HFBoards

Go Back   HFBoards > General Hockey Discussion > Prospects
Notices

Prospects Discuss hockey prospects from all over the world and the NHL Draft.

Who is the best drafting team in the NHL?

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old
05-11-2013, 01:09 PM
  #76
Led Zappa
Oy vey...
 
Led Zappa's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Sunnyvale, CA
Country: Scotland
Posts: 32,770
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by HABsurde View Post
SHARKS

DEFENSE
M. Carle
M.E. Vlasic
C. Erhoff
D. Joslin
J. Demers
T. Wishart
J. Braun
D. Murray would have been a better choice than Joslin.

Here are current Sharks Drafties still playing minus Whitney, plus some undrafted players. Not bad considering our draft order over the last decade.

Entry Year Player Draft Year Draft#
1997 Patrick Marleau Drafted 1997 1rst round 2nd
1998 Scott Hannan Drafted 1997 1rst round 23rd
1999 Brad Stuart Drafted 1998 1rst round 3rd
2001 Mikael Samuelsson Drafted 1998 5th round 145th
2003 Christian Ehrhoff Drafted 2001 4th round 106th
2005 Matt Carle Drafted 2003 2nd round 47th
2005 Milan Michalek Drafted 2003 1rst round 6th
2005 Steve Bernier Drafted 2003 1rst round 16th
2005 Marcel Goc Drafted 2001 1rst round 20th
2005 Josh Gorges Undrafted 2004  
2006 Douglas Murray Drafted 1999 8th round 241rst
2006 Marc-Edward Vlasic Drafted 2005 2nd round 35th
2006 Ryane Clowe Drafted 2001 6th round 175th
2007 Joe Pavelski Drafted 2003 7th round 205th
2007 Torrey Mitchell Drafted 2004 4rth round 126th
2008 Devin Setoguchi Drafted 2005 1rst round 8th
2009 Jason Demers Drafted 2008 7th round 186th
2009 Fraser Mclaren Drafted 2007 7th round 203rd
2010 Justin Braun Drafted 2007 7th round 201rst
2010 Logan Couture Drafted 2007 1rst round 9th
2010 Andrew Desjardins Undrafted Signed 2008
2010 Jamie McGinn Drafted 2006 2nd round 36th
2010 Nick Bonino Drafted 2007 6th round 173rd
2011 Tommy Wingels Drafted 2008 6th round 177th
2012 Charlie Coyle Drafted 2010 1rst round 28th
2012 Matt Irwin Undrafted 

__________________

"This is not a nick or a scratch, this is an open wound" - Doug Wilson.
Led Zappa is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
05-11-2013, 10:23 PM
  #77
donpaulo
Capt Barry Beck
 
donpaulo's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: nihon
Country: Japan
Posts: 1,605
vCash: 500
It would also be interesting to see data broken down by round.

Which teams draft best in round 2, 3 , 4 and so on

I am too lazy to crunch it myself

donpaulo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-11-2013, 10:26 PM
  #78
tiger_80
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 5,527
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
I doubt we are even top 20.

tiger_80 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-14-2013, 05:28 PM
  #79
DetBigWangs
Registered User
 
DetBigWangs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,155
vCash: 500
What about quality over quantity. You want 3-4 good 4th liners to be weighed the same as a HOF center?

DetBigWangs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-15-2013, 01:28 PM
  #80
moorebf235
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Boston
Country: United States
Posts: 55
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DetBigWangs View Post
What about quality over quantity. You want 3-4 good 4th liners to be weighed the same as a HOF center?
It goes back to would you rather a flash in the pan or a solid 4th liner. If you get a player thats plays 300-400 games he's not a bust. Thats it.

moorebf235 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-15-2013, 01:35 PM
  #81
Shrimper
Trick or ruddy treat
 
Shrimper's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Essex
Country: United Kingdom
Posts: 68,705
vCash: 50
Pittsburgh at the start of the 00's were poor at drafting but since then and mostly with Shero we've improved although we seem to have more focus on defenders than forwards. That's the only downside to our drafting. Would be interested to learn what we've got from our draft picks when traded and their success.

Shrimper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-15-2013, 02:25 PM
  #82
reffree
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: ste-justine québec
Posts: 1,572
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsujimoto74 View Post
Stats from between 97-06
Forwards and d-men counted as successful picks from 1997-2004 had to play at least 125 NHL games. From 04-06, 80 were required. For goalies, at least 51 if drafted between 97-04, and at least 25 if drafted between 04-06.

National Hockey League – Top 30

1. Buffalo - 10yrs – 91 draft picks – 28 NHL Players = 30.7% success rate (1)

2. Boston - 10yrs – 85 draft picks – 26 NHL Players = 30.5% success rate (1)

3. Ottawa - 10yrs – 92 draft picks – 26 NHL Players = 28.2% success rate (2)

4. Pittsburgh - 10yrs – 95 draft picks – 27 NHL Players = 28.4% success rate

5. Colorado - 10yrs – 96 draft picks – 27 NHL Players = 28.1% success rate (1)

6. San Jose - 10yrs – 78 draft picks – 21 NHL Players = 27.0% success rate (3)

7. Montreal - 10yrs – 90 draft picks – 24 NHL Players = 26.6% success rate (2)

8. Anaheim - 10yrs – 74 draft picks – 19 NHL Players = 25.6% success rate

9. Nashville - 9yrs – 88 draft picks – 20 NHL Players = 24.0% success rate (3)

10. NY Rangers -10yrs – 100 draft picks – 23 NHL Players = 23.0% success rate
That's a pretty cool list. I tought it would end the thread. I suppose it's funnier to name teams without looking at data

reffree is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-15-2013, 03:02 PM
  #83
Analyzer
#WeAreBoston
 
Analyzer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Renfrew, ON.
Country: Canada
Posts: 40,978
vCash: 500
Montreal has older players who they picked like Vokoun, Beauchemin, Carkner, Asham.

Analyzer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-15-2013, 03:22 PM
  #84
moorebf235
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Boston
Country: United States
Posts: 55
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by reffree View Post
That's a pretty cool list. I tought it would end the thread. I suppose it's funnier to name teams without looking at data
The link I posted to start the thread had similar data but this is the internet. A place where you can propose a trade of:

Toronto: Alex Pietrangelo, Vladimir Tarasenko, 2014 2nd

St Louis: Phil Kessel, Jake Gardiner/Morgan Rielly, 2013 1st, 2014 1st

And then go on to try and justify it.

moorebf235 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-19-2013, 02:21 PM
  #85
DetBigWangs
Registered User
 
DetBigWangs's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 2,155
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by moorebf235 View Post
It goes back to would you rather a flash in the pan or a solid 4th liner. If you get a player thats plays 300-400 games he's not a bust. Thats it.
Flash in the pan? I'm talking about a bona-fide 1st liner. A franchise players. A core you can build around. You can score 100% on players every draft and still do nothing if they're all 4th liners.

It really would be better to take risks than make the safe pick every time. That's because the bottleneck on any team is roster size. 7 Picks a year x 3 (~10 year career for effective players) years is all you would need to ice a lineup that would last the next seven. So it would be more beneficial to a team to draft to add a couple impact players per year and live with a few flameouts.

DetBigWangs is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-19-2013, 03:52 PM
  #86
Erik Estrada
One Country United!
 
Erik Estrada's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Land of the Habs
Country: Canada
Posts: 7,700
vCash: 500
Habs are pretty good. Surely Top-10 or Top-5. If it wasn't for some Milbury-style trades and decisions by management (for example, McDonagh...), Habs would be set...

Erik Estrada is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-19-2013, 04:43 PM
  #87
Sean Monahan
#Moneyman
 
Sean Monahan's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Cowtown
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,207
vCash: 50
Ottawa's gotta be out there

Sean Monahan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-19-2013, 05:14 PM
  #88
moorebf235
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Boston
Country: United States
Posts: 55
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by DetBigWangs View Post
Flash in the pan? I'm talking about a bona-fide 1st liner. A franchise players. A core you can build around. You can score 100% on players every draft and still do nothing if they're all 4th liners.

It really would be better to take risks than make the safe pick every time. That's because the bottleneck on any team is roster size. 7 Picks a year x 3 (~10 year career for effective players) years is all you would need to ice a lineup that would last the next seven. So it would be more beneficial to a team to draft to add a couple impact players per year and live with a few flameouts.
How would you measure that quality of a player while still taking into account different types of players or being subjective?

moorebf235 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-19-2013, 05:17 PM
  #89
Soundgarden
Registered User
 
Soundgarden's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Spring Hill, TN
Country: United States
Posts: 6,229
vCash: 562
I believe Nashville had a defense line-up of:

Weber-Josi
Klein-Bartley
Blum-Ekholm

for a couple of games at least.

Soundgarden is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-19-2013, 05:35 PM
  #90
The Podium
Formerly chrisx101
 
The Podium's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 11,300
vCash: 657
Toronto's exactly where i thought theyd be. Good at drAfting but held back by their ability to actually keep their picks. I hope this proves that "Toronto sucks at drafting" misconception is finally put to rest.

The Podium is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-19-2013, 07:58 PM
  #91
SchennSational1022*
The Future
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Long Island New York
Country: United States
Posts: 3,281
vCash: 500
Flyers have to be in anyone's top 5 regarding forwards IMO, but probably, no exaggeration, are last regarding defensemen. The only defensemen we've drafted since 93 that played over like 150 games was chris Therien

SchennSational1022* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-19-2013, 08:08 PM
  #92
Scarecrow Boat
Registered User
 
Scarecrow Boat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 3,750
vCash: 500
I'd go with Nashville because they're team is mostly homegrown. I have so much respect for how that organization is run top to bottom. I know they don't have much offensively but they just draft so many quality players regardless of draft position. This year is the earliest they pick since David Legwand in '98 (all things considered he's still great value when you look at the rankings back then lol) and they'll definitely be picking a much needed stud forward to go along with Filip Forsberg.

Scarecrow Boat is online now   Reply With Quote
Old
05-20-2013, 02:24 AM
  #93
Kevin8se7en
Unregistered User
 
Kevin8se7en's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Ottawa, ON
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,144
vCash: 500
Tried not being a homer but Ottawa had one of the best prospect crops before this season began, and only one of those guys (Zibby) was a high pick.

Silfverberg, Lehner, Stone, Pageau.. all non-first rounders. Not to mention Wiercioch, Gryba, and a few others.

I believe Greening was a late pick as well, but he's a bit older.

Since Murray stepped in, our drafting has been top-notch. Before then - not so much

Kevin8se7en is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-20-2013, 03:32 AM
  #94
Smallz
Registered User
 
Smallz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Toronto
Country: Canada
Posts: 2,113
vCash: 500
I'm a Leafs fan and its Ottawa

Smallz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-20-2013, 05:48 AM
  #95
416Leafer
Registered User
 
416Leafer's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 5,563
vCash: 500
At this point I dont think you can really say Detroit anymore. Sure, they have Datsyuk and Zetterberg from outside of the 1st round, and formerly had Lidstrom. But these were all over 10 years ago. They havent drafted a top line talent in a long long time.

They used to have a big advantage in Europe, but I think at this point, other teams have caught up. I also dont give points for getting a franchise player with a top 5 pick. Those picks almost always go in a more or less consensus order, so following that order isnt considered impressive to me. So Pittsburgh gets no points for having drafted Crosby, Malkin, etc, in fact you could say MAF was a really bad choice.

My answer is Ottawa. Theyve recently added Karlsson with a mid 1st rounder, Lehner looks like he could become a top 5-10 goalie in this league, and they got him outside of the 1st round. So thats top top talent outside of the top 5 picks. They also get a lot of depth out of their later round draft picks. Really well run organization.

416Leafer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-20-2013, 09:12 AM
  #96
SchennSational1022*
The Future
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Location: Long Island New York
Country: United States
Posts: 3,281
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by 416Leafer View Post
At this point I dont think you can really say Detroit anymore. Sure, they have Datsyuk and Zetterberg from outside of the 1st round, and formerly had Lidstrom. But these were all over 10 years ago. They havent drafted a top line talent in a long long time.

They used to have a big advantage in Europe, but I think at this point, other teams have caught up. I also dont give points for getting a franchise player with a top 5 pick. Those picks almost always go in a more or less consensus order, so following that order isnt considered impressive to me. So Pittsburgh gets no points for having drafted Crosby, Malkin, etc, in fact you could say MAF was a really bad choice.

My answer is Ottawa. Theyve recently added Karlsson with a mid 1st rounder, Lehner looks like he could become a top 5-10 goalie in this league, and they got him outside of the 1st round. So thats top top talent outside of the top 5 picks. They also get a lot of depth out of their later round draft picks. Really well run organization.
Detroits drafting is very overrated and Ottawa is probably the best OVERALL drafting team. I still think Flyers are the best at drafting and developing forwards.

SchennSational1022* is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-20-2013, 09:16 AM
  #97
Hoogaar23
Registered User
 
Hoogaar23's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 1,468
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by moorebf235 View Post
How would you measure that quality of a player while still taking into account different types of players or being subjective?
That's the problem with all these various iterations of "who is the best drafting team".

Most of them have some subjective threshold like "100 GP" - if GP >= 100, then success, else fail. So a team that drafted 20 guys that played 99 games is at 0, but a team that drafted one guy that played 100 games and 19 that never played is somehow better?

And this exercise - just going by games played. Who's 2003 draft was more successful?

Predators: 1118GP from Suter and Weber
Oilers: 1307GP from Pouliot, MacDonald, Jacques, Stortini, Brodziak, Roy, Bodie

I don't think anyone would argue against the Preds by a landslide.

Many people have tried (myself included), but all have failed miserably in quantifying a team's success in the draft.

Also - from the 98 draft, Is Datsyuk in the 6th round as much or more of a success than Lecavalier 1st overall? How about Chris Neil in the 6th round vs Lecavalier 1st overall?

Hoogaar23 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-20-2013, 09:24 AM
  #98
Kaner Coffee
Anna for Hart Trophy
 
Kaner Coffee's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Chicago
Country: United States
Posts: 1,569
vCash: 500
I like how fans say their team drafted poorly for a while, then list prospects they took in the last couple drafts as evidence that they've turned it around. Because, ya know, all of their team's prospects are studs.

Kaner Coffee is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-20-2013, 09:32 AM
  #99
I am the Liquor
Registered User
 
I am the Liquor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Sunnyvale
Country: Canada
Posts: 34,256
vCash: 8345
Minnesota has been consistently good year after year. They get my vote.

I am the Liquor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old
05-20-2013, 09:50 AM
  #100
Scarecrow Boat
Registered User
 
Scarecrow Boat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 3,750
vCash: 500
Quote:
Originally Posted by I am the Liquor View Post
Minnesota has been consistently good year after year. They get my vote.
What? How?
AJ Thelen
Ben Pouloit
James Sheppard
Colton Gillies
Tyler Cuma


5 straight years of wtf first round picks.


If it wasn't for 2010 they'd be considered one of the worst drafting teams and there's still plenty of time for those kids to bust

Scarecrow Boat is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Forum Jump


Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 09:50 PM.

monitoring_string = "e4251c93e2ba248d29da988d93bf5144"
Contact Us - HFBoards - Archive - Privacy Statement - Terms of Use - Advertise - Top - AdChoices

vBulletin Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
HFBoards.com is a property of CraveOnline Media, LLC, an Evolve Media, LLC company. ©2014 All Rights Reserved.