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2013 Draft: Stop winnin for MacKinnon, or Do Meth for Seth?

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Old
05-21-2013, 12:32 PM
  #926
Boom Boom Anton
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Originally Posted by Blueline Bomber View Post
There's no way the Avs don't take Jones. He fits a need, he's a hometown kid, and while he probably won't make the same immediate impact as the forwards, the PR the Avs will get for picking him will more than make up for it.

Still think we're going to grab Monahan, no surprises till later in the round, where the risk/reward tilt starts making picks like Nurse and Nichushkin more appealing.

Colorado - Jones
Florida - McK
Tampa - Drouin
Nashville - Barkov
Carolina - Monahan

Nurse probably won't make it pas the Oilers, and I see Nichushkin dropping till New Jersey.
This would be my guess also, which means it likely won't work out this way. I've been surprised by how the top 5 have panned out the last few years so I suspect there will be some surprises again this year. I'll be quite surprised if Jones and McK don't go 1-2, but after that, I wouldn't at all be surprised by guys slipping / moving up.

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05-21-2013, 12:52 PM
  #927
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It would be silly for Nichushkin to drop out of the Top 5. There, I said it. And I doubt it happens.

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05-21-2013, 01:14 PM
  #928
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I think the only player is absolutely 0% chance of falling to the Canes is MacKinnon. Of the rest I would go:

1) Jones
2) Drouin
3) Barkov
4) Monahan
5) Lindholm

I don't think Nurse should even be apart of the discussion. Nichushkin makes me too nervous as a Canes pick, they might not have the money to lure him over to the NHL.

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05-21-2013, 01:24 PM
  #929
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Originally Posted by Vagrant View Post
It would be silly for Nichushkin to drop out of the Top 5. There, I said it. And I doubt it happens.
I see the appeal of Nichushkin with his size (could top out at 6'5"-6'6", 225lbs), play style, and dominance when playing juniors... But every single highlight reel is him doing the exact same Eric Staal/Rick Nash "go wide and cut into the goal" power move over and over again. It works for him, I just don't think he can be successful consistently in the NHL as a one trick pony.

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05-21-2013, 01:47 PM
  #930
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What magical moves are people supposed to be using in a 1 on 1 rush up the wing, where the Dman has help to the middle? They aren't using the same move because of a lack of creativity, or a limitation on their skills. It's generally the best choice, particularly on guys who can create an occasional scoring chance out of it.

Just like when Staal is behind the net, and 'always' tries the wraparound stuff. As opposed to? Flipping the puck up over the net and off the back of the goalie?

A rush up the wing with the dman in good position is a low value situation. These guys are trying to create something out of nothing. If they can get a good scoring chance, even 1 times out of 10, that's a big deal.

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05-21-2013, 01:56 PM
  #931
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It would be silly for Nichushkin to drop out of the Top 5. There, I said it. And I doubt it happens.
It's tough to pass on a guy that can help immediately to plan for 15-16. Your roster has to be in a certain situation to justify it, I think. Canes want to win now. Tampa only has so many more years of St. Louis and Lecavlier. Nashville has Weber/Rinne in their prime on big contracts.

Calgary makes the most sense, as they have squat going for them for the forseeable future.

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05-21-2013, 03:39 PM
  #932
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What chances would you give the Hurricanes of getting Barkov? 10%, 30%, 50% etc? Thanks!

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05-21-2013, 05:18 PM
  #933
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Originally Posted by wallym View Post
What magical moves are people supposed to be using in a 1 on 1 rush up the wing, where the Dman has help to the middle? They aren't using the same move because of a lack of creativity, or a limitation on their skills. It's generally the best choice, particularly on guys who can create an occasional scoring chance out of it.

Just like when Staal is behind the net, and 'always' tries the wraparound stuff. As opposed to? Flipping the puck up over the net and off the back of the goalie?

A rush up the wing with the dman in good position is a low value situation. These guys are trying to create something out of nothing. If they can get a good scoring chance, even 1 times out of 10, that's a big deal.
Personally, when behind the net, I expect an insane lacrosse-style pick the puck up and deposit it in the top corner.

Really though, it isn't a problem that he is great one on one coming down the wing, he is using his strengths. My problem is the lack of any other highlight reel type play from him. Check out Drouins highlight reel and you'll see the difference, Drouin can beat you from the corner, from the point, from behind the net, streaking in from Center ice, and he regularly makes ridiculous passes. There are videos of him racing down the ice, single handedly beating 3-5 guys, and potting a goal.

With Nichushkin its more like "what a sick move outside", "great drive to the net", "ok, yeah he beat him again outside", "wow, another power move outside?", "hmmm.. Let me guess".

In the words of Wutang financial, Diversify yo bonds.

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05-21-2013, 05:39 PM
  #934
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Originally Posted by Jussijuice View Post
Personally, when behind the net, I expect an insane lacrosse-style pick the puck up and deposit it in the top corner.

Really though, it isn't a problem that he is great one on one coming down the wing, he is using his strengths. My problem is the lack of any other highlight reel type play from him. Check out Drouins highlight reel and you'll see the difference, Drouin can beat you from the corner, from the point, from behind the net, streaking in from Center ice, and he regularly makes ridiculous passes. There are videos of him racing down the ice, single handedly beating 3-5 guys, and potting a goal.

With Nichushkin its more like "what a sick move outside", "great drive to the net", "ok, yeah he beat him again outside", "wow, another power move outside?", "hmmm.. Let me guess".

In the words of Wutang financial, Diversify yo bonds.
Thank God NHL scouts don't use YouTube to pick prospects.

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05-21-2013, 05:57 PM
  #935
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Thank God NHL scouts don't use YouTube to pick prospects.
Fair enough, but who actually wants to go to Russia or watch a KHL game?

The real issue with Nichushkin or any young, Russian star player is money. With some there isn't a lot of incentive to come over and make $900k on an ELC when they are already making millions back home. So the team either gets lucky and they decide to come over anyway (like Tarasenko), your team has to promise to overpay to get them to come over (like Radulov), or the player may just never come over (like Kuznetzov).

Canes don't seem like the type to want to roll the dice.

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05-21-2013, 06:07 PM
  #936
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I read on the Prospects board that there are scouts who feel the same way about Nichushkin: that he only has one move.

Now, I've seen highlights at the WJC where he did show he was more than a one trick pony. In addition, I think there is merit that an 18 year old is able to continuously get away with the same move. Like Erik Cole. Everyone knew it was coming, and no one could stop it.

At the least, that speaks to having a rare combination of size and speed that any team will want.

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05-21-2013, 06:11 PM
  #937
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i actually agree a little bit on nichushkins style. he looks like artyukhin sometimes. i know he's still just a kid and has plenty of room to grow, im not sure his game will be as a high producing guy when compared to drouin. drouin can take the middle, has great lateral skating with top end playmaking. nuchuskin has a huge reach and great speed wide. i would question at the nhl level how well he will get back to the front of the net or make good plays off of it. its nit picking, the kid has huge natural gifts, he just the most raw of the top guys imo. he isnt a sniper at this point, hes a bull in a china shop. i love his skating compared to barkov, but barkov has everything else right.

i think hes a great prospect and fun to watch, i just see questions and when you're top 5 you have to ask them. he looks like a great possible power forward, and we need that on the wings no doubt. i think it will take him some time to develop, and we wont give him that time if we can help it.

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05-21-2013, 06:13 PM
  #938
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Originally Posted by Jussijuice View Post
Fair enough, but who actually wants to go to Russia or watch a KHL game?

The real issue with Nichushkin or any young, Russian star player is money. With some there isn't a lot of incentive to come over and make $900k on an ELC when they are already making millions back home. So the team either gets lucky and they decide to come over anyway (like Tarasenko), your team has to promise to overpay to get them to come over (like Radulov), or the player may just never come over (like Kuznetzov).

Canes don't seem like the type to want to roll the dice.
Oh I agree, I doubt highly they take him.

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05-21-2013, 06:33 PM
  #939
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i actually agree a little bit on nichushkins style. he looks like artyukhin sometimes. i know he's still just a kid and has plenty of room to grow, im not sure his game will be as a high producing guy when compared to drouin. drouin can take the middle, has great lateral skating with top end playmaking. nuchuskin has a huge reach and great speed wide. i would question at the nhl level how well he will get back to the front of the net or make good plays off of it. its nit picking, the kid has huge natural gifts, he just the most raw of the top guys imo. he isnt a sniper at this point, hes a bull in a china shop. i love his skating compared to barkov, but barkov has everything else right.

i think hes a great prospect and fun to watch, i just see questions and when you're top 5 you have to ask them. he looks like a great possible power forward, and we need that on the wings no doubt. i think it will take him some time to develop, and we wont give him that time if we can help it.
It's hard to not love his speed and size. He could easily end up being 6'5", 225 lbs. Any player that size with even mediocre skill is going to be a huge asset. Speed like his is rare for a guy that size.

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05-21-2013, 07:20 PM
  #940
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I'm curious who Tony Macs list of 6 elite talents contains. Or more importantly, who it doesn't. Assuming MacKinnon, Drouin, and Jones are there. Which one of Barkov, Lindholm, Monahan, and Nichushkin are left off.

Barkov - Doubtful, he's been on the radar for at least a year and scored better than any draft eligible prospect ever had in the Finnish Elite League
Lindholm - Maybe? More a jack of all trades, but many project him to be the next Backstrom or on the crazy end Forsberg
Monahan - Possibly? Played great on a bad team and has elite intangibles, but might have the lowest offensive ceiling of the four.
Nichushkin - Russian factor just take him off the list automatically? Every actual NHL scouting director I've heard says he is dominant.

MacDonald said any of of the top-6 could be the best in time. While the easiest answer would be scratch Nichushkin, I think Monahan has the lowest chance of possibly matching MacKinnon's level.

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05-21-2013, 10:10 PM
  #941
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Interesting read on the Avs brass. 1% chance they draft Jones.

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05-21-2013, 10:21 PM
  #942
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Interesting read on the Avs brass. 1% chance they draft Jones.
What are you referring to, exactly?

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Old
05-21-2013, 10:27 PM
  #943
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What are you referring to, exactly?
The article posted by WTF from the last page. Positional needs need not apply. They want to draft the best talent, and that's Mac IMO.

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05-21-2013, 10:41 PM
  #944
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The article posted by WTF from the last page. Positional needs need not apply. They want to draft the best talent, and that's Mac IMO.
Oh, I see that now. Apparently I skimmed over that post earlier in the day, and picked up reading right around Dubinchuk talking about the Domi pass.

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05-21-2013, 10:57 PM
  #945
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Oh, I see that now. Apparently I skimmed over that post earlier in the day, and picked up reading right around Dubinchuk talking about the Domi pass.
Coincidentally, I didn't look much into that post either. However, the kid's got potential. I like his chances in the top 10.

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05-21-2013, 11:04 PM
  #946
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05-21-2013, 11:14 PM
  #947
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....what love?

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05-21-2013, 11:30 PM
  #948
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having only YouTube vids to go on, i agree that drouin's highlight reels are indeed amazing to watch. he seems incredibly talented.

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05-22-2013, 07:37 AM
  #949
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Translated by google so take it for what it's worth
Quote:
MOSCOW, May 22 - R-Sport, Simon Galkevich. striker Valeri Nichushkin said the agency "F-Sport", which is planning to sign a contract with the club of the National Hockey League, which will select it in the NHL Draft 2013.
Quote:
"I had already decided that leave in the NHL - said Nichushkin. - In the" Dynamo "calmly reacted to this: I was told that I could leave if I want. No legal problems there. Contract with" Dinamo "will terminate, and I'm going free agent. was lucky that I went to the club to make concessions. We agreed that they would let me go, but if the ocean something goes wrong, I'm right back to them. "
So yeah theres that. I've been aboard the Lindholm/Monahan train pretty firmly but if damn it if Nichushkin doesn't complicate things every other week.

http://rsport.ru/hockey/20130522/663576629.html


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05-22-2013, 07:39 AM
  #950
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Thank God NHL scouts don't use YouTube to pick prospects.
Yeah, that's more the sole domain of the self-proclaimed experts on HFBoards.

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