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05-22-2013, 08:08 AM
  #776
Parker
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Chalk this up as a failed experiment and move on. Clowe isn't the same player he once was and is now an injury liability and can be expected to continue to decline.

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05-22-2013, 10:55 AM
  #777
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At one point I was under the impression that we didn't need to re sign this guy, but I fear i'm wrong. This team has little attitude, little personality, without him. He's pure grit, and he sticks up for his team mates. No one else here does that. The more I think about it, the more I think he needs to be resigned.

3 yrs/ 3.5 tops.

We desperately need an identity. He exemplifies what NY stands about. He played 12 games for us, roughly. I don't think he can be considered a "failed experiment". He got 2 untimely (likely) concussions. Unfair sample size. Let him heal and rest this offseason. Resign him to a short term, fair contract (which I think we'll be able to do because his recent concussions and injury problems). He's gonna be huge for us next year.

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05-22-2013, 11:11 AM
  #778
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Originally Posted by kenjets36 View Post
At one point I was under the impression that we didn't need to re sign this guy, but I fear i'm wrong. This team has little attitude, little personality, without him. He's pure grit, and he sticks up for his team mates. No one else here does that. The more I think about it, the more I think he needs to be resigned.

3 yrs/ 3.5 tops.

We desperately need an identity. He exemplifies what NY stands about. He played 12 games for us, roughly. I don't think he can be considered a "failed experiment". He got 2 untimely (likely) concussions. Unfair sample size. Let him heal and rest this offseason. Resign him to a short term, fair contract (which I think we'll be able to do because his recent concussions and injury problems). He's gonna be huge for us next year.
you really want to give him 3 years 3.5, to a guy who has had 2 concussions since joining the rangers ? and whos style of play only suggests more on the way ?

No thanks.

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05-22-2013, 11:18 AM
  #779
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Originally Posted by NYRKindms View Post
you really want to give him 3 years 3.5, to a guy who has had 2 concussions since joining the rangers ? and whos style of play only suggests more on the way ?

No thanks.
One concussion from a flying elbow, and probably returning symptoms from rushing back before he was ready.

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05-22-2013, 11:42 AM
  #780
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I wouldn't be upset with a shorter term deal like 2-3 years for a reasonable amount of money like 2.5-3.5 mil. Torts system needs a lot of big guys who can win on the walls. Clowe could provide that.

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05-22-2013, 11:44 AM
  #781
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This guy should have signed an extension with the Rangers after the first game he played here. His value has plummeted since. How can we trust he can stay on the ice?

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05-22-2013, 11:44 AM
  #782
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Originally Posted by SingnBluesOnBroadway View Post
Interesting how all the sudden draft picks have value around here.
Revisiting this, yeah, I'd still rather have the picks.

He's going downhill, can't believe it's not more apparent to some of you, we should know about that downward spiral more than any teams fans.

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05-22-2013, 12:55 PM
  #783
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Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
Revisiting this, yeah, I'd still rather have the picks.

He's going downhill, can't believe it's not more apparent to some of you, we should know about that downward spiral more than any teams fans.
2/3 year deal on the cheap, limiting him to 3rd line role? Regression is possible, maybe even likely, but as long as he's not making more than 3-3.5 and signed longer than 3 years it won't be a bad deal to make. Redden would have been a serviceable 6th d-man had he not been signed to such an albatross contract.

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05-22-2013, 01:05 PM
  #784
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Originally Posted by kenjets36 View Post
2/3 year deal on the cheap, limiting him to 3rd line role? Regression is possible, maybe even likely, but as long as he's not making more than 3-3.5 and signed longer than 3 years it won't be a bad deal to make. Redden would have been a serviceable 6th d-man had he not been signed to such an albatross contract.
I might agree, but the recent struggles AND a concussion? No thanks, rather develop some youth over having to watch him decline and get beaten up. Too depressing for a team that specializes in it

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05-22-2013, 01:08 PM
  #785
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Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
I might agree, but the recent struggles AND a concussion? No thanks, rather develop some youth over having to watch him decline and get beaten up. Too depressing for a team that specializes in it
I'm also very wary. Would weigh giving him a 1-year offer but nothing beyond that. He will get better offers elsewhere I am sure.

Do we have anyone in the system that plays similar to Clowe that will be ready in next 2-3 years?

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05-22-2013, 01:13 PM
  #786
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Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
I might agree, but the recent struggles AND a concussion? No thanks, rather develop some youth over having to watch him decline and get beaten up. Too depressing for a team that specializes in it
Not gonna have much developing if 0 guys stick up for each other.

Clowe gives that type of team identity. Just cause Dorsett or Asham can fight doesn't mean they'll give that identity. No one did that this year.

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05-22-2013, 01:22 PM
  #787
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Originally Posted by kenjets36 View Post
Not gonna have much developing if 0 guys stick up for each other.

Clowe gives that type of team identity. Just cause Dorsett or Asham can fight doesn't mean they'll give that identity. No one did that this year.
I've heard this argument for years, it's really not a good enough one. I would rather use that money, time and spot on a better player. I refuse to believe Ryan Clowe or any one player will make the difference in the toughness department, which is really what you are saying. Toughness spread through the lineup is way more valuable.

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05-22-2013, 01:34 PM
  #788
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Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
I've heard this argument for years, it's really not a good enough one. I would rather use that money, time and spot on a better player. I refuse to believe Ryan Clowe or any one player will make the difference in the toughness department, which is really what you are saying. Toughness spread through the lineup is way more valuable.
Where do you start? Because this team is beyond soft.

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05-22-2013, 01:38 PM
  #789
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Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
I've heard this argument for years, it's really not a good enough one. I would rather use that money, time and spot on a better player. I refuse to believe Ryan Clowe or any one player will make the difference in the toughness department, which is really what you are saying. Toughness spread through the lineup is way more valuable.
I think Asham and Doresett along with Clowe gives us part of the equation.

We need one or two mean SOB dmen to finish it off.

I hope Clowe is healthy to come back, however I think he's being rushed.

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05-22-2013, 01:43 PM
  #790
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i really like what little i saw of clowe. but i think losing a second-rounder to keep him is a bad move. i could see the rangers re-signing him, i guess, if he would come cheaply for a few years. and he might. but for big dollars, i can't see it. especially with the second-rounder. this isn't news, i suppose

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05-22-2013, 01:47 PM
  #791
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Originally Posted by lbrowne View Post
I think Asham and Doresett along with Clowe gives us part of the equation.

We need one or two mean SOB dmen to finish it off.

I hope Clowe is healthy to come back, however I think he's being rushed.
Asham is a mercenary. Not a smart one either. We'd be up 2-0 and he'd fight guys for no reason giving the other team momentum and energy. He has no allegiance to the guys on this team.

Clowe, Dorsett, McIlrath, another tough energy guy. Thats where you start with the energy. The other guys will feed off. You replaced Prust with Clowe. Need to keep him now. Otherwise, you run the risk of playing how we did to start this year... again...

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05-22-2013, 01:56 PM
  #792
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Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 View Post
Where do you start? Because this team is beyond soft.
Not with Clowe, he's the opposite of what I'd want - aging, downward progression, concussed. Absolutely no one in the system can come close to what he does upfront, makes you think he's a must at this point. Not me, I'd rather explore other options. That's on the pro scouts and gm, find cheap alternatives cause you have none on the farm, we should be use to it by now.

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Originally Posted by lbrowne View Post
I think Asham and Doresett along with Clowe gives us part of the equation.
All those guys missed significant time this year

Aging, hurt, and/or not performing up to past ability. Great start.....

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05-22-2013, 01:58 PM
  #793
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Originally Posted by Bluenote13 View Post
Not with Clowe, he's the opposite of what I'd want - aging, downward progression, concussed. Absolutely no one in the system can come close to what he does upfront, makes you think he's a must at this point. Not me, I'd rather explore other options. That's on the pro scouts and gm, find cheap alternatives cause you have none on the farm, we should be use to it by now.



All those guys missed significant time this year

Aging, hurt, and/or not performing up to past ability. Great start.....
I am starting to come around on not signing Clowe, but something HAS to be done about how soft this team is. For how they want to play, it's sickening.

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05-22-2013, 02:07 PM
  #794
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We need to bring up McIlrath just for the toughness factor next season.

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05-22-2013, 02:08 PM
  #795
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We need to bring up McIlrath just for the toughness factor next season.
Then we are all back at the same point. Expecting one player to provide all of the toughness. Although Dorsett will help, it needs to be a team identity. Get McIlrath ready to play. Bring in someone else who can handle that side of the game though. In hindsight, Tootoo would have been ideal for the 4th line.

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05-22-2013, 02:09 PM
  #796
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I'm not saying the answer has to be Clowe.

But toughness is a big part of what's missing in the equation, IMO. Playable toughness (aka not John Scott) and it's resulting influence brings players together. Its a lot easier to set screens and crash the net when you or your linemates have the confidence to deal with the consequences.

Obviously there are skill issues too. Not saying it's the be all end all. But it matters, a lot more than often is immediately apparent. I think it provided real glue last year.

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05-22-2013, 02:11 PM
  #797
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Originally Posted by kenjets36 View Post
One concussion from a flying elbow, and probably returning symptoms from rushing back before he was ready.
Two head shots. Two concussions. Have you read up on concussions at all? Are you a doctor and know something we don't? The only correlation the first incident has to the second one is that it gets worse with each additional head shot. It is NOT an issue of "returning symptoms." Just because the rangers CIA staff led by the dictator, John Tortorella, tells you he hasn't sustained a concussion doesn't make it to be truth.

Clowe deserves no extension, and quite honestly he would not have had a significant impact on this series. This team's defensive system is severely flawed with how loose they are on the point men. Clowe would've just been a slower skater out there trying his best to close the gap between him and the wide open defenseman with the puck.

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05-22-2013, 02:13 PM
  #798
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Originally Posted by NYR Boyler87 View Post
Where do you start? Because this team is beyond soft.
Clowe is a soft player now IMO. Injury prone and I haven't seen him working in front of the net. He's not nearly fast or physically engaging enough to change team identity. I'd be absolutely fuming if the Ranger contemplated to re-signing him. He is probably staged for a Ryan Smyth esque decline 2.0.

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05-22-2013, 02:14 PM
  #799
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Originally Posted by HatTrick Swayze View Post
I'm not suing the answer has to be Clowe.

But toughness is a big part of what's missing in the equation, IMO. Playable toughness (aka not John Scott) and it's resulting influence brings players together. Its a lot easier to set screens and crash the net when you or your linemates have the confidence to deal with the consequences.

Obviously there are skill issues too. Not saying it's the be all end all. But it matters, a lot more than often is immediately apparent. I think it provided real glue last year.
One tough guy means you have one tough guy, not really a tough team to play against. If that one guy, in this case Clowe, goes down, who is there to step up in that department? Toughness dept, not just fighting. If the answer is really no one who can play top minutes than that's a problem and you really don't have toughness as a team. It's like putting almost all our offensive woes on Nash. It shouldn't have to be all his doing, the team supports him and he supports the team.

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05-22-2013, 02:14 PM
  #800
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Two head shots. Two concussions. Have you read up on concussions at all? Are you a doctor and know something we don't? The only correlation the first incident has to the second one is that it gets worse with each additional head shot. It is NOT an issue of "returning symptoms." Just because the rangers CIA staff led by the dictator, John Tortorella, tells you he hasn't sustained a concussion doesn't make it to be truth.

Clowe deserves no extension, and quite honestly he would not have had a significant impact on this series. This team's defensive system is severely flawed with how loose they are on the point men. Clowe would've just been a slower skater out there trying his best to close the gap between him and the wide open defenseman with the puck.
Just cause he was playing doesn't mean he had healed from his previous concussion (if it was that to begin with). Boyle is widely speculated to have played through one last year. Clowe came back 4-5 games after he sustained one? Doesn't seem like an adequate time period to get over a concussion (in professional sports).

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