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Ryan Smyth: The most useless player on the team

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05-27-2013, 03:26 PM
  #326
backhandsauce
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
Remember how Colin Fraser sucked so much here? Look how good he fits in with LA.

How many of these guys would fit in with teams that have good depth?
Brodziak, Glencross, Fraser would all look good in our bottom 6 right now.

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05-27-2013, 03:42 PM
  #327
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
Remember how Colin Fraser sucked so much here? Look how good he fits in with LA.

How many of these guys would fit in with teams that have good depth?
Are they considered the depth players?

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05-27-2013, 03:46 PM
  #328
joestevens29
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Originally Posted by oilers83 View Post
Are they considered the depth players?
I think if you have 9 guys in front of them it doesn't matter. That's my point. 4th liners aren't what's going to turn this team around. Need better mixture on lines 1-3, who plays on the 4th line shouldn't matter that much. Should be a bunch of interchangeable guys.

Every team that is still alive in the west right now has used at least 2 extras in a couple cases 2. We don't hear how Tanner Pearson or Bracken Kearns are the reason these teams are losing.

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05-27-2013, 07:02 PM
  #329
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Originally Posted by joestevens29 View Post
I think if you have 9 guys in front of them it doesn't matter. That's my point. 4th liners aren't what's going to turn this team around. Need better mixture on lines 1-3, who plays on the 4th line shouldn't matter that much. Should be a bunch of interchangeable guys.

Every team that is still alive in the west right now has used at least 2 extras in a couple cases 2. We don't hear how Tanner Pearson or Bracken Kearns are the reason these teams are losing.
That is definitely true for good teams. Unfortunately for the Oilers, the 4th line usually lets us down. They can't tread water.

If you look at the good teams in the league, they've got guys who can randomly chip in a goal or two. That's huge. They're also generally better at not giving up goals than our 4th line.

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05-27-2013, 07:10 PM
  #330
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Originally Posted by Master Lok View Post
If that's the case, then where's the criticism for Hartikainen, Smithson, Lander or Vandevelde?

Smyth scored 13 points, was -5 in 47 games. Half the time, he was playing out of position at centre, which he has never played before with any regularity.

Heir apparent Teemu Hartikainen scored a mere 3 pts, was a worse -8 in 23 games and he didn't even play on the PK, or play out of position at centre.

Jerred Smithson, an actual centre, scored 1 pt, was plus 0, in 10 games.

Prospect Anton Lander scored 1 pt, was -4 in 11 games.

AHL centre Chris Vandevelde scored 0 pts, was -3 in 11 games.

By this comparison, Smyth was no where near the "most useless player" on the roster - an utter classless description by the OP, which says more about the OP than it does about Smyth.

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05-27-2013, 07:29 PM
  #331
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Originally Posted by Master Lok View Post
If that's the case, then where's the criticism for Hartikainen, Smithson, Lander or Vandevelde?

Smyth scored 13 points, was -5 in 47 games. Half the time, he was playing out of position at centre, which he has never played before with any regularity.

Heir apparent Teemu Hartikainen scored a mere 3 pts, was a worse -8 in 23 games and he didn't even play on the PK, or play out of position at centre.

Jerred Smithson, an actual centre, scored 1 pt, was plus 0, in 10 games.

Prospect Anton Lander scored 1 pt, was -4 in 11 games.

AHL centre Chris Vandevelde scored 0 pts, was -3 in 11 games.

By this comparison, Smyth was no where near the "most useless player" on the roster - an utter classless description by the OP, which says more about the OP than it does about Smyth.
Taking TOI into consideration, it's fairly easy to see why Smyth outscored the other 4th line centers.

Smyth - 15:22 min per game (including averaging over a 1:15 on the PP)
Smithson - 11:43 (0 pp)
Lander - 11:01 (0 pp)
CVV - 7:02 (0 pp)

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05-27-2013, 08:38 PM
  #332
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Originally Posted by KlimasLoveChild[B
;66643923]Bwhahahaha.....so the measuring stick of a quality NHL player is whether or not he is better then a HF poster.[/B] I've heard it all now. The Smyth apologists are really digging deep now. Way to put things into perspective.

I don't think anyone here would deny he was a quality player at one time. It's just quite clear that time was in the distant past and he could really save face by packing it in now. Have you ever heard a pro athlete when retiring mention that he didn't want to be that guy who tried to hang on too long. Well, Smyth is that guy at the moment.
Brilliant response. No one would actually believe that that was the point I was making.

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05-27-2013, 09:21 PM
  #333
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Originally Posted by vespa99 View Post
[/B]


This. In spades.
Obviously the game has passed Smytty by, or at the very least the lockout forced him to sit for too long. Either way to talk about a guy that has generally been a good Oiler this way is classless. He played in the Nhl for many many years and worked his butt off for every one of those years. He could still skate circles around us scrubs on this board so lets keep it in perspective shall we? If nothing else he deserves a little respect for having had a great career. I think it is fine to suggest he should retire but lets keep it classy for a change,
If you were watching the Oilers after December last year you'd realize the lockout has nothing to do with his ineffectiveness.

Great careers are easily soured. Take yourself out of the game before people forget the pre-Islander Smyth days.

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05-27-2013, 11:57 PM
  #334
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Originally Posted by GreatKeith View Post
If you were watching the Oilers after December last year you'd realize the lockout has nothing to do with his ineffectiveness.

Great careers are easily soured. Take yourself out of the game before people forget the pre-Islander Smyth days.
I don't disagree with this at all. I think Smytty should retire now. I just don't like the petty sniping at him on this board. He has earned at least a little respect in my opinion. There are thousands of players that hang on a little too long. It is the competitive nature in them that blinds them to the reality of their skills. That is no excuse for this type of crap though.

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05-28-2013, 12:13 AM
  #335
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"Die and be a hero, or live long enough to see yourself become the villain. I went from the favourite, to the most hated, but would you rather be under paid or overrated" - R Smyth

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05-28-2013, 02:05 PM
  #336
Master Lok
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Originally Posted by vespa99 View Post
I don't disagree with this at all. I think Smytty should retire now. I just don't like the petty sniping at him on this board. He has earned at least a little respect in my opinion. There are thousands of players that hang on a little too long. It is the competitive nature in them that blinds them to the reality of their skills. That is no excuse for this type of crap though.
Agreed 100%.

Smyth has been a long term Oiler, and while his jersey won't be hung in the rafters, I can see him being named to an Oiler Wall of Honor.

Smyth is 6th in all time Oiler points and second in all time Oiler games.

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05-29-2013, 12:08 PM
  #337
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Why is MacT seemingly on board with getting rid of Horcoff but is giving Smyth a free pass? Smyth has been much worse than Horcoff, IMO

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05-29-2013, 04:51 PM
  #338
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Originally Posted by 5RingsAndABeer View Post
Why is MacT seemingly on board with getting rid of Horcoff but is giving Smyth a free pass? Smyth has been much worse than Horcoff, IMO
I think Mac T's point was about stagnation: players need a change of scenery. The players he identified as Hemsky and Horcoff. Both of those players still have a few years left to play hockey.

Smyth is in the twilight of his career. Whether he gets moved or not, his play will probably be about the same. There's a good chance he'll retire next season, whether it's the result of another injury or at the end of the year.

Different situations, I think.

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05-29-2013, 11:20 PM
  #339
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Originally Posted by Master Lok View Post
Agreed 100%.

Smyth has been a long term Oiler, and while his jersey won't be hung in the rafters, I can see him being named to an Oiler Wall of Honor.

Smyth is 6th in all time Oiler points and second in all time Oiler games.
Where is the wall of honour?

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05-30-2013, 12:34 PM
  #340
Master Lok
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Originally Posted by Seedling View Post
Where is the wall of honour?
Doesn't exist. It's been suggested however by other posters in the past. There's a number of Oilers who aren't noteworthy enough to be in the Hall of Fame, or to have their jersey hung up in the rafters but still have had profound impact on the organization.

i believe other NHL organizations have such a wall right?

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05-30-2013, 02:56 PM
  #341
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Where is the wall of honour?
In the blueprints for the new arena. I've been told it's HHOF-quality.

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05-31-2013, 02:28 AM
  #342
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Originally Posted by Mr Forever View Post
"Die and be a hero, or live long enough to see yourself become the villain. I went from the favourite, to the most hated, but would you rather be under paid or overrated" - R Smyth
Sick, was just listening to that song today lol. Ryan must be bumping Jigga.

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08-25-2013, 06:51 PM
  #343
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Thought I would rekindle this as I recently read a blog by some two bit hack suggesting we slap the C on Smyttys chest. While this may seem like a good idea in somebodies fantasy world, is it a real possiblity? Who here would get behind this? I would think you need the captain to either be a vocal leader and/or set an example. Smytty butchers the english language and was possibly the worst player in the league last year. I just can't see how this is a good idea. If Smytty plays in 50+games this year the remote is likely to go threw my TV.

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08-25-2013, 07:31 PM
  #344
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Originally Posted by KlimasLoveChild View Post
Thought I would rekindle this as I recently read a blog by some two bit hack suggesting we slap the C on Smyttys chest. While this may seem like a good idea in somebodies fantasy world, is it a real possiblity? Who here would get behind this? I would think you need the captain to either be a vocal leader and/or set an example. Smytty butchers the english language and was possibly the worst player in the league last year. I just can't see how this is a good idea. If Smytty plays in 50+games this year the remote is likely to go threw my TV.
If Eakins chooses Ryan Smyth as the captain, I'll eat my hat.

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08-25-2013, 11:00 PM
  #345
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Originally Posted by AlowlyOilersfan View Post
If Eakins chooses Ryan Smyth as the captain, I'll eat my hat.
better provide pictures.

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08-25-2013, 11:18 PM
  #346
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Smyth as a 13th forward coming into the lineup for injuries and/or for forwards in Eakin's doghouse (and I expect there will be some)... is a fine role for Smyth. 100% chance this is his last season and to have him play as a utility/role player for this last season is something I'm ok with... in fact with limited minutes and fewer games I think he can put up a decent performance.

I just hope if a big series of injuries hit... he isn't pushed high up into the lineup. He needs to stay on the 4th line at best.

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08-26-2013, 10:01 AM
  #347
Trafalgar Law
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KlimasLoveChild View Post
Thought I would rekindle this as I recently read a blog by some two bit hack suggesting we slap the C on Smyttys chest. While this may seem like a good idea in somebodies fantasy world, is it a real possiblity? Who here would get behind this? I would think you need the captain to either be a vocal leader and/or set an example. Smytty butchers the english language and was possibly the worst player in the league last year. I just can't see how this is a good idea. If Smytty plays in 50+games this year the remote is likely to go threw my TV.
Smyth should be waived, not named captain.

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08-26-2013, 11:06 AM
  #348
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I think who gets the C is totally unimportant. If they want to give it to Smitty for a season who cares, the players know who the real leaders are.

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08-26-2013, 11:09 AM
  #349
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Originally Posted by nexttothemoon View Post
Smyth as a 13th forward coming into the lineup for injuries and/or for forwards in Eakin's doghouse (and I expect there will be some)... is a fine role for Smyth. 100% chance this is his last season and to have him play as a utility/role player for this last season is something I'm ok with... in fact with limited minutes and fewer games I think he can put up a decent performance.

I just hope if a big series of injuries hit... he isn't pushed high up into the lineup. He needs to stay on the 4th line at best.
I'm thinking the same thing. IF he works his ass off this off-season (knowing Eakins demand of high fitness), and IF this allows him to keep up to the higher paced game plan Eakins will surely implement, he could be useful on the 4th line with (currently) Lander/Acton and Brown, but never playing in back to backs (Joensu subbing in).

Bigger questions are whether he can accept this role. Last year there was a media ****storm the first time he was a healthy scratch when it was widely accepted he was a 4th liner. The healthy scratch in back to back games would need to be established by Eakins (with Smyth's endorsement) to the media before regular season got underway.

In that role I think he could be an effective 4th liner.

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08-26-2013, 11:12 AM
  #350
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I have no idea how I ended up on the defending Smyth side of this argument.

I have always thought Smyth as over hyped in Edmonton.

Hell the guy has always been a poor skater, shooter, and passer... Not exactly the kind of guy that should be on your top line. I know he has had great success with his grit and heart but he really was played in a position far above his skill set in Edmonton.

On Smyth at the moment tho.

He is a vet. Heart and Soul Edmonton guy. His play last year was not good but I would also say that people on these boards are greatly exaggerating how bad he did play last year.

He should be able to play out his final year here in a very limited role. Having this guy in our dressing room should be an asset.

The only problem I see is if he continues to pretend he can still play this game at a high level.

He should be splitting time with Brown for the 13th forward and mainly be a locker room presence.

Have him play 41 gameish with only 5-10 min of ice time and let him sail into the sunset an Oiler.

It is a very classy thing to do. The organization needs some positive reinforcement with player relations.

And having Smyth play that kind of role will not hurt this teams chances to make the playoffs even slightly unless he has taken even a bigger step down from last year.

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