazar, Domi, and Horvat. Most of Wennberg's games this season are available for free on YouTube. So, I've seen a fair amount of him as well.

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05-20-2013, 10:54 AM
  #50
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I've never seen Gauthier play. London and Edmonton have had a lot of exposure the last couple of years, so I've seen a fair bit of Lazar, Domi, and Horvat. Most of Wennberg's games this season are available for free on YouTube. So, I've seen a fair amount of him as well.
Do you have a link to that?

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