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05-20-2013, 12:45 PM
  #926
Broad Street Elite
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Chris, you are the Idealistic Sniper of the Flyers fanbase

To me, our forward core is as good as anyone in the NHL right now.

Our stock of defensive defensemen is championship caliber.

Unfortunately, we are relying on an elderly Kimmo Timmonen, a novice Erik Gustaffson, and a paper Andrej Meszaros to move the puck on the defensive end. That crew is at best borderline borderline and an injury away from dragging our team down. This is also one of the most difficult areas to address in Free Agency with it basically being Streit or bust there. By the way, Ghost had a good, solid year, but let's not act like he's anything more than a promising prospect at this stage. There's no way we can bank on him (or Stolarz) amounting to anything given how far out and how much development (both physical and play) needs to occur to be NHL caliber, let alone a difference maker.

I do agree with Chris that solid, though not spectacular goaltending is the objective. Bryz was that for about half this shortened season, then fell apart only to have Mason out play him down the stretch. Bryz is being paid like a difference maker on defense. That's just not who he is nor who the Flyers should expect most nights.

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05-20-2013, 12:46 PM
  #927
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Originally Posted by duffy9748 View Post
I am not all doom and gloom like others around here. I think the Flyers have a very bright future. But until you add a number 1 defenseman and a reliable goalie, this team isn't going anywhere.
I'm with you. I think this team is a boarderline playoff team next year at this point.

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Old
05-20-2013, 12:47 PM
  #928
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Originally Posted by LegionOfDoom91 View Post
I some what disagree with that. They did it the year before with basically the same roster. They had Carle but the Flyers scored more when he was off the ice IIRC.

The offense isn't top 5 unless the young guys step up. Getting PMD would help too but that's not the sole reason for that this year.
I'm not talking about the 2012-13 offense though.

A lot of the forwards will be different next year. A healthy year from Hartnell as well as a moderate step-up for Couturier and Schenn will do wonders for our even strength offense.

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05-20-2013, 12:49 PM
  #929
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Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
I'm assuming a lot, but my interpretation of a top 10 defense is...

Timonen (2012-13 level) - Schenn (2012-13 level)
Gustafsson (WC level) - Coburn (2010-2012 level)
Meszaros (wildcard) - Grossmann (2012-13 level)
Clearly there is no changing your opinion so I won't even bother replying after this, but they can all play those levels, and it still isn't a top 10 defense. I'm a fan of Gus and want to give him a chance, but lets not compare him playing in a meaningless tournament to being a top 4 defender in the NHL NEXT YEAR.

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05-20-2013, 12:50 PM
  #930
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Originally Posted by duffy9748 View Post
Chicago
St. Louis
New York Rangers
Pittsburgh
Boston
Los Angeles
Montreal
Phoenix
Vancouver
Nashville


Those are 10 off the top of my head that I would take over the Flyers. You are also relying on Timonen staying healthy for another season when his play has been on the decline since the run to the Finals.

You acknowledge this but still say our roster is stacked. Goaltending is a vital position. We made a run to the finals with awful goaltending in '09, but that roster had two number 1 dmen with Coburn and Carle playing their best hockey. We no longer have anything close to a number 1 dman.
Why? Like seriously why? The Rangers can't score in the playoffs and have a pretty soft forward group when you really look at it.

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05-20-2013, 12:51 PM
  #931
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Originally Posted by LegionOfDoom91 View Post
I'm with you. I think this team is a boarderline playoff team next year at this point.
I don't see how anyone can say anything different until we see what Holmgren does this offseason. If this roster stays the same, there will be improvement but nothing drastic enough to make us a cup contender.

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05-20-2013, 12:51 PM
  #932
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
I'm not talking about the 2012-13 offense though.

A lot of the forwards will be different next year. A healthy year from Hartnell as well as a moderate step-up for Couturier and Schenn will do wonders for our even strength offense.
I think you're way too optimistic for next year.

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05-20-2013, 12:52 PM
  #933
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Originally Posted by TheLegendkiller View Post
Why? Like seriously why? The Rangers can't score in the playoffs and have a pretty soft forward group when you really look at it.
What does scoring have to do with defense? If you wouldn't take Staal, Mcdonagh, Girardi, Del Zotto, ect. over our defense, I really don't know what to say.

I don't feel like going into every detail, but I am assuming you have never watched a Coyotes game if you wouldn't take their defense over our's. Sure they play a defensive system, but the difference of talent between the two isn't even close.

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05-20-2013, 12:52 PM
  #934
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Originally Posted by Broad Street Elite View Post
Chris, you are the Idealistic Sniper of the Flyers fanbase

To me, our forward core is as good as anyone in the NHL right now.

Our stock of defensive defensemen is championship caliber.

Unfortunately, we are relying on an elderly Kimmo Timmonen, a novice Erik Gustaffson, and a paper Andrej Meszaros to move the puck on the defensive end. That crew is at best borderline borderline and an injury away from dragging our team down. This is also one of the most difficult areas to address in Free Agency with it basically being Streit or bust there. By the way, Ghost had a good, solid year, but let's not act like he's anything more than a promising prospect at this stage. There's no way we can bank on him (or Stolarz) amounting to anything given how far out and how much development (both physical and play) needs to occur to be NHL caliber, let alone a difference maker.

I do agree with Chris that solid, though not spectacular goaltending is the objective. Bryz was that for about half this shortened season, then fell apart only to have Mason out play him down the stretch. Bryz is being paid like a difference maker on defense. That's just not who he is nor who the Flyers should expect most nights.
There's a reason I picked Gus as the breakout player for next year.

I do think Campbell is a good idea though. Campbell, Gardiner, or Streit would all be solid options to bring the PMD side back to where it needs to be.

Our young offense will correct itself with time. Poor even strength scoring is symptomatic of a young offense. Briere is another guy who is addition by subtraction in that regard as well.

Call me an optimist, but I think we're a much better team than we pretended to be this half season. If this was a full season, I think we're in the playoffs. Some pretty mediocre talent level teams made the postseason this year thanks to great starts.

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05-20-2013, 12:54 PM
  #935
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If Florida could take half of his salary, what would it take to get Campbell?

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05-20-2013, 12:55 PM
  #936
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It seems that some of you think a great offense, an average to slightly above average defense, and ****** goaltending will win us a cup. News flash, we have had that same mix for the last 20 years and we haven't won a damn thing.

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05-20-2013, 12:58 PM
  #937
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Originally Posted by SolidSnakeUS View Post
If Florida could take half of his salary, what would it take to get Campbell?
**** that. I'll take Campbell at full salary as long as we wipe out Bryz and Briere.

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Old
05-20-2013, 01:00 PM
  #938
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Originally Posted by duffy9748 View Post
It seems that some of you think a great offense, an average to slightly above average defense, and ****** goaltending will win us a cup. News flash, we have had that same mix for the last 20 years and we haven't won a damn thing.
No, I think a great offense, a great defense, and cheap goaltending can win us a Cup.

The only way to create that model is to do exactly what the Flyers did in 2010. A healthy Emery and that Cup is ours.

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Old
05-20-2013, 01:01 PM
  #939
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
**** that. I'll take Campbell at full salary as long as we wipe out Bryz and Briere.
Like this?:

CAPGEEK.COM USER GENERATED ROSTER
My Custom Lineup
FORWARDS
Scott Hartnell ($4.750m) / Claude Giroux ($3.750m) / Jakub Voracek ($4.250m)
Brayden Schenn ($3.110m) / Sean Couturier ($1.375m) / Wayne Simmonds ($3.975m)
Jason Akeson ($0.900m) / Scott Laughton ($1.107m) / Matt Read ($0.900m)
Zac Rinaldo ($0.750m) / Maxime Talbot ($1.750m) / Tye McGinn ($0.775m)
Jay Rosehill ($0.675m) /
DEFENSEMEN
Kimmo Timonen ($6.000m) / Luke Schenn ($3.600m)
Braydon Coburn ($4.500m) / Brian Campbell ($7.143m)
Nicklas Grossmann ($3.500m) / Erik Gustafsson ($1.250m)
Bruno Gervais ($0.825m) /
Chris Pronger ($4.941m) /
GOALTENDERS
Ilya Bryzgalov ($5.667m)
Steve Mason ($1.500m)
OTHER
Buyout: Oskars Bartulis ($0.100m)
Buyout: Danny Briere ($0.000m)
------
CAPGEEK.COM TOTALS (follow @capgeek on Twitter)
(these totals are compiled with the bonus cushion)
SALARY CAP: $64,300,000; CAP PAYROLL: $67,092,637; BONUSES: $2,960,000
CAP SPACE (23-man roster): $167,363

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Old
05-20-2013, 01:03 PM
  #940
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Originally Posted by Chris Shafer View Post
No, I think a great offense, a great defense, and cheap goaltending can win us a Cup.

The only way to create that model is to do exactly what the Flyers did in 2010. A healthy Emery and that Cup is ours.
I'd agree, I think that roster with Emery would have won a cup. I'm just not expecting Timonen to get three years younger and for Pronger to hop on the ice tomorrow.

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05-20-2013, 01:09 PM
  #941
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Originally Posted by duffy9748 View Post
I'd agree, I think that roster with Emery would have won a cup. I'm just not expecting Timonen to get three years younger and for Pronger to hop on the ice tomorrow.
Emery also came cheap because he had a history of personal problems and nobody wanted him. Good luck finding a goalie of that caliber again for under 2 million dollars.

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05-20-2013, 01:13 PM
  #942
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Originally Posted by duffy9748 View Post
Emery also came cheap because he had a history of personal problems and nobody wanted him. Good luck finding a goalie of that caliber again for under 2 million dollars.
We could probably find one that has political views that got scrutinized and would come in around 3.5-4 million. Timmy Thomas of course! Timmy is even better caliber than Emery.

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Old
05-20-2013, 01:14 PM
  #943
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Originally Posted by SolidSnakeUS View Post
Like this?:
Nah. Like this...

Hartnell (4.75) - Giroux (3.75) - Voracek (4.25)
Simmonds (3.98) - Couturier (0.93) - Schenn (0.90)
Gagne (1.75) - Laughton (0.93) - Read (0.90)
Rinaldo (0.75) - Holmstrom (0.60) - Talbot (1.75)
Rosehill (0.68)

Timonen (6.00) - Schenn (3.60)
Campbell (7.14) - Coburn (4.50)
Gustafsson (1.25) - Grossmann (3.50)
Gervais (0.83)

Mason (1.50)
Thomas (2.00)

SALARY: 56.24
CAP: 64.30
SPACE: 08.06

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05-20-2013, 01:15 PM
  #944
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The idea that you're advocating Thomas scares me. In all honesty, I'd rather give that job to Eriksson.

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05-20-2013, 01:17 PM
  #945
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Originally Posted by Prongo View Post
We could probably find one that has political views that got scrutinized and would come in around 3.5-4 million. Timmy Thomas of course! Timmy is even better caliber than Emery.
I wouldn't hate a Thomas/Mason tandem. It isn't ideal but there is potential. With Luongo and Miller likely on the move, there are those options as well.

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Old
05-20-2013, 01:20 PM
  #946
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Originally Posted by SolidSnakeUS View Post
The idea that you're advocating Thomas scares me. In all honesty, I'd rather give that job to Eriksson.
To be perfectly honest, I would too.

I don't know where the realm of possibility stands with regards to Eriksson though. I'm holding my breath hoping for any word.

If he wants an NHL job, I say buyout Bryz and hand the reigns over to him and Mason. It realistically cannot possibly be any worse than Bryzgalov.

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05-20-2013, 01:24 PM
  #947
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To be perfectly honest, I would too.

I don't know where the realm of possibility stands with regards to Eriksson though. I'm holding my breath hoping for any word.

If he wants an NHL job, I say buyout Bryz and hand the reigns over to him and Mason. It realistically cannot possibly be any worse than Bryzgalov.
That sounds like a recipe for another lottery pick. If we buy-out Bryz I would hope we sign sign a veteran on a cheaper and shorter term.

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05-20-2013, 01:27 PM
  #948
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The idea that you're advocating Thomas scares me. In all honesty, I'd rather give that job to Eriksson.
See this is what is wrong with HF. Yes, let's go with Eriksson, a player who never played in NA over a Vezina winning goalie who took a year off and before that year played at an extremely high level. Let's not forget Eriksson is extremely young, and you don't want to throw him into that mix if Mason struggles(see Bob, over played here at times for being so young.) I am not saying give Thomas 3 years, do one year and see how he competes. He gives us a much better chance than Eriksson and Bryz.

You want to go with a Mason/Eriksson tandem, we will enjoy picking in the lottery again. No doubt in my mind.

Luongo won't be bought out, so why trade for him and that contract? Luongo is only going to be a nice addition if he is bought out at a cheaper rate, that's not happening. If we want to trade for Miller, we will have to give up assets. Assets this team probably can't afford to give for a goalie. The UFA market is much more suitable for the Flyers if they buy out Bryz. TImmy P also said today on twitter he thinks Bryz is here next year, but he doesn't know what he is talking about half the time. So take it with a grain of salt.

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05-20-2013, 01:31 PM
  #949
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Politics aside and just for 2013-14, Thomas is a much better option than Bryzgalov or Eriksson.

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05-20-2013, 01:33 PM
  #950
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I'd rather go Thomas as well.

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