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Draft Thread Part 2: Bark to the Future

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Old
05-21-2013, 11:27 AM
  #101
Top 6 Spaling
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I leave for a three week wilderness canoeing trip on June 30th. If I come back and find out Poile took Monahan over Barkov, I may just go back to the wilderness.

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05-21-2013, 11:37 AM
  #102
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Didn't realize you guys think that lowly of Monahan. I thought he would be a great fit, let alone having better offensive potential then Barkov.

Oh well - Senapreds connection <3

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05-21-2013, 11:39 AM
  #103
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Originally Posted by SERGEI BOBROVTREE View Post
Didn't realize you guys think that lowly of Monahan. I thought he would be a great fit, let alone having better offensive potential then Barkov.

Oh well - Senapreds connection <3
Monahan would be a great player to have. I see him developing into a Ryan Kesler type from what I've heard, and there is nothing wrong with that. But Barkov is being compared to Thornton, and that is the kind of player who can put us over the top.

In Poile We Trust, but still, from what I've heard, it's Barkov or Bust for me once Drouin and Mac are gone

Yep, rocking the Sens avatar. I love that team.

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05-21-2013, 12:08 PM
  #104
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Originally Posted by SERGEI BOBROVTREE View Post
Didn't realize you guys think that lowly of Monahan. I thought he would be a great fit, let alone having better offensive potential then Barkov.

Oh well - Senapreds connection <3
My guess is this has less to do with how high people think of Monahan and more to do with how they think of Barkov. When you compare Barkov's game to other high pick europeans, there are only a handful of players in history that have been as great at draft year as Barkov. Add to that Barkov is only days away from being a 2014 pick and you have all the reason to hold Barkov high as a prospect.

If there would be a way of getting both I'm sure there wouldn't be any riots .

PS. about Monahan having more offensive potential than Barkov, I wouldn't be that sure. I wouldn't even bet on McKinnon having a better career stats wise though so take my opinion with a grain of salt.

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05-21-2013, 12:52 PM
  #105
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Just keep the fourth pick and take barkov, if barkov gets taken in top three then take Mack or drouin, whoever slips. There is no way to screw this up because jones will be a top three pick as well, so no matter what we are getting one of the big three forwards, preferably Mack or barks because they are centres.
So there is no excuse to trade the pick because our guy wasn't available and there is no reason at all to take monahan or Lindholm or nichushkin. Barkov I believe is better than all of them in every aspect of the game, literally. I'm just drooling over barkov in a gold jersey!

We take him and never look back. Even if poile traded down and got vanek and Lindholm over barkov I would be so upset. That speaks volumes of how high barkov is being held by us fans.


Side question,
Why do some call him Sasha and others aleksandr?

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05-21-2013, 01:12 PM
  #106
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Originally Posted by maplepred View Post

Side question,
Why do some call him Sasha and others aleksandr?
Sasha is a diminutive for Alexander and Alexandra in eastern europe. Though it's more just a very much used nick name in his case. Not to go into the linguistics but here is the Wikipedia article on Sasha (name) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sasha_%28name%29

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05-21-2013, 01:21 PM
  #107
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We take him and never look back. Even if poile traded down and got vanek and Lindholm over barkov I would be so upset. That speaks volumes of how high barkov is being held by us fans.
Thank god you aren't our GM. Vanek + Lindholm is easily better than barkov. The issue is that lindholm won't be there at 8. Other than that, I would take a proven scorer plus a prospect with lindholm's potential over barkov without thinking twice. Barkov looks like he will be good, possibly great, but he's not so far above lindholm that anyone should be anything less than thrilled if we made that move.

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05-21-2013, 01:24 PM
  #108
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Interesting topic on the Predators web site about the top 5 prospects.

http://predators.nhl.com/club/news.h...id=DL|NSH|home

The teams head scout (Jeff Keatly) goes over his scouting report on his top 5.

The two things I noticed was that Nichushkin isn't on the list and Lindholm is.

Also something posted there about Barkov...

"Something you may not know: Barkov is fluent in Finnish, Russian and English. His father, Alexander, played professional hockey in Russia, Italy and Finland, and serves as an assistant coach for Ak Bars Kazan in the KHL. His mother played basketball for the Russian National team."

Having a dad coaching in the KHL worries me just a little. Radulov bolting hurt the franchise a ton and we can't have that happen again. It's probably nothing but yeh...

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05-21-2013, 01:53 PM
  #109
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Originally Posted by Persona5 View Post
Interesting topic on the Predators web site about the top 5 prospects.

http://predators.nhl.com/club/news.h...id=DL|NSH|home

The teams head scout (Jeff Keatly) goes over his scouting report on his top 5.

The two things I noticed was that Nichushkin isn't on the list and Lindholm is.

Also something posted there about Barkov...

"Something you may not know: Barkov is fluent in Finnish, Russian and English. His father, Alexander, played professional hockey in Russia, Italy and Finland, and serves as an assistant coach for Ak Bars Kazan in the KHL. His mother played basketball for the Russian National team."

Having a dad coaching in the KHL worries me just a little. Radulov bolting hurt the franchise a ton and we can't have that happen again. It's probably nothing but yeh...
http://futureconsiderations.ca/shoul...s-draft-dream/

0% chances that he wants to play in KHL instead of NHL.

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05-21-2013, 01:58 PM
  #110
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Having a dad coaching in the KHL worries me just a little. Radulov bolting hurt the franchise a ton and we can't have that happen again. It's probably nothing but yeh...
Sorry but lol at the worries, like Barkov would pull a radulov because his father has a couple of years deal of coaching in the KHL. Barkov is Finnish so playing in KHL isn't staying at home for Barkov. Also Barkov said to russian media in WJC, that if he has no place in the NHL then KHL might be an option, but he won't even leave FEL for the KHL before he has tried his game in north america as playing in the NHL is his childhood dream.

If anything having a dad that knows about the game enough to be a coach in 2nd best league in the world is a good thing. And both parents being athletes shouldn't count as minus either.

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05-21-2013, 02:26 PM
  #111
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Originally Posted by CraigsGotHandles View Post
Thank god you aren't our GM. Vanek + Lindholm is easily better than barkov. The issue is that lindholm won't be there at 8. Other than that, I would take a proven scorer plus a prospect with lindholm's potential over barkov without thinking twice. Barkov looks like he will be good, possibly great, but he's not so far above lindholm that anyone should be anything less than thrilled if we made that move.
Maybe your right, but what if barkov turns into the next selanne and vanek doesn't sign extension and leaves after one season and Lindholm is just good. How would that move look then?!

Barkov has EVERY tool, he is the absolute complete package, and I would not be willing to turn that down over one year of Tomas vanek and a lesser prospect in Lindholm.


As far as the name thing, when he comes to North America, would he go to alek or Sasha??

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05-21-2013, 03:03 PM
  #112
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Scouting reports can be wrong.

Quote:
1. Pierre Turgeon, C (actual pick: BUF, 1st overall - 1,294 career NHL regular season games)

"He has been criticized for being inconsistent and an under-achiever...'What everybody questions is his ability to perform every game,' a scout said. 'Some nights, he's just not interested in playing.' Said another, 'In the playoffs, he didn't pick up the challenge.'"
"He didn't play particularly well in the last half of the season and was a disappointment in the playoffs. Nor does he seem to be a leader."
2. Brendan Shanahan, LW (NJD, 2nd overall - 1,524 NHL games)

"His skating could be a problem and some scouts worry that he will amount to little more than an NHL role player. 'He has no spark,' said a scout. 'He does his job, but you don't notice him.'"
"Said another, 'He might turn out to be a role player, but he's such a strong-willed kid, you have to overlook that. He won't score over 40 goals a season in the NHL, but he has the character and leadership to be another Terry O'Reilly.'"
3. Dave Archibald, RW (MNS, 6th overall - 323 NHL games)

"Archibald is a slick and multi-talented prospect, effective at both ends of the ice."
"Scouts say he anticipates well, has quickness, good hands and a great shot. 'He has more color and is a nicer hockey player to watch than Shanahan,' said one."
4. Glen Wesley, D (BOS, 3rd overall - 1,457 NHL games)

"...some think he should have been more dominant in 1986-87."
"Others argue that he is not physical and sometimes avoids rough play."
"There are those who worry about the 'Portland syndrome' - the theory that former star defencemen from Portland, such as Gary Nylund and Dave Babych, never play up to expectations in the NHL."
5. Chris Joseph, D (PIT, 5th overall - 510 NHL games)

"Joseph was on a poor team in 1986-87 and some scouts don't think he learned much, despite playing 40 minutes a game (editor's note: HOLY SH*%!!!). He has defensive weaknesses and is not a good positional player."
"Said a scout, 'I don't think anybody's ever taught him what the game is all about. He goes all over the ice, but he has plenty of raw talent.'"
6. Wayne McBean, D (LAK, 4th overall - 211 NHL games)

"A terrific skater, McBean might be the fastest player in the draft."
"He has strong offensive skills - a fine passer, and playmaker, with a good shot from the point."
"He also is fairly aggressive, tougher than Wesley."
"Playing 40 minutes a game (editor's note: HOLY SH*% AGAIN!!!), he helped lead the [Medicine Hat] Tigers to the Memorial Cup championship."
7. Luke Richardson, D (TOR, 7th overall - 1,417 NHL games)

"Defensively, he has problems. 'He makes some real bone-head plays,' said one. 'He gives the puck away in situations he shouldn't.'"
8. Bryan Fogarty, D (QUE, 9th overall - 156 NHL games)

"Another skilled offensive defenceman, Fogarty has an accurate point shot, moves the puck well and plays within his capabilities."
Note: Fogarty had a serious drinking problem (that was likely a coping mechanism for his severe social anxiety) that drastically undermined his ability to stay healthy and fulfill his potential. As noted in the report: "NHL clubs...are worried about rumors of an undisciplined off-ice lifestyle, although some say that is no longer a problem." Tragically, close friend John Kordic's drug-related death in 1992 weighed heavily on his continued attempts at sobriety, and Fogarty himself died of an enlarged heart (a frequent consequence of alcohol abuse) in 2002.

9. Jody Hull, RW (HTD, 18th overall - 831 NHL games)

"Some say he lacks intensity, but others describe him as a character player who works hard."
10. Joe Sakic, C (QUE, 15th overall - 1,378 NHL games)

"'He doesn't have much quickness...'"
"Usually, a player of this calibre would be certain to go in the top five. The reason he probably won't is his size and average skating ability."
11. Stephane Quintal, D (BOS, 14th overall - 1,037 NHL games)

"Criticisms include inability to make use of teammates, for example, passing off when rushing the puck. One scout said he is a bit of a floater."
"Said another, 'He's not that smart a player.'"
12. Adam Burt, D (HTD, 39th overall - 737 NHL games)

"He has few offensive skills and one scout believes he attempts to do too much in his zone."
13. Darren Rumble, D (PHI, 20th overall - 193 NHL games)

"One of the best skaters in the draft, Rumble is an immensely talented player, with all of the required offensive skills."
14. Peter Soberlak, LW (EDM, 21st overall - 0 NHL games)

"He is a good skater, has a great shot and is described as a dependable and good positional player."
"...strong..."
15. Rob Murphy, C (VAN, 24th overall - 125 NHL games)

"...good playmaker with excellent acceleration."
"Passes well to both sides."
16. Gord Kruppke, D (DET, 32nd overall - 23 NHL games)

"He is a big, tough kid, who 'knows no way but to go straight through you,' according to one scout."
"...is fairly strong defensively."
17. Keith Osborne, RW (STL, 12th overall - 16 NHL games)

"Osborne is (Editor's note: grammar mistake is not my own) solid all-round winger, has a good shot and skates well."
"He improved steadily during the season."
18. Jeff Ballantyne, D (WSH, 36th overall - 0 NHL games)

"One scout calls Ballantyne, 'a model of stability and consistency.'"
"...he is a strong positional player."
19. John McIntyre, C (TOR, 49th overall - 351 NHL games)

"...hard-working, aggressive player. Though more of a checker than a scorer, he's a good skater."
"Was the OHL's scholastic player of the year."
20. Bryan Marchment, D (WPG, 16th overall - 926 NHL games)

"He takes bad penalties..."
Yeah, I'd say that was a pretty good assessment. One of the not-entirely negative comments: "Probably the toughest player in the first round, as well as the dirtiest."
http://www.arcticicehockey.com/2012/...87-draft-class

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Old
05-21-2013, 03:07 PM
  #113
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Maybe your right, but what if barkov turns into the next selanne and vanek doesn't sign extension and leaves after one season and Lindholm is just good. How would that move look then?!

Barkov has EVERY tool, he is the absolute complete package, and I would not be willing to turn that down over one year of Tomas vanek and a lesser prospect in Lindholm.


As far as the name thing, when he comes to North America, would he go to alek or Sasha??
What if Lindholm becomes the next Selanne and Barkov is just good? Prospects are tricky because nobody in the world knows for certain how they will translate into the big leagues. I think both will be first line centers, but who will be better? I am not comfortable assuming that we know the answer to that.

Vanek on the other hand has proven he can produce, with or without a supporting cast, at this level. If properly managed, worst case scenario is that he's traded for additional picks/prospects at the appropriate time, but it's not impossible that he would resign. Adding two talented pieces in this case would be preferable to adding one talented player, and don't try the quality over quantity line, because we would be getting a quantity of quality behind door number two.

I don't think Buffalo does that deal, and don't think we get Lindholm at that spot if it does happen, so I won't make any more points on this hypothetical topic, but over valuing an unproven prospect is unwise

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05-21-2013, 04:15 PM
  #114
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Originally Posted by CraigsGotHandles View Post
What if Lindholm becomes the next Selanne and Barkov is just good? Prospects are tricky because nobody in the world knows for certain how they will translate into the big leagues. I think both will be first line centers, but who will be better? I am not comfortable assuming that we know the answer to that.

Vanek on the other hand has proven he can produce, with or without a supporting cast, at this level. If properly managed, worst case scenario is that he's traded for additional picks/prospects at the appropriate time, but it's not impossible that he would resign. Adding two talented pieces in this case would be preferable to adding one talented player, and don't try the quality over quantity line, because we would be getting a quantity of quality behind door number two.

I don't think Buffalo does that deal, and don't think we get Lindholm at that spot if it does happen, so I won't make any more points on this hypothetical topic, but over valuing an unproven prospect is unwise

Agreed, the fact that vanek may leave and we get nothing out of him other than a year and he walks. Or he signs an extension and we got a sick hockey forward! Who knows!

And your right, Lindholm will not be available at eighth overall for sure. Monahan may not be either for that matter. So we can't bicker and barter over what if's.

I just think we should not make any moves with buffalo personally unless we are allowed to talk to vanek beforehand about an extension.
Barkov has everything you want in a prospect and it's not worth a gamble IMO. Just pick barkov and make no trades poile. Unless its a trade not involving fourth overall pick.

I really have a strong feeling poile is going to go after Horton hard. Then we get a wicked forward who can lead the show and don't have to trade fourth overall. That's my ideal scenario

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05-21-2013, 04:35 PM
  #115
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Does anybody else not like Horton that much? I just feel like he'd be more of the same. Yes, he has had a 30 goal and 60 point season, but that was a couple years ago and his stats have dwindled since then.

I know it's not always about goals and points and he plays an aggressive game, but it just seems like it'd be another Fisher move. Predators definition of elite forward.

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05-21-2013, 04:44 PM
  #116
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Does anybody else not like Horton that much? I just feel like he'd be more of the same. Yes, he has had a 30 goal and 60 point season, but that was a couple years ago and his stats have dwindled since then.

I know it's not always about goals and points and he plays an aggressive game, but it just seems like it'd be another Fisher move. Predators definition of elite forward.
I am meh on Horton.

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05-21-2013, 04:57 PM
  #117
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It would put us back into the deep scoring depth build, IMHO.

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05-21-2013, 08:44 PM
  #118
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I think Horton is a better asset than erat. If that's who we are replacing. Plus he is years younger.

Does replacing erat without costing us any assets get us back into playoffs though?!

I think so, as long as we get a veteran defenseman to play with Klein. I think this could be one of our more interesting offseasons in a while...

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05-21-2013, 08:53 PM
  #119
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We've seen now how important being healthy is to a playoff run for sure.

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05-21-2013, 08:54 PM
  #120
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Originally Posted by maplepred View Post
I think Horton is a better asset than erat. If that's who we are replacing. Plus he is years younger.

Does replacing erat without costing us any assets get us back into playoffs though?!

I think so, as long as we get a veteran defenseman to play with Klein. I think this could be one of our more interesting offseasons in a while...
No way I'd give Horton the dough he will demand to come play here. He made 4 million this season - someone will give him more over the summer. We have had enough Hortons. Poile makes a trade to get a Vanek or we roll with our in-house guys, hope they stay healthy this time, and see if Barkov can crack the lineup at some point.

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05-21-2013, 09:59 PM
  #121
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No way I'd give Horton the dough he will demand to come play here. He made 4 million this season - someone will give him more over the summer. -snip-
It's not my money, so i'm actually hoping that Poile will overpay for Horton and Streit. Throw Barkov and Forsberg into the mix, plus a (hopefully) healthy roster and lose some dead weight... it could be a huge comeback year for the Preds.

Okay, i'm not hoping that he overpays, i'd be thrilled if he pays just the right amount. But i'm not going to blow up about it if he has to overpay to get them signed. I'm also not going to hold my breath on either of those guys, I'd be much more surprised if we signed even one of those players than if we didn't sign anyone at all.

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05-21-2013, 10:26 PM
  #122
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It's not my money, so i'm actually hoping that Poile will overpay for Horton and Streit. Throw Barkov and Forsberg into the mix, plus a (hopefully) healthy roster and lose some dead weight... it could be a huge comeback year for the Preds.

Okay, i'm not hoping that he overpays, i'd be thrilled if he pays just the right amount. But i'm not going to blow up about it if he has to overpay to get them signed. I'm also not going to hold my breath on either of those guys, I'd be much more surprised if we signed even one of those players than if we didn't sign anyone at all.
I have to agree, I want every talented player we can get.

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05-22-2013, 04:54 AM
  #123
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I'm curious of we will be playoff team next year or if this is a two year plan poile is implying.

Forsberg and barkov would really be able to contribute with a year under their belts and this years ufas are not great at all. Just a thought, but I want playoffs for sure next season!
It's the predator way!

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05-22-2013, 09:30 AM
  #124
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If they make the right moves.

-Bye Sk, Halischuck, Yip.

-Locate a legit forward to replace Erat.

-Locate a 2nd pairing Dman

-Throw Barkov and FF in the fire and let them learn and grow immediately.

-Get some specialized training in passing and what to do when the puck is within your sticks reach and you are in the slot.

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05-22-2013, 10:07 AM
  #125
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I'm curious of we will be playoff team next year or if this is a two year plan poile is implying.

Forsberg and barkov would really be able to contribute with a year under their belts and this years ufas are not great at all. Just a thought, but I want playoffs for sure next season!
It's the predator way!
I think next year in our new division Chicago is the only lock and if we are healthy(especially Pekka) we can hang with anyone else

in two years, if all goes as planned, we could be challenging Chicago for the top spot.

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